I understand why you would think that more moves would be better but trust me, the arena is already complicated enough as it is haha. More moves added wouldn't help make it any easier for newer players to try it out. 

 

There used to be a guide by Trackxyj (2nd in Arena wins, was first for a VERY long time) but for some reason when the cows started the new forum, his thread got lost in the process. I learned a lot from it even as a somewhat intermediate player. If I ever find the link to the google docs page, I'll be sure to post it in my bio. 

I actually feel that the opposite would be true volcom. By adding more arena moves it would make for a larger arrangement of combinations being used (assuming of coarse that the new moves were actually useful, unlike the poison and fire....). A larger arrangement of moves would mean that your moves can work specifically with a certain gear type rather than having a combat move set that can generically be used for several different gear sets. This would, in a sense, make it more likely for a novice to win an arena due to the increased variance of moves and gear customization, adding another level to the arena.

Nobody can blame "Epics" and "paying players" for arena wins, since the majority of epics are worse than the normal gear, and since legendary and crystalline items are at an all time low cost.. New moves could change the arena dynamics dramatically, unless of coarse you want to "dummy it down" by somehow making a player win by the roll of the dice. I feel that the customization of combat moves is what makes the arena stand apart from other "luck" based games... A good analogy would be slots vs. poker, whereas slots is 100% luck and poker is a combination of luck AND skill. This diversity is what keeps many of us interested in playing the arena and if it was any less diverse, I would not be playing the arena at all.

Currently, if you are using an attack/armor gear set then you are hoping your opponent is using a defensive gear set and you are also "hoping" that your opponent is not using an armor/damage set....etc.etc.etc.

What we need is a diversification of the combat moves so that it isn't so cut and dry, thereby reducing that "hope" (which is really just luck) of not being matched up with a certain player in a certain arena, and having it be more about having a good combination of combat moves, using moves that will enhance your specific gear type.

In reality, anybody could win any arena with a little luck (I've seen it happen when low level players enter an arena a couple hundred levels higher, and still win based on the above mentioned "hope"), or the classic deflect move that always seems to activate at just the right time, except when I am using it .

I hope this makes sense.

I know that I stopped taking bounties as soon as the 100 stams came into play for the Smasher Medal  I would bet many others did the same.

This is my point too. I also stopped for a very long time and have heard from a few others that did the same. This is the reason why this change is even being proposed. I even attempted to participate in a group that vowed not to re-bounty when they were cleared (a list of people). THIS is what we had to resort to just because I wanted my bounty medal without losing a bunch of levels. It was not very successful though, since the timing never seemed to work out just right. Once I regained faith in the players, I tried again to complete bounties and ALWAYS used 10 stamina (unless it was someone requesting delevel). That worked for a couple of months but then I got stung again....

I believe this is the whole reason for this proposed change.

I usually have an optimistic view on things, but unfortunately, I cannot put one on the outlook that Grim has taken on this. 

 

The bounty board, in most ways, is a self-policing part of the game in terms of bounty hunters being bountied. Outside of the idea that bounties are to expire and someone is dropped 5 (which has happened even when there are 12+ hours left on bounties that I've seen). If you remove the expiration from the bounties, then it will go back to the olden days where usually if you clear with 10 stams, then you won't get bountied, unless you've made enemies (and they're looking for bounties on you). Outside of expiring bounties, if you clear someone with 10 stams and get bountied, then you make sure to throw 100s next time - it's not difficult and it gets the message across. There is no reason to adjust the community roadmap for this proposition on a part of the game that is dead because of lack of activity on the PVP side rather than "bounty hunters crying foul". 

 

As this is not on the roadmap, and you've made it very clear "we are sticking to the roadmap. if it's not on there, it won't get listened to." - then please stick to the roadmap and put this on the end if that's the case. Put this one in the pocket and let it be voted on next time.

I wish it was that simple. The problem is, certain guilds have more involved players than others. Some guilds are happy to participate in a de-level party and can easily gather the required players to do so in a timely manner. Other guilds would rather stay out of it. If I was dishonorably deleveld, my choice is to 100 stam them or just leave it be. If I do a retaliatory 100 stam attack, then you can bet another delevel party is in store for me. If I place everybody that participated in my delevel on the BB, you can bet they will be 10 stamina cleared by their own friends that are eagerly awaiting, getting MY reward money and only losing a fraction of the same xp that I lost. FAR from retaliation.

So I ask you this, how can a person get their retaliation after being deleveled?

You still remembering that y0da's case everytime?
We explained the reason was not only the bounty about to expire, but the trash talk. Happened only one time, and we had 2 bounties on him, and done a delevel only on one, the second one was not even placed.
-
The answer for that kind of (as you say) "abuse" is to make impossible to place a bounty on the B Hunter?
How anyone will be placed on BB at first place? Only for those who do gold hits?
GvG = not bountyable
BB hits = ?not bountyable?
Ladder hits = ?not bountyable?

That will make the BB completelly DEAD. 

Not trying to bring this up again, but I must correct your statement.

1.The trash talk happened AFTER the threat that was made to me, so as a response.

2. Two bounties WERE placed, but the first one was cleared by a friend. The SECOND one was the unwarranted delevel party.

Please get your facts straight before posting. Thank you.

Everyone should try bounty hunting, is not that bad, really, I NEVER got bountyed for doing 10stam clears, doesn`t matter if those guys are hardcore PvPers or just levellers.

It's very rare someone having problems with that

As 'rare' as it is, I was deleveled the first day that the smasher medal was released after attempting to 10 stam a bounty. I avoided the BB for over a year after that one instance. Then I had it happen to me again recently. I do not think there is justification to lose 5 levels just for clearing a bounty with 10 stamina hits. Most people that have posted here agree with that at the very least.

This once again brings up the BB flaws. For the sake of integrity, I completely agree that a 10 stamina clear should not be re-bountied. Although most players already play in this manner, there are some that do not and that discourages many of us from participating in clearing a bounty, essentially removing that part of the game for us. This problem was made worse after the release of the smasher medal. For the record, I do agree with the point that others are making against a complete re-bounty ban.

So looks like you're in the 1% there. You've been told why you were dropped and still you don't like the answer.

Because it was bull.

So let's see, someone made up a rule that 10 stam clears are 'clean' and shouldn't be counter bountied, then got upset because oh my god! they got bountied! All the while knowing fully well that ANY hit on a bounty can be counter bountied!

 

Wow!! Stop everything at once! what injustice! an imaginary rule got broken! the game is falling apart! We need to immediately change things!

 

To repeat what some good folks have already said, nothing is broken, none of the reasons or back and forth matter, game allows bounty hunter to be counter bountied, you take a bounty at your own risk, that's what makes PVP fun! The risk, the fight! If you don't like losing XP, stay away from the board, don't go after the hunter medal without the mindset to PVP then complain about it because you wanted to get it without any risk whatsoever and it didn't work out.

 

You want to live by some honor code, good for you, people in the game are free to play as they choose, do not try to impose your honor code on others by legislating it via rules through loud complaints because people aren't following your self imposed honor code.

 

Next time you see those folks on the board hit back or let it go, don't try to ruin a well functioning aspect of the game because it doesn't fit your narrow vision of how it should be played.

Would you clear a bounty if you lost 5 levels each time? If the "risk" is being bountied, thats fine as I did not complain when the first bounty was placed on me and was cleared honorably. My complaint came when the SECOND bounty was placed with a delevel party.  Being counter bountied is one thing, being victim of a delevel party for a clean clear is in a whole new league. 99% of the time, clean clearing a bounty would NOT result in a delevel party. If I'd have known that clearing his bounty would result in losing 5 levels, I obviously would not have taken it. But since there is "risk" of it happening, does that mean that we should avoid the BB all together? Reduce the participation rate even more?

The fact of the matter is, the BB is flawed, just look at the number of bounties....

I think most would agree that the bounty is NOT a "well functioning" aspect of the game...

Talk about complaining, what about a player that is on the bounty board already and gets his bounty clean cleared, yet gets mad about it and delevels the clearer? THAT is the childish act here.

 Personally I wasn't their - I am not apart of the guild but have views to share on this topic -

 

1. You claim your innocent - but you were insulted first an felt the need to return insults as well (that's not innocent) ; My advise to you is next time you are clearing someone and get a nasty message -  explain your personal reasons at such time for taking the bounty with respect ( just cause someone stoops to insult you, doesn't mean you can't be a bigger person about it all and reply with respect to that person or that person's guild.)

 

2. Despite all threats and nonsense comments - if it was a clean clear ( doesn't sound like it either so far) Copy the " nasty messages that are sent to you" Go to their leadership - make a respectful appeal on your own behalf explaining that you are going for your bb medal - or you were bored etc - you were then threatened - insulted - etc ---> Explaining both sides of the situation will 9 out of every 10 reduce the amount of support for a de-levelment - No guild wants to look bad - no leader wants to look like a bully or fool - Things are always carried out in this game with good intent or followed by good reasoning.

 

3. Bad things can and do happen sometimes in life just as in game - One bad turn doesn't always deserve another - I agree with Kat this forum is not a proper place to cry about getting your wounds licked and in fact only creates further appeal to drop you the next time - Since you didn't learn the lesson 1 ( I am not making threats towards you neither I am merely explaining the mind set of most or common pvpers in game) As I said things are followed through with reasoning and cause - If you had cause to complain - you lost it - If someone was wrong - you just mended it - 2 wrongs in this game sometimes can equal a right lol this forum for this particular complaint was misused from the looks of it.

 

Sorry for being the bad news bear =(

 

Chazz 

1. I never claimed innocence, as I openly admitted to returning the same disrespect that was given to me. I was the victim however of an unjust act. Most people, in RL or in a game, would react to disrespect by returning it.

I did send him a message stating that I was clearing his bounty with 10 stamina hits to help him out (at least that is what I thought I was doing). He was offline during the bounty so its not like I could have a discussion with him. When he got back online, he sent a threatening (not insulting) message to me to which I responded.

2. It WAS a clean clear and I would be happy to provid anybody that doubts it with the logs (I will screen shot it even if you need that proof). I agree that this does NOT make sense to delevel party on a clean clear... that is my point.

I disagree with "going to their leadership" as ONE threatening message was sent to me, and ONE was sent back to him, and I thought that would be the end of it. Why would anybody take it further? Keep it going? Make it worse? It doesnt make sense to me either. In addition, going to their leadership would only bring more people in on a situation that did not need to be at that time, since again I did not see it as being a big deal that I had clean cleared a bounty. Not to mention the fact that anybody in that guild would be biased to believe their own member, making this an ineffective manuever. Also, his guild leader, or guild mates that participated in the delevel party couldve came to me to hear my side of the story, so lets not place all of the blame on me for not reaching out.

I AM explaining my side of the situation in this thread, and I think clearing a bounty can easily be associated with getting a bounty medal, without needing to say such to said person.

3. This thread was to bring light to a problem with the bounty system, and to find reason and opinion for an action that did not make sense to me. The only "bad" thing that I did was send a negative response in response to his threat. Notice that I did not attack him again, I did not place his guildies on the BB for deleveling me, I have not encouraged any further retribution, only wanting an explanation.

If not voicing this concern in the forum, then where? I had extreme cause to complain as an unjust action was made on me. Rather than focus on how "low class" it is for me to create this thread, how much "lower class" is it for somebody to put a delevel party on a clean bounty clear? Again, I feel that this thread is more than justified.

+1 Grim

 

I support Grim especially a critic without suggestion - I also agree with Dom on this as well another +1 carefule what bounties you take - usually if guilds are at war they will say so in their bio that such bounty is reserved - however even if it's not stated just don't offer anyone from that guild future clears pretty easy lesson learned I think ... There are other situations where it's great to bounty the hunter and in all honesty - I don't know the whole story but just reading your half of it I would drop each person 5 levels and return the favor - that's me though not supporting this particular cause just saying it's a helpful feature being able to bounty - bounty hunters at times. I do not think it needs any fixing personally.

 

Just my two cents

 

- Chazz

Myself and others have voiced opinions of the need for a revised BB in the past, and given suggestions and solutions. It really was not off the mark for me to bring attention to this issue when the topic had already been addressed with suggestions. Plus, as you can read in this thread, this has brought out a few other suggestions as well, and I provided mine again too.

And you trash talked a lot for our friend via PMs, that's why you got deleveled.

Actually, he was first to send me a threat, to which I responded to with the same disrespect that he had given me.

Lets get the facts straight.

Just so everyone knows ALL the facts and so that you may LEARN a little something about how some players react. You where deleveled one out of two possible bounties that you cleared BECAUSE you decided to clear the bounties that were about to expire, and by that I mean less then an hour left. This action was perceived as cheap, and proven so by your cowardice coming here to cry about it. You did nobody any favors, and had malicious intent to take the bountys with so little time remaining. SO, as you now know you can take ANY bounty at ANY time that it's on the BB with anywhere between 10 to 100 stam hits. You can also lose 5 levels for EACH bounty taken. Consider yourself lucky you didn't lose 10! NOTHING is wrong with the bounty board. You got what you deserved.

Oh, is THAT what he told you? My logs will prove otherwise as I was working on those bounties for over 2 hours due to multi-tasking, and that is assuming that the bounties wouldve expired exactly the moment that I finished the second one. So, this is just simply not true, but good try...

What sort of malicious intent could I have possibly had by clearing a bounty with 10 stamina hits? This is absurd. I sent him a couple of messages while I was doing the bounty, as I always do, out of respect (bad judgement call on this guy though).

In addition, even if the bounty was about to expire, which it wasnt, does that really justify a delevel party? I think not.

Lets get the facts straight, and perhaps reconsider who you are friends with.

Just curious but for all those that participated in deleveling you, can't you post then all on the bounty board? I don't participate in this aspect of the game but I was just curious

Yes, of coarse. But then I am spending gold or fsp x 5 to place them there, just so that they can have their friends clear them from the bounty board using 10 stamina. They might each lose 1/4 of a level if that, plus then their friends get the bounty reward plus the accumulative bounty medal. I lost 5 levels. Putting them each on the bounty board is in no way justice.

Many people suggest 100 stamming every bounty, but isnt that just feeding into the problem as well as giving the person valid reason to re-bounty? Even if you ONLY 100 stam the people that you know or hate, it would still lead to a cycle of bounties and rebounties.

Having integrity would suggest that a bounty cleared with 10 stamina hits would be appreciated, whereas a bounty cleared with 100 stamina hits would give reason for revenge.

Contributing to this behavior, although a valid solution, is not THE solution.

lol no im not suggesting that BUT do you ALWAYS get deleveled for a gentle clear? NO i highly doubt it. So an occasional delevel is not the same as 100% of hits being 100 stam..

 

I agree with the others though. Next time no gentle clear for them. 100's only if it were me.

 

 

(on a side not ive lost over 250 lvls and have my Bh'r bronze...lol nither are connected though)

You are correct that it would not happen every time, my point is that it shouldnt even be possible.

The system is flawed in your opinion. We think it is fine as is. 

 

If the system is flawed, how would you suggest it be fixed? Provide feedback instead of simply saying something does not work.

I have, dont allow a bounty hunter to be bountied.

Or, if you dont like that, limit the ability to place a bounty on a bounty hunter so that the re-bounty can only be done if more than 10 stamina was used per hit.

Yes, DomCorvis, I learned that same lesson when the smasher medal came out as the same thing had happened to me back then too. So you are saying that the bounty medal should not be acquired unless you want to lose 5 levels every time you clear 1 bounty? So you are okay with a person losing 250 levels just to acheive the bronze bounty medal? Lose 1000 levels just to get a silver medal?

So I clear a bounty with 10 stamina, my reward? A DELEVEL PARTY!

Let me get this straight, I do YOU a favor by clearing your bounty ( that was only there because you had attacked somebody in the first place), and I use 10 stamina hits out of respect. Most normal, decent, humane people would be happy about that and give thanks... but not ! Beware of this player, as he has no soul nor logic. I would not be associated with such a person in real life, nor in a game.

Again, the bounty system is flawed if this is allowed to happen, as I've said in the past. When will the cows get it? Perhaps never.

Name edited out of advice from DomCorvis

I personally would like to see arena improvements as part of the roadmap.

1. ui tweaks like make completed tournies be a bit more searchable, list down the stats that you used to join the tournament (for people that have different setups on same level range)

2. speed up arena by forcing tournaments to start after 24hours, consequently display closing time for the tournament

3. tweak other potions in arena to make it more useful. some are really useless. max of level 250 except for existing lightfoot potion. (and level 300 for composing perhaps?)

4. use extracts to make potions, this makes them more usable. extract rates of some resource are horrible, i get 10 xinlor left and 2 xinlor right. this is a fact known among fellow extractors no matter how hcs support says it is balanced.

5. arena tokens.
simple. titans hunters have tkp for failed secure. pvp laddr have pvp tokens. so why not in arena as well, i believe theres a separate thread by Shindrak in the forum.

6. tweak combat moves
Remove moves like lunge, increase poison and fire chance a bit (this was nerfed too much from previous update) introduce moves like increase defense and increase armor (permanent) raise stats like damage, def or attack by a higher rate but increase is temporary. or moves that increase one stat but decrease others by 'x' percent

7. bring back fsp reward in arena. this can be a separate tab so another 20 tournies. joining fee and reward can be discussed later

+1

I'd love to see a serious discussion regarding the arena