mary4ever

At first glance , I like this idea.. a choice is always good... I believe everything should stay the same as far as buffs , the market etc.  But choice is good =) You should be able to  play either way ...and maybe have a weekly reset with an option , such as a  preference box setting you preset for your choice of pvp system you want to play for the week or day or ?

under your Preferences you will have the choice to choose what kinda PvP system you want to play (you can alternate between raw PvP and soft PvP if you want after each reset, the choice is yours)

I agree, choice is always good 

MARY WINS the Internet today!!

IT'S NOT FRIDAY YET, THANK GOD 

Mary.. I have read your post a few times but honestly Raw PvP would be very few players and how many levelers would opt in to any PvP (and stay).  Soft PvP while using less stamina would still drain stamina and I would opt out to regain stamina.  I still have to level. 

can you please tell me why soft PvP will require less stamina than raw PvP?

Even in your crew how many would opt in to Raw PvP as you guys are pushing to gain on FFS. Maybe your EOC players would opt in as I am not sure how many other PvP crews have players at EOC so they would not have to spend stamina 100 staming.

this last year my guild got lots of GXP because most of our pvpers spent their stamina on leveling, if you look closer at my guild you will find that we have many players who play different aspects of the game, we have pvpers, levelers, arena players, titan hunters, ...... everyone plays their part of the game they like and that is how it should be

which guild does not want to be #1 guild, guild ranking does not matter as long as the members are enjoying their stay

 

I like the ladder but if I have to 100 stamina hit everyday I will only stay until i am tired of stamina loss. (buffing and 100 staming)

there is no ladder system in the raw PvP system, sorry, will change my post (my mistake, a mistype)

I do not see this increasing PvP activity 

 

EDIT:  Am I missing something?

I guess I don't understand the need for this.

 

There IS XP LOSS AND LEVEL LOSS in the proposed new system, so why is it being labeled soft? Just because it happens to be XP specific to PVP? Doesn't it sound strange to keep harping on that? Why not take this opportunity to embrace the aspect of the game you love in a nicer more direct and open environment?

 

The new system does what should have been done from day 1, separate two aspects of the game that never should have been intermingled in the first place.

 

The new system actually promotes pitting the best against the best in the way it is structured which is what I as a PVPer would like to see.

there are 2 systems: raw PvP and soft PvP => you have the choice to choose which one you want

raw PvP system is XP loss (=you can lose experience, levels and your VL can drop too)

soft PvP system is PvP xp loss (=you only lose PvP xp, not sure if you lose PvP level too, please go to Dooms post http://forums.hunted...loss-from-pvp/)

bleacher, I only named them raw and soft, I could have called them leg and arms or A and B, I am not the one who is deciding the name of these 2 systems

Players need to have something on their bios showing what kind of PvP they are Opted in.

currently we have for example """ PvP Rating: 1,000 """ on our Profiles under PvP Stats

we could then have """ Raw PvP Rating: 1,000 """ and """ Soft PvP Rating: 1,000 """on our Profiles

Buffs can stay the same, but Honor, Shame, Bastion and Protection should work for PvPXP if you're signed on this kind of PvP.

You should be posted on the VICTIM side of the BB, just like you said.
yes, vitcitm side, after all the victim is the victim 
There should be 2 types of tokens/rewards, all Bound, one for each kind of PvP.
BOUND is always good, if you want them get them yourself !!!
I like this idea a lot more.

I'd like to think about this for a bit, but i think this option has potential:

 

There will be 2 different bounty board systems (RAW BB and SOFT BB) It is possible to hit someone in another PvP system, difference is you will be posted on the bounty board of the victims system: EXAMPLE: if tom from SOFT system hits mark from RAW system, tom gets bountied on RAW system and loses XP, not PvP xp (this is to counter exploiting ratings for both systems) !!!  gold hits are possible to do regardless of the system you are in !!!

 

would you be able to transfer from raw to soft im guessing...perhaps in preferences like opting in and out of the ladder on reset?

or would it be a one time call ?

 

if a raw hits a soft for a gold hit, im assuming it counts as a soft hit, and vice versa, thus the BB difference?, its the defenders system your gold hitting in?

 

couldnt we just adapt the current pvp buffs to work on either system?

"""" if a raw hits a soft for a gold hit, im assuming it counts as a soft hit, and vice versa, thus the BB difference? """ YES

"""" couldnt we just adapt the current pvp buffs to work on either system? """" I agree (this would give HCS less work)

From my initial read, I like it. Only thing I would ask is if I could switch to raw at some point in time

yes you can BUT only after the reset !!! (this is to counter exploiting)

The suggestion is having 2 different kinds of PvP systems:

Raw PvP (with xp loss) and Soft PvP (with pvp xp loss) (I named them raw and soft, names can be changed)

This solution to have 2 different kinds of PvP systems should make both parties happy (levelers and pvpers) and does not force anyone to play something he does not want to, you are given a choice and that is the wonderful thing about this, you have a choice, you decide, it is your decision, it is not forced upon you

Once this suggestion gets approved and then implemented you will be asked to choose a side (pvp system, raw PvP or soft PvP) after your next log-in under your preferences !!!

For Soft PvP system look at Dooms post at http://forums.hunted...-loss-from-pvp/

This is how the Raw PvP system works:

• XP loss, no xp pvp loss !!!
• Open ranges (can be discussed)
• PvP rating transfer like in the old days (details about pvp rating transfer for 10-100 stamina, higher lvl attacking lower lvl / lower lvl attacking higher lvl, ….)
• Every hit is bounty able
• Raw PvP Rating reset will be randomly at the same time as the Soft PvP rating system reset
• Rating will be transferred to tokens (ratio currently unknown, needs discussion)

Interactions between raw PvP and soft PvP Systems: (2 options)

• No hits possible => this option gives lesser pvp activity
• There will be 2 different bounty board systems (RAW BB and SOFT BB) It is possible to hit someone in another PvP system, difference is you will be posted on the bounty board of the victims system: EXAMPLE: if tom from SOFT system hits mark from RAW system, tom gets bountied on RAW system and loses XP, not PvP xp (this is to counter exploiting ratings for both systems) !!!  gold hits are possible to do regardless of the system you are in !!!

the main point why xp loss had to be removed was because of bullying and the victims had no way to escape as long as there was xp loss, this system gives them an escape chance and solves the bullying issue PLUS gives us PvPers who want to pvp in our system, this is a WIN - WIN situation where everyone (pvpers and levelers) gets what he wants

please give your opinions on what you think about this system and please if you say you are against it then tell the reason so we know why and can maybe alter the system to "perfection" , thanks for your input in advance

To be frank, I'd simply add that to the PvP XP hit I guess. But this could be an addition I suppose. Or replacement for the Ladder. I'll have to talk with Hoof and Zorg.

I understood from BigGrim's post that he would add it to the hit, meaning that we will have a choice when attacking to choose between normal attack / ladder attack / gvg attack / bounty attack / PvP XP attack

thanks a lot for explaining it, seems like I misunderstood it

Hrm. An idea to have PvP not taking Levelling XP has potential. This is something that might heal by divorcing PvP from levelling XP, thereby neutering the level loss, and in some cases, the bullying that can and and does occur in rare instances. This is something I'd like to discuss with Hoofmaster and Zorg though, so don't get your hopes up.

 

~ Grim

@clock96: sorry to ask this but are you sure you and Biggrim are on the same page?

.......
Player lost XXXXX XP
Player lost 300,000 gold of which clock96 stole 200,000 gold
Clock96 gained 10 PvP prestige
Clock96 gained XXXXXX PvP XP, Player lost XXXXXX PvP XP

→So no "safe" PvP
→the attack now can be bountied
→no new special attack mode
→Same ordinary ranges
→if someone has 0 PvP XP (For example: -10,000) , he will start loosing a percent from his PvP enhancements,
→want to get your PvP enhancements up again ? Then participate in PvP and get PvP XP and level up in PvP,
→on bounty board ? You will loose normal XP and a tiny PvP XP (according to stam used on you in the attack)

▶Did I make this clear now ? Any questions plz post and make your question straight forward, thanks

you are talking about PvP taking leveling XP (Player lost XXXXX XP)

from what I understand is that BigGrim is talking about PvP NOT taking Levelling XP BUT you are talking about PvP taking Levelling XP

can you please explain this? (maybe I am misunderstanding something)

1.  Yes, I read your post fully - and the assumption (maybe speculation was a better word) I'm referring to is "I do not have any objection if the levelers want this kinda "safe" pvp system BUT like I mentioned before: hoofmaster needs to assure the pvpers that the NEW SYSTEM will NOT replace the current pvp system in the future !!!"   <-- YOUR quote.

 

2. Most updates have been tweaking PvP yes - but I disagree with your ladder one. Folk are on the ladder (broken as it is) and meant to be hitting each other for rewards. Being able to bounty hits on there has no place..

IMO a player should be able to bounty ladder hits IF he/she hits the same player too at least once per ladder reset because if you bounty a ladder hit then the other player can bounty too !!!

normal, ladder and bounty attacks should be bounty able !!! any form of PvP attack that takes XP should be bounty able (for example: the arena and gvg do not take any XP so they should not be bounty able)

 

3. What I was meaning with "try the safe version" was ... *tries to explain it more clearly* ... if folk get a "buzz" from hitting other players, working out gear / buff combinations etc, then the next logical progression would be to move from the "safe" environment to the "less safe" environment. Would everyone who tried it do that ? - probably not - but would some ? - I'd bet money on it. And, thus, that's MORE players participating in "real" PvP - so a win for your camp.

GvG has NO RISK too and even a wider attack range:

Level Ranges are as follows:

• 50 - 300 (+/- 25)
• 301 - 700 (+/- 50)
• 701+ (+/- 100)

so GvG gives you an even wider playing field (after lvl 701 your attack range is +/- 100 which is much more than the normal pvp or new system attack range) and if the levelers have not moved from the "safe" environment to the "less safe" environment yet then in my opinion the chances are even smaller for them to make the transition to "real" PvP after the "new system"

Working on the assumption that Hoof will maintain existing PvP and that this suggestion is not a precursor to that going - and where this assumption has sprung from, I have no idea. BUT ...

did you even read my post? I said that as you can see they are all ANTI - PvP updates which reduce/restrict PvP activity !!!! I really do not remember any PRO - PvP updates in the last 5 years, do you?

 

I really fail to see why PvP'rs are SO vehemently against this ?

I never said that I am against it !!! I do not have any objection if the levelers want this kinda "safe" pvp system BUT like I mentioned before: hoofmaster needs to assure the pvpers that the NEW SYSTEM will NOT replace the current pvp system in the future !!!

 

Folk can try this system out with no risk and, if they like it, make the transition to "real" PvP.

 

Isn't that a WIN for your camp ? - seems to be in my opinion at least.

can you please explain why this is a "WIN for our camp"? why would a leveler make the transistion to "real" PvP if the NEW system offers him NO RISK at all?

to be honest: IF I was a pure leveler I would stick with the new system because it offers me NO RISK !!!

 

when I read the headline "PvP XP / XP through PvP" I did not bother to read the topic because there were many pvp topics in the last years and HCS have not shown any interest in them   BUT when I heard that BigGrim liked the idea and even wanted to discuss it with hoof and zorg it piqued my curiosity so I started reading it .....

this NEW SYSTEM would be ADDED (NOT REPLACE the CURRENT PVP SYSTEM)

IF this SYSTEM gets accepted then I fear that the pvp system where there is XP loss would then soon be removed UNLESS hoofmaster assures the pvpers that this will NOT happen !!!

why do pvpers need hoofmaster's to assure that?

simple, let's see some of the updates regarding pvp in the last 5 years :

• pvpers "forced" to compete in brackets (=ladder), now I can only hit +/- 10 levels, original fallen sword game = open pvp => win for the levelers
• pvp protection was added (Fallen Sword Point Upgrades) => win for the levelers
• cheaper pvp protection was added (Gold Upgrades) => win for the levelers
• max 5 levels can be taken per bounty (old system, you could lose more than 5 levels per bounty) => win for the levelers
• the skill "honor" reduces % of XP loss (old system: honor used to reduce % of pvp rating) => win for the levelers
• ladder hits not bounty able => win for the levelers
• activation rate of DEFLECT (I hate this buff) higher than in description => win for the levelers
• smasher medal only working on ladder and BB (old system: worked for normal pvp too) => win for the levelers
• bounties expire after 48 hours (old system: bounties NEVER expired) => win for the levelers
• + many more ANTI - PvP updates

as you can see they are all ANTI - PvP updates which reduce/restrict PvP activity !!!!

I really do not remember any PRO - PvP updates in the last 5 years, do you?

I have been called a "bully" a few times in 2 different situations:

1. for a 10 stam prestige hit !!!! funny thing is that some of those who called me a "bully" for a 10 stam prestige hit and who bountied me are now doing the EXACT same thing !!! I have proof and will gladly post it if HCS allows me (I made print screens of our conversation with these players) !!!
2. levelers joined my ladder band and wanted to only allow 10 stam hit and NO 100 stam, when I refused they called me a bully !!! I mean, why do you join the ladder if you are not prepared to get hit with 10, 20, ..... 100 stam ?!?

I like to call myself a pvper but I have not done any real pvp in a very long time, BB is dead, ladder is dead, I only have +/-10 attack range (hardly anyone in my range), for gods sake I am in the "top10 most GXP" because I do not know what to do with my stamina !!! I have about 3 times the amount of GXP a player would have at my level, I turned into a ***** ULTRA POWER LEVELER my guild mate bilops is even in the "top3 most GXP" !!!

I only log-in once or twice a month to hunt or maybe do an event and I am not the only one, look at top guilds, their members go offline for many days too, activity is decreasing

to be honest I will not play this NEW SYSTEM because there is NO RISK involved !!

NO RISK => NO FUN

even leveling has a tiny little bit of RISK, if you lose a battle then you lose XP, in this system you do not lose any XP (only PvP XP)

for me this new system is not PvP (no risk) BUT if the levelers want this system then I will not object to this idea if hoofmaster assures the pvpers that the NEW SYSTEM will NOT replace the current pvp system in the future !!!

ALL pvp-updates I mentioned above were for the levelers, even this new system so when is it our turn to get a PvP update that benefit us PvPers????? we have been waiting for over 4 years and still nothing there are tons of suggestions in the forum how to increase pvp activity by NOT putting any restrictions on pvp !!!

some pvpers have asked for a "pvp event" , why do we not have one? we already have global events and XP events !!!!

nobody is "forced" to participate in those events, I myself did not participate in all global / xp events so where is the problem if we have a pvp event?

these updates regarding PvP are clearly reducing the RISK factor and surely but slowly heading towards NO XP LOSS and in my opinion this is the problem why pvp activity is this low, not only pvp activity but even the number of players have been decreasing during the years (yes, I know there are other factors but I believe this is one too because many of my friends left for this reason)!!!

this game used to be so much fun and I ♥ fallen sword !!!