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Potential Balance Changes - Buffs


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#1 Tilley10

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 15:58

Hello people of FS!

A group of players have recently come together to discuss a few existing buffs from the vast Udder land and wanted to see what other people thought (including the Devs!) on these ideas. While I understand these are mainly used for the PvP aspects of the game, it is in our minds that slight tweaks to these buffs could potentially help stimulate these aspects to be more enjoyable for a larger portion of the community. Without further delay, here are some of the changes that have been discussed:

 

Dispel Curse:

Dispel Curse (First iteration): 0.2% > 0.1% chance per point that Dark Curse will not work against you (PvP only)

 

Dispel Curse (Second Iteration): 0.1% per point reduction to the effectiveness of Dark Curse.

Reasoning: Dispel Curse can currently reach 100% activation rate with the right potion - which can be quite strong in PvP combat. A reduction of its activation rate or a rework of its mechanic would be more fair for PvP in general. While having the ability to negate a buff like “Dark Curse” is good on paper, the buff, as it is, can be used more as a “100% wincon” crutch when used with other buffs later seen here. The first iteration listed would reduce the effectiveness by half, but the second would just halve the effectiveness of “Dark Curse.”

 

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Assist

 

+0.05% chance per point that an ally, up to 25 levels above you (+1 level per point), assists you in combat vs. Creatures. Ally adds 50% of their Attack, Defense, Damage, Armor and Health >>> +0.05% chance per point that an ally, up to 25 levels above you boosts +0.1% per point to drop rate of Creatures.

 

Reasoning: Assist’s current iteration remains rarely used. This change would make Assist a more attractive use and a better defined role in the buff list. As it is with all of the composed and epic potions around, people aren’t hurting for the stats they could gain from Assist.

 

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Trendy

 

+0.05% per point added to your Attack, Defense, Armor, HP and Damage for each piece of equipped gear that is Common, Rare or Unique. If the piece of equipped gear is Super Elite, gain +0.025% per point instead.

 

Reasoning: For something so Trendy, this buff rarely sees the light of day. With this change, the use of the buff would be expanded to enable gears not called Legendary to have more of a say in many areas of the game.

 

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Flinch

 

0.1% > 0.05% per point to enemy Attack

 

Reasoning: Flinch + Fumble combo is currently too strong in PvP (as a defender). Reducing one, or both, would make attacking into it a less flinching experience.

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Fumble

 

0.1% > 0.05% per point reduction to attacker's Attack when successfully defending (PvP only, excludes Relic Combat)

 

Reasoning: Flinch + Fumble combo is currently too strong in PvP (as a defender). Reducing one, or both, would make players fumble a little less when attacking into it.

 

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Invigorate

 

+0.01% >>> +0.025% per point added to your Attack, Defense, Armor, HP and Damage for each piece of gear equipped that is Epic

 

Reasoning: A little buff would hurt nobody. Just like Trendy, this change would make this buff more attractive in general.

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Balanced Attack and Defense

Balanced Attack: +0.05% per point to Attack and Damage if every piece of equipped gear is the same level >>> Complete Attack: Gain 0.05% per point to Attack and Damage if all equipment worn is part of a complete set.

 

Balanced Defense: +0.05% per point to Defense and Armor if every piece of equipped gear is the same level >>> Complete Defense: Gain 0.05% per point to Armor and Defense if all equipment worn is part of a complete set

 

Reasoning: In their current iteration, the Balanced buffs are too hard to execute and their bonus is insignificant. This change would make the buff’s bonuses to be more easily accessible.

 

Example of Reworked Buff: If you are wearing 4 two-piece sets and 1 filler item, you WOULD NOT be granted the bonus of balanced buffs. If you are wearing 3 two-piece sets and 1 three-piece set, you WOULD be granted the bonus. The easy way to remember this would be: Do I havea filler, an epic, or any piece of gear where I’m not being granted a set bonus? If the answer is “yes,” then you aren’t getting the bonus from the buffs.

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Brute Strength 

 

Enchant Weapon, Fury and Berserk buffs are increased by +1 level when cast for every 20 points in this skill. >>>>Enchanted buffs and Cursed Buffs are increased by +1 level when cast for every 20 points in this skill (also applies to Iron Fist).

 

Reasoning: All three of the buffs this buff enhances are available at a higher level in potion form and at a cheap price, making this very niche, if not borderline useless. By changing the buffs it affects, it remains niche but much more attractive.

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Disclaimer: This is not financial advice - we just like the stock.

 

If you’re still here, feel free to discuss, and I ask you, please come in with input; I want to hear outside perspectives on these as well; perhaps they could could change my outlook as well on some of these current buffs. After all, we all just want to see FS thrive!


Edited by Tilley10, 23 March 2021 - 16:16.


#2 EpicPiety

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 16:08

Anything to nerf defense. There is no question between a armor and defense set currently.



#3 Corrupted

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 19:29

All on board.


#4 nickkc420

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 20:46

I agree! However when it comes to flinch and fumble receiving possible adjustments, I would like to see fumble take most if not all of it as it is a PvP only buff. This would allow Flinch to remain effective in other aspects of the game!



#5 Corrupted

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:06

I would also like to mention that I think Fortitude should become a buff that comes off from %Armor instead of %Defense into HP.

It's easier to have more HP on Defense than in Armor sets. I don't think this should work this way since Armor is about 'tanking' and Defense is about 'dodging/not getting hit'.

Much thank


#6 shindrak

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:08

Make these buffs workable only  on Creatures  , and make PvP less random  with that much of buffs...


Edited by shindrak, 23 March 2021 - 21:08.


#7 LordOfRuin

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:09

Wow.. another player wants the game tweaked to their own advantage.. quelle surprise!!



#8 shindrak

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:12

Wow.. another player wants the game tweaked to their own advantage.. quelle surprise!!

Actually  I don't see there is any advantage from this , every game i knew always make tweaks to the game over and over,  so its normal.

He suggesting and people can add their thoughts


Edited by shindrak, 23 March 2021 - 21:13.


#9 nickkc420

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:14

In what way would this be advantageous to anyone in particular? The proposed changes would effect everyone equally. 



#10 Tilley10

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:17

Anything to nerf defense. There is no question between a armor and defense set currently.

Yes, I agree. Defense is highly regarded as more superior to Armor in many ways. These changes would put them closer to equal statue.

I agree! However when it comes to flinch and fumble receiving possible adjustments, I would like to see fumble take most if not all of it as it is a PvP only buff. This would allow Flinch to remain effective in other aspects of the game!

Interesting thought. I would love to see what others think of your comment here. I would be for it as Fumble would still bee nerfed from how it is currently.

I would also like to mention that I think Fortitude should become a buff that comes off from %Armor instead of %Defense into HP.

It's easier to have more HP on Defense than in Armor sets. I don't think this should work this way since Armor is about 'tanking' and Defense is about 'dodging/not getting hit'.

Much thank

This does make sense from a thematic point of view. Armor is more of a tank and should get more HP. Defense is more of a shifty type where you avoid being hit. This would make things interesting for sure. Would need to run the numbers to see if this would be too broken.

Make these buffs workable only on Creatures , and make PvP less random with that much of buffs...

Can you describe what specific buffs you are talking about?

Wow.. another player wants the game tweaked to their own advantage.. quelle surprise!!

This list of changes was crowd-sourced from multiple players. We all have a common goal of making FS the best it can be. We value everyones input and opinions. Please share the thoughts you have on this subject. :)

Edited by Tilley10, 24 March 2021 - 00:52.


#11 Bujon

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:39

There is an opportunity here to simply introduce a new buff to reduce opponents armour by 0.1 per level. Basic buff, composed and epic pot. Agree on dispel curse, but would apply same logic to last ditch. Nothing should really be allowed to exceed 100% in my opinion, and a few of those epic pots have killed most less hard core players enthusiasm for PvP.

Reducing flinch and fumble don't seem necessary, perhaps more transfer buffs could allow more flexibility. Transferring Damage to Attack and vice versa.....Defence to Armour and vice versa.

Edited by Bujon, 23 March 2021 - 21:41.


#12 Tilley10

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:43

There is an opportunity here to simply introduce a new buff to reduce opponents armour by 0.1 per level. Basic buff, composed and epic pot. Agree on dispel curse, but would apply same logic to last ditch. Nothing should really be allowed to exceed 100% in my opinion, and a few of those epic pots have killed most less hard core players enthusiasm for PvP.

Reducing flinch and fumble don't seem necessary, perhaps more transfer buffs could allow more flexibility. Transferring Damage to Attack and vice versa.....Defence to Armour and vice versa.


Thank you for your thoughts! It sounds like you would like a buff that is similar to Smite (-0.1% per point to attacking enemy's Armor (PvP only)) but it would reduce armor while attacking? Just want to make sure I understand what you are saying :)

I do agree that “chance” buffs shouldn’t exceed 100% (Dispel, Last Ditch, etc.).

#13 Bujon

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Posted 23 March 2021 - 21:52

Smite but for the attacker....perfect. That would work well if transfer buffs of attack/damage and defence/armour were in play. If we increasing composing levels, may as well introduce new buffs.

#14 Tastria

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Posted 24 March 2021 - 00:10

Well reasoned  topic.  However, from my viewpoint, I can't see that it would affect my playing style one way or another..  



#15 Tilley10

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Posted 24 March 2021 - 00:16

Smite but for the attacker....perfect. That would work well if transfer buffs of attack/damage and defence/armour were in play. If we increasing composing levels, may as well introduce new buffs.


Not sure why I didn’t think of this in my previous response: change Smite to work attacking and defending. Easier to have one buff instead of two.

More transfer buffs would be very interesting. Could open up more set building and creativity.

#16 TheCount

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Posted 24 March 2021 - 00:18

I agree with the majority of the proposed changes.

 

I disagree that Fortitude should be changed to work with armor, though I would love to see an Armor counterpart to the buff. I think swapping the way Fortitude itself works would only make Armor as powerful as Defense currently is. Having the same effect for either stat would likely be more balanced, although Armor/HP would still be much more powerful than Defense/HP ever was.

 

I think Fumble should be nerfed, and Flinch left alone. Fumble works only on defending players, while Flinch works the same for both.

 

Many of the imbalances in the game comes from lack of gear. The last Attack/Armor Legendary or better set is at 3400, while Defense sets have legendary variants close to EOC.

 

I think the Balanced rework sounds great, not only would it be more viable but also changes up some possible metas which would be fun to learn.

 

I'll post some ideas here if I have them, but for now this looks good.



#17 Melons

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Posted 24 March 2021 - 00:42

Wow.. another player wants the game tweaked to their own advantage.. quelle surprise!!

 

I don't think these suggested changes are benefitting one person. 

 

It's safe to say there is a problem when someone becomes unbeatable with a high-level dispel, flinch, and fumble. 

 

 

Without further delay, here are some of the changes that have been discussed:

 

I agree with the nerfs to the dispel, fumble, and flinch. The flinch + fumble combo is a bit unbalanced, especially with fumble 202 now a possibility. 

 

As for the balanced attack/defense buffs, this is probably the best suggestion I have seen to make them useful. 

 

I think assist could be changed for something else than finding more drops. I believe there are already plenty of buffs that improve the drop rate. 


Edited by Melons, 24 March 2021 - 00:43.


#18 Thoran

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Posted 24 March 2021 - 02:11

I agree with most of these changes.


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#19 Bujon

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Posted 24 March 2021 - 06:40

The Count hit nail on head referring to gear beyond lvl 3400. The problem with the whole PvP side of the game is essentially that depending on your level dictates what type of set up wins. Lower levels it is predominantly about Armour, 3900+ it is about Defence. There isn't anything particularly fun about it to attract the masses, there needs to be way more adaptability in the buffs available that means you do not have one trick ponies hogging the ladder. Just my two pennies worth, PvP 'could' be interesting, but as is it is a little lame. To counter the epic pots which are here to stay, there should be a 100% fist fight, also tame down deflect by big chunks and scrap anti deflect altogether. The list could go on forever. 😜

Edited by Bujon, 24 March 2021 - 06:43.


#20 Artzik

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Posted 24 March 2021 - 11:34

I agree with most of these changes too




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