22 replies to this topic

[EpicPiety]

Lately i've been thinking about how to improve the ladder and i came up with an idea. I came up with a possible alternative to seasons which i think will reign superior. Add a new ladder that spawns along side the old ladder that everyone can participate in. The new ladder would spawn a certain level range *with heavier weights on sub level 1000-1200 of course*... Meaning you can only use a gear level under the level of the ladder spawned. Either everyone is auto opted in or you can choose to opt out...Whichever. Although it would be cool to have a slight chance to opt you in regardless of your preference...Say 10% but that's open to debate of course. You can imagine this will attract the eye of almost every pvper in the game... A ladder full of all the best and worst pvpers in the game. This would also be a great experience for the people newer to pvp to learn or the ones that wish to learn. Imagine the blood bath happening with 100 people able to hit you? This would need to offer a new and totally unique reward unlike any other that's fairly difficult to obtain. I don't want to see the rewards flooded into the game... I want to see a maximum of 1 of whatever a week being put into the game. A new invention to FS not a knock off of something else or an upgraded version. Heck maybe even throw in a small % chance to auto post someone to the bounty board. The percent would have to be tweaked later on when we can see the popularity of the ladder. If there are 1000 hits going out everyday i'd imagine a 2%-4% chance would be a nice fit. Feel free to expand, debate or tweak the idea to your liking

 

***Edit

 

Forgot to mention that you should also be able to play both ladders simultaneously 

Edited by EpicPiety, 22 January 2016 - 04:16.

[sweetlou]

I like the poll being public

[EpicPiety]

I like the poll being public

Care to post a better idea then? You were complaining about the ladder no more than a few days ago. Better reward for the current ladder system won't cut it i'm afraid.

[WhoToldYouSo]

Wouldn't this just be like any other Ladder but with the small diffrence that higher level players would be able to smash the spine out of your body?

 

There's alot of PvPers in all ranges of the game - So let's say the level range set would be 1200 - You would probably only see players level 900+ join to have a chance to match the stats (or they would simply hit players offline as it goes already on the regular ladder) - If a level 500 player joined such a ladder they would just get wrecked over night?

 

How is this diffrent from the arena? besides you can use buffs (and high level players will have the benefit of having much more powerful buffs than the players who only just got the level for the allowed maximum item levels)

[EpicPiety]

Wouldn't this just be like any other Ladder but with the small diffrence that higher level players would be able to smash the spine out of your body?

 

There's alot of PvPers in all ranges of the game - So let's say the level range set would be 1200 - You would probably only see players level 900+ join to have a chance to match the stats (or they would simply hit players offline as it goes already on the regular ladder) - If a level 500 player joined such a ladder they would just get wrecked over night?

 

How is this diffrent from the arena? besides you can use buffs (and high level players will have the benefit of having much more powerful buffs than the players who only just got the level for the allowed maximum item levels)

Buy a 900 set? Most guilds have utility to all gear ranges. IDK about anyone else but i'd have a difficult time in some of the lower level brackets it's been a long time since i thought of gear sub 1000.

Edited by EpicPiety, 22 January 2016 - 13:42.

[EpicPiety]

Believe this would be a better integration method to counter the slaughter fest of the lower levels in the seasons...Like i said it doesn't have to go exactly this way. Just use it as a template to improve seasons somehow. The idea i proposed is sort of a ladder/season hybrid. Instead of running all the time there could be designated time windows where they would spawn...Say 2+ weeks every quarter...So 4 times a year. During the 2+ weeks about 7+ could spawn so every level range has a chance of showing up.

Edited by EpicPiety, 22 January 2016 - 13:50.

[yotwehc]

Sorry auto opt in even at 10% makes this idea DOA. I think the biggest flaw with seasons was the rollout and not allowing users to opt out initially. I don't think it would have been as unpopular if that option was available from the start but who knows.

[yghorbeviahn]

I really like the idea of a small chance to be opted-in on this, to be honest, I wish that could be implemented even at the Ladder we have now, but at 2,5% chance, or 5%, since the brackets are huge.

I'm trying to understand the proposal yet, I'm a bit confused and I'll cast my vote later.
pv
PS: To do PvP you need another player at the same range/bracket that is also willing to do PvP, that's the main reason why PvP is dead...Levellers can just kill creatures all day because they are always there, PvPers can't.

[EpicPiety]

I really like the idea of a small chance to be opted-in on this, to be honest, I wish that could be implemented even at the Ladder we have now, but at 2,5% chance, or 5%, since the brackets are huge.

I'm trying to understand the proposal yet, I'm a bit confused and I'll cast my vote later.
pv
PS: To do PvP you need another player at the same range/bracket that is also willing to do PvP, that's the main reason why PvP is dead...Levellers can just kill creatures all day because they are always there, PvPers can't.

Yes...and i was thinking if maybe a level 1000 bracket spawned all those pvpers above that would participate including 800-1000 or even lower... Would be all relative if a lower level spawned or higher... Like i said pick and choose what you like and do something with the ladder...

[Filletminion]

Yes It will be like any other Ladder, until every single player has level 60 composing pots available to them. Pvpers know stats they know buffs why would they join something knowing before they start they cannot win?

[EpicPiety]

Yes It will be like any other Ladder, until every single player has level 60 composing pots available to them. Pvpers know stats they know buffs why would they join something knowing before they start they cannot win?

Which brings me to my other thing i forgot to bring up... NO BUFFS ALLOWED ... For those that think everyone should be on an equal playing field...There ya go... I mean either that or only buffs that are level 175-...anything over that won't count in combat and they will be ignored... Vanilla FS buffs only...Don't wanna see fist fight etc...Maybe you can earn buffs only through spending stamina hitting people aswell... 100 stam put in 10 stam worth of buffs you can use

Edited by EpicPiety, 22 January 2016 - 23:02.

[yghorbeviahn]

Ok, I'll try to resume your idea, say if I'm wrong.

Your idea:
- 1 single bracket, with random gear level cap:
With, lets say, 70% chance to be 1200 or lower, and 30% to be 1201 or higher.

- Gear level cap, by random:
Any player who is participating on a 'New Ladder' lvl 1200, would be able to wear any lvl1200 on this.

- You'll be able to opt-in/out:
But there is a small chance that you'll be opted-in by game for 1 'season' of that Ladder, you'll be out of the next one if you still opted-out.

- Limit of level 175 buffs:
Those can be from Composing (to raise duration) or casted, but none buff above lvl 175 will be allowed.

- Prizes:
To be discussed further.

Is that it?

-

Some suggestions:

- Buffs:
Would be nightmare to handle the buff level limit, because lets say I'm using a SH480 to hunt a Titan and someone hit me, will my SH480 be useless on the combat? That's not cool. We need to make it an automatic thing, you can use buffs of any level, but once the combat starts the game will consider any higher level buffs as a level 175, so if I have a SH480 running it will not be useless, and when the combat starts it will be considered a SH175.

- Gear level cap:
That's the best idea to make it more fair, but we need further notice about the gear cap of the next reset to be able to acquire the gear needed for battle, maybe a notice on the 'New Ladder' page saying something like "The next 'New Ladder' Season will be level 890 cap'.

- Chance to be auto opted-in:
Just code it right to be sure that no one can buy PvP Protection and be able to opt-out, now on the Ladder you can opt-in, hit people (unbountyable) and buy PvP Protection to be out of the Ladder, this should not occuor.

- PvP Rating:
Right now on the Ladder when you hit people with low PvP Rating, you get less Rating on a victory, I think that is not smart, make it 1 victory = 1 Point, 1 loss = 0 points lost, so people will need to be active to get more points, and no one can group together against a single player to harass his chance to win.

- Stamina use/XP Loss/XP Gain:
Make it a 50 stamina hit, 100 stamina per hit is way too much for something that big. XP Loss would be counted for a 50 stamina hit. And make it with some XP Gain.
(Not sure about the XP Gain formula, should not be big, so people can not do their 'hunts' on the Ladder instead of killing creatures, maybe consider the XP Gain based on the level cap of the season, I don't know exactly how to do it).
 

[EpicPiety]

- Gear level cap, by random:
Any player who is participating on a 'New Ladder' lvl 1200, would be able to wear any lvl1200 on this.

Yes... So only gear under level 1200 will be calculated in.

 

- Gear level cap:
That's the best idea to make it more fair, but we need further notice about the gear cap of the next reset to be able to acquire the gear needed for battle, maybe a notice on the 'New Ladder' page saying something like "The next 'New Ladder' Season will be level 890 cap'.

Very good idea...A little bit of a heads up would be perfect. Believe this will really help the market as well... All those higher levels would suddenly be showing the lower level/overfarmed gear some love... Prices would raise on all of that which would also help out the lower levels because they are generally the ones that farm it.

 

- Stamina use/XP Loss/XP Gain:
Make it a 50 stamina hit, 100 stamina per hit is way too much for something that big. XP Loss would be counted for a 50 stamina hit. And make it with some XP Gain.
(Not sure about the XP Gain formula, should not be big, so people can not do their 'hunts' on the Ladder instead of killing creatures, maybe consider the XP Gain based on the level cap of the season, I don't know exactly how to do it).
 

I see no issues with all of this... 50 stamina would make it easier for those with lower stam banks to participate...Also adding in some small xp gain from each attack will make PvP more viable for those that also wanna level... Of course they won't be gaining nearly as many Stam:Level as someone purely leveling but at least something very small but yet still rewarding to show for it.

 

 

- PvP Rating:
Right now on the Ladder when you hit people with low PvP Rating, you get less Rating on a victory, I think that is not smart, make it 1 victory = 1 Point, 1 loss = 0 points lost, so people will need to be active to get more points, and no one can group together against a single player to harass his chance to win.
 

Couldn't agree anymore...Nothing more annoying than someone sneaking in a win at no effort... People can put in dozens upon dozens of hits and be at about 1400 rating... But someone can just hit them a couple of times take the lead last minute.

 

- Chance to be auto opted-in:
Just code it right to be sure that no one can buy PvP Protection and be able to opt-out, now on the Ladder you can opt-in, hit people (unbountyable) and buy PvP Protection to be out of the Ladder, this should not occuor.

 

Your saying no one should be able to opt into the ladder and be playing it then suddenly decide they don't wish to be in it any longer so they spend a fsp on PvP protection to get themselves out of it before the ladder resets? If so yes totally agree... When on the ladder you should not be able to purchase pvp protection.

 

- Buffs:
Would be nightmare to handle the buff level limit, because lets say I'm using a SH480 to hunt a Titan and someone hit me, will my SH480 be useless on the combat? That's not cool. We need to make it an automatic thing, you can use buffs of any level, but once the combat starts the game will consider any higher level buffs as a level 175, so if I have a SH480 running it will not be useless, and when the combat starts it will be considered a SH175.
 

If the buff level was over level 175 it would simply scale down to it on activation of combat

 

 

 

Essentially this was my idea to integrate the ladder with seasons... Ladder seasons lol. It's important to note that this would run parallel to the old ladder system... The old ladder system wouldn't be done away with. But these ladder seasons would be treated like a global event... Say we get one every quarter so 4 a year. The ladders would spawn and reset just like the old ladder for 2 weeks each quarter. Otherwise the cows are just going to add the seasons back as a global event and we all know the community hated seasons as a whole apparently... I thought this would appeal to people that liked the seasons and those who didn't sort of an intermediate for everyone to enjoy.

Edited by EpicPiety, 24 January 2016 - 00:08.

[EpicPiety]

Sorry auto opt in even at 10% makes this idea DOA. I think the biggest flaw with seasons was the rollout and not allowing users to opt out initially. I don't think it would have been as unpopular if that option was available from the start but who knows.

10% was merely a filler number... i'd imagine it should be at about 1-2%... I can't give an exact number because i don't know how many players log in each day... I'd imagine only 10 players out of every single player that logs in should get auto opted in. With 1000 playes thats only a 1% chance... Being opted in once every 100 resets? That's really not too bad is it? I'd imagine there would be a grace period for new accounts as well. With a little bit heavier weights of opting in someone closer to the level range...Anyways i said everything is up for debate...This idea is very dynamic and things can be added,removed or modified .

Edited by EpicPiety, 24 January 2016 - 00:26.

[Mister Doom]

You'd also have to factor in LUP and the fact that lvl 2800 players will have a lot more than say a lvl 1000 player, which in turn leads to better results from base stat enhancing skills.

 

I'm not really sure what to make of all of the other aspects if I'm honest but this little point really stuck out almost straight away.

[yotwehc]

Thankfully the majority is voting against this. Sorry EP. I don't care if forced opt in is 0.01%, I won't bother with the idea as you are basically going to lose players any idea pushing players out is bad. Everyone will beat up on the weakling you are forcing into this bloodbath. Not sure why you think this is a great idea

[Pythia]

I voted no. 

 

When seasons rolled out, I stopped hunting, I stopped doing anything but watching and mending gear when I had to.    

 

I opted out as soon the that option became available.

 

I have played that part of other games and it got old real fast.

 

Thanks, but no thanks.

[EpicPiety]

Thankfully the majority is voting against this. Sorry EP. I don't care if forced opt in is 0.01%, I won't bother with the idea as you are basically going to lose players any idea pushing players out is bad. Everyone will beat up on the weakling you are forcing into this bloodbath. Not sure why you think this is a great idea

Auto opt in was just an idea...Doesn't have to be in it lol. Not a make or break change if its there or not. Like i said i like this idea personally because of the flexibility of it.

Edited by EpicPiety, 25 January 2016 - 02:56.

[Pythia]

Auto opt in with a russian roulette aspect is not a good thing for any player that has no interest in PvP.

 

So many threads pushing different tweeks to the same thing also gets old.

 

I'm sure the admin will bend, fold, spindle and twist a few more times before they find something that works for those that PvP and as long as I'm not auto opted in and I have no chance of being spun up with target on me I didn't ask for, I wish you happiness and good gaming.

 

Enjoy.

[Egami]

Hmmm, well... this post is rightfully confusing and that's not EP's fault. 

 

Seasons was HCS' intention to replace the ladder and that was thrown out. Personally, I think the Ladder should be maintained and, as some other recent posts have suggested, Seasons should return. HCS has said they are "working on" the return of Seasons. 

 

So, my personal critique is: Don't post a topic with Seasons and then start discussing the Ladder. The two are not the same entity.

 

Ever since Seasons was implemented I felt that all of the things that came out of it needed to be placed in their own separate topic. For me, the entire thing was epic and had tons of great concepts that were sidelined, simply because there was too much all at once. For me, Seasons, BB, Ladder, PvP, GvG are all separate game aspects. There were great additions for all, but they needed to be directed to the appropriate game aspects.

 

What I would like to see at this point is a topic started by HCS on Seasons with the updated concept for some player input. Yes, there are some other posts out there.