339 replies to this topic

[justinian9]

or it could be that:

• "Harvey" just bounties him and the attacker loses XP with 10 x 10 stam clear
• "Harvey" just bounties him and the attacker loses XP with 10 x 100 stam clear OR
• "Harvey" just bounties him and the attacker loses XP full 5 levels OR
• that his attacker does not bounty Harvey at all OR
• OR ........

these are all assumptions !!!!

 

but back to your example:

in theUPGRADED SYSTEM

 

if "Harvey" is a leveler then the possibility of him hitting back is very low knowing that there is a possibility that he would end up on the BB himself !!!!

IF "Harvey" is under constant attack then he would join the soft PvP system !!!  it would not matter if his attacker is on the raw or soft side, for gold hits you get posted on the raw BB losing XP !!!!

there the attacker can not take his XP, only his gold BUT "Harvey" will keep posting him and he will be losing XP !!!

 

I consider myself a pvper who can hold my own against any player BUT if I was constantly hitting a player hourly on the "soft" side then in the long run it would do me much more damage than to my target + I risk a ban from HCS  !!!!

I would be losing stamina, fsps, buffs, xp, levels

my target would be losing fsp

my target would have the possibility of the mighty DEFLECT, chance of winning an attack, ....

 

one more thing: the saying that pvpers do not care about their xp / levels is not true !!! pvpers do care !!! difference between a pvper and a leveler is that a leveler cares for his xp / levels more than a pvper !!!

 

 

NOW let me ask you a question too:

system is NO XP LOSS(DOOMs system)

Harvey is leveling, gets attacked and MT kicks in, he loses all his gold, he wants to punish his attacker but posting will only result in the attacker losing pvp xp which the attacker does not value at all !!!

@BadPenny: how can Harvey get his attacker punished for losing all his gold that he got after his long hunt?

 

 

do you really not see how fair the UPGRADED SYSTEM even after the explaination? 

Question using BadPenny's example: 

 

If soft player lists Raw player the Raw players goes on Raw BB correct?

 

Who is going to clear this Raw player from the Raw BB... only Raw players correct?

 

So Raw Players sits on BB until bounty time runs out and no one hits him as most PvP players are friendly to each other.  Maybe someone clears him with conserve and 10 stam hits... what good was the bounty?

[wil72]

XP loss is not the problem, it's the game mechanics that allow XP loss to "bully" that is the problem. And yes you can say send in a ticket, do this, do that but at the end of the day the mechanics allow what could be termed "bullying". Aren't HCS hands tied because of this? How do you punish a player that is only doing what the game allows? Unfortunately it appears that some have abused these mechanics and now XP loss is deemed a problem by HCS. This was always going to happen folks. " To much of a good thing " an all that.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[mary4ever]

Well, obviously it IS true - because otherwise they'd not be tempted to PvP, knowing full well that there is a risk of losing said XP / Levels.

I have encountered many pvpers and some said that they do not care but as soon as they started losing levels their attitude changed !!! they tried to "intimidate" BUT everyone cares for his xp / levels !!!!

the only time I encountered players who really did not care about their xp / levels were levelers who wanted to drop levels on purpose to get more GXP !!!!

Of course, most players also know that some (NOT all) pvp'rs band together to soft clear each other and delevel anyone who dares to hit back. Level / XP is only valuable when it prevents gear being worn.

 

1. Soft hits Raw = Soft BB. This is a prevention of abuse. If soft hitting raw went to the raw bb, then levels and xp are lost. Soft hitting raw will only do gold theft (and how many pvp'rs keep gold on hand?) and earn some pvpxp. Why should they lose levels for that ? - Wanting them to lose levels is exactly the same as the scenario we have now.

• in the upgraded system the "soft" attacker would only get GOLD, no rating by hitting "raw"
• THIS is an abuse because if the same thing happened and a raw hit a soft then raw would lose XP !!!
• you do realize that pvpers need to level too, with your suggestion you are giving an overhelming advantage to the soft side by gold hitting the raw side without any punishment but if raw did the same thing they would lose XP / levels

this is clearly not fair !!!

2. Soft hits Soft = Soft BB. That's simple - a like for like "back and forth". Why should soft hitting soft involve regular xp loss. Both those players in that scenario have opted for the soft side to specifically AVOID losing xp.

what about those who are on "soft" side doing leveling or potion sellers or players who hold gold on had and they get hit?

posting their attacker will not get the attacker punished, only pvp xp will be lost for the attacker on the BB !!!!

some of those who are on the "soft" side want to pvp (get pvp xp) without any risk or hurting anyone BUT gold hits hurt the victim and that is why all gold hits should be with XP LOSS !!! hitting for pvp xp hurts nobody and therefore is with NO XP LOSS !!!

if potion sellers are not able to punish their attackers (with xp loss) then it would be safer for them to sell all their potions for FSPs and not for gold anymore !!!! currently DC225 potion for 30k-40k in AH, it would then jumb to DC225 potion for 1 FSP !!! that is about 5 times more expensive !!! prices would explode and the real victims would be the new players who joined, lower lvl players + "poor" players RESULTING in a declination of players which is very bad for the game !!!!

 

this is clearly not fair !!!

Soft should be "policed" by Soft - Raw "policed" by Raw.

 

Anything else is just an attempt to try to maintain as big a percentage of the current PvP system (with XP loss) as possible - and that is, the whole crux of the matter.

 

TOO MANY PLAYERS ARE SICK OF XP LOSS - if that were not the case, the cows would not be doing anything about it ...

• from the number of players posting in forums it is clearly that there are far more people for XP LOSS than the NO XP LOSS system (go and count them) but then again only a small part of players visit the forums
• if you are sick of XP LOSS then no problem, join the "soft" side and you will never have to bother with XP LOSS again as long as you do not do any gold hits !!! you can do "pvp xp" hits without any fear of losing any gold or XP !!!!

[Pardoux]

 

Well, obviously it IS true - because otherwise they'd not be tempted to PvP, knowing full well that there is a risk of losing said XP / Levels.

I have encountered many pvpers and some said that they do not care but as soon as they started losing levels their attitude changed !!! they tried to "intimidate" BUT everyone cares for his xp / levels !!!!

the only time I encountered players who really did not care about their xp / levels were levelers who wanted to drop levels on purpose to get more GXP !!!!

Of course, most players also know that some (NOT all) pvp'rs band together to soft clear each other and delevel anyone who dares to hit back. Level / XP is only valuable when it prevents gear being worn.

 

1. Soft hits Raw = Soft BB. This is a prevention of abuse. If soft hitting raw went to the raw bb, then levels and xp are lost. Soft hitting raw will only do gold theft (and how many pvp'rs keep gold on hand?) and earn some pvpxp. Why should they lose levels for that ? - Wanting them to lose levels is exactly the same as the scenario we have now.

• in the upgraded system the "soft" attacker would only get GOLD, no rating by hitting "raw"
• THIS is an abuse because if the same thing happened and a raw hit a soft then raw would lose XP !!!
• you do realize that pvpers need to level too, with your suggestion you are giving an overhelming advantage to the soft side by gold hitting the raw side without any punishment but if raw did the same thing they would lose XP / levels

this is clearly not fair !!!

2. Soft hits Soft = Soft BB. That's simple - a like for like "back and forth". Why should soft hitting soft involve regular xp loss. Both those players in that scenario have opted for the soft side to specifically AVOID losing xp.

what about those who are on "soft" side doing leveling or potion sellers or players who hold gold on had and they get hit?

posting their attacker will not get the attacker punished, only pvp xp will be lost for the attacker on the BB !!!!

some of those who are on the "soft" side want to pvp (get pvp xp) without any risk or hurting anyone BUT gold hits hurt the victim and that is why all gold hits should be with XP LOSS !!! hitting for pvp xp hurts nobody and therefore is with NO XP LOSS !!!

if potion sellers are not able to punish their attackers (with xp loss) then it would be safer for them to sell all their potions for FSPs and not for gold anymore !!!! currently DC225 potion for 30k-40k in AH, it would then jumb to DC225 potion for 1 FSP !!! that is about 5 times more expensive !!! prices would explode and the real victims would be the new players who joined, lower lvl players + "poor" players RESULTING in a declination of players which is very bad for the game !!!!

 

this is clearly not fair !!!

Soft should be "policed" by Soft - Raw "policed" by Raw.

 

Anything else is just an attempt to try to maintain as big a percentage of the current PvP system (with XP loss) as possible - and that is, the whole crux of the matter.

 

TOO MANY PLAYERS ARE SICK OF XP LOSS - if that were not the case, the cows would not be doing anything about it ...

• from the number of players posting in forums it is clearly that there are far more people for XP LOSS than the NO XP LOSS system (go and count them) but then again only a small part of players visit the forums
• if you are sick of XP LOSS then no problem, join the "soft" side and you will never have to bother with XP LOSS again as long as you do not do any gold hits !!! you can do "pvp xp" hits without any fear of losing any gold or XP !!!!

 

 

I think we're just going to have to agree that our viewpoints on this are radically different and that you see abuses possible in the amendment I suggested, whereas I see abuses in your amended "final" solution.

 

Maybe neither your NOR my suggestion is a viable solution to the current problem of players feeling victimised and thus the cows taking action.

 

Players are just going back and forth here until the cows provide a framework of THEIR ideas ...

Edited by Pardoux, 14 October 2014 - 23:48.

[mary4ever]

I think we're just going to have to agree that our viewpoints on this are radically different and that you see abuses possible in the amendment I suggested, whereas I see abuses in your amended "final" solution.

 

Maybe neither your NOR my suggestion is a viable solution to the current problem of players feeling victimised and thus the cows taking action.

 

Players are just going back and forth here until the cows provide a framework of THEIR ideas ...

with your suggestion gold hits on "soft" side will be without any punishment and gold theft would be all over the place and this will sooner than later bring "chaos"

many pvpers would join the "soft" side just to hit everyone for gold because there is no punishment at all !!!

it will not take long before players start submitting tickets to HCS because of constantly getting attacked

that is why gold hits need to be punished with XP LOSS !!!

[Pardoux]

with your suggestion gold hits on "soft" side will be without any punishment and gold theft would be all over the place and this will sooner than later bring "chaos"

many pvpers would join the "soft" side just to hit everyone for gold because there is no punishment at all !!!

it will not take long before players start submitting tickets to HCS because of constantly getting attacked

that is why gold hits need to be punished with XP LOSS !!!

 

WHICH THEY'VE SAID IS GOING - hence my statement about us all going round in circles ...

[justinian9]

XP loss is not the problem, it's the game mechanics that allow XP loss to "bully" that is the problem. And yes you can say send in a ticket, do this, do that but at the end of the day the mechanics allow what could be termed "bullying". Aren't HCS hands tied because of this? How do you punish a player that is only doing what the game allows? Unfortunately it appears that some have abused these mechanics and now XP loss is deemed a problem by HCS. This was always going to happen folks. " To much of a good thing " an all that.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

Good point, but my scenario is an example of an issue.  Less Players on Raw side and almost all of them friendly.  The soft side BB will have more consequences then the Raw BB.  

 

Am I misunderstanding something?

[mary4ever]

with your suggestion gold hits on "soft" side will be without any punishment and gold theft would be all over the place and this will sooner than later bring "chaos"

many pvpers would join the "soft" side just to hit everyone for gold because there is no punishment at all !!!

it will not take long before players start submitting tickets to HCS because of constantly getting attacked

that is why gold hits need to be punished with XP LOSS !!!

 

WHICH THEY'VE SAID IS GOING - hence my statement about us all going round in circles ...

nothing is set in stone UNTIL there is an official post in the NEWS section !!!!

BigGrim himself visited this topic many times and did not lock it, only those very few players that kept pushing for NO XP LOSS demanded to lock the topic so that other players can not discuss any further !!!

 

if there is a solution to "satisfy" both levelers & pvpers which I believe the UPGRADED SYSTEM (I know it is not perfect yet) does then why not go for it instead of choosing to upset the pvpers or the levelers?

Edited by mary4ever, 15 October 2014 - 00:30.

[Pardoux]

nothing is set in stone UNTIL there is an official post in the NEWS section !!!!

 

if there is a solution to "satisfy" both levelers & pvpers which I believe the UPGRADED SYSTEM (I know it is not perfect yet) does then why not go for it instead of choosing to upset the pvpers or the levelers?

 

Hence my saying let's wait for the cows to give their ideas now - what they decide could be COMPLETELY different to anything so far suggested. They have a fine line to walk here, especially with this emotive game facet - so both sides should try to work WITH them, rather than AGAINST each other.

[mary4ever]

Hence my saying let's wait for the cows to give their ideas now - what they decide could be COMPLETELY different to anything so far suggested. They have a fine line to walk here, especially with this emotive game facet - so both sides should try to work WITH them, rather than AGAINST each other.

we finally agree on something   

HCS could maybe take part of my suggesion OR nothing OR accept it OR take part of DOOMs suggestion OR part of it OR accept it OR just mix them OR like you said something completely different, we do not know

 

that is why I will keep posting about the UPGRADED SYSTEM until HCS official NEWS post, maybe some players can help with their input to improve it

[Trailman]

There was a suggestion a while back in a thread not sure which one (there are 3 on this topic) to make 2 choices when attacking a player,

 

10 stam or 100 stam.

 

A 10 stam hit takes PvPxp/Prestige and can't have a bounty on it.

 

A 100 stam takes PvPxp/Gold/Prestige and can have a bounty placed on it.

 

I believe that when a bounty can be placed there should be xp loss.

 

I would also suggest that ALL bounty attacks be set at 100 stam (no more soft clears). No BB attacks can have a bounty placed. If you lose to your target you lose both xp and gold so the risk remains. XP loss has been removed from the BB I would like to see it reinstated if xp loss is removed from most of the game. Players NEED a way to delevel if they want to and finding a SE attacking naked as I joked about is the only way with BG's plan.

 

The above allows for gold theft yet still protects all non BB players from losing xp.

 

The above removes the opportunity for BB bashing. I think one of the things BG is talking about is a player returning an attack, getting placed on the BB and losing 5.

 

Example

So a PvP'er 100 stam's me he gets my gold and little or no PvPxp because I don't PvP. I post him and he loses both PvPxp and xp for that attack. As a leveler I have my vengeance and the PvP'er has my gold but not my xp which I do value.

 

So a PvP'er 100 stam's me he gets my gold and little or no PvPxp because I don't PvP. I return the attack with a 10 stam attack no bounty can be placed but I still gain both PvPxp/Prestige from the attack if I win. If he wins he gets 10 PvPxp just like any other attack. DEFLECT DOES NOT COUNT AS A WIN

 

So a PvP'er 100 stam's me he gets my gold and little or no PvPxp because I don't PvP. I return the attack with a 100 stam attack, that's down right stupid no PvP'er holds any real gold to steal.

 

PvPxp is 10 per attack no matter what the stam is off board if my PvPxp is equal or greater then and 0 PvPxp if mine is less then. I lose 5 from the attack. This will stop all farming for PvPxp

PvPxp is 20 per attack on the BB no matter what the PvPxp is. Target loses 5 PvPxp per attack until reduced to 0

Prestige is no longer awarded from the BB it can only be earned from 10/100 off board stam PvP attacks

Edited by Trailman, 15 October 2014 - 01:35.

[gomezkilla]

 

I tried keeping the system as simple as possible, I believe the more change/complicated you make a system the lower the chance to get it accepted / for new and current players to easy & quickly understand it

You said it there: Simplicity is key. So why don't we think up ONE system rather than two? One is simpler than two, right?

 

with the upgraded system:

you can CHOOSE which PvP system to join (raw PvP or soft PvP), pvp as you much as you want + satisfy the rest (potion sellers, players while hunting getting attacked, ...) in short people who have lots of gold on hand, if they get attacked for their gold they will get to punish their attacker with XP LOSS, regardless of whether you are on raw PvP or soft PvP system !!!

Sounds just like the ladder system if I'm not mistaken.... and look how that whole plan worked out. 

 

it is very important to get ALL gold hits on the raw BB for many reasons, PvP does not only effect PvP, it effects other aspects of the game too !!!

EXAMPLE: if potion sellers are not able to punish their attackers (with xp loss) then it would be safer for them to sell all their potions for FSPs and not for gold anymore !!!! currently DC225 potion for 30k-40k in AH, it would then jumb to DC225 potion for 1 FSP !!! that is about 5 times more expensive !!! prices would explode and the real victims would be the new players who joined, lower lvl players + "poor" players RESULTING in a declination of players which is very bad for the game !!!!

This made me laugh a lot! Here's a little idea: (Caution: it may blow a few minds here) Instead of selling individual DC 225s for 30-40k each, we could sell them in packages for FSP. In this case, 5-6 per 1 FSP.

 

----------------------------------------------

 

So, a few questions:

 

1. What is considered a gold hit? Define it for me if you will.

2. PvPXP is traded in both systems, correct?

     2a. Aren't we making PvPing even more complicated by adding more and more things? If we add in PvPXP, then we                are dealing with Gold, PvPXP, XP, and prestige. 

 

3. I'm just thinking aloud here: We now technically have two PvP systems, PvP Ladder and non-ladder, and we have one Bounty Board system. With this new "upgraded system", we will still have two PvP systems, but we will now have two BB systems. What's next after this goes awry? More subcategories to everything? With the arena talk, some people want to divide up everybody, kind of like this. I keep trying to get across that by doing so, the arena would not be helped, killed in fact. What makes division in the PvP any better?

 

And can we please stop with all the colors? Penny's soft purple is fine, but neon yellow, green, and dark red.... no thank you.

 

Thanks for listening,

Gomez.

[mary4ever]

 

 

 

You said it there: Simplicity is key. So why don't we think up ONE system rather than two? One is simpler than two, right?

the upgraded system is simple:

raw hits raw => raw BB 
raw hits soft => raw BB  
soft hits soft => soft / raw BB  (soft BB if "pvp xp" hit / raw BB if "gold" hit)
soft hits raw => raw BB

(you do not get any gold from "pvp xp" hits, all attacks that take gold are on the raw BB)

 

Sounds just like the ladder system if I'm not mistaken.... and look how that whole plan worked out. 

 

This made me laugh a lot! Here's a little idea: (Caution: it may blow a few minds here) Instead of selling individual DC 225s for 30-40k each, we could sell them in packages for FSP. In this case, 5-6 per 1 FSP.

I do not know why it would make you laugh but anyhow:

• you will need to catch the potion seller online to get him to sell you the potions
• what is if the potion seller refuses to sell to me + you cheaper or in packages?
• there were often times when I needed a pot in the middle of leveling (because it expired, ...) or for pvp and I bought it from AH and got it in less than 5 mins, with your suggestion it would only work if the potion seller is online + accepts to sell to me and even thein I would need to maybe negotiate the price with him and that would take time (I have enountered potion sellers who refused to sell to me but if their potions are in AH then everyone can buy them)
• ......

 

----------------------------------------------

 

So, a few questions:

 

1. What is considered a gold hit? Define it for me if you will.

any attack that steals gold !!! (in the upgraded system the "pvp xp" hits do not take any gold, only pvp xp !!!

2. PvPXP is traded in both systems, correct?

NO, "pvp xp" rating is traded on the "soft" PvP and "pvp" rating is on the raw PvP

     2a. Aren't we making PvPing even more complicated by adding more and more things? If we add in PvPXP, then we                are dealing with Gold, PvPXP, XP, and prestige. 

hits between raw and soft are "gold" hits !!!

NO "pvp xp" or "pvp" rating is traded from these gold hits !!!

 

3. I'm just thinking aloud here: We now technically have two PvP systems, PvP Ladder and non-ladder, and we have one Bounty Board system. With this new "upgraded system", we will still have two PvP systems, but we will now have two BB systems. What's next after this goes awry? More subcategories to everything? With the arena talk, some people want to divide up everybody, kind of like this. I keep trying to get across that by doing so, the arena would not be helped, killed in fact. What makes division in the PvP any better?

well if the upgraded system "satisfies" the levelers & pvpers then why not?

I have no idea about the arena except that tokens were introduced BUT that is not the topic here

And can we please stop with all the colors? Penny's soft purple is fine, but neon yellow, green, and dark red.... no thank you.

 

Thanks for listening,

Gomez.

 

Edited by mary4ever, 15 October 2014 - 01:37.

[gomezkilla]

 

the upgraded system is simple:

raw hits raw => raw BB 
raw hits soft => raw BB  
soft hits soft => soft / raw BB  (soft BB if "pvp xp" hit / raw BB if "gold" hit)
soft hits raw => raw BB

(you do not get any gold from "pvp xp" hits, all attacks that take gold are on the raw BB)

 

Are hits using the system below? 

 

10 stam or 100 stam.

 

A 10 stam hit takes PvPxp/Prestige ...

 

A 100 stam takes PvPxp/Gold/Prestige ...

 

 

I do not know why it would make you laugh but anyhow:

• you will need to catch the potion seller online to get him to sell you the potions
• what is if the potion seller refuses to sell to me + you cheaper or in packages?
• there were often times when I needed a pot in the middle of leveling (because it expired, ...) or for pvp and I bought it from AH and got it in less than 5 mins, with your suggestion it would only work if the potion seller is online + accepts to sell to me and even thein I would need to maybe negotiate the price with him and that would take time (I have enountered potion sellers who refused to sell to me but if their potions are in AH then everyone can buy them)
• ......

Planning! You should try it, it works wonders. Buy a package deal when this person is online, or ask for an ST and accept it when you get it. Then you have X amount of potions to use from that package. 

 

well if the upgraded system "satisfies" the levelers & pvpers then why not?

You are assuming that this system will satisfy everyone. You ask for suggestions, ask for explanations regarding opinions, yet you offer none in return for my questions? All I get from you is "why not?"..  *Shaking my head*

[mary4ever]

Are hits using the system below? 

NO, please read the upgraded system on page17 !!!

 

Planning! You should try it, it works wonders. Buy a package deal when this person is online, or ask for an ST and accept it when you get it. Then you have X amount of potions to use from that package. 

I already explained to you why it won't work:

• you will need to catch the potion seller online to get him to sell you the potions
• what is if the potion seller refuses to sell to me + you cheaper or in packages?
• there were often times when I needed a pot in the middle of leveling (because it expired, ...) or for pvp and I bought it from AH and got it in less than 5 mins, with your suggestion it would only work if the potion seller is online + accepts to sell to me and even thein I would need to maybe negotiate the price with him and that would take time (I have enountered potion sellers who refused to sell to me but if their potions are in AH then everyone can buy them)
• what about new players and others who have a few free BP slots or do not have enough BP slots
• I know many players who buy most of their potions just before they hunt
• how many PM would those potion sellers get
• .......

why so much trouble when it is simpler to just go to AH and buy the potions you need?

 

You are assuming that this system will satisfy everyone. You ask for suggestions, ask for explanations regarding opinions, yet you offer none in return for my questions? All I get from you is "why not?"..  *Shaking my head*

I think the upgraded system will satisfy most, there is no perfect system that will satisty everyone !!! but we can try to satisfy the mayority, the more like it the better 

I am answering your questions, read my replies !!!

now I am asking you a question:

read the upgraded system on page17 and tell me if you like it or not, if not then please give a REASON (WHY) with maybe an example !!!

Edited by mary4ever, 15 October 2014 - 02:22.

[gomezkilla]

I already explained to you why it won't work:

 

• you will need to catch the potion seller online to get him to sell you the potions
• what is if the potion seller refuses to sell to me + you cheaper or in packages?
• there were often times when I needed a pot in the middle of leveling (because it expired, ...) or for pvp and I bought it from AH and got it in less than 5 mins, with your suggestion it would only work if the potion seller is online + accepts to sell to me and even thein I would need to maybe negotiate the price with him and that would take time (I have enountered potion sellers who refused to sell to me but if their potions are in AH then everyone can buy them)
• what about new players and others who have a few free BP slots or do not have enough BP slots
• I know many players who buy most of their potions just before they hunt
• how many PM would those potion sellers get
• .......

why so much trouble when it is simpler to just go to AH and buy the potions you need?

Again, plan! Message potion maker who will most likely have a deal in his bio (if he's smart) asking to buy one of his package deals, wait for ST, accept ST. New players now have 10 bp slots and I highly doubt they already have 2-3 setups for PvPing to work around other PvPers setups. So those 10 slots can be used for potions. And you are worried about PMs... I am a merchant, similar to a potion maker except I deal in items and trading, and I get excited to see I have new log messages that are potential deals! And so will those potion makers.

 

It is not simpler to just go to the AH to get what you need, it is merely the lazy route. 

 

now I am asking you a question:

read the upgraded system on page17 and tell me if you like it or not, if not then please give a REASON (WHY) with maybe an example !!!

 

 

in the soft system you will have 2 options to attack a player: "gold" hit or "pvp xp" hit

if you attack someone with a "gold" hit then you will be posted on the raw BB !!!

 

if you attack someone wit a "pvp xp" hit then you will be posted on the soft BB !!!

furthermore any gold loss from a "pvp xp" hit will be ZERO, only pvp xp will be lost !!! no gold !!!

Oh look! More things to add to an already simple PvP system.

 

All this is doing is adding more things to the ladder system that we have now. Looking back on the ladder, I don't see any upside to this idea. 

 

Raw PvP: Where you hit for gold and xp loss like normal PvPing and PvP rating is exchanged as well just like in the Ladder now. Raw PvP has its own Raw BB. Soft PvPers can hit him, but if he counter bounties, they end up in the Raw BB to lose some real XP.

 

Soft PvP: Where you for PvPXP or gold and the PvPXP grows from Doom's thread. Hit for PvPXP - go to soft BB to lose that PvPXP. Hit for gold - go to Raw BB to lose real XP. 

 

What happened to getting hit, then going to the BB, losing some XP, and that circle of life? You have successfully made a very simple PvP system into a complicated PvP system with multiple outcomes for all these hits. If you can compare the PvP systems, now and this one, this one is WAY more complicated than the system now. And I thought we were trying for a simple system...

[mary4ever]

 

Again, plan! Message potion maker who will most likely have a deal in his bio (if he's smart) asking to buy one of his package deals, wait for ST, accept ST. New players now have 10 bp slots and I highly doubt they already have 2-3 setups for PvPing to work around other PvPers setups. So those 10 slots can be used for potions. And you are worried about PMs... I am a merchant, similar to a potion maker except I deal in items and trading, and I get excited to see I have new log messages that are potential deals! And so will those potion makers.

you are assuming that all potion sellers would sell to all players !!! I told you that I have enountered potion sellers who refused to sell to me but if their potions are in AH then everyone can buy them !!!

when I was new to the game I only had 2-3 BP slots, I was buying potions just before my hunt, it took me some time to increase my BP slots until I could hold a 2nd setup (including the one I was wearing)

keep in mind that not everyone donates !!!

It is not simpler to just go to the AH to get what you need, it is merely the lazy route. 

 

 

 

 

Oh look! More things to add to an already simple PvP system.

 

All this is doing is adding more things to the ladder system that we have now. Looking back on the ladder, I don't see any upside to this idea. 

 

Raw PvP: Where you hit for gold and xp loss like normal PvPing and PvP rating is exchanged as well just like in the Ladder now. Raw PvP has its own Raw BB. Soft PvPers can hit him, but if he counter bounties, they end up in the Raw BB to lose some real XP.

 

Soft PvP: Where you for PvPXP or gold and the PvPXP grows from Doom's thread. Hit for PvPXP - go to soft BB to lose that PvPXP. Hit for gold - go to Raw BB to lose real XP. 

I told you to go to page17 and read the upgraded system, you did that and shortly replied with a summary understanding it

this proves further that the upgraded system is really simple to understand  

 

What happened to getting hit, then going to the BB, losing some XP, and that circle of life?

it s still the same, you hit someone, you go to the BB, you lose gold+xp or pvp xp, that circle

You have successfully made a very simple PvP system into a complicated PvP system with multiple outcomes for all these hits. If you can compare the PvP systems, now and this one, this one is WAY more complicated than the system now. And I thought we were trying for a simple system...

so your problem with the upgraded system is that it is not simple enough? eventhough you understood it very quickly like many others I told to read it

Edited by mary4ever, 15 October 2014 - 03:19.

[gomezkilla]

you are assuming that all potion sellers would sell to all players !!! I told you that I have enountered potion sellers who refused to sell to me but if their potions are in AH then everyone can buy them !!!

 

when I was new to the game I only had 2-3 BP slots, I was buying potions just before my hunt, it took me some time to increase my BP slots until I could hold a 2nd setup (including the one I was wearing)

keep in mind that not everyone donates !!!

Did you even read what I wrote? Please keep in mind that others may not run into your problem of no one wanting to sell to them. And I am assuming that the potion makers want to actually sell their stuff, whether they want to pick and choose who to sell to is up to them.

 

I told you to go to page17 and read the upgraded system, you did that and shortly replied with a summary understanding it 

this proves further that the upgraded system is really simple to understand

Because I can summarize your comment, that means your system in simple? You don't find that statement to be much of a stretch?

 

Let's see, my summary of your system took up 5 lines to write.. let's try the current system:

 

Current: Where you hit for gold and xp - go to BB to lose real XP.

 

Wow! That was done in 1 line... I forgot, was 5 simpler than 1 or the other way around?

 

so your problem with the upgraded system is that it is not simple enough? eventhough you understood it very quickly like many others I told to read it

My problem with this new "upgraded" system is that there are too many parts. The only good that came with this "upgrade" from the OP is that there is roughly only one bounty board save for the Soft-Soft hits. That was the only "progress" made with this idea, and don't get to thinking I'm all of sudden for this idea, because you're dead wrong if you do.

 

Enough of us talking, why don't we ask some levelers and PvPers to come and view this idea and give their opinions on it? I am against this idea. You, the creator, are for the idea, unless I've convinced you that this is a bad idea....?

[mary4ever]

1st) I never said that the upgraded system was simpler than ..... !!! I said it was simple !!! there is a difference between these 2

 

2nd) the upgraded system can be done in 1 line too: """ any kind of attack that steals gold gets you on the BB to lose XP """

[BigGrim]

There was a suggestion a while back in a thread not sure which one (there are 3 on this topic) to make 2 choices when attacking a player,

 

10 stam or 100 stam.

 

A 10 stam hit takes PvPxp/Prestige and can't have a bounty on it.

 

A 100 stam takes PvPxp/Gold/Prestige and can have a bounty placed on it.

 

I believe that when a bounty can be placed there should be xp loss.

 

I would also suggest that ALL bounty attacks be set at 100 stam (no more soft clears). No BB attacks can have a bounty placed. If you lose to your target you lose both xp and gold so the risk remains. XP loss has been removed from the BB I would like to see it reinstated if xp loss is removed from most of the game. Players NEED a way to delevel if they want to and finding a SE attacking naked as I joked about is the only way with BG's plan.

 

The above allows for gold theft yet still protects all non BB players from losing xp.

 

The above removes the opportunity for BB bashing. I think one of the things BG is talking about is a player returning an attack, getting placed on the BB and losing 5.

 

Example

So a PvP'er 100 stam's me he gets my gold and little or no PvPxp because I don't PvP. I post him and he loses both PvPxp and xp for that attack. As a leveler I have my vengeance and the PvP'er has my gold but not my xp which I do value.

 

So a PvP'er 100 stam's me he gets my gold and little or no PvPxp because I don't PvP. I return the attack with a 10 stam attack no bounty can be placed but I still gain both PvPxp/Prestige from the attack if I win. If he wins he gets 10 PvPxp just like any other attack. DEFLECT DOES NOT COUNT AS A WIN

 

So a PvP'er 100 stam's me he gets my gold and little or no PvPxp because I don't PvP. I return the attack with a 100 stam attack, that's down right stupid no PvP'er holds any real gold to steal.

 

PvPxp is 10 per attack no matter what the stam is off board if my PvPxp is equal or greater then and 0 PvPxp if mine is less then. I lose 5 from the attack. This will stop all farming for PvPxp

PvPxp is 20 per attack on the BB no matter what the PvPxp is. Target loses 5 PvPxp per attack until reduced to 0

Prestige is no longer awarded from the BB it can only be earned from 10/100 off board stam PvP attacks

 

I'd suggest adding that to the pinned BLOOD topic.

 

Okay, I've had to trim a bunch of bickering and flaming. This thread has pretty much run it's course and everyone is going around in circles and rising to each others bait. This is locked.