44 replies to this topic

[xpwaste]

really? this is your reason?

 Community was all fine and dandy then this happened and now look...tons of people hating each other that use to be friends....tons of non combative based chars being killed by pvpers when they are trying to enjoy the game their way. Not a good vibe this will send to anyone.

I am out of this.

[HuMoR]

Limit daily farming time in ta for 1hour. Shouldn't let anyone flood the economy with mats they can farm for hours non stop due to no threat to them. Let them reap the benefits of endless resources for free.

 

Sad to see the game go the way it is.

you create a large problem that way,also when steam live comes..and the game floods with players..due to the limited spawns of the island vs population...you will have not enough resources on an island for all but more then enough pkers to slaughter them all....creating an even bigger problem.

[HuMoR]

100 spots to gather from..being 1oo players max to be there (most likely less due to the fact of people disliking sharing...) so 1/10th population maximum able to be there. other of the skillers going to different servers and etc...ok..well just out of currrent population 1/4 the population is pvp....so 250 pvpers...lvl tiering combat to diffuse high lvl pvp killing lower lvled resolves nothing...nothing at all. and you just further create an issue and make a bigger gap or slaughter. So you can have 100 people there gathering being killed by pvpers massively. Then you make the game ass backwards and basically the pvpers gain skill lvls by killing all the people working to advance their skills  

I think you are a bit biased towards it as you choose to not work towards your lvls but instead just rather kill skillers and get their stuff to lvl up your own...as that's the only possible reason as to why you would even support such an flawed system is if you are trying to reap the benefits of its current structure..

skillers put in hours and hour of gathering to be killed and have nothing left...
pvpers get to do what they do having fun killing skillers and advance furhter using the stuff they just took from the skillers .

great game hope you sense my sarcasm.

I support it too, under one condition

skillers get an option where....if they target you and collect resources outside of TA then each resource they collect should come directly from your gold. so 1 log chopped = 1 gold lost because...well its only fair  

Edited by HuMoR, 06 August 2014 - 15:03.

[HappyDays]

When I used to play a while back. There used to be places to harvest for resources outside TA. Have these been reduced to a point where only TA is now viable ??

[RISDMAC]

I personally find the risk in TA well worth the reward considering I collect more resources per gather.

This is an incentive to the skiller to gether here rather than in the safety of the non pvp zone but come with the obvious risk.

 

Introducing a limit cap on the area of +/- so many levels would only cripple TA as a pvp zone for those who enjoy it.

 

I would suggest 2 possible solutions:

 

1. increase the buff on lower players so that they are more powerful (stat wise) in comparison to level capped players.

This would mean that while they have less effective skills in combat, they would pack more of a punch, especially since a lot of the PK'ing involves level 45's bulldozing their way around the place.

 

2. Add a gatherers shield to a player who gets attacked while in the prone state of being mid gather. The shield would block all damage taken for 3 seconds: This is the length of time lost through animation while transitioning into combat. This would give the player being attacked 3 seconds to prepare the skills/gear to fight back fairly (may have ax/pickaxe/fishing rod etc equipped)

 

With both of these said, I still stand of the opinioin that this is a PVP zone and any limitation applied to the PVP mechanics is a step in the wrong direction.

 

If you absolutely hate PVP and want to skill in peace, stay out of TA, you can successfully level your way up in skills without needed this one particular zone to do it 

[HuMoR]

I think a lot of you aren't seeing the point of this thread. 

It is not about hating pvp or skilling or etc.

its about organizing the game the correct way,and making it more balanced and focused on what it should be focused on.

also,J when steam live happens you wont be able to gather anything at all...if you try you will die not enough spots and an over populated mass of pvpers on an island= a joke..

Also,yes fable they have been tweaked and nerfed a bit. slower respawns and insta spawns removed...only Ta has them now and double resources. so yes Ta is really the only correct viable way for excelling forward at a decent rate.

throwing skillers into a pit..to make them fight for what they have already spent hours working on is a bit pointless....you make a battleground of pvpers fighting skillers. so pvpers go in kill skillers risking nothing...and skillers have to fight for their life to save what they work for. So if this is to stay,then sometihng needs to be done that forces pvpers to have to fight skillers and risking something at some point or else you have a half assed game focusing on one prime aspect and giving the wrong incentives to do something.



resources like this shouldn't be in Ta at all....it ruins the longevity of this game.

Edited by HuMoR, 06 August 2014 - 16:51.

[HappyDays]

Also,yes fable they have been tweaked and nerfed a bit. slower respawns and insta spawns removed...only Ta has them now and double resources. so yes Ta is really the only correct viable way for excelling forward at a decent rate.

throwing skillers into a pit..to make them fight for what they have already spent hours working on is a bit pointless....you make a battleground of pvpers fighting skillers. so pvpers go in kill skillers risking nothing...and skillers have to fight for their life to save what they work for. So if this is to stay,then sometihng needs to be done that forces pvpers to have to fight skillers and risking something at some point or else you have a half assed game focusing on one prime aspect and giving the wrong incentives to do something. Resources like this shouldn't be in Ta at all....it ruins the longevity of this game.

 

I have no idea why hcs do things like this. Nerfing the outside nodes to force people onto a battle ground in some attempt to generate some false activity for pvp :/ . It probably won't lead to anything good long term. On what kind of boost steam will bring in terms of players into the game remains to be seen, it may increase the pop, but it is better to ground expectations as the game may not get this massive boost some people expect steam to bring in. I recall all the people outside the city mines crafting and they had to extend the crafting area to be larger ....... fast forward a while and it was like a ghost town around it and all the people that signed up left and the pop crashed in some respects. So if eldevin does indeed get a lot of people from steam, hopefully hcs put their best foot forward.

[RISDMAC]

Also,yes fable they have been tweaked and nerfed a bit. slower respawns and insta spawns removed...only Ta has them now and double resources. so yes Ta is really the only correct viable way for excelling forward at a decent rate.
 

 

I would disagree that they have been nerfed as all the spots I would usually go to give me the same amount of resources that they used to and the respawns are almost the same (some node groupings have been increased from 3s to 4s, but nothing has decreased in my vew)

 

Also insta spawns are still around -> removing these is a good thing as they were never an intentional part of the game.

 

 

I don't mean to disagree, but with and injection of players from steam TA could truely be an amazing pvp battle ground. I don't see the problem with it being filled with more players. If a map size increase or level restriced areas need to be introduced to tackle over crowding these could be addressed.

 

Lets not forget that stacks of smuggled goods stack at 999 -> another HUGE convenience to goatheres/skillers as this saves on space meaning you don't need to have a single sack in order to compete with selling your gathered mats.

 

And I would repeat that nothing is forcing you to go there, you can still scout the best spot for resources you are gathering and grind these away like we all did back at the start.

 

Huge convenience for storage, increase to resources gathered, chance to find smuggled gold + tokens for valor ->

The combination of all these make TA quite balanced in my view and if you get attacked, blow off some steam by attacking back, you might surprise yourself by enjoying it like I did . 

[HuMoR]

I would disagree that they have been nerfed as all the spots I would usually go to give me the same amount of resources that they used to and the respawns are almost the same (some node groupings have been increased from 3s to 4s, but nothing has decreased in my vew)

 

Also insta spawns are still around -> removing these is a good thing as they were never an intentional part of the game.

 

 

I don't mean to disagree, but with and injection of players from steam TA could truely be an amazing pvp battle ground. I don't see the problem with it being filled with more players. If a map size increase or level restriced areas need to be introduced to tackle over crowding these could be addressed.

 

Lets not forget that stacks of smuggled goods stack at 999 -> another HUGE convenience to goatheres/skillers as this saves on space meaning you don't need to have a single sack in order to compete with selling your gathered mats.

 

And I would repeat that nothing is forcing you to go there, you can still scout the best spot for resources you are gathering and grind these away like we all did back at the start.

 

Huge convenience for storage, increase to resources gathered, chance to find smuggled gold + tokens for valor ->

The combination of all these make TA quite balanced in my view and if you get attacked, blow off some steam by attacking back, you might surprise yourself by enjoying it like I did . 

I'm the one doing the killing and taking the resources and even i see the flaws in this. This is a horrible design of the game and will cripple this game in the long run can already see it.

[Brioche]

I think I get one of Guthix's points. One main drawback of the pvp area in TA is that pkers bear no risk in killing skillers, and skillers gain no rewards in fighting pkers. This creates an imbalance in that pkers go around TA killing skillers with impunity, and skillers have to be constantly under duress while gathering resources.

 

I was thinking of something like Runescape's "skull" system for initiating combat, but I'm not sure if it would work here; combat in Eldevin is way too fast-paced, and if this was implemented, skillers wouldn't be able to get a pre-emptive strike in for fear of receiving this debuff. Still, there needs to be some kind of penalty for for pkers attacking skillers that would allow skillers to gain some benefit as well.

[HuMoR]

I think I get one of Guthix's points. One main drawback of the pvp area in TA is that pkers bear no risk in killing skillers, and skillers gain no rewards in fighting pkers. This creates an imbalance in that pkers go around TA killing skillers with impunity, and skillers have to be constantly under duress while gathering resources.

 

I was thinking of something like Runescape's "skull" system for initiating combat, but I'm not sure if it would work here; combat in Eldevin is way too fast-paced, and if this was implemented, skillers wouldn't be able to get a pre-emptive strike in for fear of receiving this debuff. Still, there needs to be some kind of penalty for for pkers attacking skillers that would allow skillers to gain some benefit as well.

that is one of the points yes,and no matter how you look at it you create a big divide in your player base when you make your skillers>fight your pve/pvpers. and its already happening at a large scale. So think of how much bigger it will be when there is actually more pvpers there then skillers..by more then 2x....you will just get complaints of all the killing. Thus making it an false sense of hope to even gather there making it 100% pointless to have put them there in the first place. Also this just reduces the longevity when everyone speeds to lvl 45s in skills just by getting to lvl 15 cb which takes all of 1 hour to do...

They need to use an idea basically like what i said in the OP to not only increase the longevity but to create more incentives to increasing skills....and balancing out the market for skills. At this moment in the game there is no true incentive to raising your skills if you have a friend or friends with it maxed already. They need to do more then just make a gangbang moshpit oof pvpers killing skillers.

Edited by HuMoR, 07 August 2014 - 02:17.

[xpwaste]

Remove gathering nodes from TA.

Add new pvp sets, with new pvp attributes. only one new attribute will suffice.

Make this set purchasable from valor.

Let pkers fight each other in TA to gain increased amount of valor than right now.... for obviously the valor would be needed to upgrade the pvp sets & to buy gems.

Pvpers get there pvp sets and gems

non pvpers can gather in safety.

Skillers and pvper are seperated from everything then. It's fair for all.

Or remove pvping/areans/TA any form of pvp. Play a fps is you need pvp.. make eldevin more like sims. everyone seems happy with that.

yep im crazy!

Edited by xpwaste, 07 August 2014 - 07:41.

[Anakiro]

Also,yes fable they have been tweaked and nerfed a bit. slower respawns and insta spawns removed...only Ta has them now and double resources. so yes Ta is really the only correct viable way for excelling forward at a decent rate.

 

If you feel you've found some nodes where this is the case, please let us know so we can look into it. We haven't nerfed any nodes. What I suspect might be the issue is that TA now feels incredibly quick compared to the rest of the nodes in the world, which may make everything else seem slower.

 

Instant respawns have been removed in some places because, let's face it, there's no way that was a good thing for the game. Being able to stand at a node with complete impunity just encouraged bots. The fix, however, was to place other nodes nearby. As a result you should always be close to a node, you just have to go looking for it.

 

We've always said that TA is a risk/reward system. From our point of view it's working well. TA is populated and world PvP is taking place. If you don't want to engage in the PvP then you don't go there. The gathering situation outside TA is the same as it has always been.

[RISDMAC]

I'm the one doing the killing and taking the resources and even i see the flaws in this. This is a horrible design of the game and will cripple this game in the long run can already see it.

I see what you mean by the PK'er running no risk.

 

I think adding a shield to the atttacked player who was gathering should suffice to give them protection to prepare to defen themselves, this would be nice. (see earlier post, should only last the time it takes to end gathering animation)

 

Also maybe introduce a new negative buff to the attacker who initiated the combat.

This buff ensures that if they die, they lose 100% of their smuggled items plus a % (0.01 or so) of their actual gold.

 

 

With that said, I think the principle of TA for gatherers should remain the same -> I wouldn't like to see nodes removed nor would I like to seem them relocated to a "safe" zone.

Edited by JQuan, 07 August 2014 - 08:46.

[ernzor]

Put a temple in the trappers village where prospective gatherers can pray/give offering to the PvE God (yes PvE god, he protects them from PvPers). The amount they give will then give them a passive buff (strength determined on amount given) that would discourage PKers from attacking them.

 

The buff activates if you are attacked (even if you dodge/block) not if you defend yourself. So only if someone takes the first swing at you.

 

You lose the buff if you take the first swing at someone.

 

What the buff is? I dont know, didnt get that far, am sure someone else can come up with that...

[xpwaste]

I see what you mean by the PK'er running no risk.

 

I think adding a shield to the atttacked player who was gathering should suffice to give them protection to prepare to defen themselves, this would be nice. (see earlier post, should only last the time it takes to end gathering animation)

 

Also maybe introduce a new negative buff to the attacker who initiated the combat.

This buff ensures that if they die, they lose 100% of their smuggled items plus a % (0.01 or so) of their actual gold.

 

 

With that said, I think the principle of TA for gatherers should remain the same -> I wouldn't like to see nodes removed nor would I like to seem them relocated to a "safe" zone.

 

Put a temple in the trappers village where prospective gatherers can pray/give offering to the PvE God (yes PvE god, he protects them from PvPers). The amount they give will then give them a passive buff (strength determined on amount given) that would discourage PKers from attacking them.

 

The buff activates if you are attacked (even if you dodge/block) not if you defend yourself. So only if someone takes the first swing at you.

 

You lose the buff if you take the first swing at someone.

 

What the buff is? I dont know, didnt get that far, am sure someone else can come up with that...

 

Debuff/punish people for attacking people in a PVP zone which warns you that "you might die on entering."

legit.

[RISDMAC]

Debuff/punish people for attacking people in a PVP zone which warns you that "you might die on entering."

legit.

 

This was a possible solution to those who feel PK'ers have an unfair advantage over gatherers.

 

The shield I proposed should only last during the gathering animation - it would end as soon as the player is ready to start combat.

 

Also whoever initiates the attack  should bear a greater risk than the person defending - it adds more incentive to ensure you win and punishes you if you picked a target that was more deadly than you initially thought :-)

 

 

At the end of the day I do not want TA to change as I like it, but have no objection to making it a more balanced experience for everyone.

[xpwaste]

This was a possible solution to those who feel PK'ers have an unfair advantage over gatherers.

 

The shield I proposed should only last during the gathering animation - it would end as soon as the player is ready to start combat.

 

Also whoever initiates the attack  should bear a greater risk than the person defending - it adds more incentive to ensure you win and punishes you if you picked a target that was more deadly than you initially thought :-)

 

 

At the end of the day I do not want TA to change as I like it, but have no objection to making it a more balanced experience for everyone.

ernzor is a friend of ben.. the pkers who kills all, has he gathered a billion resources out of killing all the people he see?

What i am feeling with all this whine going on, that the pve people are so addicted to the good drop rates, they want to abuse it,get everything they want within few hours and be safe while doing so.

[stefliew]

What i am feeling with all this whine going on, that the pve people are so addicted to the good drop rates, they want to abuse it,get everything they want within few hours and be safe while doing so.

 

The way I see it, the pvpers are equally addicted to the good drop rates they get from killing people. That's why they keep burying the complaints of the pve people with "You were warned, lolol" and "stop whining, it's a pvp area".

 

pve people gather resources, and then pvpers waltz in, kill people, grab stuff, run. Basically, the pvpers "want to abuse it, get everything they want within few minutes and be safe while doing so".

 

There needs to be a proper risk/reward system for pvp areas. The risk that gatherers have is the risk of losing resources that they have gathered, if they are killed. Their reward is the awesome smuggled stuff.

 

Where is the risk for pvpers?

[xpwaste]

The way I see it, the pvpers are equally addicted to the good drop rates they get from killing people. That's why they keep burying the complaints of the pve people with "You were warned, lolol" and "stop whining, it's a pvp area".

 

pve people gather resources, and then pvpers waltz in, kill people, grab stuff, run. Basically, the pvpers "want to abuse it, get everything they want within few minutes and be safe while doing so".

 

There needs to be a proper risk/reward system for pvp areas. The risk that gatherers have is the risk of losing resources that they have gathered, if they are killed. Their reward is the awesome smuggled stuff.

 

Where is the risk for pvpers?

It has double drop rates. right?

so even if you loose 50% of your gathered resources, you would still be left with enough resources that you could have harvested outside of TA. where is the loss for pve players. your still getting the same amount as outside + more if your lucky.. wheres the loss for you in that?