95 replies to this topic

[Maehdros]

just have to ROFL as when I suggested something similar to this months ago almost all the people in here +1 the original poster who also said the idea was insane are now in favor of it

Months ago pvp wasn't on the verge of being shoved out the door. It;s seen as the red headed step child of fallen sword now.

[rhann123]

just have to ROFL as when I suggested something similar to this months ago almost all the people in here +1 the original poster who also said the idea was insane are now in favor of it

Months ago pvp wasn't on the verge of being shoved out the door. It;s seen as the red headed step child of fallen sword now.

Just now? I'm pretty sure PvP has always been one of the "taboo" things.

[lordthade]

The bounty board's problems are related to, but not necessarily part of the PvP in-game.

Frankly, it was flawed from the start and deserves a separate discussion (as has been had many times over).

Either way, if PvP were so dead I wouldn't be on my fifth consecutive month of buying PvP protection to avoid it. :roll: You may not be able to hit all the people you want, but I promise there's no situation I can imagine where I would be alright with someone rising up out of the ether to rob me of gold OR xp. It simply does not interest me to hit back, either.

For the record, I'm not saying PvPers can't hit each other. More power to ya. The retaliation idea has some merit. Particularly if the retaliation might get some of the gold/xp back--if so, the original hitter shouldn't be able to immediately "hide" the gold on another player and I don't know how you might stop that from happening.

[Khanate]

I think the idea is to hit to get a part of your exp back. If you get hit for gold, it should remain in the hands of the attacker (minus whatever you get back from him on your retaliation hit).

[Etlebrook]

I have said this before... but perhaps it makes more sense now?

Please bear in mind that I do not PvP, and am now totally confused over what rules on which week on what day applies where... Honestly too many changes lately to keep with it, especially since my interest does not lie with any aspects of PvP in this particular game.

Why can't we all compromise over the XP loss?? It is the one thing that the levelers like me hate, and I honestly do not see how its loss benefits the attacker.... So leave the XP alone except under special circumstances. And definitely leave in gold loss. If I am stupid enough to carry a lot of gold, then I deserve to get whacked... LOL

Perhaps the changes should be geared toward risk for PvPers. That is another thing which bothers levelers. If a PvPer attacks me off-line, honestly where is the risk?? You have all the time in the world to figure out the numbers, adjust your armour set and buffs, and then have at it. There is no way for an off-line leveler to defend. So suppose we up the value of risk?? If both parties are currently online, and the attack occurs, if the PvPer wins, then s/he gets more points for winning. If the target is offline, then the award is substantially less.

There should also be a higher reward dependent upon the level gap between attacker and target. If the target is in the upper allowable range, than the rewards should be greater to the winner.

Finally keep the bounty board as is, and let that be the only place that XP loss occurs for the target. A change may be needed in the rules of putting someone on the board perhaps?? For instance, you can put one random person up once a week, who has not attacked you but has pissed you off??? Once a week because if it was 24 hours I can see a lot of abuse happening... And the once a week would force people to think carefully about exactly who they wanted to put up there LOL

Just thoughts from a non-PVPer.... who doesn't mind the idea of PvP for gold and awards, but thinks if you remove the XP loss the levelers would probably go along with the new medals.... with a new point system??

[Eleonora2]

The idea of gaining exp for PvP has been proposed countless times and shot down as many times. It's a terrible idea. Gain your exp through PvE; it is also, like PvP, a vital aspect of the game.

Could you explain why its a terrible idea? Xp is lost when defeated by creatures similar to how its lost when defeated in pvp. What would be detrimental about it being gained in pvp?

Really Meahdros at your level you should know better.

Xp lost, and in your proposal gained by attacker, is for a large part of the game 4 or more times greater than can be gained by PvE with the same amount of stam. So what you ask for is for PvP to be 4 times more efficient to gain levels than hunting PvE. Also have a look at the sacrifice buff, if a PvE hunter wants a tiny bit more xp it comes at a significant price in reduced gold income. PvP can as always pick their target for highest gold gain.

You're a big fella so i think you can take it if i summarize in one catching remark:
This is a classic example of someone wanting to have it both ways.

That said i do like the idea of revenge hit(s). To make it easier to code maybe make option on BB 'create bounty and accept it yourself' (bounty tickets used, no reward offered, double xp loss as normal bounty, max 2 lvl lost)

Oh and the BB is a failure because it's extremely easy to use as exploit

[Maehdros]

The idea of gaining exp for PvP has been proposed countless times and shot down as many times. It's a terrible idea. Gain your exp through PvE; it is also, like PvP, a vital aspect of the game.

Could you explain why its a terrible idea? Xp is lost when defeated by creatures similar to how its lost when defeated in pvp. What would be detrimental about it being gained in pvp?

Really Meahdros at your level you should know better.

Xp lost, and in your proposal gained by attacker, is for a large part of the game 4 or more times greater than can be gained by PvE with the same amount of stam. So what you ask for is for PvP to be 4 times more efficient to gain levels than hunting PvE. Also have a look at the sacrifice buff, if a PvE hunter wants a tiny bit more xp it comes at a significant price in reduced gold income. PvP can as always pick their target for highest gold gain.

You're a big fella so i think you can take it if i summarize in one catching remark:
This is a classic example of someone wanting to have it both ways.

That said i do like the idea of revenge hit(s). To make it easier to code maybe make option on BB 'create bounty and accept it yourself' (bounty tickets used, no reward offered, double xp loss as normal bounty, max 2 lvl lost)

Oh and the BB is a failure because it's extremely easy to use as exploit

You propose a revenge bounty? That's too abusable, sorry. The purpose of a bounty is for others to assist/ defend the victim.

hitting 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 with the same set up. Or attacking various players ( with varying sets), with the risk of losing more then you can gain. The suggestion was meant to add more excitement and participation to the pvp aspect of the game, while also eliminating alot of the *fear* from it.


The only issue I could see with the bounty board would be an EOC deleveling a low level to gain levels.

Simple fix. If the bounty board target (player being attacked is lower level then Player A, Player A only gain the % equal to Player B's level. Example: This prevents a level 1400 from gaining 10% of a level for each 100 stam hit by smashing a level 300

[iron300]

Nice Idea +1.

[Eleonora2]

You propose a revenge bounty? That's too abusable, sorry.

How can that be abused, the victim cannot take revenge unless and until (s)he gets hit? :?

The purpose of a bounty is for others to assist/ defend the victim.

BB revamp, hire a hunter who will defend you the next 10 attacks made on you. Attacker cannot see who and even if a hunter has been hired. (i know that is likely to kill pvp but one crazy idea is worth another and yes this could easily be exploited too)

The only issue I could see with the bounty board would be an EOC deleveling a low level to gain levels.

I was referring to current BB. In case you dont know there are players who will hit you to entice a bounty. They *want* to get bountied so a buddy can cash the reward. Now there's an exploit.

You did not comment in any way on the xp gain being very much out of balance with xp gain possible through PvE. With your idea i could 100 stam hit 10 players of my level to gain a level. Stam used per level: 1k, stam needed to gain level through PvE: 4k. With the risk of PvP not greater than it is now this is totally a win key.

Apart from the question if PvP should be more rewarding than as is.

[fusionj]

Of course I voted yes, but it'll never happen.

We're simply outnumbered by levelers, and if HCS were to run a poll, thousands would only see this as another reason for them to be hit, when they want nothing to do with PVP.

I doubt you'll even get an admin post it this thread.

[lordthade]

No xp from PvP.

Increase gold loss/sunk. Give the defender a shot at the gold in the attacker's hand. However, xp should never be gained form PvP.

It will be used for leveling. In fact, I can totally envision someone "selling" themselves to others for leveling purposes so they could be hit and used to pole-vault.

If hunting on AL175 takes 4,000 stamina to earn a level (or thereabouts) at my level, and 10 100-stam hits earns a level also... well, I'm not great at math but I can see which method will be used/abused.

[Maehdros]

If hunting on AL175 takes 4,000 stamina to earn a level (or thereabouts) at my level, and 10 100-stam hits earns a level also... well, I'm not great at math but I can see which method will be used/abused.

Is it bad if it causes more people to pvp, instead of level? Oo



10 x 100 stam hits = 10 bounties. possible 20 levels lost. (under the new system)

[DragonLord]

The idea of gaining exp for PvP has been proposed countless times and shot down as many times. It's a terrible idea. Gain your exp through PvE; it is also, like PvP, a vital aspect of the game.

Could you explain why its a terrible idea? Xp is lost when defeated by creatures similar to how its lost when defeated in pvp. What would be detrimental about it being gained in pvp?

XP is lost when defeated by a creature - yes - but normally the players are online, buffed up and as ready as can be during that combat.

A lot (subjective term, I know) of PvP is done against players whilst hunting (so in the wrong gear) or offline (so totally unbuffed).

Not really comparing like with like there Maedros

Like the others tho, I do like the "free hit back" idea.

[Snowy900]

The idea of gaining exp for PvP has been proposed countless times and shot down as many times. It's a terrible idea. Gain your exp through PvE; it is also, like PvP, a vital aspect of the game.

Could you explain why its a terrible idea? Xp is lost when defeated by creatures similar to how its lost when defeated in pvp. What would be detrimental about it being gained in pvp?

XP is lost when defeated by a creature - yes - but normally the players are online, buffed up and as ready as can be during that combat.

A lot (subjective term, I know) of PvP is done against players whilst hunting (so in the wrong gear) or offline (so totally unbuffed).

Not really comparing like with like there Maedros

Like the others tho, I do like the "free hit back" idea.

why are you so against any kind of compromise for pvp?

and i dont agree at all with the offline status,, yes offline hits are more likely when playing the ladder and offline hits occur if someone is silly enough to log off carrying a large amount of gold,
but when people hunt they are usually buffed to the hilt with all the 1200 buffs etc

all i see are levellers trying to force HCS into completely crushing any form of pvp off the ladder or BB

[DragonLord]

Could you explain why its a terrible idea? Xp is lost when defeated by creatures similar to how its lost when defeated in pvp. What would be detrimental about it being gained in pvp?

XP is lost when defeated by a creature - yes - but normally the players are online, buffed up and as ready as can be during that combat.

A lot (subjective term, I know) of PvP is done against players whilst hunting (so in the wrong gear) or offline (so totally unbuffed).

Not really comparing like with like there Maedros

Like the others tho, I do like the "free hit back" idea.

why are you so against any kind of compromise for pvp?

and i dont agree at all with the offline status,, yes offline hits are more likely when playing the ladder and offline hits occur if someone is silly enough to log off carrying a large amount of gold,
but when people hunt they are usually buffed to the hilt with all the 1200 buffs etc

all i see are levellers trying to force HCS into completely crushing any form of pvp off the ladder or BB

Umm, where did I say I was against any sort of compromise ? - All I said that the two things there weren't exactly comparable.

(as for the "when hunting" comment - of course they're buffed up - but which part of "in the wrong gear" did you not read ? Hunting gear is not exactly ideal for defending against an incoming PvP attack)

[Snowy900]

and which part of buffed to the hilt did you miss,,
but that doesnt disguise the fact that the leveling community are happy to do their best to destroy part of this game which will in turn finish the game off

[krypt118]

I really like the revenge idea but i am thrown with XP gain idea. I can see it getting HEAVILY abused by certain players. Not all PvPers show the same kind of respect. The hourly 100 stams ( Farming ) some players will do to gain lvls faster is to great, especially in the lower lvls. Players would quit the game from not being able to lvl them selves out of range. Now if you lowered the % of amount gaining ( maybe 50% of xp loss ), Dropped it to no more the 3days inactive and made XP loss only allowed every 12 hours ( to cut down on farming and abuse ) then i could agree.

The BB idea is great too, The attacked player would almost be guaranteed revenge on the BB.

[DragonLord]

and which part of buffed to the hilt did you miss,,
but that doesnt disguise the fact that the leveling community are happy to do their best to destroy part of this game which will in turn finish the game off

I'm guessing you think that no gear is adequate to defend against an incoming PvP attack then (seeing as you seem intent on disregarding the bit about the WRONG gear), as long as the player is buffed to the hilt ?

Also, the only buffs that would be of use to someone in hunting mode (against an incoming attack) would be Force Shield and Last Ditch ? (maybe others, can't be bothered going thru them all) and maybe the First Strike enhancement. Otherwise, the attacker is going to make sure he can beat the targets defence and do enough damage to cover ARM+HP ?. Therefore, all other hunting buffs (mostly damage orientated) become useless as defence buffs. Or, am I missing something glaringly obvious here ?

Hmm ... But, feel free to keep assuming that all levellers are trying to destroy PvP (and that the death of PvP would = death of the game - MASSIVE leap of faith there)

[iTzBiLL]

A bunch of panty-waisted toe-suckers you are. Grow a pair and hit back, you might actually get a much more unexpected result than you think. I know EVERY SINGLE PERSON in ODP will actually strike up a conversation with you if you do so. You might even get a free lesson on how to go out and hit on your own.

I PvP, and my vote counts... Yes.... +1

[Snowy900]

its too late at night for me to argue the toss about what buffs are used or not used.

but explain for me why hardcore pvpers such as Maehdros, Kitiara and others are almost bending over backwards to try and come up with a solution to the 'PVP' problem, that will give levellers their retribution with a minimum amount of effort on their part, and yet still blow it all out of the water without a thought.

good night