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100 stam / hit ? - It kills BB
Set pvp range to (lvl/50)+5 It will work on any level.
PvP Ladder Suggestions
Started by Hoofmaster, Jul 28 2010 10:57
806 replies to this topic
#82
fs_coyotik
fs_coyotik
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:22
Hi all,
- Bounty Attacks must be 100 stamina otherwise they don't count as bounty hits.
IMO wrong, excluding newbies from bounty hunting effectively.
- Potion to increase PvP rating transfer.
Is it needed? I mean, one can transfer 2% of current value if I recall correctly, that sounds enough to me.
- Reset every two weeks - PvP tokens are allocated to the top 50 which can be exchanged for items.
This could lead to speculations and disadvantaging of people in certain time zones - last-moment attacks to get in the top50... If there are rewards to be given, then it should be based either on how many hours you were in top50 in that period or by the amount of time that your PvP rating was above some value. Yep, either sounds complicated, but IMO necessary.
- Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10
How about making the range increase with levels? At level 1, range of 1 level is enough given the truckload of players, so how about making it level/50 (rounded up)? 2 at level 51, 5 at level 201, 19 at level 951. This would nicely cover the possible relative advantage in levelup points. Level 11 attacking level 1 has quite a big relative advantage (the difference in levelup points is very big compared to the absolute number of them).
(Or as others have suggested, 5+level/50 or any other number you see fit)
- If the targets actual level is outwith the range (ie. they are only in range due to virtual level), only pvp rating / gold is taken.
Better than nothing, but why not simply scrap VL? Before it was introduced, beating the crap out of somebody got him out of your range - and I think that this "defensive" mechanism should be restored. If you worry about advantage of extra levelup points (which in vast majority of cases is almost nonexistent, anyway), solve it by either:
a) forcing player to unassign levelup points when they lose levels.
simply reducing their levelup points by (AL/VL) ratio. Either will achieve what VL is doing, without any nasty sideeffects.
#83
fs_sollimaw
fs_sollimaw
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:23
- Bounty Attacks must be 100 stamina otherwise they don't count as bounty hits.
This means a brand new player will never have the opportunity to take a bounty without donating. As others have said, this is not the correct solution to the problem.
Just remove the ability to place a bounty for less than 10 hits.
- Potion to increase PvP rating transfer.
Eh. Needs a little more info before I can say yes or no.
- Reset every two weeks - PvP tokens are allocated to the top 50 which can be exchanged for items.
Yes. As long as the rewards for PvP Tokens are bound and not insanely overpowered.
- Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10
Yes but only above level 300. Perhaps a second increase to +/-15 levels at 600+ and +/-20 above 900+
- If the targets actual level is outwith the range (ie. they are only in range due to virtual level), only pvp rating / gold is taken.
Not a fix. Remove VL entirely and just force players to unassign skill and level up points the moment they are deleveled. No other actions can be taken. No other page will load except the one to unassign your points. Simple and efficient.
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Additions:
EXP LOSS +/- 5 levels!!!!!!!! Nothing can be fixed without this.
Attacker loses Exp and Gold if they lose. Does not apply on bounty board.
Rating is earned on the bounty board in relation to the level difference between attacker and defender. If attacker is lower level than the defender, bonus rating is earned, and if the attacker is higher level, less rating is earned. A sliding scale would work well here, but all rating earned should be lowered compared to off the board PvP attacks.
If you do all of these you will have a serious chance to fix this permanently.
#84
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:24
I have a question and a suggestion
If i understand how it works, if i get hit i can put the hitter on the BB, but i can do it once every 24 hours while he keeps hitting me every hour...correct?
If this is the case, how about stacking the hits?
For every hit there can be a bounty , i get hit 4 times in a day, i can can put the hitter on the board 4 times, every time someone clears him he will be up again
Now tell me who would keep hitting every hour if he can lose 5 levels every hour?
If i understand how it works, if i get hit i can put the hitter on the BB, but i can do it once every 24 hours while he keeps hitting me every hour...correct?
If this is the case, how about stacking the hits?
For every hit there can be a bounty , i get hit 4 times in a day, i can can put the hitter on the board 4 times, every time someone clears him he will be up again
Now tell me who would keep hitting every hour if he can lose 5 levels every hour?
#85
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:24
21 level compared to how many? 100? more? thats how many they have to lose under the current system, if not more. You said it yourself, you were competitively pvping at your VL of 240 in level 160 gear, thats ALOT more then 21 levels. I understand you protecting your own interest being so far under your VL, but when you attack, is taking xp that big of a deal for you? And if so, would it be to hard to level back up to your range to do so? Your living proof that the BB is not adequate punishment as isInteresting, but it would be the lesser of the two evils. Why? Because that 240 could keep bountying the 250 until he was under his VL and couldnt take any XP anymore, and that would take much less time then the current system where you have to bounty them until where their gear doesnt count anymore lol
Scenario:
Ok, a jerk at 250 keeps 100 stamming a level 240 player (this is if the pvp range is increased to 10 levels either way.) the level 240 player is deleveled 1 level, and is continuously getting attacked and can still lose xp... However, when he retaliates and starts 100 stamming the level 250, he does not lose xp...creating a neverending loop, and a scenario for "Fine Whine"
sorry i have to clear something up that you might not have seen...
It says that they have to be deleveled out of the range for them to no longer take xp...which is 21 levels that the 250 has to lose...I rest my case...
#86
fs_grantslego
fs_grantslego
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:24
Hoof, Grim, neither of you are to far from my range, so before making any updates regarding pvp, then why don't you come into pvpers ranges ( i would enjoy the chance to pvp you, and i am sure others would too). To experience what PVP actually is...
#87
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:28
POSTING FOR TAKING4 AS HE CAN'T GET ON - MAY NOT REFLECT MY OWN VIEWS
- Bounty Attacks must be 100 stamina otherwise they don't count as bounty hits.
Please do not Implement this. This update will dishearten members who are actually after medals, because that would mean that it will take individuals 10 times as long to gain their medals. 10 times as much stamina to be used. Or are you guys planning on an epic item that increases stam gain 10 times, as well? (surely that would cost us, less financially fortunate players, an arm and a leg. lol) Is FS a game, or a way of life? I thaught it was a game with a nice social atmosphere, not meant to be a major time consumer, simply to cater to those with large amounts of money... This particular update would ALSO promote more abuse. Ppl who could care less about the art of bounty hunting will be out for nothing more than taking levels from high level players, just because it is "required". Yes, that means if I have to 100 stam you to get my medal, you and everyone else will definitely be losing levels. It's not having fun pvping, it's bloodlust and brutality. Please do not implement this update.
- Potion to increase PvP rating transfer.
I don't use many potions because they cost, but hey I won't hate on anyone who uses it on me.
- Reset every two weeks - PvP tokens are allocated to the top 50 which can be exchanged for items.
This is a cool idea. I like it.
- Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10
If this is to go into effect, I would also like to see the maximum loss a person can recieve on the bounty board changed to 10 levels.
- If the targets actual level is outwith the range (ie. they are only in range due to virtual level), only pvp rating / gold is taken.
Does nothing to help even the current effectiveness of the bounty board...
- Bounty Attacks must be 100 stamina otherwise they don't count as bounty hits.
Please do not Implement this. This update will dishearten members who are actually after medals, because that would mean that it will take individuals 10 times as long to gain their medals. 10 times as much stamina to be used. Or are you guys planning on an epic item that increases stam gain 10 times, as well? (surely that would cost us, less financially fortunate players, an arm and a leg. lol) Is FS a game, or a way of life? I thaught it was a game with a nice social atmosphere, not meant to be a major time consumer, simply to cater to those with large amounts of money... This particular update would ALSO promote more abuse. Ppl who could care less about the art of bounty hunting will be out for nothing more than taking levels from high level players, just because it is "required". Yes, that means if I have to 100 stam you to get my medal, you and everyone else will definitely be losing levels. It's not having fun pvping, it's bloodlust and brutality. Please do not implement this update.
- Potion to increase PvP rating transfer.
I don't use many potions because they cost, but hey I won't hate on anyone who uses it on me.
- Reset every two weeks - PvP tokens are allocated to the top 50 which can be exchanged for items.
This is a cool idea. I like it.
- Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10
If this is to go into effect, I would also like to see the maximum loss a person can recieve on the bounty board changed to 10 levels.
- If the targets actual level is outwith the range (ie. they are only in range due to virtual level), only pvp rating / gold is taken.
Does nothing to help even the current effectiveness of the bounty board...
#88
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:31
- Bounty Attacks must be 100 stamina otherwise they don't count as bounty hits.
I'm torn on this. It sounds like fun, it would make people take the bounty board more seriously, and definitely weed out alot of the posers. But that's alot of stamina to use for what is already a non-profitable game aspect. If anything, increase the bounty rewards.
- Potion to increase PvP rating transfer.
- Reset every two weeks - PvP tokens are allocated to the top 50 which can be exchanged for items.
Personally I care nothing for PvP rating, but all of your attempts to fix the ladder so far have just made it worse. IMO it needs a complete overhaul (plenty of nice ideas for alternatives floating around the forum), or to be completely removed.
- Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10
Yes~ Also please reinstate the ability to take XP from players below you.
I'm torn on this. It sounds like fun, it would make people take the bounty board more seriously, and definitely weed out alot of the posers. But that's alot of stamina to use for what is already a non-profitable game aspect. If anything, increase the bounty rewards.
- Potion to increase PvP rating transfer.
- Reset every two weeks - PvP tokens are allocated to the top 50 which can be exchanged for items.
Personally I care nothing for PvP rating, but all of your attempts to fix the ladder so far have just made it worse. IMO it needs a complete overhaul (plenty of nice ideas for alternatives floating around the forum), or to be completely removed.
- Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10
Yes~ Also please reinstate the ability to take XP from players below you.
#89
fs_grantslego
fs_grantslego
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:32
21 level compared to how many? 100? more? thats how many they have to lose under the current system, if not more. You said it yourself, you were competitively pvping at your VL of 240 in level 160 gear, thats ALOT more then 21 levels. I understand you protecting your own interest being so far under your VL, but when you attack, is taking xp that big of a deal for you? And if so, would it be to hard to level back up to your range to do so? Your living proof that the BB is not adequate punishment as is
Interesting, but it would be the lesser of the two evils. Why? Because that 240 could keep bountying the 250 until he was under his VL and couldnt take any XP anymore, and that would take much less time then the current system where you have to bounty them until where their gear doesnt count anymore lol
sorry i have to clear something up that you might not have seen...
It says that they have to be deleveled out of the range for them to no longer take xp...which is 21 levels that the 250 has to lose...I rest my case...
i have one thing to say regarding the xp-out of range idea....."Guild wars" would horribly suffer. My thoughts about removing Virtual level:
virtual level is also determining the amount of gold you get from a creature kill, so it does have it's uses.
Although, i would not complain if they removed the Virtual level system, as it would allow me to make 100% gold on my hunts, rather than my current 10-20% of normal gold
#90
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:32
I'd like to make a couple of suggestions:
First; Limiting XP- Either change it so only BB hits take XP loss, or only 100 stam hits generate XP loss.
Second; Potion- Generate a potion that has a probability of "Conserve" for PvP hits, meaning that attacks have +0.0X% to take no stamina, buff named 'Assassinate'
Third; Eliminate counter-bounties
First; Limiting XP- Either change it so only BB hits take XP loss, or only 100 stam hits generate XP loss.
Second; Potion- Generate a potion that has a probability of "Conserve" for PvP hits, meaning that attacks have +0.0X% to take no stamina, buff named 'Assassinate'
Third; Eliminate counter-bounties
#91
fs_80gdan
fs_80gdan
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:33
I LOVE this updates in this way the PvPers will have to work for their money, not just steal them
in this way the PvPers will have to work for their money, not just steal them
#92
fs_darkang3l
fs_darkang3l
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:34
From Stangvalle: PVP Rating should only be transfered with 100 stamina attack that take xp wether its on the BB or through direct pvp. Anyone within hitting range should lose xp. It should not matter if someone is lower level. If bounties must be completed with 100 stam attacks then xp lock should be removed from the game. All bounties should have a 10 kill minimum. If bounties must be completed with 100 stams and xp lock is still available then bounties should be able to be placed on the person who placed the bounty. Attacker loses Exp and Gold if they lose. Does apply on bounty board.
#93
fs_grantslego
fs_grantslego
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:35
I LOVE this updates
we do work for our money, working through your defense, buying items, and losing 5 every once in a while.
I hope you get deleveled for that statement
#94
fs_aleph82
fs_aleph82
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:36
i liked most the ideas, except the potion and the increased range.
but i'm not sure about the 100 stam bounty hits.
BB is supposed to be a deterrent and a punishment, and with 100 stam hits it's going to be, so i like the basic concept. but i'm not sure if it's worth it for the occasional bounty hunters to waste so much stam just to clear a bounty they hold no grudge against, so maybe a new reward system for the BB might also be in order.
but i'm not sure about the 100 stam bounty hits.
BB is supposed to be a deterrent and a punishment, and with 100 stam hits it's going to be, so i like the basic concept. but i'm not sure if it's worth it for the occasional bounty hunters to waste so much stam just to clear a bounty they hold no grudge against, so maybe a new reward system for the BB might also be in order.
#95
fs_theopholis
fs_theopholis
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:36
We would like your feedback regarding the PvP Ladder changes. Here is what we are looking at currently:
- Bounty Attacks must be 100 stamina otherwise they don't count as bounty hits.
If this meant that only 100-stamina hits could land you on the bounty board, it would read "Only 100-stamina hits are bountyable." What this means is that bounty hits (hits that count toward the required number of hits to clear a bounty) must be 100-stamina. I don't see how this is fair to players who haven't upgraded their maximum stamina. You want to encourage new players to try out all aspects of the game so they become more interested in it and continue to play, right? Blocking them from bounty hunting by requiring 100-stamina hits is doing just the opposite.
People can already post in the FSBox that they are offering a special bonus for deleveling on a bounty, but not too many people do that because this advertising approach is unreliable. Perhaps you could add a note section to the bounty listing that allows players to offer more gold/FSP to players who do 100-stamina hits or delevel the bounty target. Maybe have a reward column and a deleveling bonus column, with the deleveling bonus being temporarily removed from a player's stash when the bounty is placed and then either paid out to the player who delevels the target or returned if no one completes the deleveling requirement. If the deleveling bonus is 1 FSP and the bounty target is deleveled twice, five FSP would be temporarily collected, with two being paid out to the attacker upon each delevel and three returned to the bounty placer.
- Potion to increase PvP rating transfer.
OK, but this is likely to be one of those potions that routinely sits unpurchased in the auction house like so many of the new potions you created during the last big potions update and then decided to overcharge for.
- Reset every two weeks - PvP tokens are allocated to the top 50 which can be exchanged for items.
Reset the PvP rating?!?! So players who have played for three years and worked long and hard to acquire 2000+ PvP points are going to have all that wiped away? Keep the PvP rating system as is, please. If you want to implement this kind of strategy, why not add a Top Rated list that resets every two weeks? The winners could be announced in the Tavern Rumors, and there could be arrow buttons at the top/bottom of the list page so players can flip back through the last four or five top-50 lists to see how they've done over time.
- Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10
Like it. +/- 5 levels is limiting at higher levels because there are fewer players at your level and gear changes by level don't necessarily give higher level players a big advantage over lower level players. If you are concerned about this hurting lower-level players, you could start out at +/-5 and change to +/-10 at level 100 or something.
- If the targets actual level is outwith the range (ie. they are only in range due to virtual level), only pvp rating / gold is taken.
I've never been a huge fan of this virtual range thing. Why not just make PvP based on actual level and be done with it. It's a lot simpler and, I believe, more fair. Plus it gives getting deleveled on the bounty board more meaning because a deleveled player may not be able to attack you without you having to both delevel the attacker and increase your own level at the same time to get out of target range.
I'm also in favor of having XP loss go both ways on an attack, though I understand that this idea may decrease PvP. Maybe if you don't want to make XP loss go both ways all the time there could be a buff/potion that gives a defending player the ability to cause XP loss to an attacking player if the defender wins the battle. That way you don't discourage PvP in general but still make losing XP on an attack a possibility.
- Bounty Attacks must be 100 stamina otherwise they don't count as bounty hits.
If this meant that only 100-stamina hits could land you on the bounty board, it would read "Only 100-stamina hits are bountyable." What this means is that bounty hits (hits that count toward the required number of hits to clear a bounty) must be 100-stamina. I don't see how this is fair to players who haven't upgraded their maximum stamina. You want to encourage new players to try out all aspects of the game so they become more interested in it and continue to play, right? Blocking them from bounty hunting by requiring 100-stamina hits is doing just the opposite.
People can already post in the FSBox that they are offering a special bonus for deleveling on a bounty, but not too many people do that because this advertising approach is unreliable. Perhaps you could add a note section to the bounty listing that allows players to offer more gold/FSP to players who do 100-stamina hits or delevel the bounty target. Maybe have a reward column and a deleveling bonus column, with the deleveling bonus being temporarily removed from a player's stash when the bounty is placed and then either paid out to the player who delevels the target or returned if no one completes the deleveling requirement. If the deleveling bonus is 1 FSP and the bounty target is deleveled twice, five FSP would be temporarily collected, with two being paid out to the attacker upon each delevel and three returned to the bounty placer.
- Potion to increase PvP rating transfer.
OK, but this is likely to be one of those potions that routinely sits unpurchased in the auction house like so many of the new potions you created during the last big potions update and then decided to overcharge for.
- Reset every two weeks - PvP tokens are allocated to the top 50 which can be exchanged for items.
Reset the PvP rating?!?! So players who have played for three years and worked long and hard to acquire 2000+ PvP points are going to have all that wiped away? Keep the PvP rating system as is, please. If you want to implement this kind of strategy, why not add a Top Rated list that resets every two weeks? The winners could be announced in the Tavern Rumors, and there could be arrow buttons at the top/bottom of the list page so players can flip back through the last four or five top-50 lists to see how they've done over time.
- Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10
Like it. +/- 5 levels is limiting at higher levels because there are fewer players at your level and gear changes by level don't necessarily give higher level players a big advantage over lower level players. If you are concerned about this hurting lower-level players, you could start out at +/-5 and change to +/-10 at level 100 or something.
- If the targets actual level is outwith the range (ie. they are only in range due to virtual level), only pvp rating / gold is taken.
I've never been a huge fan of this virtual range thing. Why not just make PvP based on actual level and be done with it. It's a lot simpler and, I believe, more fair. Plus it gives getting deleveled on the bounty board more meaning because a deleveled player may not be able to attack you without you having to both delevel the attacker and increase your own level at the same time to get out of target range.
I'm also in favor of having XP loss go both ways on an attack, though I understand that this idea may decrease PvP. Maybe if you don't want to make XP loss go both ways all the time there could be a buff/potion that gives a defending player the ability to cause XP loss to an attacking player if the defender wins the battle. That way you don't discourage PvP in general but still make losing XP on an attack a possibility.
#96
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:37
I LOVE this updates
we do work for our money, working through your defense, buying items, and losing 5 every once in a while.
I hope you get deleveled for that statement
PvPer Motto: "We work hard to steal your gold" Sounds about right
#97
fs_grantslego
fs_grantslego
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Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:38
i remember a solution for pvp, from an old thread, which has since been pruned.
Why not:
10 stam hits take gold/pvp rating
11+ stam hits take More gold/xp.
10 stam hits are non-bountyable.
this would cut down on a large portion of complaining
Why not:
10 stam hits take gold/pvp rating
11+ stam hits take More gold/xp.
10 stam hits are non-bountyable.
this would cut down on a large portion of complaining
#98
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:38
Conserve works in pvp, but it doesnt show itself in battle(doesnt work in gvg though) when conserve activates, no xp is takenSecond; Potion- Generate a potion that has a probability of "Conserve" for PvP hits, meaning that attacks have +0.0X% to take no stamina, buff named 'Assassinate'
So if I take your bounty and 100 stam you 9 times for no reason whatsoever and let someone else finish it, you shoudnt be able to counter bounty me? Maybe for ten stamina hits, but anything more should be bountyable IMO Even the ten stamina hits should be bountyable for those who dont finish your bounties.Third; Eliminate counter-bounties
#99
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:41
Conserve works in pvp, but it doesnt show itself in battle(doesnt work in gvg though) when conserve activates, no xp is taken
Second; Potion- Generate a potion that has a probability of "Conserve" for PvP hits, meaning that attacks have +0.0X% to take no stamina, buff named 'Assassinate'So if I take your bounty and 100 stam you 9 times for no reason whatsoever and let someone else finish it, you shoudnt be able to counter bounty me? Maybe for ten stamina hits, but anything more should be bountyable IMO Even the ten stamina hit should be bountyable for those who dont finish your bounties.Third; Eliminate counter-bounties
Really? I've never heard of Conserve being used in PvP, let alone ever seen it on anyone who attacked me
#100
Posted 28 July 2010 - 12:44
Just wondering, whats the status on having a Top 10 for PvP Prestige? Or did I not understand the statement right?
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