81 replies to this topic

[Mister Doom]

There'd be nothing wrong with certain level ranges not being able to use CoA without using some lower level gear.

We used to do that all of the time!

 

Although I can say with a certain degree of certainty that there would be 'that' many level ranges that wouldn't be able to come up with a proper CoA compliant setup.

 

(You have to remember that there are also SE, elite and champ sets. Not just LE's...)

[BadPenny]

well..... my current hunting set up, as suggested by the wiki.  has an odd piece..... so, that would make me unable to 1 hit.....    try again, Doomikins........

[BigGrim]

probably because every level range doesn't have that possibility so it would of been a useless buff for a lot of levels until new equipment was added..

Sure it does if you include Elite and Champion sets. We'd just have to plug more 3 piece sets into the game, which might make for some interesting new sets.

[Mister Doom]

well..... my current hunting set up, as suggested by the wiki.  has an odd piece..... so, that would make me unable to 1 hit.....    try again, Doomikins........

 

That doesn't make any sense penny. If the buff changed, obviously the setups would change... ¬_¬

[wil72]

There'd be nothing wrong with certain level ranges not being able to use CoA without using some lower level gear.

We used to do that all of the time!

 

Although I can say with a certain degree of certainty that there would be 'that' many level ranges that wouldn't be able to come up with a proper CoA compliant setup.

 

(You have to remember that there are also SE, elite and champ sets. Not just LE's...)

 

I understand where you are coming from but how can a buff be changed in how it functions after it has been introduced, and that goes for any buff. Everyone has been able to take advantage of how this buff operates from lower level players all the way up to EOC. And it's because of that it has to remain unchanged in my opinion.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[RebornJedi]

probably best to introduce new buffs to the last half of the game instead of trying to change any existing buffs..

[Mister Doom]

I don't see what difference that makes, the buff as it stands now is the same for everyone, when/if changed it would be again the same for everyone.

 

The game has become progressively easier year after year. Using your logic, no remedies can ever be made to give difficulty back to the game, as this would be unfair to some?

[Leos3000]

There'd be nothing wrong with certain level ranges not being able to use CoA without using some lower level gear.
We used to do that all of the time!
 
Although I can say with a certain degree of certainty that there would be 'that' many level ranges that wouldn't be able to come up with a proper CoA compliant setup.
 
(You have to remember that there are also SE, elite and champ sets. Not just LE's...)

Or another reason to turn epics into 1 piece sets

[BadPenny]

Ok, epics should not be part of the equation. However, if the buffs get changed as doomikins proposes, one of you will have to help me 1 hit.... Please, let's not do this?

[wil72]

I don't see what difference that makes, the buff as it stands now is the same for everyone, when/if changed it would be again the same for everyone.

 

The game has become progressively easier year after year. Using your logic, no remedies can ever be made to give difficulty back to the game, as this would be unfair to some?

 

Of course it makes a difference, it has been used in it's current form by players to reach EOC, it therefore has to stay as it is to help others do the same. Easier? In what way is the game easier? Levelling may well be easier but in what other ways is FS easier now compared to "way back when" ?

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[Mister Doom]

Well I will just have to disagree wil, claiming you can't change the buffs because, "He/she used it and it's not fair if I can't." Is a very self centred view on the situation, when what we need is to look at the 'bigger picture'.

 

'Everything' is easier these days... (With the obvious exception of converting gold-FSP)

[wil72]

I could quite easily say the same about your post mate, self-centred, games to easy, change the buffs make them do less, I used them when they did more but now I'm EOC I want it less easy for others to do the same, quite self-centred view on the situation I'll think you'll agree. . Starting a bran new Guild, easier now? Nope. PvP/BBoard, easier now? Nope. Titan hunting, easier now? Nope.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[Mister Doom]

EoC isn't the end so your point isn't valid.

 

Even people at the current EoC will (should the changes be implemented) have to change the way they play.

In a year down the line, content will have moved on. Players will all have had to adapt. (including myself)

 

My point about the game being easier refers to the obscenely overpowered gear and potions and their effect on game balance.

(Not the current price of things or lack of interest in certain aspects)

[rowbeth]

As I recall, the original plan for CooA & CooD was that you had to have nothing but complete sets equipped. I.E. you would need to have a 3 item set equipped as well as the 2 pieces. Not sure why it was not done that way.

 

 

Is there any chance that this could be made to be how it works?

I'm under no delusions about it being a popular idea, it would certainly add a bit more balance to those buffs however.

You know, instead of being one of the four 'all powerful buffs'.

(KE, CoA, CoD, and SH) Although I guess there are a few more that fit that category now too, I just don't see it often as I don't have much use for armour.

 

 

Sure it does if you include Elite and Champion sets. We'd just have to plug more 3 piece sets into the game, which might make for some interesting new sets.

 

Personally, I don't see the benefit in this. One of the (few) drawbacks of CoA/D is that it makes a whole lot of gear redundant. Implementing this would just make it even more restrictive, and reduce even further the choices of gear-sets people would be willing to use. I'd prefer to see more flexibility introduced and not less (which is why I once suggested a "pseudo-set" buff which would enable a non-set item to be included with CoA/D).

 

But it is clear, BG, that this "original" idea has not been part of your thinking for a long time, and changing it would require a major influx of 3-piece sets across the levels. A quick look indicates that of the top 60 damage sets (thinking of hunting), 57 are 2-piece sets. The three that aren't come in at 39th (Hades, level 820), 47th (drealord bane, level 1000, but not exactly common enough to be widely available) and 60th (Keeper, level 1590).

 

I really would see this change as creating a lot of hassle while creating no benefit in terms of improved game-play.

[wil72]

I never said it was the end, and of course my point is valid, please stop trying to dismiss it. You can try to "paint" my argument any way you want mate but at the end of the day the buff can't be changed if it has already helped players to reach EOC. I will not change my mind on this doom, we've argued this point a few times in the forums.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[Mister Doom]

I'm well aware of your feelings with regards to EoC wil.

You make a fair point though, debating this issue with you is a good example of an "Exercise in futility".

[wil72]

You have no idea how I feel with regard to EOC as I have never discussed it with you so please don't pretend that you do. And mate, "Resistance (to my argument) is futile".

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[Mister Doom]

We've been in many many debates on these forums over the years.

 

But okay, I can infer your opinion on EoC with your many many anti EoC statements over the years.

I can see how you might jump to the conclusion that this is somehow a 'bonus' for higher levels.

 

I suppose in some ways it is. However over the years as hunting and gaining xp has become progressively easier, the opposite could be claimed for those that were already EoC, watching newer players do things much easier.

 

The argument can easily become cyclical though if you don't take a step back and actually think what would be the best for the game, instead of what would be best for ourselves or only a group of people.

Edited by Mister Doom, 12 March 2015 - 20:47.

[wil72]

If I have made anti EOC comments in the past i'll think you'll find it has been with regard to certain individuals and not the actual number itself. I would like to think i have many friends who are EOC, so anti EOC is quite far from the mark mate.

 

Yes, new players are doing something easier than those that started the game "way back when".....levelling. And that's it. One part of the game, one part! I am stepping outside the box and looking in and I just don't see how making levelling harder will help the game, attract new players and retain old and new players alike. Levelling is easy but so many other things are really hard, especially for a new player. I've cited a few already. Changing ones levelling experience will have little effect on the game and it's player retaining powers in my opinion. A "reboot" to other parts of the game, now that could be a different story.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[Mister Doom]

It's not just levelling...

It's anything that is affected by buffs. (which is quite a lot of things)

 

De-powering buffs in order to make the player think a little more about what they're doing is not going to be bad for the game...

CoA being changed doesn't affect the new players, since they will have had no experience with the buff, can't cast the buff and do not need the buff for many levels.

 

(I distinctly remember many us - them type statements coming from you towards EoC.

EoC the place in game, not specific players, so...)

 

I'm not seeing why a 'reboot' to other sectors of the game wouldn't fall into the same 'problem' (as you see it) of things changing for new players that were different (sometimes easier) for older players...

Edited by Mister Doom, 12 March 2015 - 22:05.