306 replies to this topic

[Hoofmaster]

Just please remember no matter what direction the discussion takes on the forum put this to a game wide poll before making changes to something lots of people have invested heavily in. A really small percentage of players ever read anything here. An even smaller percentage post anything.

 

Yeah, we'd like to see a wide range of thoughts on it

[cucullainn]

There are seven Epic Quest that gives stamina bonuses to new players. I see some new players get to level 150, and then I don't see them playing anymore. Granted I see a handful that are still playing. Up around level 250. They have fallen in love with the game like I have. Only how long have these Persians been in effect? I have had my experience with some higher level composing pots. They have made it easier for leveling which is good for me because I would like to one day get to where EOC is now. I am not sure about the other Buffs like PVP there are a few that I have used. But I know I will not try to clear any Benny's when I click on someone's profile and they have 70 buff applied. I want even look at them to see what or how high they are, if there are not leveling buffs. I am just not going to spend the gold or FSPs trying to get high level pots or Buffs. I'm not even going to use composing Pots to try clearing a bounty. If I see that person already has 60 Buffs cast on them.

Now I have had players cast high level buffs on me to hit and to defend in GvGs. But I've never used high level composing pots to do so. I guess not everyone is lucky enough to have level 60 composers in their guilds.

So I'm not too sure how I feel about PVP buffs. But diminishing leveling Buffs in a game. Where new players are looking at players Over 3200. Then they realize that they can only move so fast after doing the handful of Epic Quest. And not having Buffs that they​ feel would be the only way for them to advance. Such as a few of the Potions from the chest from Events. Well I just don't see why any current leveling Buffs would need to be diminished

[Mister Doom]

There are seven Epic Quest that gives stamina bonuses to new players. I see some new players get to level 150, and then I don't see them playing anymore. Granted I see a handful that are still playing. Up around level 250. They have fallen in love with the game like I have. Only how long have these Persians been in effect? I have had my experience with some higher level composing pots. They have made it easier for leveling which is good for me because I would like to one day get to where EOC is now. I am not sure about the other Buffs like PVP there are a few that I have used. But I know I will not try to clear any Benny's when I click on someone's profile and they have 70 buff applied. I want even look at them to see what or how high they are, if there are not leveling buffs. I am just not going to spend the gold or FSPs trying to get high level pots or Buffs. I'm not even going to use composing Pots to try clearing a bounty. If I see that person already has 60 Buffs cast on them.

Now I have had players cast high level buffs on me to hit and to defend in GvGs. But I've never used high level composing pots to do so. I guess not everyone is lucky enough to have level 60 composers in their guilds.

So I'm not too sure how I feel about PVP buffs. But diminishing leveling Buffs in a game. Where new players are looking at players Over 3200. Then they realize that they can only move so fast after doing the handful of Epic Quest. And not having Buffs that they​ feel would be the only way for them to advance. Such as a few of the Potions from the chest from Events. Well I just don't see why any current leveling Buffs would need to be diminished

 

Stat affecting buffs, not 'levelling buffs'. Being able to drink a potion and then roflstomp everything in Uber-pot god mode spoils the game.

 

It is exactly the same as activating cheat mode.

[Mister Doom]

Yeah, we'd like to see a wide range of thoughts on it

 

A game-wide poll is doomed.

 

It'd be like asking a den of crack addicts, "Hey, that is quite bad you know, would you mind if we made it a little less potent?" Then deciding what to do about it based on what the junkies replies were... Pointless.

 

If you (Hoof) think that everything is fine and hunky dory as-is then fine, whatever, don't make a change. IF you see that things have become ridiculous and agree with those of us who can separate ourselves from our uber-pot dependency, then you DON'T NEED the 'permission' of the masses to fix stuff in your game... ¬_¬

[Hoofmaster]

If you (Hoof) think that everything is fine and hunky dory as-is then fine, whatever, don't make a change. IF you see that things have become ridiculous and agree with those of us who can separate ourselves from our uber-pot dependency, then you DON'T NEED the 'permission' of the masses to fix stuff in your game... ¬_¬

 

I said the team will take a look at it over the next couple of weeks, but we still want opinions and thoughts on it

[Chooma123]

i like the idea of simply lowering the max level gained from composed potions and some easily obtained epic potions for example the dragon egg ones, i think those are ridiculously op

 

this way, these epic potions and composed potions still give an advantage to those who use them, but arent ridiculously OP

 

eg move KE from 350 to 250

 

I know hoof you spoke a lot about a diminishing return which could also work but the problem I see with this is it is no different to just lowering the level, as it would either be such a small gain after a certain level that its worthless, or still a large gain after a certain level to keep OP. If you were to find the "perfectly balanced" dimishing return, i dont think this is any different to just lowering the max level of the buffs in the first place

[Josh1404]

A game-wide poll is doomed.

 

It'd be like asking a den of crack addicts, "Hey, that is quite bad you know, would you mind if we made it a little less potent?" Then deciding what to do about it based on what the junkies replies were... Pointless.

So because they aren't here shouting at the top of their voice in every thread they deserve no opinion? Because most people lost faith in the forum long ago their opinion is worthless? Just because you know they will disagree with you you decide they have no right to say so. That's utter rubbish. I really don't think the players of FS are in any way addicted to these potions as your analogy suggests. I think the majority of people if given the chance to put their opinion forward would give a balanced and intelligent opinion. It wouldn't be a case of wanting to keep the acclaimed "win button" at all costs. I think we all play the game and want what's best for it. Just some people think differently about the subject at hand. Try accepting that and don't dismiss their chance to say so.

 

If you (Hoof) think that everything is fine and hunky dory as-is then fine, whatever, don't make a change. IF you see that things have become ridiculous and agree with those of us who can separate ourselves from our uber-pot dependency, then you DON'T NEED the 'permission' of the masses to fix stuff in your game... ¬_¬

Though I love how you phrased this. Hoof is not an idiot. To disregard his player base would be a poor move. Though I have no doubt he knows that so I won't push the point any further.

[dobroeutro]

Well, I've spent a significant amount of time & dots over the last 3.5 years maxing composing to have my accomplishment diminished just because a vocal few demand it "for the good of the children" "for the good of the game" to be happy about the way the discussion is going with regard to composing.

 

The door was opened, an inch was given, now a mile is the only acceptable solution... lol.

 

If the end result of this discussion is to cap or diminish stat increasing/diminishing potions, game wide, that's gonna upset alot of folks. AH merchants, scavengers, LE/Dragon hunters, PvP Ladder players, Global participants, Donators will all be affected. I don't imagine they'll be overjoyed at the prospect.

 

As far as a game wide poll, although you don't need "the masses" or anyone's approval to make changes to your game, you do need them, "crack addicts & junkies" included, to have one...

[Pythia]

I don't use epic potions on a normal hunt, I use what can be bought in the buff market, the ah, and the bazaar along with my tiny little composed potion.

 

I still have to pay attention or I get handed my arse and my poor imps get sent to imp heaven. I died 3 or 4 times in the hunt before the last one.. I just hunted.  So, no, what I do is not an instant win every single time and yes I have to pay attention.

 

If everything you do is an instant win, then change things up so it's not  Use lower level gear or something. Don't tell me you already do that because there is no gear for your level, I've already heard you say it.  Go lower with your gear. Go naked if you really need a challenge.. I hear there is nothing quite like the breeze over vast areas of open flesh, very liberating,  invigorating even I've read.

 

My epics potions are strictly for my fun use and GEs.

[bloody18]

my opinion :

 cap skill levels for pvp only ..  this would solve most of the forum posts I read

 

leave the rest alone - 

everyone can compose, the pots are readily available in the game.. the biggest issue I had "back in the day" was getting buffed,the buff market solved that problem... 

 

And its not about having a WIN button for me ..Its having a hamburger thats on the menu. now I am  finally able to order that hamburger...   and now the hamburger that I ordered may not be the one advertised.. thanks but no thanks ... Lets not  play games within a game. 

 

again PVP skill capping imo would solve almost all of the probs I have seen in forum over the past couple years.

 

take a poll .. 

Edited by bloody18, 13 April 2017 - 17:17.

[Davros81]

Would setting a max skill cap across PvP in general be a better idea? Or apply some form of diminishing return like I suggested before when high levels of the skills are used in PvP?

I prefer the latter but I'm open to ideas on it

NO!

[wil72]

Can I ask and please forgive my ignorance when I do but these so called over powered potions have "ruined everything" for who exactly?

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[Davros81]

Can I ask and please forgive my ignorance when I do but these so called over powered potions have "ruined everything" for who exactly?

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

Yes, who?

[Filletminion]

maybe the best solution is to remove buffs of any level entirely from PVP...That way it ceases to be about who has the most fsp or the highest level buffer, but instead returns to who can design the best setups..

 

None of us are entitled to more because we have spent  hundreds of millions in gold or thousands of fsp Self interest needs to take second place here.

Edited by zizzwyly, 13 April 2017 - 23:36.

[sweetlou]

You need to hear everyone's opinion. Not that of 10  - 20 people only. This includes myself also. You need all people to have their say before making changes like this. I'd bet a great deal you will see an overall disapproval.

The decision to do anything to the game is not a democratic one, which means it doesn't matter what the majority of players think. This is Hoof and his team alone doing what they think is in the best interest of the game.

 

While you might think, "I've invested so much time and resources to attaining level 60 composing I DESERVE the right to have Super powers like a cheat code," it doesn't necessarily mean you should be able to retain these advantages even if the majority of the game votes to keep the status quo. It's Hoof's call in the end.

[sweetlou]

Can I ask and please forgive my ignorance when I do but these so called over powered potions have "ruined everything" for who exactly?

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

The ultra high skill levels found in many potions have hurt the game itself. Specific injuries to players are not being proposed in the argument against the use of the ultra high level skills. The over powered skills have made areas of the game unchallenging and ridiculous. Leveling doesn't require anything more than the same set for a 1000 levels. Just pot up, done. Are groups even necessary any longer for anything? PvP and GvG have clearly been effected by the introduction of these pots. I have yet to hear one argument to keep these pots beyond, "I did all the work to hit level 60 composing, and therefore I have earned the right to the advantages I have against everyone else." It's selfish, but what should we expect?.

[mary4ever]

Wyld Titan. If you can 1 hit it without luck buffs kicking in, you are amazing.

 

 

"a picture says more than a thousand words"

 

*had to unblock shortly to reply*

 

 

Necrosis is a chance, "Luck" buff... 

why would you point towards the "Necrosis" SKILL that is a "luck" buff + has ZERO impact if it activates or not on the Titan?

 

BEFORE the 1,2,3,4,R (rolfstoping with OP pots) players would actually check out each mobs profile before attacking to know if they had enough attack / damage / ...... !!!

if you had bothered to check the Wyld Mari (Titan) profile BEFORE posting here (like I did in order to answer yotwehcs question) you would have known that the Titan was already "Undead" & that you would NOT need "Necrosis" at all !!!

Necrosis =>   +0.1% per point chance that the creature you are fighting will be turned into an 'Undead' creature at the start of combat. (PvE Only)

since the creature is already Undead, Necrosis will be "useless" (you can not turn an already "Undead" to "Undead" )

 

if you have not already noticed the "answer" was obviously HOLY FLAME !!!

Holy Flame => +0.2% extra damage vs. undead per point.

 

before you ask, Holy Flame is NOT a "luck" buff & yes, you can easily 1-Hit-Kill the highest lvl Titan (many have already done so) & yes HolyFlame lvl 500 is way OP (DOUBLES your damage at only lvl 500, distilled even more) !!!

 

if you still "somehow" believe it can not be done then PM me ingame & I will gladly help you or just ask anyone who has hunted it before

 

ps: if you use OP composing + castable buffs + the Valaraths Egg then at your level you can get 750k+ damage (the Titan "only" has 365k HP so you will NOT even need a wither pot LOL, that just further proves how OP pots have become

[mary4ever]

Thanks, I understood Melons post just fine. I even said that some buffs could be tweaked a bit to balance them out between themselves. Only needing one setup to win suggests the stats on setups available need to be varied a bit more as stat increasing buffs only compound an issue that is already there.

do you mind explaining in DETAIL what you mean? maybe with an EXAMPLE & a possible Sollution?

I think once you start talking about it in detail you will realize that it is a skill issue !!!

 

for EXAMPLE: if I & my opponent use the SAME PvP setup (same forge / craft) with the only exception that I use OP pots & he / she uses only castable buffs then his / her chances to win are almost NONE !!! EVENTHOUGH we are using the same PvP setup => thus further proving it is a SKILL ISSUE !!!

 

it has ALWAYS been a "SKILL - ISSUE", if you remember at the "early stage of the game" when people rushed to level in order to get castable 175 buffs !!! EVERYONE back then (regardless of being a PvPer or NON-PvPer would tell you that the skill level matters a LOT !!!

 

Maybe you didn't understand what I was saying. It was about the players who feel castable buffs should be able to compete with composing buffs. Not about buffs being an issue themselves.

castable buffs hardly stand a chance against OP Composing as castable buffs hardly stand a chance against EPIC Pots !!!

that is the main point of this thread => It's about time to balance out those overpowered pots in PvP.

 

I fail to see how being required to match another players efforts to beat them is an issue.

please let's not start talking about "efforts" to simply justify anything regardless of the "effects" it causes !!!

if you wanna talk about EFFORTS then what about the PvP Efforts????

what about the YEARS of PvP Efforts, the resources (FSPs, Gold, Stamina, lost XP, lost Levels, Time, .....) they put BEFORE OP Composing was released & **** it up for them???

I have put a LOT more "effort" into PvP than into Composing, PvP has cost me X times more than Composing & I know many PvPers were it applies too !!!

the "efforts" PvPers have put over the years hardly mattered AFTER OP Composing !!!

how do you think these PvPers felt after engaging OP Composed players in PvP & to find out that their years of PvP efforts hardly matter & they hardly stand a chance?

many PvPers went complaining into the forum (incl me) but unfortunately we know what happened if you posted any negativity about OP Composing

some either quit the game, left PvP or just like me started to level up Composing in order to be able to compete in PvP !!!

 

there are many things to add to the PvP efforts that the Composing efforts can not even come close to BUT like I said before let's not start talking about "efforts" here because you will lose the "fight" before it even starts .....

 

when years of PvP "efforts" pale in comparison to the Composing "efforts" in relation to PvP (PvP Ladder, GvG, ......) then something has to be wrong !!!

 

& finally: acknowledging ones "efforts (Composing efforts) while disregarding the others "efforts" (years of PvP efforts) is just wrong / ..... !!!

 

the only honest arguement I heard so far to keep OP Composing was: I have put a lot of effort into Composing so it should stay !!!

BUT even that only honest arguement does not hold a candle when PvPers talk about their years of PvP efforts !!!

 

afterall this is about PvP !!!

This is PvP

 

@hoof: you do not have to listen to anything I or anyone says, since you are an admin & have access to see things "behind the scenes", you can observe how players use OP composing almost as a "WIN - button" on the (PvP Ladder, BB, GvG, relic battles) & "wiping out" any players who are not using OP composing themselves !!! access player logs, see for yourself the frag amount some players have (millions of frags to create TONS of EPIC OP Composing skills), the person you should trust the most should be yourself, trust what you see / observe

I really hope you will do this to see for yourself what is really going on & if you do then I am confident you will "unfortunately" know how OP Composing has affected PvP (PvP Ladder, GvG, .....)

[dobroeutro]

why would you point towards the "Necrosis" SKILL that is a "luck" buff + has ZERO impact if it activates or not on the Titan?

 

if you had bothered to check the Wyld Mari (Titan) profile BEFORE posting here (like I did in order to answer yotwehcs question) you would have known that the Titan was already "Undead" & that you would NOT need "Necrosis" at all !!!

 

 

Oops... lol. 

[wil72]

The ultra high skill levels found in many potions have hurt the game itself. Specific injuries to players are not being proposed in the argument against the use of the ultra high level skills. The over powered skills have made areas of the game unchallenging and ridiculous. Leveling doesn't require anything more than the same set for a 1000 levels. Just pot up, done. Are groups even necessary any longer for anything? PvP and GvG have clearly been effected by the introduction of these pots. I have yet to hear one argument to keep these pots beyond, "I did all the work to hit level 60 composing, and therefore I have earned the right to the advantages I have against everyone else." It's selfish, but what should we expect?.

 

Isn't the specific injury to players the fact, in your opinion, that certain areas of the game are now unchallenging and ridiculous due to, dare I say it, recently introduced overpowered pots. If this truly were the case then each and every player would have the same complaint. I'm sorry mate but I just don't think this runs true.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

Edited by wil72, 14 April 2017 - 18:58.