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It's about time to balance out those overpowered pots in PvP.


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#1 Woot

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 15:12

I know that some of you have become addicted to your win-button and you're not willing to let it go, after all buying our way through everything is part of the Fallensword culture imo, but let's be real here, those potions have absolutely wrecked pvp into oblivion!

Those insanely high level buffs are completely imbalanced and outclass player-casted ones in both power and duration. The only way to effectively compete against someone else using op pots is to make use of it yourself, otherwise better pray to the RNG god for a very lucky proc.

OP pots are a luxury which not all of us have access to compared to 175/192's that are affordable and can be easily purchased through the buff market. In addition, they raise the entry barrier and limits pvp participation which would explain why the ladder is so dead, even with those new shiny rewards. I played during a time when the the brackets were far smaller and rewards were pitiful yet we still had more players and the competition was fierce.

Based on what I have seen and experienced, those pots certainly DO NOT promote fair, strategic and competitive gameplay. At this point why not add hunting style key-binds to ladder targets so that we can mindlessly '1234'? It's pointless to check active buffs on your opponents if your own stats are passively several times higher than theirs.

Now before I lose my sanity;
I propose that all skills in pvp combat should be capped at 200-250 max.
The longevity of potions along with the fact that some of them cannot be leeched and the few extra levels above player-casted buffs seems like plenty for potions to remain useful while keeping the playing field even. (:


Edited by Woot, 19 March 2017 - 15:14.


#2 lapdragon

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 16:33

im confused as to how players cant have access to pots?  look at the global reward right now.  the prize is not just for the top 100.  so anyone can get those chest and have a choice of pots to use.  and there are traveling composers and pretty much most guilds have a composer or two.  what pots are you speaking of that only those who pay can get?? even the eggs could have been hunted. also, just cuz you have high pots on doesnt give an automatic win.  the ladder is not for everyone.  those playing take it seriously. hit every hour.  it is not for the faint of heart.  which is what it is for.  thats just my opinion.



#3 Josh1404

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 19:41

It's been suggested various times phrased in different ways. Always got an absolute no from the bovines above. Don't see that changing. Having said that...

 

Whilst I appreciate how much of an effect these potions have on PvP. Unless your counting donation potions all the "overpowered" potions are available to all. And frankly if players are using donation potions competing in PvP despite their value then GG. 

 

Want composing potions? Level up your composing.

 

Want global potions? Qualify in Global Events.

 

Want potions from Crystal Ladder Chests? Compete in the ladder to earn your tokens and make your own.

 

All their resources are available to you as well. Match them and beat them. Simple.

 

The whole reason I levelled my own composing to 60 is so that should I compete seriously they can't have that advantage over me. I choose not to use them regularly only in response to other's using theirs. I match their resources and null their advantage. 

 

also, just cuz you have high pots on doesnt give an automatic win.  the ladder is not for everyone.  those playing take it seriously. hit every hour.  it is not for the faint of heart.  which is what it is for.  thats just my opinion.

Agree entirely. Just because someone uses some superior potions does not grant them an automatic win. No gear knowledge and lack of knowledge on how to best use those potions will still make them the likely loser in this scenario.


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#4 maxdragon

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 20:55

I know that some of you have become addicted to your win-button and you're not willing to let it go

that says it all



#5 Chooma123

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 21:28

I think composed pots are completely broken and I agree with you



#6 Chooma123

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 21:46

although saying that nothing will change with composing lol



#7 yotwehc

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 22:28

Take me as a great example of losing despite access to the lvl 60 pots. I lose to players 1,000's of levels below me. Sure, I'm a noob but it's not a guarantee win despite many folks who say it is.

The great thing about the pots is it encourages players to be online. Buffing your offline friends so they can win in pvp seems like what you are advocating for. Live pvp is the best thing ever. Try it. And the pots make it even more fun especially when the wee players are schooling you with regular buffs. I always send them compliments. They deserve medals. David and Goliath achievement!

#8 mary4ever

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 00:58

ignoring the problem does NOT make it go away, it is prolonging the inevitable !!!

(in general)


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#9 Woot

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 05:38

im confused as to how players cant have access to pots?  look at the global reward right now.  the prize is not just for the top 100.  so anyone can get those chest and have a choice of pots to use.  and there are traveling composers and pretty much most guilds have a composer or two.  what pots are you speaking of that only those who pay can get?? even the eggs could have been hunted. also, just cuz you have high pots on doesnt give an automatic win.  the ladder is not for everyone.  those playing take it seriously. hit every hour.  it is not for the faint of heart.  which is what it is for.  thats just my opinion.

 

My concern is about fairness. I strongly believe that a certain degree of integrity should be maintained for competitive activities. If I'm not mistaken, my own script was banned in titan-hunting, because it gave a tremendous advantage and became a requirement in order to compete against others using it, OP pots are no different.

Even if composing was added as a sub-category on the AH, player-casted buffs would still be cheaper and more accessible. By setting a standard, the entry barrier is lowered and more people can partake in such activities on a level playing field.



#10 Hoofmaster

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 10:09

Is there specific buffs you feel are overpowered at high levels? Could you give me some examples?



#11 lapdragon

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 14:01

 If I'm not mistaken, my own script was banned in titan-hunting, because it gave a tremendous advantage and became a requirement in order to compete against others using it, OP pots are no different.

 

if it was "your own" script...then it should be banned, since not everyone had the option or access to it...as i stated in my OP, ALL pots, buffs, chests, eggs, EVERYTHING is available if you chose to play the ladder....just like ANY competition, you use EVERY resource to your advantage that is ALLOWED in that said contest.  Why would i not train to run a race? i would ALSO, watch what i eat, AND make sure i have the BEST gear possible if i want to even place.  so why would any promoter only allow sandals to run the race?  you have the choice, and i have played the ladder many times, with great players all thru my FS career! pots, buffs, i EXPECT them all to be used.....it is not a surprise.  i still dont see the problem....as we all know......THEY are not a consistent WIN button....but still, if someone WORKED HARD to obtain said issue, and it is a viable aspect of FS, ie. GLOBAL, LADDER, ARENA, COMPOSING, why would they now be nurfed? .............and anyone playing the ladder always checks out gear and buffs on their target, so the "1234" reference is not plausible...



#12 yotwehc

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 14:29

Is there specific buffs you feel are overpowered at high levels? Could you give me some examples?

This is disappointing. You're actually considering the complaints of a small vocal minority? Some of these guys beat me up constantly even while I use these "op" pots and they don't.

#13 Josh1404

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 14:41

This is disappointing. You're actually considering the complaints of a small vocal minority?

Agreed.

 

Please hoof before even considering to contemplate perhaps beginning to think about any change of this scale put it to a game wide poll so everyone can have their say. Not the same group shouting loudly on an endless campaign.

 

I would bet a great deal this is not the opinion of the player base as a whole.

 

Edit - 

 

My objection is firstly that the means to obtain these "overpowered potions" categorically is available to all players. The denial of that is frankly ridiculous.

 

And secondly a great deal of players have invested into their composing for this very purpose. Having spent that time, effort and gold to do that and to subsequently have the benefits of doing so removed is a massive slap in the face. Which yes does include me... Do I get my gold back? And don't say they will be available to use in all other aspects. I don't play any other aspects. I barely ever level and don't do anything besides play the ladder casually and qualify in global events. If you remove these potions from use in PvP that stops an opponent using them vs me which means I have no need of them. This removes the very reason I needed the ability to make my own potions which was to respond to another using them vs me. Cancelling out their advantage. Without that to me they are truly 100% pointless. And that's a lot of gold and effort wasted. And I for one would be seething. Bet I am not alone...


Edited by Josh1404, 20 March 2017 - 15:11.

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#14 sweetlou

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 15:14

Is there specific buffs you feel are overpowered at high levels? Could you give me some examples?

Yes, stat changing skills!


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#15 BigGrim

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 15:31

Yes, stat changing skills!

He asked for specific buffs.

~ Grim

#16 suderlon

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 15:53

Is there specific buffs you feel are overpowered at high levels? Could you give me some examples?

 

Yes, stat changing skills!

yes, stat changing skills like keen edge, coordinated attack, smashing hammer, flinch, terrorize and the rest of the skills that change stats



#17 Chooma123

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 16:00

He asked for specific buffs.

~ Grim

I feel pretty much all are over powered, but in particular keen edge, coord atk and def, and smashing hammer just give ridiculous boosts to you stats 



#18 lapdragon

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 18:31

arent just about ALL buffs stat changing in one way or another? except like UB, Spell Leach, SB and Deflect?.....so would that list be expanded to include EW?  it changes stats....will there be a poll on what stats are allowed to be changed? what ones arent?  i am being a bit snarky but, also i am trying to make a point.....a few players made an uproar about the composing pots, but it was a great addition to the game, some, especially in my guild only compose.  so if the rewards from globals change, many may not participate, (look at  the chest being offered on this global, it has  the community well beyond the set goal......) but i will follow what ever HCS decides to do...



#19 sweetlou

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 19:14

He asked for specific buffs.

~ Grim

Hoof should know which skills they are since he is the architect of the game.


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#20 Mister Doom

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 21:19

Is there specific buffs you feel are overpowered at high levels? Could you give me some examples?

 

Enchant Weapon, Keen Edge, Dark Curse, Coordinated Attack/Defense and Smashing Hammer are the primary offenders but the other stat modifiers suffer from the effects of the uber potions almost as bad.


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