116 replies to this topic

[Chazz224]

Let's Make Fallen Sword and PvP GREAT AGAIN !!!!!!!!!!

 

PvP is apart of THIS GAME !!! *crowd yells yay !!!* 

 

Let's work on a new model for expanding the level ranges so players in game have more potential PvP targets !! *crowd yells YAY!!!* 

 

Let's work towards expanding GvG ranges so players have more viable targets that have logged on this week ! *Crowed again yells YAY !!!!!!!!!!!* 

 

Let's work towards creating a Top Rated List that has a reset so that anyone and everyone can get to the top if they work hard in this game !!! *Crowd yells YAYYYYYYY !!!!!!!!!!!! <---- Also would include PvE aspects as well as many others FYI

 

Let's encourage more players to take part in PvP - create PvP wars - Spend more Money !!! - Take some levels - Regain some levels !!!!!!!!!! *The crowd ---------- is out on that one still* LOL 

 

Let's talk to our Dev's about creating new upgrades so we can have Higher Hourly Stam ticks so players with small stam banks can hunt 3 and 4 or 5 times a week and those players with 600k Boat Loads of Stam can hunt more than once per year !! 

 

We want to do more - play more - spend more stam - hunt more - SE hunt more - did I say do more? LOL 

Edited by Chazz224, 30 November 2016 - 18:00.

[Calista]

Chazz, you are right. PvP is part of this game. The problem is that the division between PvPers and Levelers has only grown over the years, especially with the brilliant disaster we refer to as PvP Seasons.  I know Grim gets mad when we bring it up, but there are players coming back to the game who missed all that happened with that. It is relevant to the history of the game and how PvP has been watered down and damaged in the game. You can't pretend it didn't happen.

 

When HCS was scrambling to try and make Seasons work, an opt out to pvp was introduced. Granted, Seasons didn't last long before it had to be yanked out of the game and PvP returned as it had been. But now that there was ever an option to opt out completely from any form of  pvp in game,  they can't let it go. They even want an opt out for the daily pvp quests which no one is required to do.

 

I spoke some with Necra last night and filled her in on some of it. She mentioned being very discouraged and not understanding why there is so much hostility. You guys should read what hasn't been deleted off the forum about what went on during that time.  It'll help you understand where pvp is at in the game at this point and why we are fighting so hard to keep what little is left. Plus it will give you an idea of where the different sides are coming from, since even I admit I'm clearly what is referred to as a hard-core pvper. 

[LadyJ]

- The HCS should ditch the ladder system, its a major flop, and bring back the way PvP was before this current system was introduced, with every player having a constant rating, no random resets anymore, and every hit, whether for rating or for gold, 10 stamina or 100, being able to get bountied, with every 100 stamina hit counting towards the smasher medal.

 

-Change the PvP token system so the currency, instead of PvP tokens, will be PvP prestige, and make 10 stamina hits grant 1 prestige and 100 stamina hits grant 10 prestige. I feel that this will motivate more people to deliver prestige hits as it won't just be used as a buff anymore. (Also, I've noticed a lot of people don't like to take part in the ladder because it isn't profitable enough, so, to minimise the overflow of the market of items made from resources bought currently by PvP tokens, make these available resources cost a good amount of prestige, say at a ratio of 50 prestige points for the cost of every 1 current token? Though this is something that can be discussed on a different topic).

 

-Also I like the idea of increasing ranges just a tad bit, because the higher levels really do have a huge lack of targets.

 

-The only way a person can opt out of this system should be by purchasing prestige.

 

 

I feel that this system is fair to everyone, pvp is a huge part of fallen sword, and for people to have the option of just not taking part in it seems a little bit unfair as it limits the possibilities of the people who DO want to take part in it, and if there are some people who REALLY don't want to take part in it then they still have the option not to, even though it might cost them some money. This is just what I think is fairest to suit all the parties.

 

Thanks for hearing me out.

Edited by LadyJ, 30 November 2016 - 18:32.

[Chazz224]

Chazz, you are right. PvP is part of this game. The problem is that the division between PvPers and Levelers has only grown over the years, especially with the brilliant disaster we refer to as PvP Seasons.  I know Grim gets mad when we bring it up, but there are players coming back to the game who missed all that happened with that. It is relevant to the history of the game and how PvP has been watered down and damaged in the game. You can't pretend it didn't happen.

 

When HCS was scrambling to try and make Seasons work, an opt out to pvp was introduced. Granted, Seasons didn't last long before it had to be yanked out of the game and PvP returned as it had been. But now that there was ever an option to opt out completely from any form of  pvp in game,  they can't let it go. They even want an opt out for the daily pvp quests which no one is required to do.

 

I spoke some with Necra last night and filled her in on some of it. She mentioned being very discouraged and not understanding why there is so much hostility. You guys should read what hasn't been deleted off the forum about what went on during that time.  It'll help you understand where pvp is at in the game at this point and why we are fighting so hard to keep what little is left. Plus it will give you an idea of where the different sides are coming from, since even I admit I'm clearly what is referred to as a hard-core pvper. 

A link to this forum would help assist me in catching up. - That should help me out 

 

However, despite what has happened, or how long it took place for - what's most important is that the Devs did correct the issue(s) that didn't seem to work back then. Also what's very important to make mention too is that the Devs tried to do something good for PvP, regardless as to how it may have turned out for them they at least tried. 

 

Now, I respect history, but let's focus and try to work towards a positive future so that we can build a better tomorrow for PvP - for Fallen Sword as well. I'd really like to see more players in game, more action, activity - and let's never introduce an Opt out button ever again lol - they have protection the bb - so many insurances and luxuries go to those players who level mainly they don't need an opt out of anything. Being EOC is a privilege players in this game capitalize on where they make money selling buffs and etc they don't need additional welfare to help them out further, so while something like that was put in I'm very thankful it was also removed. =) 

 

Working for a better tomorrow in game - that's our goal and purpose 

Expand PvP level ranges - Expand GvG level ranges - Create a new Top Rated list for the guilds who Have not earned or got there yet, and let's spark some incentive back into the game. Don't dwell too much on the mistakes we've all made but look ahead to the future where we quadruple the number of players in game - and bb's and pvp action. *holds a glass up high and calls for a cheer* =) 

[Pardoux]

I've advocated this in the past, and I will advocate it still ...

 

If PvP is such a big part of the game, let the PvP'rs just attack each other and give those players that want no part of it a total opt-out. I used to be in that camp, but since the introduction of the DQ's, I do dabble a LITTLE bit now.

 

But, PvP could thrive, if it was contained to those that WANT to participate - and let's be brutally honest here - some players will excel and others will be found wanting because they'll be attacking their peers, not folk sitting offline with no buffs and in stamina gear. Yes, I know stam gear is a choice, but hey, who doesn't want more stamina.

 

I know I'll get shot down here - restricting PvP to only those that WANT to partake will create a you-know-what storm of protestation *moves to the nuclear bunker in readiness*

Edited by Pardoux, 30 November 2016 - 19:25.

[yotwehc]

A link to this forum would help assist me in catching up. - That should help me out 

 

However, despite what has happened, or how long it took place for - what's most important is that the Devs did correct the issue(s) that didn't seem to work back then. Also what's very important to make mention too is that the Devs tried to do something good for PvP, regardless as to how it may have turned out for them they at least tried. 

 

Now, I respect history, but let's focus and try to work towards a positive future so that we can build a better tomorrow for PvP - for Fallen Sword as well. I'd really like to see more players in game, more action, activity - and let's never introduce an Opt out button ever again lol - they have protection the bb - so many insurances and luxuries go to those players who level mainly they don't need an opt out of anything. Being EOC is a privilege players in this game capitalize on where they make money selling buffs and etc they don't need additional welfare to help them out further, so while something like that was put in I'm very thankful it was also removed. =) 

 

Working for a better tomorrow in game - that's our goal and purpose 

Expand PvP level ranges - Expand GvG level ranges - Create a new Top Rated list for the guilds who Have not earned or got there yet, and let's spark some incentive back into the game. Don't dwell too much on the mistakes we've all made but look ahead to the future where we quadruple the number of players in game - and bb's and pvp action. *holds a glass up high and calls for a cheer* =) 

Although I appreciate your efforts in improving the game, if you don't consider the failures of the past, I'm not sure how you see your ideas succeed.

 

You mentioned how the devs tried to do some good for PVP but it resulted in spectacular failure. Not trying to figure out the "why" is not a priority? Let's forget the failure and look forward and possibly repeat mistakes from the past?

 

Smasher Medal - awarded a tick to a medal for any 100 stam hit. Some still don't understand why this failed. Changed to only give ticks for Ladder and BB 100 stam hits and the outcry ended. Seems normal 100 stam PVP hits was the root problem? no?

 

PVP seasons - major change that just about everyone hated except for the most hard core PVP players. Too many issues to get into... The not as hard core PVP'rs hated the BB because they lost control of it. Levelers hated the no opt out and no cool down between hits.

 

If your goal is to get rid of folks who don't like pvp, then so be it. Game was fun while it lasted. I would like to see the game work for all types of players. That's what the "RP" part of an "MMORPG" stands for me.

[Necra]

i Hunt  i do all my quests ( love them )  and I pvp.  i love all the aspects of the game  i invent - im working on my composing and i donate to the game to help pay the bills at HCS.   im excited for this new app for my phone and tablets rye plays on his tablet so this app will benefit him greatly. i love seeing new players joining FS i try and help them.   i GVG  i try to be syphilitic to walks of life in FS   i LOVE LOVE TO GVG it helps my guild and my guild mates get the RP and sell the items and share the spoils with my mates.    i want to encourage players staying in game !   its hard when EVERY THING is done with stam... u burn through stam sooo fast when ur doing all aspects of FS .   opeing up the pvp ranges will help bring players back in FS  will help keep new players  will help HCS get $$ with increase of players    think of how long it takes to level vs how long it takes for stam to gain....  ppl are going to get bored fast !!!  past 2 weeks i have spent most of my time in game chatting then playing why - beause of stam restrictions.      because of the changes of PVP over the 10 years....  im really scared for FS in its future changes of pvp.... could end up being the death of FS    pvp is dam near close to dead. because of that so is FS 3-400 active players......   its not about what killed it  LEST MAKE IT RIGHT ! AND DO IT RIGHT !  

[LadyJ]

I've advocated this in the past, and I will advocate it still ...

 

If PvP is such a big part of the game, let the PvP'rs just attack each other and give those players that want no part of it a total opt-out. I used to be in that camp, but since the introduction of the DQ's, I do dabble a LITTLE bit now.

 

But, PvP could thrive, if it was contained to those that WANT to participate - and let's be brutally honest here - some players will excel and others will be found wanting because they'll be attacking their peers, not folk sitting offline with no buffs and in stamina gear. Yes, I know stam gear is a choice, but hey, who doesn't want more stamina.

 

I know I'll get shot down here - restricting PvP to only those that WANT to partake will create a you-know-what storm of protestation *moves to the nuclear bunker in readiness*

 

Because all the pvpers quit the game, due to the fact that the changes in PvP no longer made it exciting or competitive, when Fallen Sword was created I'm sure PvP was intended to be a part of it, so why can't it be like that now? There should only be 1 way that you can avoid PvPing, if you really want to, and that is by buying PvP protection, it only costs 3,000,000 gold for 28 days of protection, which is 12-15 FSP.. In this day and age, where the market is so overflowed, it's practically nothing at all...

[Necra]

fs active player history over the past 10 years  :  9-7000 active players ( 1st pvp change)  = 3-4000 active players (2nd pvp change) = 9-700 active players ( last pvp change) 3-400 active players   mind u pvp was changed to please the levelers with a failed twist to mock the pvp'rs ( imo) now there is pvp protection and a few are crying about using it it cost to much !!   how u expect HCS to stay afloat when they give and give to the levelers and they wont give back   thats the hardest smack to the face if i have ever seen !!!     - sry for the derailling  

Edited by Necra, 30 November 2016 - 19:50.

[Pardoux]

Because all the pvpers quit the game, due to the fact that the changes in PvP no longer made it exciting or competitive, when Fallen Sword was created I'm sure PvP was intended to be a part of it, so why can't it be like that now? There should only be 1 way that you can avoid PvPing, if you really want to, and that is by buying PvP protection, it only costs 3,000,000 gold for 28 days of protection, which is 12-15 FSP.. In this day and age, where the market is so overflowed, it's practically nothing at all...

 

Opting out of PvP for higher levels, is, as you say "practically nothing at all" - what you fail to take into account is that for very low level players, it's a LOT !!

Also, if PvP were confined solely to other pvp'rs, surely it would be a lot MORE exciting ? - because they can be prepared, they can "challenge" you rather than you just buff up, hit and move on as it is with ill-prepared, unwilling targets.

PvP, like every other feature of the game, should be optional ... and by that, I don't mean "pay to protect yourself"

[Chazz224]

I've advocated this in the past, and I will advocate it still ...

 

If PvP is such a big part of the game, let the PvP'rs just attack each other and give those players that want no part of it a total opt-out. I used to be in that camp, but since the introduction of the DQ's, I do dabble a LITTLE bit now.

 

But, PvP could thrive, if it was contained to those that WANT to participate - and let's be brutally honest here - some players will excel and others will be found wanting because they'll be attacking their peers, not folk sitting offline with no buffs and in stamina gear. Yes, I know stam gear is a choice, but hey, who doesn't want more stamina.

 

I know I'll get shot down here - restricting PvP to only those that WANT to partake will create a you-know-what storm of protestation *moves to the nuclear bunker in readiness*

While I disagree with the Opt out option/ button - This is what I can say to in support of all players who "want to play this game" The game is built on the mechanics of mathematical numeration and stam and that's fine but the problem many of the players run into is this "lack of stam" or the desire to use stam gain gear so we can play more. 

 

It's my belief that we are not playing enough. We all need more stam regardless what you enjoy to do in this game. I'd like to gain 400 stam an hour without being hindered by using "stam gain gear" - While some people may laugh at this notion or suggest wishful thinking - People want to play - if there is a desire to log in and play more the dev's should fuel it. 

 

If you or I gained 400 stam per hr - Let's just say - Would levels still be precious ? Yes, sure but gaining them back would be a lot easier as well. If I gained that much stam would I still donate to the game? Sure I would - because there is the desire for "more" - right now we players struggle playing once a week honestly some of us that pvp may have to wait as long as a month to pass for us to actually level depending on how many targets we hit or how active we are or can be. 

 

HCS wants money - we want stam - we want level expansions - we want a top rated that allows and encourages active people to work hard and play hard. HCS wants donations - we want to help them but they have to help us help them first. If we can't play - we can't spend - if we can't spend the game loses money. 

 

I want to see level expansion for everyone in game - Yes, you might be at risk and you might get it - there are plenty of options as I've explained. We all want MORE STAM - buy it - earn it through quest's or dailies or arenas - truth is I don't have enough - I can't play as much as I'd like - watching my stam grow is about as exciting as watching grass grow... We all want more and to do more... Support the ideas to expand areas of the game - come together and help us all achieve more. This is a PvP game - accept that logging in - help me help you level up and get out of that attackers reach - support the idea of level expansions - more stam per hr - new top rated list - expanding levels for gvg. Help me, help you all here. 

 

- Chazz

[MSCruz]

Remember upon logging in... this is what? "A PvP BASED GAME so you are signing up to be possibly attacked as someone might be equally attacked by you one day. 

 

Really sorry if I am ruining your original post. I really tried to help. But there is nothing to do if the "two sides" cannot enter a common ground. So this is my last reply to this topic.

 

I really disagree with you. When I entered this game was because of the plot. The start page says "Fallen Sword. Browser based RPG. Explore the world of Erildath in this 2D RPG" and "Fallen Sword is a MMPORG set in this exciting and evolving world of Erildath. Players enter the world and explore, adventure across a vast number of realms with thousands (???) of other players", then "you encounter FELLOW players who you CAN engage in battle against". Well, this is the only place saying something about PvP. One of the aspects of the game, not the evident one, nor the most important.

 

You say the numbers show this is a PvP game, but you or anyone else proved with numbers. Is just an opinion based on something I cannot say if it is true or not. Besides, all your suggestions are your point of view. If I BB, I am supporting PvP. I would never ask someone to revenge me. I created a guild to make my own way into the game. I don't want easy buffs, easy gears, easy whatever. I interact with the players while playing, when I want to socialize I go outdoors; much more fun. But I don't question who does differently. And I don't try to impose my point of view or preferences. The way you play is correct, for you. But this does not mean it is correct for everyone.

 

I just don't understand why is not funny to PvP only those who like PvP? Why this is not enough? (This is a rhethoric question)

 

That being said, I really hope you can improve PvP in the game, just ask you to think about the non-PvPers.

 

Sorry, fellows!

[Pardoux]

PvP has always been and will always be "The Great Divider"

 

I can equate it to 2 lawns on either side of a fence. PVP'rs are on one lawn, Anti-PvP'rs are on the other lawn and some, getting splinters up their butts, are sitting on the fence.

 

The problem the cows have is probably insurmountable here ...

If they boost PvP, the levellers will object
If they nerf PvP, the PvP'rs will object

The comment about "big" MMORPG's having a thriving PvP aspect is true - as far as it goes. Unless it's changed since I played one of the biggest ones there were, there was a choice. You either log into a realm that SUPPORTS PvP, or you log into a realm that DOESN'T ?

 

Why is that so hard to implement here. Let PvP'rs PvP, and let those that don't want to, not have to

[Chazz224]

PvP has always been and will always be "The Great Divider"

 

I can equate it to 2 lawns on either side of a fence. PVP'rs are on one lawn, Anti-PvP'rs are on the other lawn and some, getting splinters up their butts, are sitting on the fence.

 

The problem the cows have is probably insurmountable here ...

If they boost PvP, the levellers will object
If they nerf PvP, the PvP'rs will object

The comment about "big" MMORPG's having a thriving PvP aspect is true - as far as it goes. Unless it's changed since I played one of the biggest ones there were, there was a choice. You either log into a realm that SUPPORTS PvP, or you log into a realm that DOESN'T ?

 

Why is that so hard to implement here. Let PvP'rs PvP, and let those that don't want to, not have to

Hoof + Grim = The creators of this game - have said this is a "PvP based player game" 

 

It's also an mmo as well yes of course. If I could I'd strongly advise Hoof that he should have enabled a warning that upon logging in or creating a character - all players are subject to PvP. There is nothing wrong with it again - just as there is nothing wrong with other aspects leveling and what not. 

 

We all want more as i've said - I'd like to see us get more. 

[Necra]

little by little - one at a time im sure we can get there peacefully and successfully  and ofc it will take time. 

[BadPenny]

In the beginning, the "levelers" cried out for PvP protection. For years, it was denied, kept on the "List of things that will never happen". Then, that changed, it was introduced, and at first, it protected gold AND XP. Eventually gold was removed, as stealing gold was what PvP was all about in the olden days. Still, the "levelers" whined about being fish in a barrel. PvP was fun way back when, and I did more of that than leveling, so it took me 7 years to hit 500....

Now, at least in my opinion, PvP is no longer fun. I don't even do it for my DQ when it pops up, not because I don't like it (I do), but because I have put a lot of time to meet a leveling goal now, and I'm not prepared to lose 5 levels for a 10 stam hit for a daily quest. I don't even go for prestige anymore, lest I be accused of "farming"...

I don't see a solution for the drama PvP generates, nor do I see anything that can make it fun and vibrant again, at least not while we have players that hold each other in contempt for whichever side of the fence they reside on.

None of you are ever gonna be remotely happy with the PvP dynamics of this game.... Me, I've moved on to other games where PvP is accepted for what it is without all this endless debate and bickering.....

I'm sick of it.

IT'S A GAME! PVP IS IN IT, AND IT WILL STAY, FLAWED OR NOT! PLAY THE GAME, HAVE FUN AND STOP TRYING TO BEND EVERYBODY ELSE TO YOUR WILL... LET HOOF AND THE GANG RUN THINGS THEIR WAY, FOR PITY'S SAKE!

#END RANT

[grimnok]

Hoof + Grim = The creators of this game - have said this is a "PvP based player game" 

 

It's also an mmo as well yes of course. If I could I'd strongly advise Hoof that he should have enabled a warning that upon logging in or creating a character - all players are subject to PvP. There is nothing wrong with it again - just as there is nothing wrong with other aspects leveling and what not. 

 

We all want more as i've said - I'd like to see us get more. 

 

By any reasonable definition, it plainly is NOT a PvP based game. How do I know? Because you can be terrible at it, and succeed at anything else you want to do. It is not, in any way, essential to progress in any other aspect. That said, as it stands now, with the abundance of free leveling pots given out at events, PvP is a minor hindrance to those not inclined to participate, unless you go out of your way trolling people to hit you.

 

But PvP is hilariously unbalanced in favor of the attacker, unless you go to extraordinary lengths to defend yourself, and it gets more unbalanced every time a new relevant buff is created or an old relevant buff has a higher available level. If you want people to care more about PvP who don't already, you need to make it more balanced.

 

You need new buffs usable for PvP defense.  They need to be cheap, effective, long-lasting, and only effective while on the defender. For example, a Nightmare Visage-like buff that doesn't subtract attack to be effective.

[Egami]

1) Let's promote some PvP by increasing the +/- hit range. 

 

2) I would also like to suggest additional PvP Daily Quests -

 

2a) For example a new daily could promote pvp where a player gains 3000 stam by 100 stamming another player off the BB this would be 10 hits and would be an example of a Legendary Quest.

 

2b) Other examples could consist from common quests where a player would apply 1 - hundred stam attack to a player that's on the bounty board and the reward could be something like 300 stam. 

 

3) We could even think of some crafty medal's perhaps for losing levels on the bb - taking levels from people on the bb and so fourth. 

Above numbering mine and post has been edited. Apologies for that.

 

1) Players have discussed this at some length. I'm against it because:

 

i) I fail to see how that would "promote" PvP other than for those that are already into it. Please note that I am not at all anti-PvP and would love to see more activity.

 

ii) In a nutshell, you need to remember that the ability to escape an attacker's range or get back to your target's range is an essential part of PvP strategy that keeps many "active". 

 

2) I'd def like to see that, but have collusion concerns. A lot of players create the illusion as is that a 10 stam hit should be a free pass. I'd like to see the option to choose gotten rid of. I openly admit that I'm not sure I'd be for that idea myself, lol.

 

2a) Sounds "collusionistic" and only stacks rewards already given. Part of taking 5 is having to use your stam. I also don't see how this would "promote" PvP. 

 

2b) Sounding like a broken record: I don't see how this would "promote" PvP. I have heard tale of peeps trying to sneak in 100 stams for their medal. I think the medal is reward enough. 

 

3) I like this idea as it doesn't change game play and could draw some peeps in. The "level" idea is pretty random as it works now though. Not sure that's the "best" suggestion. Also not sure how to improve the suggestion. An amount of XP taken with some type of calc based on attacker's VL? Not at all thought out. 

[Hoofmaster]

I don't think adjusting the PvP ranges would be beneficial to the game. I am however open to looking at potentially adding more PvP oriented daily quests (within reason!)

[wil72]

I don't think adjusting the PvP ranges would be beneficial to the game. I am however open to looking at potentially adding more PvP oriented daily quests (within reason!)

 

PvP Daily quests are all well and good in helping to promote this area of the game but what about an Event? Any chance of one in the "near" future?

 

Cheers.

 

wil72