86 replies to this topic

[Pardoux]

The fallensword helper, whilst an approved script, can be user-modified to provide extra functionality that the "core" helper doesn't provide. As such, for those with javascript knowledge, it can - and does - offer the ability to cheat in various facets of the game.

 

Zorg is reluctant to add the core features into the game - see http://forums.hunted...516#entry873841 for reasons - so, to combat the problem, here's a simple yes or no question.

 

Should the FSH be banned from the game ?

[gomezkilla]

Until this turns into a major problem, I say keep FSH as it provides some very useful tools for the game. Granted, some have become obsolete with the other updates HCS has implemented, but the ones still there are very useful.

[vamunre]

Normally I wouldn't say this, but somebody sure cries about FS helper allot!

[Pardoux]

Normally I wouldn't say this, but somebody sure cries about FS helper allot!

 

When folk are leaving the game because cheating (perceived or otherwise) is rampant - and modified FSH's being the cause - then yes, I'm pretty vocal about it.

 

I would much rather do without the facilities that the helper gave us and have a more "honest" game than keep the helper and allow cheats to prosper ..

[wil72]

Until this turns into a major problem, I say keep FSH as it provides some very useful tools for the game. Granted, some have become obsolete with the other updates HCS has implemented, but the ones still there are very useful.

 

If FS Helper is a doorway to cheating for those that can manipulate it then isn't that already a "major" problem? To be honest I'm completely blind as to what it allows, those clever manipulaters, to do. Details please.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[Pardoux]

 Details please.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

 

The details that I've managed to gather (admittedly few), have been passed to Hoof and he is going to take a look into it. Suffice it to say that facets of the game can be altered to provide great advantages

[bloody18]

FSH is an asset to the playability of the game. Although it seems to not function as well as it use to.. Once you are FSHelped  you never go back .. or something like that. Thanks

FSH is an asset to the playability of the game. Although it seems to not function as well as it use to.. Once you are FSHelped  you never go back .. or something like that. Thanks

[BraveKath]

I would rather see what people would like to see from FSH -- maybe a few are easy fixes - their priorities, and push hard for those.

For me -- these are the items that if they're not there affect my enjoyment of the game.

1) Moving my Allies up and prominent (or at least option to do so) -- My Allies are in a sense, my 2nd Guild.

2) Having checklist for Buffs -- this really helps when using a lot of buffs and potions.  Can live without, but I do love this.
3) Wanted and Current Bounties  

4) Moving the Shout Box (to me should just be in the lower Left Corner anyway -- upper right is annoying) -- this superficial information - not of any priority.  This should be a quick easy fix.

The rest .... *shrug* some are nice, but eh.

So I find that I can't vote one way or the other since HCS hasn't chosen to -- in my mind -- address several things that players have wanted for a long time.  Maybe I'm wrong, since I really don't want the cheating either, but to give HCS a pass on a matter that I feel they should have addressed doesn't seem right either.  They juggle a lot of priorities, so I know it's not easy.

That's my initial reaction to this.
 

Edited by BraveKath, 22 June 2014 - 23:06.

[wil72]

If FS Helper can be used by a clever few to gain advantage in areas of the game then isn't that like any other illegal script? Isn't that on a par with the multi, multi, multi. What it provides means nothing if this is the case. You could say this is the cleverest "illegal" script of all time. It provides FS players with nice wee add ons and they're real happy. Little do they know "some" are using it to get ill gotten gains. Bloody marvellous!

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[j3k]

no its meant for helping for people. 

[wil72]

no its meant for helping for people. 

 

What????!!!! Have you even read the posts here? Talk about "just making comment". I give up.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

[BraveKath]

Oh -- Another big thing I would miss is:

* Medal Progression -- if not for this, I frankly would have quit the game long, long ago.  I was away from the game for a while.  Came back and was sorting out if there was enough to keep me interested and I noticed some medals that I had some progress on and others out there that I could work to achieve.  When I left the game all I had was a Bronze Adventurer Medal, A Ruby Guild Loyalty, a Annual Service and game Loyalty medal -- not sure of the levels on those.  I've been back since about early 2012.  I was pretty much absent the year before that, and very active from 2009-2010 but mostly all GvG focused.

Medal Progression is one of the strongest motivators in this game for people to keep active and buying points, that and the friend connections.  Scratched out as I was in error.

We're the customer here.  Why can we not push for what we as players feel are the priorities?  Why do we have to just roll over and accept that Zorg says he doesn't want to do it?  If there are legal barriers that's one thing, but I'm sure there are ways around this.

Regardless, sadly, I am not optimistic that stopping FSH will stop the hackers-scripters from bending the game to their will.   
 

Edited by BraveKath, 23 June 2014 - 05:19.

[cyrus7]

Oh -- Another big thing I would miss is:

* Medal Progression -- if not for this, I frankly would have quit the game long, long ago.  I was away from the game for a while.  Came back and was sorting out if there was enough to keep me interested and I noticed some medals that I had some progress on and others out there that I could work to achieve.  When I left the game all I had was a Bronze Adventurer Medal, A Ruby Guild Loyalty, a Annual Service and game Loyalty medal -- not sure of the levels on those.  I've been back since about early 2012.  I was pretty much absent the year before that, and very active from 2009-2010 but mostly all GvG focused.

Medal Progression is one of the strongest motivators in this game for people to keep active and buying points, that and the friend connections. 

By "Medal Progression", do you mean this page?  http://www.fallenswo...bcmd=medalguide

It can be found on your profile right above your medals, and is part of the actual game, not the FSH.

 

If this is not the info you are looking for, please forgive me, as I do not use the 3rd-party script to gain additional options within the game, and do not know if there is "medal progression" info separate/in addition to the page available in the game.

 

 

 

[My comment below is not directed at you specifically, BraveKath.]

I have to say though, this is just another example problem with allowing the FSH: Many players have forgotten what is part of the game, and what is part of the 3rd-party script. Many times things have "broken" in FSH, and players have incorrectly blamed HCS.

[sweetlou]

The details that I've managed to gather (admittedly few), have been passed to Hoof and he is going to take a look into it. Suffice it to say that facets of the game can be altered to provide great advantages

Do you really think banning something that is quite useful for so many will prevent the people, you claim you know are cheating, from cheating in some other way? I don't. They will continue to write scripts if they have the knowledge to do so and there's not a thing the admins will do to stop them.

 

HCS doesn't monitor jack. They rely on players to police the game. They can't or won't even crack down on multis and shared accounts. I personally know of dozens of accounts either not being driven by the original player or where one player plays multiple accounts. So selling of accounts also takes place. If HCS doesn't want to take a proactive approach to protect their game, I'm certainly not going to dedicate time to help. I've essentially stopped caring about the game.

[BraveKath]

By "Medal Progression", do you mean this page?  http://www.fallenswo...bcmd=medalguide

It can be found on your profile right above your medals, and is part of the actual game, not the FSH.

 

If this is not the info you are looking for, please forgive me, as I do not use the 3rd-party script to gain additional options within the game, and do not know if there is "medal progression" info separate/in addition to the page available in the game.

 

 

 

[My comment below is not directed at you specifically, BraveKath.]

I have to say though, this is just another example problem with allowing the FSH: Many players have forgotten what is part of the game, and what is part of the 3rd-party script. Many times things have "broken" in FSH, and players have incorrectly blamed HCS.

 

Cyrus -- no offense taken.  And I stand corrected.  After my 1st post.  I decided to turn off FSH and see what was missing.  It didn't make sense to me that we didn't have this, but I thought it truly was absent and I found that confusing, but accepted it.  Thanks for pointing this out.

The OTHER points I made in my 1st post are still valid and true covering FSBox, Wanted & Current Bounties, etc.

Cheating in this game is rampant, but that is a problem with all games.  I will say that the cheating in FS seems far more pervasive and of a worse nature than other games that I've played.
 

It is with some sadness that I share Lou's pessimist view, but I'm a realist.  I think you can do away with FSH, block page reload and a dozen other things and the cheating will still be there as I believe for some it has become the game within the game and it almost seems they sort of demand it as somehow their right.  This may be perhaps they've gotten away with it for so long unchecked.

Edited by BraveKath, 23 June 2014 - 10:37.

[DeadParrot]

Do you really think banning something that is quite useful for so many will prevent the people, you claim you know are cheating, from cheating in some other way? I don't. They will continue to write scripts if they have the knowledge to do so and there's not a thing the admins will do to stop them.

 

HCS doesn't monitor jack. They rely on players to police the game. They can't or won't even crack down on multis and shared accounts. I personally know of dozens of accounts either not being driven by the original player or where one player plays multiple accounts. So selling of accounts also takes place. If HCS doesn't want to take a proactive approach to protect their game, I'm certainly not going to dedicate time to help. I've essentially stopped caring about the game.

 

I hate to add to this view point, but I've stopped caring as well.  I've found other games where the developers are focused on ONE game, or at the very least, have a dedicated team that is allocated to ONE game.  My biggest concerns are the lack of communication, slipped scheduling dates leading to no progress, and value for money.  This game is VERY EXPENSIVE, with a capital E.  Initially, the updates and dev involvement made the outlays palatable.  Now they are not.  

 

The proliferation of multi's has turned my stomach so much that I'm becoming a rekluse.  I feel like such a dah.  Hopefully, I find renewed interest over the summer in PvP, but I suspect not.  

 

DP

[Davros81]

I hate to add to this view point, but I've stopped caring as well.  I've found other games where the developers are focused on ONE game, or at the very least, have a dedicated team that is allocated to ONE game.  My biggest concerns are the lack of communication, slipped scheduling dates leading to no progress, and value for money.  This game is VERY EXPENSIVE, with a capital E.  Initially, the updates and dev involvement made the outlays palatable.  Now they are not.  

 

The proliferation of multi's has turned my stomach so much that I'm becoming a rekluse.  I feel like such a dah.  Hopefully, I find renewed interest over the summer in PvP, but I suspect not.  

 

DP

I like what you did there <-- oops sorry was that smarmy and condescending...?

Edited by Davros81, 23 June 2014 - 18:33.

[murabane]

Well this is fun, another area of possible cheating. I'd rather them leave it as it is considering what they have done with their "Titan Hunting" script detection. Completely ruined that and seems to be useless up to this point in its span, shame that i can set off that detector 100's of times per titan hunt. You figure just last night i did 1500 kills and had 116 set offs(yes i counted, its that annoying that you want to know how many times it happens).

 

That might be off topic, but the point im trying to make is. If they are going to do something about this, they need to take the time and do it the right way just not toss something up or out just to appease everyone and then move on and consider it done and finished. This helps a ton of players out, i have yet to use it at all. But from a lot of what i have heard it does help, is beneficial and i think from that it should be looked at extensively to try and keep FSH or at least incorporate some things it has offered into the game. I mean if it makes your game better, isn't it worth the time and effort?

 

Guess thats my little piece, i would like to know how they are cheating though. Kind of hard to debate this without some specific's or back this with numbers one way or the other.

[Pardoux]

 

That might be off topic, but the point im trying to make is. If they are going to do something about this, they need to take the time and do it the right way just not toss something up or out just to appease everyone and then move on and consider it done and finished. This helps a ton of players out, i have yet to use it at all. But from a lot of what i have heard it does help, is beneficial and i think from that it should be looked at extensively to try and keep FSH or at least incorporate some things it has offered into the game. I mean if it makes your game better, isn't it worth the time and effort?

 

 

 

I couldn't agree more - I would rather have the core features built into the game AND THEN ban the FSH completely - but Zorg doesn't want to do this for his reasons listed above ..

 

Should we roll over and play dead with his decision ? - probably not - but the level of disillusionment in the game is getting higher and higher, and getting things done is taking longer and longer (and that grates with me, for having to say it, 'cos I normally try to remain positive about developments in the game).

Getting stuff done that the cows seem to think necessary takes an age, so getting something done that they DON'T want to do ? - I'd say that gets as close to impossible as it'll ever get

[Crzy]

Didn't HCS have a poll about which FSH features we wanted implemented the most? In my book they should just implement the major features and ban any/all scripts. Even if the community would be ungrateful because the additions are things we've grown accustomed to, it would be worth it. Anything that stops cheating, multis, scripting, auto-joining/buffing, whatever is OK in my eyes.

 

I was just having a chat with someone where we both shook our heads about the fact that cheaters prosper more in this game than the honest players. :/