42 replies to this topic

[MummRa]

Maybe it's just in my crazy mind, but there is an inherent problem with the BB. IMO, speaking generally and not about all but many pvp-era I have to assume don't care about their own XP anywhere near as much as thier targets. So why can't the BB take away something they care about.

Not all are on the ladder, prestige points aren't enough. This thread will probably get derailed before anything useful is brought up.

But here's a start:

Let's create something called PvP level. At the lowest level PvP is treated as it is now. But with each PvP successful attack you can work to increase your level. A higher pvp level will allow you to attack above your normal pvp range. Maybe the higher the level the greater chance of master thief and other enhancements activating are. Have a random 4-day bonus for pvpers above x level every so often.

But... Bounty board takes points away from your PvP level (instead of XP) ** edited to include clarification on removal of XP loss **

[Maehdros]

The only issue I see with the bounty board is low levels being smashed by bigger levels for smasher because those bigger players won't bother playing the ladder to get smasher ticks ( for whatever reason) and *cannot* gain smasher ticks via normal pvp ( if they do any at all) >>> The smasher medal should be changed back >> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=107363


some players pvp to gain gold/ fsp etc. They use this for upgrades, potions and so on. Now there is less gold to hit for (due to protection) so lower amounts are what some go for.Now consider any time some low levels gold hit or pvp and are placed on the bounty board, they are ripped to peices by high levels.


Not all low levels have friends/ guildmates to defend or watch their back, so what do some of them do? They pvp even LESS. Hit's aren't worth the risk to some of them anymore.


Now, back to your idea.... Promoting hits if thats what you intended with the boost to level range/ gold thievery etc, seems nice but gold rates won't matter if theres no gold to be hit for. ( see Yotekiller's thread on that one>>> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=107492 ). However I suspect the leveling side will be up in arms being opened up to an even bigger pvp range ( surprise! )


Second, you say the issue is there isn't enough punishment, despite the fact EVERY off the board hit can be bountied now for 5 levels lost. I think the issue is actually the fact few are clearing bounties anymore for various reasons, most being *incentive* to bounty hunt.( see evilbry;s thread >>> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=107322 )

[MummRa]

The only issue I see with the bounty board is low levels being smashed by bigger levels for smasher because those bigger players won't bother playing the ladder to get smasher ticks ( for whatever reason) and *cannot* gain smasher ticks via normal pvp ( if they do any at all) >>> The smasher medal should be changed back >> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=107363


some players pvp to gain gold/ fsp etc. They use this for upgrades, potions and so on. Now there is less gold to hit for (due to protection) so lower amounts are what some go for.Now consider any time some low levels gold hit or pvp and are placed on the bounty board, they are ripped to peices by high levels.


Not all low levels have friends/ guildmates to defend or watch their back, so what do some of them do? They pvp even LESS. Hit's aren't worth the risk to some of them anymore.


Now, back to your idea.... Promoting hits if thats what you intended with the boost to level range/ gold thievery etc, seems nice but gold rates won't matter if theres no gold to be hit for. ( see Yotekiller's thread on that one>>> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=107492 ). However I suspect the leveling side will be up in arms being opened up to an even bigger pvp range ( surprise! )


Second, you say the issue is there isn't enough punishment, despite the fact EVERY off the board hit can be bountied now for 5 levels lost. I think the issue is actually the fact few are clearing bounties anymore for various reasons, most being *incentive* to bounty hunt.( see evilbry;s thread >>> viewtopic.php?f=1&t=107322 )

As I mentioned at the start of the post. Maybe I'm crazy but I just keep getting a feeling there are at least a section who don't care about the levels lost or who may even want to lose levels.

[Maehdros]

Maybe I'm crazy but I just keep getting a feeling there are at least a section who don't care about the levels lost or who may even want to lose levels.

You mean some of the EOC who don't normally pvp, sitting on crazy max stam, losing levels on purpose, then using globals to get back those levels cheaply to get more guild xp? ( I got asked by several players within the last week if I wanted free smasher hits to help them lose levels, also seen people accept bounties on purpose to get posted and lose levels)

[MummRa]

Maybe I'm crazy but I just keep getting a feeling there are at least a section who don't care about the levels lost or who may even want to lose levels.

You mean some of the EOC who don't normally pvp, sitting on crazy max stam, losing levels on purpose, then using globals to get back those levels cheaply to get more guild xp? ( I got asked by several players within the last week if I wanted free smasher hits to help them lose levels, also seen people accept bounties on purpose to get posted and lose levels)

Actually I've come across people looking to lose levels to help decrease their level to get to a lower pvp band as well so no... Not just EOC

[Maehdros]

Actually I've come across people looking to lose levels to help decrease their level to get to a lower pvp band as well so no... Not just EOC

One is more guild xp, the other is to change a pvp bracket. Is that why you think the bounty board doesn't work? It;s taking xp , correct? Do you feel because of those two examples, that the board should penalize anyone who pvps even further?

[MummRa]

Actually I've come across people looking to lose levels to help decrease their level to get to a lower pvp band as well so no... Not just EOC

One is more guild xp, the other is to change a pvp bracket. Is that why you think the bounty board doesn't work? It;s taking xp , correct? Do you feel because of those two examples, that the board should penalize anyone who pvps even further?

No my idea for the BB was instead of taking XP not in addition. I want to create something that will incentivize PvP but also creates a possibility of loss more significant than XP when there are some who just don't care about levels

[Maehdros]

Actually I've come across people looking to lose levels to help decrease their level to get to a lower pvp band as well so no... Not just EOC

One is more guild xp, the other is to change a pvp bracket. Is that why you think the bounty board doesn't work? It;s taking xp , correct? Do you feel because of those two examples, that the board should penalize anyone who pvps even further?

No my idea for the BB was instead of taking XP not in addition. I want to create something that will incentivize PvP but also creates a possibility of loss more significant than XP when there are some who just don't care about levels

SO you're suggestion is to remove xp loss from the bounty board? You might want to clarifiy that in the OP.

[BigGrim]

I must confess, I thought it pretty obvious from his post that that was his suggestion.

[Maehdros]

I must confess, I thought it pretty obvious from his post that that was his suggestion.

Then do you care to comment further? lol

[MummRa]

I must confess, I thought it pretty obvious from his post that that was his suggestion.

Then do you care to comment further? lol

I do have a bad habit of coming off unclear when I speak/write

I know the idea would probably take a lot of work; I just I hope I'm not the only who sees the potential benefits.

[smileynirv]

it may actually look to everyone like Maehdros has derailed this thread in the very first reply post LOL but i agree that the only way to fix the bounty board is to fix pvp. to give the pvp players what they want you also need to give levelers what they want or at least give them some enjoyment out of the little participation they give in pvp "being attacked". how do we get levelers to enjoy being attacked? well i dont get much more joy in this game than when a player attacks me and loses lol.
with the way its setup now if two players have the exact same armor, stats and bonuses the attacker wins as long as the 2% rule doesn't kick in. i suggest maybe "if we can all come up with a way to make it work" revamp pvp all together. i think the basic idea im having is that player A attacks player B and gets a kill taking away X xp and X gold. player B then gets a swing in there with a chance to steal back whatever.
i see how levelers feel like victims when they should feel like its a friendly duel or pvpers just want to steal gold and get a medal for it IDK.
ok pick the idea apart and see if we can get anything out of the idea. any other ideas i would love to read as well
oh and there is a whole thread on the idea of bringing back the smasher medal to its original glory. i read it yesterday so no point in bringing it up here.....again

[MummRa]

it may actually look to everyone like Maehdros has derailed this thread in the very first reply post LOL but i agree that the only way to fix the bounty board is to fix pvp. to give the pvp players what they want you also need to give levelers what they want or at least give them some enjoyment out of the little participation they give in pvp "being attacked". how do we get levelers to enjoy being attacked? well i dont get much more joy in this game than when a player attacks me and loses lol.
with the way its setup now if two players have the exact same armor, stats and bonuses the attacker wins as long as the 2% rule doesn't kick in. i suggest maybe "if we can all come up with a way to make it work" revamp pvp all together. i think the basic idea im having is that player A attacks player B and gets a kill taking away X xp and X gold. player B then gets a swing in there with a chance to steal back whatever.
i see how levelers feel like victims when they should feel like its a friendly duel or pvpers just want to steal gold and get a medal for it IDK.
ok pick the idea apart and see if we can get anything out of the idea. any other ideas i would love to read as well
oh and there is a whole thread on the idea of bringing back the smasher medal. i read it yesterday so no point in bringing it up here.....again

This has absolutely nothing to do with original post. I will ask you stay on topic. Maehdros didn't begin a derailment but your post, I fear will

[smileynirv]

the bounty board is retribution for a crime that is done against you. eye for an eye type of situation that requires the ability to steal from a player what they stole from you. i don't think any leveler cares if a pvp player cares about losing levels or not. the idea is that i delevel the attacker and i level up out of their range so they cant do it again. if there was a pvp level it would be viewed very little by a leveler. back on track

[morderme]

I agree...there is a basic disincentive in the BB. No matter how you slice it, the attacked player cannot get "even" or equitable retribution. 'Fixes" to the game only make the PvPer stronger. aka, Protection -- protects everyone -- so how are you to hit back and get your $$$ back (or at least some good part of it).

Creating a scenario where the PvPer truly loses something - valuable - is a good start. However, there continues an advantage to the PvPer (correct me if I am wrong -- uh oh, I've opened the door on that one!).

1.) Make loss of levels plain and basic. Make it so loss of levels doesn't put you into a lower PvP ladder. I say this because I am not convinced the VL works the way it is supposed to work.
2.) Make it so the Dodge and 1st strike and other enhancements REALLY work. Rarely does the dodge or 1st strike appear to kick in when needed.

OK, that's all I can think of for now... Fire away...

[MummRa]

A suggestion from the Achievement thread:

I like these ideas and I have one to add

How about an achievement for The number of levels lost on the bb or something along the same lines?

Given this suggestion, do we think the bounty board is an adequate source of recourse?

[Maehdros]

A suggestion from the Achievement thread:

I like these ideas and I have one to add

How about an achievement for The number of levels lost on the bb or something along the same lines?

Given this suggestion, do we think the bounty board is an adequate source of recourse?

Someone losing levels fighting for what they believe in, or defending their guildmates/ friends. Does that sound better?

There's plenty of reasons for which a player can lose levels, be it on purpose or due to a re action for something they did. I'm sure many would proudly wear an achievement that states they've lost levels sticking up for their guild mates( or others) and have no problem risking xp and levels to do so when the time calls for it.

[lawyergod]

A suggestion from the Achievement thread:

I like these ideas and I have one to add

How about an achievement for The number of levels lost on the bb or something along the same lines?

Given this suggestion, do we think the bounty board is an adequate source of recourse?

Someone losing levels fighting for what they believe in, or defending their guildmates/ friends. Does that sound better?

There's plenty of reasons for which a player can lose levels, be it on purpose or due to a re action for something they did. I'm sure many would proudly wear an achievement that states they've lost levels sticking up for their guild mates( or others) and have no problem risking xp and levels to do so when the time calls for it.

You're not wrong, but you're kinda missing the point. In fact, you're kinda EXEMPLIFYING the point. Simply put, if losing levels on the Bounty Board is a source of pride to a lot of people, particularly the sort of people most likely to BE on the Board, then it might not be the deterrent it was designed to be, and some sort of re-balancing might be necessary. I have no idea as to what it might be, personally -- I don't do the Board at all -- but THAT is the question that is being asked here.

[shdowdrgn]

You're not wrong, but you're kinda missing the point. In fact, you're kinda EXEMPLIFYING the point. Simply put, if losing levels on the Bounty Board is a source of pride to a lot of people, particularly the sort of people most likely to BE on the Board, then it might not be the deterrent it was designed to be, and some sort of re-balancing might be necessary. I have no idea as to what it might be, personally -- I don't do the Board at all -- but THAT is the question that is being asked here.

actually i have to disagree with you here. Mae isnt saying that the loss of levels dont hurt just that the pain is worth it when defending guild/friends/ something you believe in. PVPers are not exempt from being knocked out of gear, out of a certain range they want to be in or being put in a position where they are forced to make up lost levels.

To be blunt a majority of PVPers do not enjoy leveling at all. in fact it is down right painful for many, my self included there. personally i think leveling is the worst part of the game. i do it as i have to to get to new gear or buffs or level ranges. fact is losing levels on the BB is a good punishment the problem with it is that Levelers are so adamant that they only want to level that they wont stand up for each other and drop people levels so a lot of times only min damage gets done. rather than complaining that more damage needs to happen everyone needs to step up and use the BB the way it was intended first.

We can not avoid your end of the game, why then should you get nothing but free passes from our end...

rant done

[shdowdrgn]

I must confess, I thought it pretty obvious from his post that that was his suggestion.

would love to hear your thoughts on the matter BG if you have any opinions on it currently.