22 replies to this topic

[Crofil]

because i didn't get an answer from a dev when i posted this elsewhere i thought I'd post it in a new threag..

 

So I've been tailoring in the hope to be able to make me some gear plus i need to level it so i can make the helm for the relic set (still think this is a bad idea)

 

It costs me 19 silver to purchase 112 weak dye but after creating about 10 items with the 100 coarse cloth i only make 3 silver back this doesn't seem very fair to me? that's not to mentiong the couple of silver it cost me to farm the jute,  i think the prices need to be tweaked somwhere or people are never going to get anywhere

 

is it only the tailoring profession that this is happening in? i'm not goin to be able to buy anything if i keeps going

 

I'd really like to be able to afford my skills seeing as though some have increased in price

 

[l3fty]

Selling crafted items back to the vendors is not intended to be profitable. Other players will value these items alot more however. You will be constantly earning crafting xp, which in turn allows you to create higher level items. Not to mention as you pointed out, you're making better gear for yourself to use too.

 

In short, the vendors are cheapskates, but when there is a stable population of players you will (hopefully) find a market for crafted goods.

[Fafhred]

Losing cash while crafting has always been the case.

 

And when you still craft low level items, no, the other players will not want them; neither do you.

Edited by Fafhred, 15 November 2013 - 22:36.

[Crofil]

there will be no market when the game goes live as everyone will need to craft for the relics helms, and noone will have cash to purchase items,  how are you supposed to make cash in game when drop rates from world creatures are few and far between if crafting and selling is no way to profit?  there has to be another way to earn 

[grimnok]

Selling crafted items back to the vendors is not intended to be profitable. Other players will value these items alot more however. You will be constantly earning crafting xp, which in turn allows you to create higher level items. Not to mention as you pointed out, you're making better gear for yourself to use too.

 

In short, the vendors are cheapskates, but when there is a stable population of players you will (hopefully) find a market for crafted goods.

There almost can't be a player market for crafted items.  Players will be grinding out dozens, and later hundreds, of items per level.  Unless only a tiny fraction of players are in any given profession, there will be next to no market for any common crafted items.

[Mongo]

If you are one of the first to hit the craft level to create those relic helms, kaos... you will make a tidy profit selling them to other players, I suspect, especially while the game is still new and the demand calls for more than is supplied 

 

I am lazy, I for one will be buying those helms from the crafter's!

[Majjer]

its fine as it is now. selling crafted items to npc with loss filters true long-term crafters. otherwise everyone would be crafting so there would be no market.

[redsmokeboy]

Started leatehr work, 5 Leather crafted helm ,  Cost from npc to crafting laeather only sold 1/10 of what cost crafted, Persoanly do think should be some twick's with crafting lose get back 1/10 what cost put in is not greate to crafter's. Not sure rate for other's.

 

50% back would be ok but as i can see it get around 10/20% back far to low.

[Crofil]

how easy are the elemental flakes to come by? i they are needed in almost everything now.. looks like melee/ranged and sorcery pots will be non existent in this game depending on the elemental flakes drop rate

 

my main concern is crafting needs coins so does farming and repairing items and buying skillsyet there doesn't seem to be much to be found you lose coins building professions creature give minimal coing from being killed (hardly covers repairs) there are barely and gear drops so farming crtters could take days for any kinds of profit.

[Fafhred]

There will be few true crafters at first, since they will be levelling significantly slower than other characters (LOTS of time needed to farm resources instead of levelling), and will have to overcome the cash flow issue to able to practice crafting.

I agree with Majjer's point, but most players in the first weeks or months will be doing their own crafting because there will be no trained crafters yet.
As for Lefty's answer of selling crafted items to other players, it will not apply for weeks, and not before crafters reach the production of quality items, which is definitely not the case right away.

As for me, I do intend to be a crafter, but that will depend as well on the availability of affordable large containers, which IS a necessary expense for true crafters, regardless what non-crafters may think.
If the range and value of containers is still similar to what it was in the past (waiting to see on that, I have read that it is supposed to change, but still need to check how effective are the planned changes), you will not see trained crafters in game before months into the release.
 

Edited by Fafhred, 16 November 2013 - 02:31.

[Majjer]

are you about to win in one week? i spent some time today in othalo mine, result: prospecting 11, weapon crafting 3, armor smithing 4. not so bad for 1st day.

 

and please be aware you do not have supporter status what means you earn 25% xp & gold less.

[Kara]

the first levels of crafting should be a pain in the ass imo

[Oops]

I for one love crafting but if I am losing money hand over fist with no other way to make money I don't see me doing it I have to be able to make money to lvl up as everything is so expensive I am not much for combat hence me being a healer so crafting is my release I like making things but if I am just gonna be losing money while I try and lvl it isn't worth it to me I need to be making money so I can afford my healing spells that I have to purchase and like was said the creatures don't give much money for killing them the quest don't pay much and drops are few and far between so if I am losing money crafting and having to repair my gear which cost me dearly at times why should I waste my time crafting if I am just gonna lose more money and not be able to afford my spells that I need to be able to become a great healer 

[Alpion]

Selling crafted items back to the vendors is not intended to be profitable. Other players will value these items alot more however. You will be constantly earning crafting xp, which in turn allows you to create higher level items. Not to mention as you pointed out, you're making better gear for yourself to use too.

 

In short, the vendors are cheapskates, but when there is a stable population of players you will (hopefully) find a market for crafted goods.

I mean, you're kidding, right?  Who in their right mind thinks that it should cost more to craft than you get out of it?  So you're gaining experience...if that's your rationale, then why not just put Free Experience potions for sale for gold?  That way we can all save our time from crafting and just "buy" our levels like it's set up now.  I have never in my life played a game where you lose money on crafting.  The theory that crafters will make money from the player base is just ludicrous as well.  I would love to sit in on one of the management meetings where these decisions are made just to hear the train of thought going around.

 

And not only are we losing tons of money crafting, you all may not have noticed but they also increased the materials required for each item.  It's almost like they're forcing everyone to say "no thanks" to crafting because it's ridiculous...so that only a few people who pay real money can actually craft and control the markets themselves.

 

I'm beyond belief right now.

[Hoofmaster]

because i didn't get an answer from a dev when i posted this elsewhere i thought I'd post it in a new threag..

 

So I've been tailoring in the hope to be able to make me some gear plus i need to level it so i can make the helm for the relic set (still think this is a bad idea)

 

It costs me 19 silver to purchase 112 weak dye but after creating about 10 items with the 100 coarse cloth i only make 3 silver back this doesn't seem very fair to me? that's not to mentiong the couple of silver it cost me to farm the jute,  i think the prices need to be tweaked somwhere or people are never going to get anywhere

 

is it only the tailoring profession that this is happening in? i'm not goin to be able to buy anything if i keeps going

 

I'd really like to be able to afford my skills seeing as though some have increased in price

 

Thank you for the feedback on the crafting. We'll keep it in mind for any final tweaks we make before the game launches

[LittleJack]

I also think that the crafting isn't set up right as it is now.. I don't have to make a huge profit, but i like to be able to buy the components needed at least. 

[Majjer]

it's good that crafted items are chap to sell so they are cheap to repair.

[Foulplay]

I mean, you're kidding, right?  Who in their right mind thinks that it should cost more to craft than you get out of it?  So you're gaining experience...if that's your rationale, then why not just put Free Experience potions for sale for gold?  That way we can all save our time from crafting and just "buy" our levels like it's set up now.  I have never in my life played a game where you lose money on crafting.  The theory that crafters will make money from the player base is just ludicrous as well.  I would love to sit in on one of the management meetings where these decisions are made just to hear the train of thought going around.

 

And not only are we losing tons of money crafting, you all may not have noticed but they also increased the materials required for each item.  It's almost like they're forcing everyone to say "no thanks" to crafting because it's ridiculous...so that only a few people who pay real money can actually craft and control the markets themselves.

 

I'm beyond belief right now.

I don't know which games you have been playing. Litterally almost all the mmorpgs I have played never have what you speak of. A profession is meant to be a loss if you are doing it all solo and not selling to the player base. The proffesion feature is meant to point out the >multiplayer< in mmo. You do it to sell to a player, not a vendor.

 

 

Quite frankly, your attitude is neither constructive nor appreciated. If you want to get a point accross to the development team or this community, being polite goes a long way. Aggression only makes people want to ignore or refute your point.

[Irradiated]

I don't know which games you have been playing. Litterally almost all the mmorpgs I have played never have what you speak of. A profession is meant to be a loss if you are doing it all solo and not selling to the player base. The proffesion feature is meant to point out the >multiplayer< in mmo. You do it to sell to a player, not a vendor.

I said essentially the same thing in the other thread on this topic.  For my much longer reply, see http://forums.hunted...361#entry820873.

[Alpion]

I don't know which games you have been playing. Litterally almost all the mmorpgs I have played never have what you speak of. A profession is meant to be a loss if you are doing it all solo and not selling to the player base. The proffesion feature is meant to point out the >multiplayer< in mmo. You do it to sell to a player, not a vendor.

 

 

Quite frankly, your attitude is neither constructive nor appreciated. If you want to get a point accross to the development team or this community, being polite goes a long way. Aggression only makes people want to ignore or refute your point.

Thanks for the feedback.  Let's be constructive.

 

You're right.  A profession should be about making money from the player base.  Now please, enlighten me as to what items you can craft that will turn a profit of any sort.  Set helms?  Nah...you'll outgrow it in a few short days.  Heroic items?  Nah...same deal.  How about needing the gathered rares to create the items?  Don't see that being realistic for earning money...since it takes so long to get them...longer than the usefulness of the item it's used for.  Food?  Potions?  Depends on whether or not they leave them in-game to be purchased from vendors as they are now.  Forcing players to buy crafted items to continue quest lines?  Pretty bad way to force progression, in my opinion.  Only maybe when you get to level 50 and need a set helm...but 1 item out of hundreds that won't be seen for quite a while?  *shrug*

 

Now how about setting up shop to earn this money in this game.  Auction house?  Not yet.  Player trading stands?  Not yet.  Any idea when it may be added to the game?  Not yet.  Forums?  Pretty clunky and not effective for those wanting to really make money from trading.

 

I'm not upset that it costs more money to craft than what you get from just selling back to NPCs.  No, I don't think you should make money hand over fist by doing this.  But I also don't see why becoming a master crafter should be a losing proposal.  If you can look at this game, and give me a reasonable scenario for 6 months down the road to where crafting has become a legitimate option for a player to choose instead of grinding out quests and dungeon running, then I'd love to hear it.  My opinions are based solely on the state of the game as it is now, and where it has stated it's planning to go in the future.  If I'm missing out on some key information, then I'll gladly review my opinion when that is brought to my attention.

 

I have put in a ton of time into crafting and testing all of them in the previous releases of this game, and I continue to test it now as well.  I feel my experiences with it so far have made my concerns legitimate, whether or not others feel the same.