481 replies to this topic

[matt2269f]

lowered xp gain ? - u mean 1xp per critter  -thats not really a comparison 

[EpicPiety]

The final form included no xp loss and opt in. Is that really what you want? O_O

But you are right. If they had started with that version, it would have easily passsed.

at this point i can honestly care less as long as it gives something to do and is entertaining.

[matt2269f]

in some ways i dont see what is gained from PvP - the loser loses xp and gold - the winner only gets gold and usually just a small bit like 20%    ------   like i said before it sure would make pvp interesting if a defending 'win' took xp from the attacker and gave it to the defender 

[matt2269f]

i agree with EpicPiety  on his last statement 

 

globals i cant really say are fun or entertaining as its pretty mindless ------- 123 0 ...123 0 .... and on and on 

 

give us something fun to do that will entertain us 

[Corrupted]

in some ways i dont see what is gained from PvP - the loser loses xp and gold - the winner only gets gold and usually just a small bit like 20%    ------   like i said before it sure would make pvp interesting if a defending 'win' took xp from the attacker and gave it to the defender 

That is mostly PvP itself though. That's how it is regularly. Every other aspect in which PvP is involved has some sort of "Reward". Whether that is worth it to some or not is another subject.

In terms of the PvP Event, a good reward will be a good incentive. Plenty of things have been listed throughout the thread (medals, chests, components to invent EPICS or other things) that would make the event worthwhile even for those who don't exactly venture into the realms of Player vs Player.

[matt2269f]

That is mostly PvP itself though. That's how it is regularly. Every other aspect in which PvP is involved has some sort of "Reward". Whether that is worth it to some or not is another subject.

In terms of the PvP Event, a good reward will be a good incentive. Plenty of things have been listed throughout the thread (medals, chests, components to invent EPICS or other things) that would make the event worthwhile even for those who don't exactly venture into the realms of Player vs Player.

i can see pros and cons to the rewards/incentives ----- too little and no one will care - too much or 'special' stuff will be too inviting for players at the high end of the ranges(if there is ranges) to OP buff out and ride out the top of the wave 

[Corrupted]

i can see pros and cons to the rewards/incentives ----- too little and no one will care - too much or 'special' stuff will be too inviting for players at the high end of the ranges(if there is ranges) to OP buff out and ride out the top of the wave 

We have evidence of what entices people in the game. Of course, we don't need things to go over what we already have, lots of strong stuff out there.

If we were to have Potion Chests, they could be like the ones in Globals. Single backpack space ones that you can take multiple potions from. One of the Potions inside could be a Leveling one, and of course, one for the PvP. The Crystal Chests from the Ladder could do the trick.

If we were to have a Resource/Item used in Inventing, it would be used for the creation of new Epics. Kind of how the Milk from the new Titan works. The recipes can be worked out later on if the Cows decide to go this route.

I'm sure the latter will attract a larger playerbase, and with decent moderation on the supply of the resource/fairness of recipes, the Event could have rewards that would not burn out after a few tries. That will keep the incentive of people to participate.

There is also the possibility of introducing a new Medal(s) for said Event. People love medals.

[SirAdmiral]

The final form included no xp loss and opt in. Is that really what you want? O_O
 

 

Ew, gross. I wouldn't touch that with a 10 foot pole.

[Leos3000]

Weak critters that give you lowered xp gain? Ya mean like lowered xp loss in a pvp event? It's consistent with how the game actually works.

So what your proposing is for PvP loss to be lowered to as if we were losing the amount of xp as if we were level 25? Say somewhere around 100 xp per defeat? This would be consistent no matter what level you are.

I think with a minimal xp loss like that the community could live with xp loss occurring in the event. As you said this would then be consistent with how much xp is gained from killing global creatures (also consistent with the risk of losing to them as well since they are level 25 and when you lose that is roughly how much xp you lose)

[matt2269f]

at 100xp per loss i probably wouldnt care if i got hit a 100x 

[yotwehc]

So what your proposing is for PvP loss to be lowered to as if we were losing the amount of xp as if we were level 25? Say somewhere around 100 xp per defeat? This would be consistent no matter what level you are.

I think with a minimal xp loss like that the community could live with xp loss occurring in the event. As you said this would then be consistent with how much xp is gained from killing global creatures (also consistent with the risk of losing to them as well since they are level 25 and when you lose that is roughly how much xp you lose)

If it were this low, I don't think most people would care (you never know though, some get extremely annoyed by gvg hits) but how does this teach anyone that the xp loss is not too bad when it's tweaked down this low. Is that enough of the risk people are demanding?

[Calista]

So what your proposing is for PvP loss to be lowered to as if we were losing the amount of xp as if we were level 25? Say somewhere around 100 xp per defeat? This would be consistent no matter what level you are.

I think with a minimal xp loss like that the community could live with xp loss occurring in the event. As you said this would then be consistent with how much xp is gained from killing global creatures (also consistent with the risk of losing to them as well since they are level 25 and when you lose that is roughly how much xp you lose)

 

Personally I think the xp loss should remain what it is normally.  Few will like that though. So yeah, I'm suggesting the xp loss during the event be minimal. Same as you see with xp gain when chasing critters for drops or whatever the event is. It keeps things consistent with how PvP is actually played in the game. And it helps people learn the basic mechanics of it all.

 

 

If it were this low, I don't think most people would care (you never know though, some get extremely annoyed by gvg hits) but how does this teach anyone that the xp loss is not too bad when it's tweaked down this low. Is that enough of the risk people are demanding?

 

Risk is important to PvP in the game. But also, it's fun!  Back in the day I ran a guild that didn't allow pvp. (few will remember it, but it's true)  Getting involved with bounty hunting and from there meeting so many like minded people in the game is what keeps me here. (love you guys!) I think most can agree that an event would let some people try it out and see what the hoopla is about. So if reduced xp loss is what gets them to try it out, awesome. So long as the event remains consistent with how it works in the game.

[EpicPiety]

Enough xp loss that PvPer's are satisfied and enough xp loss that people who hate pvp are satisfied... I'd rather dedicate my life to solving world hunger.

[EpicPiety]

Successful attacks in the global can gain you experience...defeats can lose you experience. So if you participate in the event you have a net chance to lose some or gain some depending. Therefore if you expect to do the bare minimum to help the community reach the goal to get your reward you will lose a bunch of experience. Seeing that you decided to do the bare minimum only fair. The lore can be something to do with some 3rd party influencing the players causing us to have to fight each other to defeat whoever. each hit..victory or whatever you want can chip away at the health of the bad guy.

Edited by EpicPiety, 30 December 2016 - 18:08.

[matt2269f]

OMG !!!!!  An Idea both sides can agree on   

 

HOOF / Grim come quick   

Edited by matt2269f, 30 December 2016 - 19:23.

[matt2269f]

But seriously this is very workable - i cant see how either side can complain too much 

[Egami]

Thankfully, Hoof is taking the stance that the event will be an OPT-IN event, which means those that don't see it, won't log in once it's started to find themselves taking part against their will ..

 

Thanks for quoting that Pardoux, I 100% missed the context. 

 

Hopefully when Hoof gets around to reading this next week, he'll change his mind. 

 

If you look at the poll results, the final tally was 515 Yes, 974 No and 547 "Don't mind".

 

There is no poll in this thread.

 

That said, and despite the headaches it will cause the 1% of FS players who bother to use their personal time to give opinions here, I'd still like to see an FS home page announcement with a link to the topic to vote on it. 

 

I've never been a fan of the in game votes, so that's rough... but I would like to see players "possibly" participating in game development instead of it being decided based on "our" comments here. 

 

Hcs needs to stop treating pvp like it is bad. The perception given by the repeated attempts to change it is exactly that. There is nothing wrong with it.

 

The central issue and what really needs to be corrected. Is that even possible? I'm not sure. 

 

Just to give a feel for what is behind my thoughts so that I'm not "misinterpreted" (I'm not going into my personal 9-year history with it. You're welcome, lol):

 

What I have found most effective with teaching players about PvP, apart form many long hours of explaining and giving advice, is simply: Post a bounty, I'll 100 stam.

 

Players really took heed when they saw I lost 5 levels. They became interested in the cause and effect and how things work via the game mechanics. They were especially intrigued by the fact that I could care less.

 

pvp is 'not bad' but its actions of pvp'rs ruthlessness of how pvp is done that has made 'pvp' bad 

 

Disagree. The way game "education" has "progressed" is the culprit. Unfortunately, a large portions of players think it's the "worst thing in the world" and there is no knowledge passed on how to deal with the situation.

 

I got educated on the BB by some no-longer-here classics on PvP. Not their ideas mind you, but how to fight back, avoid, etc. PvPer's communication process has been nerfed beyond what's good for the game. That, unfortunately, I don't see a solution for. I do have to be really careful with my "educational" pms on the issue. 

 

Both Lvlers and pvpers have 1 thing in common -neither usually goes blindly attacking without knowing they most likely will win 

 

I'll point out the word "usually" and say that I have had tons of fun knowing I had less than a 10% chance of winning. That said, you are right that I don't go "blindly" attacking. 

 

Not always - being the 2nd pvp during a deleveling party and being online... I have to say that there is nothing more fun than that... try it :-p

 

Hard to organize (and yes I have organized being on the BB myself), but I def agree that fighting back can def be exhilarating. 

 

at 100xp per loss i probably wouldnt care if i got hit a 100x 

 

+1. Def hope that doesn't happen. Players already let Prestige hits slide far too much, myself included and that's around 600k XP loss.

 

 

If it were this low, I don't think most people would care (you never know though, some get extremely annoyed by gvg hits) but how does this teach anyone that the xp loss is not too bad when it's tweaked down this low. Is that enough of the risk people are demanding?

 

Full on agree that it needs to be exactly like it is now. Plus the BB "risk".

 

Successful attacks in the global can gain you experience...defeats can lose you experience. So if you participate in the event you have a net chance to lose some or gain some depending. 

 

Agree that XP loss should be fundamental in PvP. I've lost track of whether it still is or not. *insert embarrassed one-eyed emoticon*

 

EDIT: Only a major grammar error at the beginning that made me embarrassed. Nope, yet to triple check the rest.

Edited by Egami, 30 December 2016 - 21:29.

[matt2269f]

this kinda off topic a little bit - but i really do think it would make pvp all the more interesting if a successfully defended pvp attack would give players xp that the attacker losses ( im talking about pvp bb etc) 

[Egami]

this kinda off topic a little bit - but i really do think it would make pvp all the more interesting if a successfully defended pvp attack would give players xp that the attacker losses ( im talking about pvp bb etc) 

 

Yeah, saw you said that before. I disagree for two reasons:

 

1) Possible abuse.

2) PvP is not "supposed" to be about leveling.

 

After all, prestige was instituted for that very reason... and look what's happened. 

 

I do think the PvP Ladder prestige pot was a good idea, but I think it was a bit of a "balanced" trade off.

[matt2269f]

thats why i said only a successful defend would gain ( the gain would be equivent to what would have been lost) 

 

PvP is kinda 1 sided if u think about it - player A hits B - B losses xp+gold    --- player A hits B and loses - A loses xp (but do they care?) player B gets nothing 

Edited by matt2269f, 30 December 2016 - 20:33.