54 replies to this topic

[sweetlou]

Some things were changed when the PvP system was reverted. Most changes I've noticed are not positive! For example:

 

1) Conserve no longer saves xp from the attacked player. Was this intentional? If so please revert it so that Conserve not only saves the attackers stam but also saves xp loss from the attackee. It added a fun dynamic that has been lost. This wasn't something that had not been raised as a problem. Please don't fix what isn't broken.

 

2) Another problem I've witnessed is that bountied players sometimes don't lose xp. The xp loss is not notified on the battle page. The "XP left" column on the BB shows a reducing number after each attack however the players XP stat on their bio shows no reduction. Please fix!! This is kind of a major goof.

 

3) Now that we have had some work done to what was arguably the worst page in the game, the Attack Player page, the result is now we have way too many click requirements to do the same things, and for what? I thought upgrades were meant to improve the game. Taking multiple bounties requires players to drop down a pop up window for each bounty. Opening tabs for each player, the old method, is now useless. The old tab method worked so well because of the game's persistent lag. While you waited for a page to open you could move on to the next tab and peform an action and so on. This new Attack Player page is a step backward, much like the buff page pop up that used to tell us what level buff was already running. These "improvements" are not endearing players. They are doing the opposite. Please correct these issues.

[Hoofmaster]

1) Conserve no longer saves xp from the attacked player. Was this intentional? If so please revert it so that Conserve not only saves the attackers stam but also saves xp loss from the attackee. It added a fun dynamic that has been lost. This wasn't something that had not been raised as a problem. Please don't fix what isn't broken.

 

This was actually a bug that went unnoticed. I'm happy to make it so this is what's meant to happen and update the buff description unless anyone has any major objections?

 

 

2) Another problem I've witnessed is that bountied players sometimes don't lose xp. The xp loss is not notified on the battle page. The "XP left" column on the BB shows a reducing number after each attack however the players XP stat on their bio shows no reduction. Please fix!! This is kind of a major goof.

 

Does this only seem to happen with bounties? We'll take a look into it this week.

 

 

3) Now that we have had some work done to what was arguably the worst page in the game, the Attack Player page, the result is now we have way too many click requirements to do the same things, and for what? I thought upgrades were meant to improve the game. Taking multiple bounties requires players to drop down a pop up window for each bounty. Opening tabs for each player, the old method, is now useless. The old tab method worked so well because of the game's persistent lag. While you waited for a page to open you could move on to the next tab and peform an action and so on. This new Attack Player page is a step backward, much like the buff page pop up that used to tell us what level buff was already running. These "improvements" are not endearing players. They are doing the opposite. Please correct these issues.

 

We'll take a look and see if we can reduce the click's required

[sweetlou]

This was actually a bug that went unnoticed. I'm happy to make it so this is what's meant to happen and update the buff description unless anyone has any major objections?

It was a bug? I love the bug that lasted 8 years It really added a now unintended game dynamic that players could help allies save a little xp and save a little stam of your own. Post a poll if you need. I know most players had enjoyed this aspect of BHing.

 

Does this only seem to happen with bounties? We'll take a look into it this week.

Only on bounties. I can take screen shots as it is something I found today playing.

 

We'll take a look and see if we can reduce the click's required

I know the page is a new interface but the tab method, which is now unusable, worked so well on multiple bounties especially under lag conditions. Thanks for looking into all of these game issues Hoof

[Egami]

1) Conserve no longer saves xp from the attacked player. 

 Hoof has responded in post 2, but I wanted to put my two cents in:

 

1) I think Conserve activating should save an attacker's stam. That's the purpose of the buff as I currently understand it.

 

2) It should NOT save XP from someone on the BB. 

 

I understand the issue that it has been that way for 8 years. That does not however justify it nor does it make any sense. And yes, both myself and some I have cleared have benefited from it. Major error in my book. 

[Calista]

Conserve has always worked as saving the xp and stam of both hitter and defender. I understand it was unintended but please don't change it! BH'ers will use conserve when clearing friendly,  take conserve off with people they don't want to be so friendly to, screw up and forget they have it activated and accidentally save someone they meant to stomp, or try to see how many they can help a friend out with, etc, etc. We have great fun with it.

[yotwehc]

I thought the bounty board was for punishment :/

lol

 

Funny how folk will complain about the integrity of the game for certain aspects yet are fine when it benefits them... hmmm...

Edited by yotwehc, 24 August 2015 - 06:03.

[macb00k]

I thought the bounty board was for punishment :/

lol

 

Funny how folk will complain about the integrity of the game for certain aspects yet are fine when it benefits them... hmmm...

+1.... the whole point of the BB is for punishment... not to sit there and save you xp..... although i do believe that there should be no chance in counter bountying the bounty hunter regardless of stamina if they have completed the bounty..... ive been counter bountied plenty of times for clearing someones bounty whether it be 10 stams or 100 stams, it frustrating, so now i resort to 100 stam hit for everything because either way i get bountied

[Hoofmaster]

The change to Conserve was a side-effect of when we updated how the combat code worked, it wasn't an intentional change. Logically the buff could work either way (as the amount of xp loss is based on stamina used), however since it wasn't an intentional change and it's worked the way it has for (8+ years?) I've asked Zorg to update it today so it works as it used to before.

 

We're also going to be looking at the interface this week to see if we reduce the amount of clicks

[Kedyn]

The change to Conserve was a side-effect of when we updated how the combat code worked, it wasn't an intentional change. Logically the buff could work either way (as the amount of xp loss is based on stamina used), however since it wasn't an intentional change and it's worked the way it has for (8+ years?) I've asked Zorg to update it today so it works as it used to before.

 

We're also going to be looking at the interface this week to see if we reduce the amount of clicks

 

Thanks for the quick responses here Hoof and Zorg (since you'll be doing the update). I can go either way for Conserve saving XP - it's what was, and that's what the update moved it back to. 

 

As others have stated, it was a fun little game when trying to clear people, or forgetting that you had it on when smashing someone, or having someone cast it on you when you're smashing - fun times. 

Edited by Kedyn, 24 August 2015 - 13:26.

[yotwehc]

The change to Conserve was a side-effect of when we updated how the combat code worked, it wasn't an intentional change. Logically the buff could work either way (as the amount of xp loss is based on stamina used), however since it wasn't an intentional change and it's worked the way it has for (8+ years?) I've asked Zorg to update it today so it works as it used to before.

We're also going to be looking at the interface this week to see if we reduce the amount of clicks

Well this is disappointing. The "side effect" of folks not posting bounties because the folk that was bountied get cleared by friends is further enhanced by the fact that no xp is lost further making the BB a joke. At least the new system guaranteed punishment. Looks like the pendulum has completely swung the other way. I guess I need to learn how to freak out better about the integrity of the game

Who were the ones that kept saying xp loss is a must? I guess it only applies to those that are not of the fold. Very sad indeed.

Other aspects of the game are fixed after long undiscovered bugs are reported but not for this just cause a couple of the squeekier wheels have said something. ;(

Edited by yotwehc, 24 August 2015 - 14:24.

[sweetlou]

I thought the bounty board was for punishment :/

If you can't punish then you need to pay others to do it. I call that weak! There's also an expiration to a bounty that means the bountied player can also go UNPUNISHED if they can stay on the BB for 48 hrs. These are parts of the game, let's stop the bickering if you don't play it too well.

 

 

This was actually a bug that went unnoticed.

I was amazed to hear Hoof admit it wasn't intended, but at what stage did he know it saved xp on the attacked and said, 'you know what let's let this one go...' This is the funniest "bug" I've ever seen that wasn't addressed for 8 years! The definition of Conserve was even changed at one point to state it worked specifically in PvP.

[sweetlou]

The change to Conserve was a side-effect of when we updated how the combat code worked, it wasn't an intentional change. Logically the buff could work either way (as the amount of xp loss is based on stamina used), however since it wasn't an intentional change and it's worked the way it has for (8+ years?) I've asked Zorg to update it today so it works as it used to before.

 

We're also going to be looking at the interface this week to see if we reduce the amount of clicks

Thanks Hoof!! The game shines when we see you working on it

[Calista]

Thank you, Hoof. It is a small thing that we've had alot of fun with over the years. Glad to see it staying. 

[yotwehc]

If you can't punish then you need to pay others to do it. I call that weak! There's also an expiration to a bounty that means the bountied player can also go UNPUNISHED if they can stay on the BB for 48 hrs. These are parts of the game, let's stop the bickering if you don't play it too well.

 

 

I was amazed to hear Hoof admit it wasn't intended, but at what stage did he know it saved xp on the attacked and said, 'you know what let's let this one go...' This is the funniest "bug" I've ever seen that wasn't addressed for 8 years! The definition of Conserve was even changed at one point to state it worked specifically in PvP.

I call it "weak" fighting for the integrity of the game except for you know... when it suits you

 

If you can stay unhit for 48 hours, kudos to you. If you want to use conserve so your friends can take you off the board with no xp loss, then quit complaining about pillow fights and no xp loss. Lot of weak hypocrisy all over the place.

 

I'd be impressed with your consistency if you fought this "bug" but we all fall to our selfish motives.

 

Check this sweet quote out:

"I know many would like to see is some integrity return to the game we play and how we earn achievements. With a strong and fair game players will be attracted to it and increase it's overall health. At this time the game developers have the opportunity while upgrading PvP to stop players who have been trying to take advantage of the game's rules for their own unearned benefit, it's collusion and it should be stopped!"

 

Taking friends off BB with conserve so no xp is lost is not collusion? color me shocked!

[Calista]

Conserve has to activate in order to work. It isn't some 'free pass' from the bb. You're lucky to get it to kick once or twice in a normal bounty clear. I had great fun using distilled conserve pots clearing high level players off the bb who were trying to delevel for gxp. Made hundreds of fsp's in days. And I was lucky to get it to kick in 3 or 4 in a bounty. Bounty hunting can be a drain on the stam, which bounty hunters need to level in order to be as effective as possible. The use of conserve as a way to conserve stam as a bh'er is a practice I've always used. It wasn't presented as a bug. It was understood as how it was meant to be. We're not asking for any changes. Just leave it the way it has been. This also works in your favor, should you ever choose to be on the bounty board.

Edited by Calista, 24 August 2015 - 16:35.

[yotwehc]

Conserve has to activate in order to work. It isn't some 'free pass' from the bb. You're lucky to get it to kick once or twice in a normal bounty clear. I had great fun using distilled conserve pots clearing high level players off the bb who were trying to delevel for gxp. Made hundreds of fsp's in days. And I was lucky to get it to kick in 3 or 4 in a bounty. Bounty hunting can be a drain on the stam, which bounty hunters need to level in order to be as effective as possible. The use of conserve as a way to conserve stam as a bh'er is a practice I've always used. It wasn't presented as a bug. It was understood as how it was meant to be. We're not asking for any changes. Just leave it the way it has been. This also works in your favor, should you ever choose to be on the bounty board.

With composed and global pots, I imagine activation is a lot higher than it used to be.

 

When I do end up on the BB, I will want it to activate everytime as I plan to be on it at EOC for the GXP exploit but seems you already have a plan to ruin it for me

[Belaric]

When Find item was found to be bugged, it was corrected.

 

And the whole community had enjoyed the higher drop rate before the correction.

 

The Conserve saving XP on a PvP hit was never intended. It was never mentioned in the skill description (even after being amended to include saving stam on PvP hits.) For a long time I had no idea conserve would stop XP loss on a PvP hit. It was a bit of a trade secret.

 

People like it. It has been that way for years. So should it stay?

 

People liked higher rates of Find Item. It had always been like that, for years. It did not stay.

 

On that basis the correct thing seems to be to change Conserve to its intended purpose, which was not to spare XP loss in addition to saving stam on a Pvp hit. Conserve's only purpose was to save stamina.

 

But who are we to expect any consistency from the cows.

 

If you want a buff to save XP on a PvP hit, maybe one that is designed explicitly for that purpose should be introduced/created by HCS, and inserted low in the skill tree (at Conserve's level), rather than having the function glitched onto Conserve. That way the function is clear to all at the point of use. 

Edited by Belaric, 24 August 2015 - 17:37.

[Calista]

 Logically the buff could work either way (as the amount of xp loss is based on stamina used), however since it wasn't an intentional change and it's worked the way it has for (8+ years?) I've asked Zorg to update it today so it works as it used to be

 

This is going to be one of those circular discussions that gets us no where. I could effectively debate for either side of this issue. A zero stam hit should take zero xp.  Btw, it works off the bb as well.  And if the attacker forgets they have it on and it kicks in,  they don't take any xp or get any gold.  

[Hoofmaster]

This is going to be one of those circular discussions that gets us no where. I could effectively debate for either side of this issue. A zero stam hit should take zero xp.  Btw, it works off the bb as well.  And if the attacker forgets they have it on and it kicks in,  they don't take any xp or get any gold.  

 

Aye that's pretty much what I'm saying - it could logically work either way, but as it wasn't an intended change to change the way how it previously worked (and it's been working that way for about 8 years(ish)) then I think it's fine to continue working how it has been in the past before the update

[Belaric]

Ok. Pity you didn't think that about FI!! LOL!

 

Or as I said, simply add a buff with that function to the tree and cover the base that way. But if you want to leave the bug insitu, fair enough. 

Edited by Belaric, 24 August 2015 - 17:52.