29 replies to this topic

[Datacook]

The point, Zeus, is that he did that by firing at each enemy individually, not by putting 10 arrows on a string and letting them fly. A single-target archer could very well take down 100 enemies coming at them. What I was talking about was how firing mutliple arrows AT ONCE is terribly inaccurate in practice and thus Rangers should not focus on AoEs.

 

As for the pet, no, that isn't a part of the Ranger archetype. It's a part of the Druid archetype.

 

 

I would like to get responses from people from melee users, not mage/rangers that already dominate both PvP and PvE.

http://www.d20srd.or...sses/ranger.htm

 

See 1st level (wild empathy) and 4th level (animal companion) . They've had some form of that ability since 1st ed AD&D? 

 

It's a game. Lots of things are inaccurate or unrealistic: Spider hams, Mobs surviving an arrow to the face, fully automatic crossbows, every giant humanoid enemy, reality warping bags into which you can place other reality warping bags, crops growing in the space a few minutes, getting a quest for meat killing a several hundred pound whatever and somehow getting no meat, skinning stuff by repeatedly stabbing it, literally everything about how warriors use two handed swords  (lol whirlwind skills), face tanking anything, the entire concept of a threat, sitting down and eating an entire ham and having this heal you, magic at all period....

[Rez]

D&D should never, ever be used as a basis for class archetypes. Each edition changes classes completely every time.

 

Use something more expansive, like TV Tropes:

 

http://tvtropes.org/...in/ForestRanger

 

http://tvtropes.org/....php/Main/Druid

 

Very specific difference.

[ZeusIV]

You do realize those two correlate, right?

no you misunderstood 

in real life 

longbows have a much faster fire rate so you can actually kite with a longbow

a crossbow on the other hand needs to be cocked, usually by putting your foot in the end and pulling the string back

the real life drum fed crossbow had a crank and ratchet mechanism

now try doing that on the run

the only reason you can't kite in this game is because the animation for the longbow is too long apparently hahahahahha

[Rez]

the only reason you can't kite in this game is because the animation for the longbow is too long apparently hahahahahha

 

I meant in-game balance.

 

But if you want to do that, have cbows as having far, far greater damage with a slow fire rate (1.5s skill cooldown for all skills no matter if auto or skill was used) and longbows having lower damage to compensate for faster speed and kiting ability.

 

There.

[Datacook]

And despite the fact they do change it so often, "rangers get some sort of animal companion" has been standard since 1st ed. Even 4th ed had rules for it, even if they BSed it into a supplement because obvious money grab. Which isn't even really relevant because that type of ranger definitely exists and the devs intent was clearly for that nature magic wielding, animal familiar having variety of ranger. Arguments to the contrary are rather absurd. 

 

You're literally suggesting reworking it into an entirely different class your sole argument in favour is that the class doesn't currently play to your tastes and damn anyone else's character. Which is not a very compelling argument.

Edited by Datacook, 26 November 2014 - 00:46.

[Rez]

The point of my argument was that the Beast talents take up room that could be used for more archer talents, which makes no sense as those talents only start late in a build that is centered around bows in the first place.

 

If they want to have animal companions in the game, they can make a Beastmaster class. I would have absolutely no problem with that. What I do have a problem with is having less bow-specific talents to choose from when I'm forced to just throw points into talents I don't use in order to get to the end of the tree. The Beast talents just take up too much room: if they had the Beast skill as one talent, that would be fine, but instead they have an entire group of talents for Beast taking up space that could be used for more bow talents or even throwing weapon talents.

Edited by Rez, 26 November 2014 - 00:48.

[Datacook]

You certainly don't have to put points into the familiar talents to cap the tree. You can also dump all your points into the ranger tree without having to touch the skill.  It's purely optional.

 

The fact that the class doesn't play to your personal tastes is not a sufficient argument for such a drastic overhaul. For everyone who agrees with your vision of the class, we can find someone who likes the class as it is, would like some minor tweaks, would like to see something drastically different from both ideas and yet another who would like to see something different from all three (off the top of my head, trap focused and sword focused, both of which are also valid varieties of Ranger). 

 

For this sort of change you don't need to make the argument "this would be interesting because"  but instead demonstrate that "this is sufficiently interesting to justify to remove interesting mechanics that currently exist" 

 

What is here that would be more fun for current rangers. In what way is the current ranger irreparably broken. How is it worth completely shattering existing builds and game balance. Why is the not insubstantial amount of work required to make it reality worth the dev's time and effort. 

 

[Rez]

I'll rethink this.

[awollsd]

yeah i couldn't get behind these changes while i love ranger (as posted in my other class) my main is mage, prophet, or a hybrid of the 2 so not saying this because i simply don't want a change to my class but because i  mean it... i think ranger has been one of the best done talent tree's in the game thus far i don't think it needs a change...

 

maybe some of these options could be part of elite or specialized class builds that's been talked about before (if they decide to do it which they never said one way or the other)

 

what was suggested by me and others before was do something like have "elite class" or what ever you call it for lvl 50+ once they get that far.... those classes will require certain amount of points in multiple regular classes + require certain amount of points in specific talents in those classes....

 

Example: Beast Master (or summoner or what ever you want to call it)

Must have 15 points in ranger

Must have 3 points put into the wild familiar tallent's

Must have 16 points in Prophet

Must have 1 point in ancestral spirit

 

(just random numbers and stuff for example purposes)

 

but some of these things you're asking for would work good for things like that (with some tweaking naturaly)

[Blissy]

I"ve seen the ability to have animal companions before with archer types,  they had the ability to tame and capture an animal and make it a fighting companion.  also on the aoe front I played a game that has aoe skill/s for archer types too ( later you choose from two class upgrades, either ranger (xbow user) or sharp shooter (bow user).  

 

so not uncommon but may not be included in all mmo's for this class. js.

 

I was told the wolf isn't that useful at higher levels but I've kept mine because I like him and maybe I"ve lost some points that should be put towards other talents ( not sure which ones or if my talent build is what others do tbh but for now seems ok since I respected again a while back)  but he helps me when I'm solo as he will tank dungeon bosses for me in story modes, tank other mobs and quest bosses so for solo stuff I find him helpful.   He even helped us when I was with a group at troll once and we had a bit of a time with him and he saved us by tanking for enough time to help us not die lol.  not sure how that happened tbh lol.  so he may be a pixel wolf but he's my lil fighting companion hehee