Calista

That way the PvPers can have some challenges to PvP and a good test of their knowledge.

 

 

There lies the problem. Our knowledge means squat against the OP pots. No skill required anymore, just access to the right potions.

Most arguing to nullify the pots aren't interested in the competitive thrill. Pvp is used as a tool to punish. Not as a tool for a fun online battle of the willing. The pots turn a checkers match into a chess match and man do I stink at chess. Anyway, although folks claim HCS is the last word, they still complain so...

I really see very little cost/benefit for HCS to nerf. I think there are bigger fish to fry. Making the change is not going to bring back hordes of players. Might lose some

 

 

PvP isn't just used as a way to 'punish' players.

 

Bounty hunters are looking to be rewarded for clearing bounties. They have to pay to take the bounty;  pay for buffs and gear to be competitive; they pay in xp when losing; they pay in stam with each hit they do. The current situation with buffs where a level 750 can't be beat by someone in the level 2000 area makes it all the more not worth the effort.

 

Gold thieves are looking for gold, obviously. They know the risk and what to expect. They too are required to pay for gear, buffs, with stam, etc. Of course these days, most don't bother doing anything to defend themselves against gold thieves. More then a little frustrating when the bounty hunters can't be bothered with targets with ridiculous stats.

 

Guild smashers are defending their guild mates, by the means the game makes available. It isn't about 'punishing' another player, though that does come along with it. It requires a sense of 'team' play. We defend ourselves not to punish people, but to make it clear to others it is better not to hit us, for the consequences are not worth it.  Defense is our motivation, not punishment.  It requires the same costs as other pvp areas in the game,  gear, stam, buffs and gear.  There are few guilds left who go through the effort of defending themselves. It's hardly worth it going after targets with unbeatable buffs. (not gear, all buffs) 

 

The ladder is all about who can afford the highest level pots/buffs and who can run them the longest. There is no skill involved. The current situation with buffs is beyond obvious there.

PLEASE if you post in this thread do not comment on anything someone else says. I am asking for YOUR thoughts and reasons only. 

 

 Stuff

 

I hope everyone will answer these questions. And please remember: No comments about anothers reasons for their answers! Thanks and have FUN! 

 

 

Mods are gone, yeah. And for the record, I have no problem with PvPers. I partake in PvP myself occasionally.

~ Grim

 

  You broke the rules!!! 

 

 

hehe I kid, I kid. Please don't pvp me. 

1. Why do you play FS?  

Friends are the only thing that keeps me coming back.

 

2. A.When you play "your style" do you use buffs? Potions? A combo of the two?

    B. What level buffs/potions do you use?

PvP is my game style choice. Yes, I use buffs and pots. Unfortunately, I'm forced to use composed/ge high level buffs to have any chance to be competitive in this game style anymore. But prior to the introduction of such high level pots, I typically used as few buffs as possible. I hate feeling wasteful. Luckily I'm in a guild that feeds me what I need to remain relevant in this style of game play. 

 

3. If you use buffs or potions or a combo, why?

A combo, I guess.  I use as few pots as possible, but these days that doesn't work. Even with the high level potions it comes down to whose buffs activate, not skill.

 

4. Do you use Global Chat? Why or why not?

Rarely, usually only if someone is trash talking there. I think they got rid of them, but the player mods were a serious issue, and killed any type of fun the global chat was for me. Plus Grim isn't exactly a fan of those of us who pvp.  (no offense, Grim)

 

5. What aspects of FS have you played?

Leveling, Bounty Hunting, Arena, Ladder, Smasher, gvg.  I tried Titans but I end up cursing at the screen and planning guild wars against anyone else chasing the same titan. (and that was just the elemental titans ) Not to mention that the guide didn't tell me you had to BEAT the titan to get the item drop. Chased one for literally hours before someone took pity on me and told me where I was going wrong. 

 

6. Why did you choose to play these aspects of the game?

Leveling is a necessary evil if you want to be competitive in the game. The others because they seemed like they would be fun and presented the most challenge.

 

7. How often do you log on to FS?

3-4 days a week, sometimes more, sometimes less.

 

8. How long have you been playing FS?

Too long!    9 years according to my start date.  Though I have left for extended periods of time and returned a few times.

 

9. Are you in a guild? If so, why?

Yes, I'm in a top guild. My friends are there. I'm all about the team aspect of game play which a guild provides.

 

10. What level were you when you first joined a guild? (If you are in one that is!)

 Umm, pretty early on. Before level 20, I think.  I remember when it was a big deal that our founder reached level 200 and could cast doubler on us when we leveled.

PvP use to require skill, knowledge, and effort. I'd spend literally days making new sets to have the best stats I could. The OP pots have removed the need for anything but luck. You have to have the same OP pots going to even have a small chance of winning. But even if you have all the same pots going as a target, skill still has nothing to do with who wins. It's all about who gets the lucky buffs activated. Now it is just a weird game of Press Your Luck.

Not everything is suppose to be easy in this game. Surprising, right?  Do the basics, you get basic results. Put in some effort and the reward increases. 

Crock pot meals rock.  Fast and easy.   Cranberry pot roast, an easy favorite. You literally drop a pot roast in the slow cooker, put some basic seasoning, and throw a can of cranberry sauce on top. Come back in a few hours, the meat practically melts in your mouth. 

Yeah, I was already starting to think along those lines. The bb has to be involved and I'm not sure how that would work with that much reduced xp loss. But I do think we can afford to make the xp loss minimal compared to the norm. There would also have to be a way to differentiate between event hits and regular pvp hits. No good to limit a guilds ability to defend its players outside of the event.

So what your proposing is for PvP loss to be lowered to as if we were losing the amount of xp as if we were level 25? Say somewhere around 100 xp per defeat? This would be consistent no matter what level you are.

I think with a minimal xp loss like that the community could live with xp loss occurring in the event. As you said this would then be consistent with how much xp is gained from killing global creatures (also consistent with the risk of losing to them as well since they are level 25 and when you lose that is roughly how much xp you lose)

 

Personally I think the xp loss should remain what it is normally.  Few will like that though. So yeah, I'm suggesting the xp loss during the event be minimal. Same as you see with xp gain when chasing critters for drops or whatever the event is. It keeps things consistent with how PvP is actually played in the game. And it helps people learn the basic mechanics of it all.

 

 

If it were this low, I don't think most people would care (you never know though, some get extremely annoyed by gvg hits) but how does this teach anyone that the xp loss is not too bad when it's tweaked down this low. Is that enough of the risk people are demanding?

 

Risk is important to PvP in the game. But also, it's fun!  Back in the day I ran a guild that didn't allow pvp. (few will remember it, but it's true)  Getting involved with bounty hunting and from there meeting so many like minded people in the game is what keeps me here. (love you guys!) I think most can agree that an event would let some people try it out and see what the hoopla is about. So if reduced xp loss is what gets them to try it out, awesome. So long as the event remains consistent with how it works in the game.

Any other event in the game sticks to the basic outline of how that area of the game is played. Every time something Pvp comes up, people want to change it. It never works. PvP is part of this game. Keep an event consistent with how pvp works in the game. Lowered xp loss, lowered cost for protection, the chance to 'opt out' using protection. That is going soft! But at least it remains in line with how pvp actually works in this game. We're not asking for a slaughter. We just want the game to remain consistent with how it approaches events for each area of the game.

Hcs needs to stop treating pvp like it is bad. The perception given by the repeated attempts to change it is exactly that. There is nothing wrong with it.

Lest you forget, protection was available before seasons started... I had it and was basically opted out of the carnage... Many didn't and complained... Actually, maybe lower price of protection before event to give folks an opt out before the carnage begins... that's not a bad idea.

 

So announce the PvP event 7 days before it happens, give players time to decide if they want to be involved or 'opt out' using protection. That gives players plenty of time to protect their xp. It wouldn't prevent them from being hit, but that is consistent with how pvp works in the game. 

 

As an added deterrent, make it less 'rewarding' to hit someone with protection on.  For example, make the protected worth a small amount of 'rating' vs someone active in the event. Those active in the event aren't going to waste time on those not worth hitting, (especially as they move up).  Basically how protection works in the game.

 

Run a 'flash sale' for the 7 days that the event is announced, make protection accessible to even those with small pockets. It's works similar to the reduced xp loss idea.  Keep things consistent with how the game works, but make it more user friendly for those concerned.

A PvP global event as suggested would be a great way, in my opinion, to teach people "how to react" (in the myriad of views on that). Way overdue.

 

I'd simply add that PvP protection (which I've never really liked but "get") could be allowed as an "opt out" since it has been engulfed by the game. 

 

I'd like to remind peeps here that wil was actually for an opt out of the GE in his post. I'm not nor see any reason for there to be one as long as all the current PvP rules are maintained.

 

 

A PvP event should work the same as it does in the game. So I could see PvP protection being used as a type of opt out. It would be the way for a player not interested in the event to protect their xp.  It would also have to prevent them from taking part as well. It's consistent with how the game actually works.

A xp global isn't introducing something new. It's showing how that area of the game works with nice incentives for those of us who prefer to skip it.

A composing global isn't introducing something new. It's showing how that area of the game works with incentives to get people to try it.

A pvp global needs to do the same. Give incentives to get people to try it out as it is in the game. Not something new.

First, not sure where you got that quote but it wasn't said by me.

Authentic pvp is the way it actually works in the game, not this non existent thing people keep pushing for.

The fact you don't see the difference between no opt out and xp loss is why you shouldn't be the one starting a poll on something still being discussed.

Grim also suggested a lowered xp loss for this. Nothing is set in stone. Hoof has said he wants to read over the topic. I have faith he'll see the issues and adjust accordingly.
Or at least I believe he needs to be given the time he asked for without 20 more of the same topic.

And neither of those is entirely like PvP. GvG is closest but even that isn't quite the same. The question is to try and ask what WOULD get others to try PvP as PvPers know it. The Ladder attempts that with decent prizes and no Guild mate hitting to prevent collusion but, XP loss is there and I think that's what scares non PvPers away. I dunno if the Season Global should entirely do away with XP loss or not. If not, maybe reduced XP loss? To show that really, losing XP ain't that scary? Because really, it's not.

 

 

Maybe this should be the main concern for the discussion then? Not the "what is we nerf xp loss" approach, but the "what if we teach players that xp loss is not the worst since someone tried cooking the first brussels sprouts" ?

 

 

Here is what i find the most ironic - the loudest voices against a "PVP" event are the pvpers 

so what if its a 'pillow fight' - its another aspect where they can pvp (and dominate) - but it seems like hard core pvp'rs arent happy unless carnage is involved and they can wreck havoc and cause as much damage to others as is humanly possible 

 

You are facing pvp in this game on a daily basis. Right now, someone might be looking at your character and deciding whether or not a hit is worth it. You have ways to go about making it not worth while. But you are never guaranteed safety from an attack. Let's have an event where titans don't drop items...or where creatures give no gold or xp, or a bounty board and/or arena system that gives out no rewards. Sounds silly, right? So does a pvp event without some sort of xp loss. I'm willing to say nerfed xp loss might work in order to appease those who play this area of the game. But complete safety isn't part of this game. It isn't how pvp works. Stop treating PvP like it is something wrong. It's not any different then any other aspect of the game.

 

 

 

 

it seems to me like the majority of fs is not in heavy favor of these aspects of the game 

 following that line of thought means the majority of fs will Not be in favor of Any type of Global Event that has the aspects of Standard Pvp 

 

For a Global Event to Succeed a Majority of fs players from all styles of play will want to get involved - hcs needs to have it so that non-pvp players will be willing to get involved instead of 50%-75% opting out - (this will happen if xp loss is involved) 

 

xp loss pvp'rs have 3 options currently they can call their play ground - BB -Ladder- PVP 

 

non-xp loss players just have gvg and arena ( arena is iffy because you cant see your opponet beforehand and never see their gear)

 

 

Does everyone titan hunt... or play the arena... bounty hunt... play the ladder... gvg... level, for that matter? No, they don't. I level maybe 4 times a year. Guess when I bother... during a global event! PvP is enough a part of the game that a global is even being discussed. We have globals that are geared towards levelers,  and composers right? Can't say I've seen any others. But these globals do NOT take away from how that part of the game works for the players who partake in it. It adds to it. All we're asking for is the same.  Don't change how it works and then slap a PvP name on it. Make it PvP!