86 replies to this topic

[Davros81]

If that information was shared with players then that'd help, I reckon.  Lowering the number of invents might just be a worthwhile fix, sure.
 

 

A possibility, yeah.

Don't give current stamina, give reserve stamina instead!!

[Pardoux]

Pardoux - You and I are at EOC, and looking for things to spend our stam on. But the DQs are not just about 160 players at EOC.

 

Think of, for example, a committed leveller who is half way through the levels, with maybe 1-2 weeks of stam. The game will be better if they log on each day. If the DQ gives them a net gain (however small), then they are likely to log in and do the DQ. If the DQ is a net loss, they will see it as a distraction form their game goals and ignore them, and possibly end up logging in once every 1-2 weeks. I think this applies to any character that is currently using all their stam for existing game goals (titan hunters, GVGers ...). It is for those characters that it really is important that the DQs must not be a negative/drain on their resources.

 

This has nothing at all (for me) to do with having nothing to spend stamina on - although having more options, such as content, would be nice.

 

The point I made (and still stand by) is that they were meant to provide something to do to offer players something to do daily. Players now HAVE something to do daily - but whether they ACTUALLY do that "something" is entirely down to them.

 

I still don't think that every DQ should give a nett positive outcome - but each to their own

Edited by Pardoux, 02 November 2016 - 20:04.

[Filletminion]

This whole discussion about net return etc is why I was opposed to dailies being added in the first place.

 

Entitled players just keep asking and expecting more for less effort.. and sadly it keeps being given.

Edited by zizzwyly, 03 November 2016 - 08:32.

[BadPenny]

I get my frags from hunting and frag events.
 
I need to check that out first. 
 
This is for inventing DQs.    
 
This is good for players that have limited bp space or not much interest in frags.  Lots of zombie kings means lots of crowns.
 

Hope it helps others.

On my break down items quest, I had full stam. So I did a regular hunt. After my stam got too low for that, I killed doubler and used the rest of my stam on rats natives and snow leopards. With 14k stam, I barely broke down a third of what I needed. Granted, I got a hunt in, so it wasn't a total waste, but not being able to complete my task was a huge disappointment. I won't be attempting that particular task again.

[rowbeth]

This whole discussion about net return etc is why I was opposed to dailies being added in the first place.

 

Entitled players just keep asking and expecting more for less effort.. and sadly it keeps being given.

 Just to be clear: my position is not asking for more for less effort; it is asking for something for some effort. I am very happy for those gains to be small.

 

My position is also that the game is worse off if lots of players simply choose to ignore all these DQs.

[Filletminion]

 

 

My position is also that the game is worse off if lots of players simply choose to ignore all these DQs.

 

They never existed 8 years ago game was just fine and dandy. That then even exist at all is evidence of much bigger issues facing the game. And on that front daily's address nothing.

[Belaric]

The past, zizz, is increasingly irrelevant in terms of judging the game as it is today.

 

The internet was different. Processing power was different. Interaction between people and the platforms used for interaction were very different 8 years ago.

 

This game did not keep up.

 

I'll admit I had hope about a properly mobile platform that I hoped would bring this game to a huge audience.

 

That kick appears to have been squibbed, to use a phrase.

 

What is left for us hardliners who can't quite kick an addiction we fell for 8+ years ago?

 

The odd DQ for some.

 

For others that is an insult. Because it does not address the 'core' issues.

 

Whatever they are now. 8 years later.

 

Every constituency left in the game has its own pet peeves about what went wrong and why.

 

Why people left and did not come back.

 

Everyone thinks their pet theory is correct, and has a ton of anecdata to back it up.

 

I certainly had mine. Still do, some days, when it bothers me enough.

 

Ultimately though, I have come to accept that HCS has made a sequence of decisions.

 

That sequence has led us to the game we play today.

 

Players are not to blame for the game, only the designers.

 

Arguments can be made that designers made bad decisions based on player input, but ultimately the decision rested in the offices of the designers.

 

This allows me to actually enjoy the game as it stands nowadays, even if it mostly feels like a nostalgia trip, and not the significant engagement in my daily life it once was.

 

The bigger issues facing the game.

 

1) Can you identify them.

 

2) Can you propose a solution that will work for the designers, not the players. The designers need to eat.

 

I agree the dailys merely postpone the inevitable. Do they do harm? Not before they upped the rewards. Now they might. But again, it is too late, I think, for that to matter over much, given this game's overall trajectory.

 

I have adopted egami's paragraph structure for the sake of easy bits of info. Some may recall I used to use very dense paragraphs of argument. I will again, if I think it relevant.

 

But not today.

Edited by Belaric, 04 November 2016 - 05:26.

[duktayp]

this would not be the forum; if not for the shared misery that is Fallensword...

 

group hug, everyone

[rowbeth]

I agree with the first half of your post, Belaric.

 

I think, however, that it would be more accurate to 'blame' time, and the far-too-rapid-to-cope-with increase in computer power rather than the developers (or any other human constituency). No small company has the resources to completely rewrite the code every 3-5 years to make proper use of new computer architecture, and to completely re-design the UI every 3-5 years to keep pace with players expectations. I'm not sure that any big company has the resources to do this in a game that is continuously evolving, rather than having discontinuous new releases every couple of years.

[Belaric]

Great point rowbeth

 

Responsibility is perhaps a better word than blame.

 

Either way, your point about time is well made and taken. 

[cucullainn]

Well I will tell you this. I really wish the counter worked while doing the DQ, without having to refresh. If it worked it would boost my appreciation in actually having something to do. The way it is now, I actually believe that I went over the total needed the last two that I did. Before I realized what I was doing. And in doing that, I am considering that they may just be a waste of my time anymore.

[cucullainn]

Daily Quest
[ Common ]
Defeat 250 Champion creatures
0 / 250
Gain +700 Current Stamina

I do not see this as a common Quest. And I don't think I'm going to attempt it either

[Bibs]

Daily Quest

[ Common ]

Travel 200 tiles

0 / 200

Gain +400 Reserve Stamina

 

By far the best one I have ever had

[rowbeth]

Daily Quest
[ Common ]
Defeat 250 Champion creatures
0 / 250
Gain +700 Current Stamina

I do not see this as a common Quest. And I don't think I'm going to attempt it either

 

You would probably make a 200 stam profit (including the cost of getting there) in 10-15 minutes hunting burning imps in hellions lair with AM400.

[cucullainn]

You would probably make a 200 stam profit (including the cost of getting there) in 10-15 minutes hunting burning imps in hellions lair with AM400.

where does one get AM400

[Pythia]

I see AM400 in some of the chests I have in my bp, don't know if one can be composed or not because I've not reached that point nor have I gone looking in anyone bp.

[rowbeth]

AM400 can be composed; so not available to everyone, but available to many.

 

I've just been and checked. On one pass through (25 sqares) you can expect to encounter 12 imps.

* With AM192 that would make 20 kills for 25+20 stam (walking+killing), so about 565 stam to kill the 250 champs.

* With AM263 (250 potion + lesser distill), that becomes 500 stam

* With AM400 it should take about 350 stam

 

Helion's Lair takes a bit of walking to get to. If you can teleport, then add about 60 stam for travelling; if you can't teleport then add about 200 stam to travel there from a distant realm.

 

I a not assuming any conserve of lightfoot in those numbers.

[cucullainn]

So I traveled to Fortress of Elya (Courtyard) to kill Enraged Bone Hail (Champion)s. After spending 300 stamina I only killed 46. Plus I did not get any drops from them. So traveling to Paladir Forest (East) and spending 235 stamina. I had killed 50 Nightshade (Champion)s. Plus I got five drops, and I also killed an SE.

Using Conserve 240 and Lightfoot 260 along with AM 170. I was able to finish and get back to where I was and only ended up with a negative 300 Stam. Not Terrible

[cucullainn]

Daily Quest [ Rare ] Invent 40 items 0 / 40 Gain +495 Current Stamina

Daily Quest [ Common ] Invent 40 items 35 / 40 Gain +16 Max Stamina

Can somebody tell me why. Just because these 2 seemingly Same DQ's, are categorized differently, because of their Rewards?

Also it is not a DQ that I intend on trying to finish again. Because I absolutely believe it sucks. I'm kind of curious as if that is why I've received this Quest 2 days in a row?

Edited by cucullainn, 12 November 2016 - 00:52.

[Pardoux]

Daily Quest [ Rare ] Invent 40 items 0 / 40 Gain +495 Current Stamina

Daily Quest [ Common ] Invent 40 items 35 / 40 Gain +16 Max Stamina

Can somebody tell me why. Just because these 2 seemingly Same DQ's, are categorized differently, because of their Rewards?

Also it is not a DQ that I intend on trying to finish again. Because I absolutely believe it sucks. I'm kind of curious as if that is why I've received this Quest 2 days in a row?

 

It's called RANDOMNESS - I've had the same type (several different types) 3 consecutive days sometimes.

 

Ya get what yer given ..