84 replies to this topic

[Pythia]

Small 3 person guilds need very deep pockets if they  are to survive.

 

They must start with things that build their wealth so they keep growing.

 

PvP protection to start is probably a must because that small guild will need all their stam and hunting ability to grow.

 

I wish there was common player protect gold potion that lasted a few hours.

 

They normally do not survive. 

[Pardoux]

Small 3 person guilds need very deep pockets if they  are to survive.

 

 

Wrong, I'm afraid ... well, potentially wrong, let's be fair here.

 

Take my guild as an example. When we started it, there were 2 of us and then we added a third - and it remained that way, pretty much, up until about Guild Level 1500 or so, maybe even higher. The two starters DID, admittedly, have the advantage of high stam banks so were making a goodly chunk of gold each hunt to fund stuff, but deep pockets ? - No.

 

I think, personally speaking, that I've donated once in the last twelve months ? - I used to donate FAR more frequently, but that was back in the day when the game got a LOT of attention, both from content builders AND designers / programmers. Those days now seem to be over, more's the pity.

 

A lot of new players make the mistake of starting their own guilds before realising exactly what that entails tho - I will agree with your point that THOSE players DO need deep pockets to fund it and, more often than not, they invest and then their guild collapses for one reason or another and, I'm betting, they get pretty disenfranchised about the game. Perhaps the "CREATE GUILD?" option needs FAR more explanation to make players REALLY think before they commit, but that's another discussion for another thread ...

[Pythia]

lol That's the only experience in guild running I have had so far.

 

GvG hurt a lot back then because the four of us in that tiny guild, I got hit a lot,  and the only thing I asked of my school aged founder was that she log in once a week at least.  If she went inactive, I would leave.

 

Obviously, PoC was not that guild, but being in that guild is where I learned to hate GvG.  It's also where I loaned out and lost my Mancrusha set.  Ah well. Lessons learned.

[wil72]

Opt out, ok, but..... the "Guild" can never opt in again, it's a one time deal. The game, after all, is all about "choices".

 

Cheers.

 

wil72

Edited by wil72, 20 April 2016 - 21:57.

[Pythia]

I do not know if my guild would be interested in opting out but I do know of others would opt out in a heart beat. 

 

GvG is not everyone's cup of tea. I respect that, pity others do not.

[Mister Doom]

The way I see it, being in a guild provides many MANY bonuses to a player. Free gear, buffs, stat enhancements, pleasurable company, advice, cheese, cookies and all the salt and vinegar crisps you can eat.

 

The potential of being attacked in a GvG is the counterbalance to all of these tremendous upsides and must remain.

[Pythia]

That's one view of GvG, but I have seen comments here of other views. 

 

A guild does not need to take part in GvG to supply those things to it's members and it does not benefit their guild all that much if I'm to believe their point of view.

 

So, if the benefit is more in favor of the attacking guild, why would defending guild not want to opt out?

 

I can see both sides of it, there are things that rp can be used for, but again if the defending guild has no interest in those things, they would not want to take part.

 

Why help another guild grow when it's preventing their guild from growing?

Edited by Pythia, 20 April 2016 - 23:34.

[Mister Doom]

You missed my point entirely.

 

I'm saying it doesn't matter if GvG benefits your guild or not, it is merely another part of guild life. You can't just cherry pick all the bits you want, only keep the parts that are 'beneficial' to you. You have to take the ups and the downs together.

 

As I said, there already is an opt out, unfortunately that opt out also opts you out of many of those other benefits I just mentioned.

[Pythia]

I understand what you said. 

 

*sighs*

 

A guild must allow another guild to beat them up because that's the way the game is played.

 

Perfect understanding.

Even if that understanding is a bit simply stated.

[wazzimoto]

Anyone that complains about GvG ...needs to take a long , hard look at Their Guild and how they operate as a TEAM.... 

We successfully Defend ALL incoming GvG Attacks.....and we DO NOT GvG for RP or any Items.....we GvG for shear enjoyment and to DEFEND our Rating and Record..

(RP buffs are nice addition for weekend leveling for Guild)

 

Get together as a Guild and start communicating!!!

 

Cheers

Edited by wazzimoto, 20 April 2016 - 23:51.

[Pythia]

Wazzimoto, please check the op's comments for more understanding.

 

I admit I would not mind an opt out, but do not expect it.

 

However we are currently batting an idea back and forth for a better understanding and perhaps a little more helpful relief from rp farming guilds, which are a scourge in the game. 

[wazzimoto]

Wazzimoto, please check the op's comments for more understanding.

 

I admit I would not mind an opt out, but do not expect it.

 

However we are currently batting an idea back and forth for a better understanding and perhaps a little more helpful relief from rp farming guilds, which are a scourge in the game. 

Kick that *Farmers" A$$  lol

[Mister Doom]

No my point is even simpler than how you just tried to belittle it.

 

If you want all of the bonuses from a guild, you HAVE to put up with the downsides that come with it.

 

 

 

(far too many people in this game want all bonuses, benefits and positives without any downsides whatsoever, they feel like a balancing downside is actually punishment. Ridiculous)

[Pythia]

I appreciate your view Doom, but there are some guilds that don't stand a snowball's chance in hell of being able to defend. 

 

I have looked at so many guilds in this game.  So many I don't remember where I have seen what I have seen.  I only feel sorry for them because they don't stand much of a chance the way things are with GvG in the game now.

 

They either kick members and become a shell of what they hope to become again, no chance of rebuilding if the members are gone.

 

You and others will say that's the price they pay for their play.

 

I say, they  may quit and not bother coming back. So many  people are gone, so many guilds are dead.

 

I don't think there is much I will ever be able to say to people to have them look at the promise of what is being tossed away with a casual hand.

 

Interesting ne?

[Pythia]

I  need a break from this. I try to hard.

[Mister Doom]

The answer to rescuing the game from oblivion, isn't to make the game all benefits with no downsides.

[gilby90813]

Possibility to repair everyone gear in guild from start of gvg to one day after possible solution at guild expense?

[Calista]

There is no xp loss in gvg. The equipment damage is minimal. Stop looking for ways to make things easier.

[rowbeth]

The answer to rescuing the game from oblivion, isn't to make the game all benefits with no downsides.

 

The answer also involves ensuring that the downsides don't dominate over the benefits---for every player the game wishes to keep involved.

 

I can't help feeling that part of the problem with this discussion is that one side is thinking about big established guilds (that can provide all the advantages of lots of free equipment, free buffs, lots of people wanting to step in and share the load of defending GVG ...) while the other is thinking about small, beginning-to-get-established guilds (where you bring most of your own equipment, and where having the we-defend-our-guild attitude requires its members to have GVG as their top priority, and  potentially using up all their stamina).

 

Personally, I think the game needs both sides. And I think the game mechanics have to be such as to ensure that both sides think the benefits far outway the downsides. And I say *far* outway deliberately: this is, after all, a game---people will stay involved only because they enjoy it, and not for the good of their soul.

 

 

And as a way ahead, maybe there is a profitable discussion to be had about refining the game parameters (rather than cahnging the game mechanics). Would things be different (better? worse?) if the minimum guild size went up to 5 or 6 (or down to 3)? Or if the cool down for repeat attacks was made longer for smaller guilds? Perhaps one could introduce an intermediate guild size range (5-8 members?) where there was an opt-in/out (and yes, I realise that is a change in game mechanics, though I could argue that it is really just a smoothing that makes the existing distinctions less abrupt).

[Filletminion]

Big guilds have no advantage in gvg other than having more members to hit with ( if they are all equally skilled). The Downside is they have more players who can be hit.

 

The will to win GVG comes from being a part of a team and supporting all the members within it equally.

 

The benefit to defending in gvg is you make fsp for nothing more than  tiny bit of stam usually around 400 in a 50 hit gvg using conserve.

 

The Value of the tiny bit of stam is far higher in gvg than it is in levelling and any  gold Xp you make for your guild.

 

When your guild does not defend through lack of knowledge or team play GVG farmers will target you and they will continue targetting you it is nothing new and neither is how to stop them...They are frequently very easy to beat.

 

My guild Attacks other guilds for rating and also for rp we do so so all members of my guild can have access to the best epics available to them.

Edited by zizzwyly, 21 April 2016 - 09:35.