I suggest one of the following ideas as this has become bothersome lately
1) increase credits dropped per kill slowly by level. This has been long overdue and after completing the lvl 109 portion of the quest "A friend in need" has become overly evident that the cost to level was not put to consideration any longer.
2) decrease the mission combines BACK to the way they were pre-70 where it cost only a portion of what it cost to combine gear of the same level..
The reason i suggest these option is that in 109 it costs you 7843 credsx6 which comes to over 47k credits. During a normal level i personally aquired somewhere near 33-35k credits Maximum. By this that would mean any time there will be multiple combination quests we would be paying to complete the quests. And dont try saying oh the missions arent mandatory because some are and some arent. At the same time you cant say they arent mandatory when they are the only way to actually aquire skillpoints within this game.
by the old scale of what mission items used to cost per combine we would be around about 1500-2000 credits per combine.<--------------- which was completely reasonable before.
Credits crisis
Started by
ss_barmuka
, May 11 2009 04:13
27 replies to this topic
#2
021962
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021962
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Posted 11 May 2009 - 12:11
I did not vote. Why? Well I didn't feel there were enough options. I made enough credits at 109 to cover the cost. Running Intensifier and corrode, my kill rate and mechanic cost was not bad. I don't disagree that cost will soon get out of hand. But If the price of FC's continue to raise in the crystal market the issue will resolve it self. And if the credits are raised it will force the crystal market up. More credits in the game the higher the cost of crystals will become. Right now I would rather see the cost of crystals kept in check. That way the non donater has a chance to upgrade their player.
#3
ss_ecofrog
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Posted 11 May 2009 - 12:31
well at one point something will have to be done currently i like the idea of non rising credits it means that people who jsut start the game get a chance to buy crystals eaisly.
but imagine at say level 500 costing 3+ fc worth of credits per item to make and per item to buy in the shop and the repair costs also per level iwth a mission we could actully end up losing 10-15 crystals.
now there are several ways around this my least favorate is increasing the credits dropped.
they could give out credits for completing missions mabey not the full amount but jsut enough to make it fesible to do the mission free of charge.
secondly they could make it so we don't have to buy mission items in the shop.
i don't think they should reduce costs to repair but reducing costs to create items would help alot even more so on mission items.
but imagine at say level 500 costing 3+ fc worth of credits per item to make and per item to buy in the shop and the repair costs also per level iwth a mission we could actully end up losing 10-15 crystals.
now there are several ways around this my least favorate is increasing the credits dropped.
they could give out credits for completing missions mabey not the full amount but jsut enough to make it fesible to do the mission free of charge.
secondly they could make it so we don't have to buy mission items in the shop.
i don't think they should reduce costs to repair but reducing costs to create items would help alot even more so on mission items.
#4
ss_draconus
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Posted 11 May 2009 - 15:03
i agree that the manufacturing costs for mission items should be lowered, I mean the only thing they are good for is completing the missions, and in some cases are bound, so you wouldnt be able to buy them from someone else. also, several missions make u make the mission item several times just to complete the mission, its not fair that they cost the same as same lvl armor/equipment that can actually be used and only needs to be made once. if a mission item needs to be made several times, the cost to make it should be alot less (at least half to a third of the normal costs for that lvl) to make up for the fact you have to make it several times. at least that way u make the credit problem not as bad without increasing the credits dropped per monster
#5
ecolitan
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Posted 11 May 2009 - 15:59
Making the assembly of mission items less expensive is only a short term fix. I proposed a long time ago that the credit drops should rise, but at a much slower rate. Repair costs and assembly costs continue to rise. Holding credit drops constant does NOT allow free play of this game. Whether that started in the 90's where it was nearly required to sub-level or in the 108/9/10 mission or is about to start it is imminent.
Credits were too plentiful in the early stages of the game and that needed to be addressed. The decision to make it easier to accumulate credits at low levels is fine. Having a large percentage of the missions be credit negative, coupled with some that require sub-leveling, is not going to allow players to play without donating.
I still propose that allowing credit drops to rise (on average) of about 1 every 4 levels from 50 on would solve this. This would put credit drops 30% higher at level 110 than they are now. The assembly of these items would then be afforded within the leveling credit drops. Remember that playing for free means needing to create 4-8 items per 10 level content at the minimum (in addition to mission creations). I think it is past time for HCS to adjust to this.
Credits were too plentiful in the early stages of the game and that needed to be addressed. The decision to make it easier to accumulate credits at low levels is fine. Having a large percentage of the missions be credit negative, coupled with some that require sub-leveling, is not going to allow players to play without donating.
I still propose that allowing credit drops to rise (on average) of about 1 every 4 levels from 50 on would solve this. This would put credit drops 30% higher at level 110 than they are now. The assembly of these items would then be afforded within the leveling credit drops. Remember that playing for free means needing to create 4-8 items per 10 level content at the minimum (in addition to mission creations). I think it is past time for HCS to adjust to this.
#6
ss_barmuka
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Posted 12 May 2009 - 02:26
Making the assembly of mission items less expensive is only a short term fix. I proposed a long time ago that the credit drops should rise, but at a much slower rate. Repair costs and assembly costs continue to rise. Holding credit drops constant does NOT allow free play of this game. Whether that started in the 90's where it was nearly required to sub-level or in the 108/9/10 mission or is about to start it is imminent.
Credits were too plentiful in the early stages of the game and that needed to be addressed. The decision to make it easier to accumulate credits at low levels is fine. Having a large percentage of the missions be credit negative, coupled with some that require sub-leveling, is not going to allow players to play without donating.
I still propose that allowing credit drops to rise (on average) of about 1 every 4 levels from 50 on would solve this. This would put credit drops 30% higher at level 110 than they are now. The assembly of these items would then be afforded within the leveling credit drops. Remember that playing for free means needing to create 4-8 items per 10 level content at the minimum (in addition to mission creations). I think it is past time for HCS to adjust to this.
Thank god someone is on my side with this. I found that i ended up paying 3 fc just to complete the 109 mission portion.
HCS needs to realize that yes there are some levels that do not have missions or some levels that dont have mission parts to create but those levels allow for people to expand their gear.
Overall in 101-110 i am down about 14 crystals thus far. This is with completing quests and keeping myself not subleveling a ton(in 103 i was almost 104.5 when i left) I dont mind the fancy missions but when you are paying too much credits to complete missions it does take the fun out. At the pre70 stage mission items and combines used to cost 1/4 or so what the gear at that level did. I do realize that that would be a short term fix but at least for now we would stop losing on every mission level.And for those of you who claim you made enough in 109 to complete the mission i call bullarky. There is no way unless you a) Did not run intensifier once.
got 150 creds to drop EVERY fight c) cashed in FC from other levels to complete.Which i am betting 90% of everyone did option c. I did myself. I run intensifier on most levels unless it is a level where you have to make a SECOND mission item to complete a later mission, i.e. 103 for 105.IF they ran what you said eco we would be at what 65 credits per monster? and that would also help cure "some" of the top factions banks running low. I know that the third level of those stats structures were not planned or thought out whatsover. For if they were they would have gone from 800 creds per hour to about 1200. not 2k
#7
MamorukunBE
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Posted 12 May 2009 - 09:46
Well, we all wonder why HCS hasn’t addressed that problem yet, but don’t forget that they have to make real money with this game, so they probably see the problem from another angle. For example, here is what –I– would consider if such a problem happens in a free game I would have made:
• Let’s say I have 900 free players, and only 100 donating players (total 1000 players)
• The problem occurs, and 400 free players/10 donating players leave because of this. I have now 500 free players, and 90 donating players. But the free players wishing to continue the game have now to donate too, so lets say 10% of them begin to donate: at the end, I’ll have 450 free players, and 140 donating players, for a total of 590 players.
• In the other hand, if I solve the problem, no free player will leave, but some donating players (lets say 10% again) won’t need to donate anymore, so at the end I would have 910 free players and 90 donating players.
In other words, in my game if I don’t address the problem, I’ll have 140 donating players, but if I solve it, that number will drop to only 90 donating players! No need to say that I –won’t– solve the problem quickly
Of course, that example was REALLY simple, and the figures were just there as an example: depending on the way you see a problem, it’s sometime better NOT to solve it I don’t say that it’s what is happening with us, but it's just possible.
• Let’s say I have 900 free players, and only 100 donating players (total 1000 players)
• The problem occurs, and 400 free players/10 donating players leave because of this. I have now 500 free players, and 90 donating players. But the free players wishing to continue the game have now to donate too, so lets say 10% of them begin to donate: at the end, I’ll have 450 free players, and 140 donating players, for a total of 590 players.
• In the other hand, if I solve the problem, no free player will leave, but some donating players (lets say 10% again) won’t need to donate anymore, so at the end I would have 910 free players and 90 donating players.
In other words, in my game if I don’t address the problem, I’ll have 140 donating players, but if I solve it, that number will drop to only 90 donating players! No need to say that I –won’t– solve the problem quickly
Of course, that example was REALLY simple, and the figures were just there as an example: depending on the way you see a problem, it’s sometime better NOT to solve it
I don’t say that it’s what is happening with us, but it's just possible.
#8
Zaelin
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Posted 12 May 2009 - 13:23
From another thread Mr Grim stated:
Basically, if you need to grind 1,000 creatures to gain 1 level with 50 credits dropping each time, you get 50,000 credits. As you level up you need to kill more creatures so you get more money, so the price of the items increases.
There is a formula from this that determines the price of the items (as there is a formula for most of the things in the game), I can't tell you what it is obviously but I'm pretty sure you boffins could figure it out. From our point of view it appears that everything is fine especially when intensifier allows you to kill less creatures for the same xp/credits saving on repair also.
I'm not going to fluff my feathers and parade around saying we never make mistakes but we do take an awful lot of care to ensure that problems do not arise with the game and that balance is achieved, we don't want you to be swimming in credits but we don't want you to be begging on the post apocalyptic rpg streets either!
Credit Drops shall be staying as it is as you are killing more Entities thus getting more credits. Repair costs are not increasing by that much.
Basically, if you need to grind 1,000 creatures to gain 1 level with 50 credits dropping each time, you get 50,000 credits. As you level up you need to kill more creatures so you get more money, so the price of the items increases.
There is a formula from this that determines the price of the items (as there is a formula for most of the things in the game), I can't tell you what it is obviously but I'm pretty sure you boffins could figure it out. From our point of view it appears that everything is fine especially when intensifier allows you to kill less creatures for the same xp/credits saving on repair also.
I'm not going to fluff my feathers and parade around saying we never make mistakes but we do take an awful lot of care to ensure that problems do not arise with the game and that balance is achieved, we don't want you to be swimming in credits but we don't want you to be begging on the post apocalyptic rpg streets either!
#9
MamorukunBE
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Posted 12 May 2009 - 13:28
This one is just wonderfull Zaelin! Love it!we don't want you to be swimming in credits but we don't want you to be begging on the post apocalyptic rpg streets either!
#10
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Posted 12 May 2009 - 13:32
I know right? ;D
#11
ss_ecofrog
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Posted 12 May 2009 - 18:27
well i do kinda agree with some of your concepts Zaelin but there are a few flaws in it first of all 1000 creatures doesn't = 50k credits when you take into account the tax at 25% =37500 repairs i taking a guess at about 7500 minimum =30000 left also most people lose at least a few battles and only have 1 bank depo so say 3000 lost over the whole level i think thats a fair estimate even more if there not using fe gear so that leaves about 27000 credits.
also alot of people have exp gain so about 2.5 levels over the course of each 10 with the current rate of new content = a quarter less credits =20250 left
and the exp we get from quests reduces the amount of kills needed by mabey 1 level
and this is all before you consider the missions costs and getting new gear
and heaven forbid we'd forget about donating to faction or actully saving ourselves.
so at level 500 what would be the amount that creating a mission item will cost ???
or to repair.
WHERE WILL THE LINE BE DRAWN
also alot of people have exp gain so about 2.5 levels over the course of each 10 with the current rate of new content = a quarter less credits =20250 left
and the exp we get from quests reduces the amount of kills needed by mabey 1 level
and this is all before you consider the missions costs and getting new gear
and heaven forbid we'd forget about donating to faction or actully saving ourselves.
so at level 500 what would be the amount that creating a mission item will cost ???
or to repair.
WHERE WILL THE LINE BE DRAWN
#12
ss_altare
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Posted 12 May 2009 - 21:47
Too lazy to read all these posts and actually see what has already been posted or even what the first post was about but oh well.
I think the credit amount to make items via the assembly plant for missions is way too high. I spent over 11k just recently for one mission..that gave a mere 25k xp and 10 skill points reward.
On average I make about 15k profit a day..and it goes up every level I get by about 500 credits. That's still not too much considering I buy 2-3 stims a day to help with killing entities. After I buff up and gather all my stuff for the item I may only have 4 or 5k left..either barely enough or not enough to make the item.
It kind of annoys me too because the only way of getting skill points is missions and some of them take more than give more. Overall the system is good I just don't want to end up spending 50k on an item at lvl 200 just to get 200k xp and 10 skill points. (At that level not too much)
I think the credit amount to make items via the assembly plant for missions is way too high. I spent over 11k just recently for one mission..that gave a mere 25k xp and 10 skill points reward.
On average I make about 15k profit a day..and it goes up every level I get by about 500 credits. That's still not too much considering I buy 2-3 stims a day to help with killing entities. After I buff up and gather all my stuff for the item I may only have 4 or 5k left..either barely enough or not enough to make the item.
It kind of annoys me too because the only way of getting skill points is missions and some of them take more than give more. Overall the system is good I just don't want to end up spending 50k on an item at lvl 200 just to get 200k xp and 10 skill points. (At that level not too much)
#13
ss_barmuka
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Posted 12 May 2009 - 23:47
This one is just wonderfull Zaelin! Love it!we don't want you to be swimming in credits but we don't want you to be begging on the post apocalyptic rpg streets either!
50 credits doesnt drop each time it is the MAX that drops. The average is closer to 47 credits dropping each time. and 1/4 of that is faction tax. so really we are only gaining about 33-34 credits per kill. I repair approximately 22 times per level@600 credits per repair. No matter how you look at the math zaelin every single person in the game will lose fc's on almost every quest above lvl 100. I will start keeping a log of incoming and outgoing credits in the game during next content release and maybe you shall see that your 50 credits was only enough when mission combines werent costing 2x more then you gain during that level. I know that personally i lost 4fc during 109 and have put 1 back up on the board with 40k exp left to finish the level. So unless i gain 39K credits in my last 40k exp then i have lost out just to finish another portion of a long quest. You cant say that missions arent mandatory either especially since what happened in 100 when i had to spend half a day to find a HK just to use the steps to get to 101. Not to mention that we cannot get skillpoints in any other fashion. I believe all in all i lost about 80k credits between 101-109 this far. And i still have one more level to go
#14
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Posted 13 May 2009 - 00:08
Let's not use the tax as an excuse but we can revisit structures. Let's take the numbers zaelin proposed. 50 creds per kill (max but fine). Level 109 requires 1600 kills figuring 215 xp per kill (108^3 - 107^3)/21.5. Let's allow 50 creds per kill and assume intensifier 100 used. So, there are 80k creds from the level. Let's play the game the way we are told it is designed. So, we're likely to die a couple times right? Can we agree that 5k is lost from those? I mean, we are playing in unengineered gear and the add-ons are extra right? So, 75k.
So, on level 109 there was a blueprint, 3 parts and 3 assemblies to pay for. Each was roughly 8k. That's 56k lost to the mission. So, we have 19k left. Even with intensifier we have killed 550 things. Roughly requiring 20 500 cred repairs. So, that's 9k left. But, now we have faction structures to support. I guess I should deposit my 1800 creds to the faction and hope they can survive.... I have just paid for 16 minutes of my factions upkeep with just over a day of energy gain. If we have 50 active members we could pay for 800 minutes of upkeep per day. Wow. That worked well (for the math challenged there are 1440 minutes in a day - sometimes more in cow time ). Oh, and I have just enough creds to buy intensifier and corrode stims for my next hunt. With nothing left over for gear. Boy, aren't I glad I donated before I did that.... Of course, if we had a 25% tax the faction would have collected 20k (2.7 hours of upkeep) so the structures are probably safe. But I had to sell 1 or 2 fc to cover the cost of the level....
I trust you have a formula. I don't trust that it works to have credits not going negative. I will repeat what I said before: Whether it has already happened or is about to, playing for free (not having to use fc to stay minimally equipped and complete missions) will NOT BE POSSIBLE. I believe that you can be cred positive (buying the gear you need to buy on the way through) about as much as I believe that the level 68 mob was right before it got changed by a factor of about 3. I proposed LONG ago a very slight increase in creds dropped to cover these things. About 1 credit per 4 levels would do this. Would there be some extra creds? Not sure. I know we tend to use them all. A new structure can suck creds out from the "rich" easily if so. I'm not asking for an unbalanced game. And, quite frankly, this isn't a big deal to me as I can afford to donate occasionally. But, I probably won't if that's how this game will end up working....
So, on level 109 there was a blueprint, 3 parts and 3 assemblies to pay for. Each was roughly 8k. That's 56k lost to the mission. So, we have 19k left. Even with intensifier we have killed 550 things. Roughly requiring 20 500 cred repairs. So, that's 9k left. But, now we have faction structures to support. I guess I should deposit my 1800 creds to the faction and hope they can survive.... I have just paid for 16 minutes of my factions upkeep with just over a day of energy gain. If we have 50 active members we could pay for 800 minutes of upkeep per day. Wow. That worked well (for the math challenged there are 1440 minutes in a day - sometimes more in cow time
). Oh, and I have just enough creds to buy intensifier and corrode stims for my next hunt. With nothing left over for gear. Boy, aren't I glad I donated before I did that.... Of course, if we had a 25% tax the faction would have collected 20k (2.7 hours of upkeep) so the structures are probably safe. But I had to sell 1 or 2 fc to cover the cost of the level....I trust you have a formula. I don't trust that it works to have credits not going negative. I will repeat what I said before: Whether it has already happened or is about to, playing for free (not having to use fc to stay minimally equipped and complete missions) will NOT BE POSSIBLE. I believe that you can be cred positive (buying the gear you need to buy on the way through) about as much as I believe that the level 68 mob was right before it got changed by a factor of about 3. I proposed LONG ago a very slight increase in creds dropped to cover these things. About 1 credit per 4 levels would do this. Would there be some extra creds? Not sure. I know we tend to use them all. A new structure can suck creds out from the "rich" easily if so. I'm not asking for an unbalanced game. And, quite frankly, this isn't a big deal to me as I can afford to donate occasionally. But, I probably won't if that's how this game will end up working....
#15
ss_barmuka
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Posted 13 May 2009 - 02:33
I agree with you ecolitan 110%. The problem i am seeing is maybe HCS is following a communistic economics approach. Where every is treated exactly the same when it comes to money gain. The problem they dont see is that hooftest only makes sure the missions work. he does not make sure that it works moneywise on the level.
@Zaelin
Actually you dont kill 1000 monsters on any level anymore. lvl 109 was ~340k exp or so so lets do the math. 630 exp is my average kill count so lets use that. 330000/630=523.8 so 524 kills if researcher never activates. and discluding my xp gain.
524kills times 144 creds average(48 for single)=75428. Faction tax(cant levelwithout one) 56571 left over. during these 524 kills we will have to repair once/40 kills(this is high with non FE'd gear would be more repairs)@600 a repairx13 minimum=7800
so i am down to 48k creds. loseabout 5k to HCS randomness 43k creds This is a maximum you would make. If you did aquest then u get less. if you have xp gain, you get less. i get ~26k xp/day ~1 level a week. at a max i profit 10k a day sometimes. depends on if i have to assemble items for quests. then i lose my 10k+ a ton more. this is not including buying stims@cost or paying for any buffs. But i guess since hooftest can hit a button and level we dont matter.
@Zaelin
Actually you dont kill 1000 monsters on any level anymore. lvl 109 was ~340k exp or so so lets do the math. 630 exp is my average kill count so lets use that. 330000/630=523.8 so 524 kills if researcher never activates. and discluding my xp gain.
524kills times 144 creds average(48 for single)=75428. Faction tax(cant levelwithout one) 56571 left over. during these 524 kills we will have to repair once/40 kills(this is high with non FE'd gear would be more repairs)@600 a repairx13 minimum=7800
so i am down to 48k creds. loseabout 5k to HCS randomness 43k creds This is a maximum you would make. If you did aquest then u get less. if you have xp gain, you get less. i get ~26k xp/day ~1 level a week. at a max i profit 10k a day sometimes. depends on if i have to assemble items for quests. then i lose my 10k+ a ton more. this is not including buying stims@cost or paying for any buffs. But i guess since hooftest can hit a button and level we dont matter.
#16
ss_jimboooooo
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Posted 13 May 2009 - 03:12
I think the underlying problem here in the difference of opinion between the cows and the player base is that the cows are going off of how it should work from the way they designed the game and the players are going off of how it does work because we are actually going through these levels playing the game. I fully understand that they designed things to be a certain way and want it to stay that way, but as we all well know, things don't always work out as planned.
I really think this game would be different if all of (or at least a few of) the cows actually played the game to the end of content regularly. Oh and please don't read that as my suggesting that we wait for the cows to catch up to the end of content before they release new content. God forbid! We don't have that kind of time!
The math theory there is sound, but it just doesn't work out that way. Not only is the amount of creatures we kill per a level not always going to be static for reasons already mentioned (most notably xp gain, quests, and buffs), but the formula you are using doesn't allow for any "disposable" income for us. That means we can't upgrade our structures (especially with the flat out insane cost on some of them), we can't get all the gear we want, and we can't help out our friends and factions as much as we'd like to.
Like you said Zaelin, everyone makes mistakes. We know and appreciate that you guys do take a great amount of care into the design of the game, but we also appreciate that you guys are willing to admit error and make changes when need be. I don't want to us all swimming in credits and everything but the FC devalued either, but somethings gotta give here. Intensifier and dropping the price on missions, gears and inventing was a step, but its only a band aid. The problem needs to be fixed and thats not going to happen without some increase in income.
I really think this game would be different if all of (or at least a few of) the cows actually played the game to the end of content regularly. Oh and please don't read that as my suggesting that we wait for the cows to catch up to the end of content before they release new content. God forbid! We don't have that kind of time!
The math theory there is sound, but it just doesn't work out that way. Not only is the amount of creatures we kill per a level not always going to be static for reasons already mentioned (most notably xp gain, quests, and buffs), but the formula you are using doesn't allow for any "disposable" income for us. That means we can't upgrade our structures (especially with the flat out insane cost on some of them), we can't get all the gear we want, and we can't help out our friends and factions as much as we'd like to.
Like you said Zaelin, everyone makes mistakes. We know and appreciate that you guys do take a great amount of care into the design of the game, but we also appreciate that you guys are willing to admit error and make changes when need be. I don't want to us all swimming in credits and everything but the FC devalued either, but somethings gotta give here. Intensifier and dropping the price on missions, gears and inventing was a step, but its only a band aid. The problem needs to be fixed and thats not going to happen without some increase in income.
#17
ss_barmuka
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Posted 13 May 2009 - 03:25
I think the underlying problem here in the difference of opinion between the cows and the player base is that the cows are going off of how it should work from the way they designed the game and the players are going off of how it does work because we are actually going through these levels playing the game. I fully understand that they designed things to be a certain way and want it to stay that way, but as we all well know, things don't always work out as planned.
I really think this game would be different if all of (or at least a few of) the cows actually played the game to the end of content regularly. Oh and please don't read that as my suggesting that we wait for the cows to catch up to the end of content before they release new content. God forbid! We don't have that kind of time!
The math theory there is sound, but it just doesn't work out that way. Not only is the amount of creatures we kill per a level not always going to be static for reasons already mentioned (most notably xp gain, quests, and buffs), but the formula you are using doesn't allow for any "disposable" income for us. That means we can't upgrade our structures (especially with the flat out insane cost on some of them), we can't get all the gear we want, and we can't help out our friends and factions as much as we'd like to.
Like you said Zaelin, everyone makes mistakes. We know and appreciate that you guys do take a great amount of care into the design of the game, but we also appreciate that you guys are willing to admit error and make changes when need be. I don't want to us all swimming in credits and everything but the FC devalued either, but somethings gotta give here. Intensifier and dropping the price on missions, gears and inventing was a step, but its only a band aid. The problem needs to be fixed and thats not going to happen without some increase in income.
I would like to point out that what i bolded has not happened. Since level 70 the opposite has happened. It used to take 1/3 the cost of a piece of gear that level to complete the combine on the mission. But on 109 they totally blew that away. 7843 for a blueprint required to make the mission combine piece. 7843 for the spear we all had to buy to do the final combine 7843 to do 3 combines to make the subcombine of that mission. and an additional 7843 to make the final combine for that mission. and even without accounting for faction tax this number already exceeds my previous calculation. so 47k credits to complete a mission whereas we would gain a MAX of 43k to complete the level. 4k in the hole doesnt account for buying stims to level with, xp gain, or faction tax. In all you do lose about 2-3 fc worth of credits@13k each.what will be my solution from now on? I will only sell Fc's by ST only. 18-20k. You want to see the economy ruined? keep doing what your doing. all you will do is lose donators in the end and only free players will stay. until they cant level any further without donating then they will leave leaving nuthing.
I am sorry but new players already have an advantage. They get FE'd awesome gear for next to nuthing compared to what we paid to MAKE them. Maybe we should all stop selling FE'd items under 10 fc and then HCS can really see how hard we could make it for new players to start this game. Or they can increase the credits drop(SLOWLY) so that those of us who suffered through the low lvls and the rough levels and the impossible levels can actually play the game without coming out of pocket on every quest level. Not to mention we wouldnt be able to afford Buying new gear either at this rate. only those who donate heavy to the game will be able to proceed.
#18
Zaelin
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SIGMASTORM
Zaelin
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Posted 13 May 2009 - 08:21
I fully expected the kind of replies where we don't play the game 
I do try to play even though I know whats going to happen.. so it kind of spoils it all and stuff.. 
As for the credits, we are looking into it. Some would say we are designing the game specifically to use flux crystals to level up. Well yes.. we do want you to use flux crystals.. but not because you have to.
Flux crystals are designed to be a "wanted" thing not an essentially "needed" one.
I do try to play even though I know whats going to happen.. so it kind of spoils it all and stuff.. As for the credits, we are looking into it. Some would say we are designing the game specifically to use flux crystals to level up. Well yes.. we do want you to use flux crystals.. but not because you have to.
Flux crystals are designed to be a "wanted" thing not an essentially "needed" one.
#19
BigGrim
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SIGMASTORM
BigGrim
Level 411
Posted 13 May 2009 - 11:07
Okay. A lot of valid points. We are looking at a few options on what to do with the credit situation.
Raising the credit drops is not gonna happen but slowing the speed at which mission credit use increases is on the cards.
Mechanic and Cloning Facility cost factoring has been frozen for the last two or three updates.
We are gonna be reducing the cost of building items from the Blueprints. So I wouldn't build anything for a while until we put up a news post telling everyone that the changes are made. This will be done today. Unfortunatly, we cannot reimburse players for changed costs as this is an economic change for the good of all and the benefits would be felt by everyone in due time.
There are other ideas. We are considering the issue from several angles.
Raising the credit drops is not gonna happen but slowing the speed at which mission credit use increases is on the cards.
Mechanic and Cloning Facility cost factoring has been frozen for the last two or three updates.
We are gonna be reducing the cost of building items from the Blueprints. So I wouldn't build anything for a while until we put up a news post telling everyone that the changes are made. This will be done today. Unfortunatly, we cannot reimburse players for changed costs as this is an economic change for the good of all and the benefits would be felt by everyone in due time.
There are other ideas. We are considering the issue from several angles.
#20
ecolitan
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ecolitan
Level 356
Posted 13 May 2009 - 12:32
Thank you for addressing part of the problem at least. And, zaelin, only 1 response seemed to reference you guys not being at the end of content. I still think all the tweaking of things won't work in the long run without increased credit drops. Unless ALL costs are going to freeze. Since I don't see that happening, this will keep cropping up without some sort of credit drop growth. I assume you have new structures for factions in mind? Paid for out of what? The day we need to start selling fc's to maintain our structures is the day I quit this game. And, this isn't far from where we are with the rate of content release.
All these calculations seem to forget that factions have a week of credit gain followed by two weeks of credit drain. Before anyone starts talking about max energy or whatever, the total number of credits into the faction is the same - it just is gained in the first of the three weeks for the top factions. For the last two contents our faction balance has been lower at the onset of each content. Sure, we spend the creds on engineering and such but that's what it's there for and it isn't like we tag 50 sets per content.... Please make level 3 of the stat structures more affordable as well. It is scary that the top 5 factions have to carefully watch the credit balance with these structures (and we only have 2 of them maxxed).
All these calculations seem to forget that factions have a week of credit gain followed by two weeks of credit drain. Before anyone starts talking about max energy or whatever, the total number of credits into the faction is the same - it just is gained in the first of the three weeks for the top factions. For the last two contents our faction balance has been lower at the onset of each content. Sure, we spend the creds on engineering and such but that's what it's there for and it isn't like we tag 50 sets per content.... Please make level 3 of the stat structures more affordable as well. It is scary that the top 5 factions have to carefully watch the credit balance with these structures (and we only have 2 of them maxxed).
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