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Offical Suggestion : Kick up the fire, Hell-Forge is burning


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Poll: What do you think about the proposed Hell-Forge changes? (95 member(s) have cast votes)

What do you think about the proposed Hell-Forge changes?

  1. Don't change it, I like the Hell-Forge as it is! (11 votes [2.81%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.81%

  2. Sounds good but needs some work! (68 votes [17.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.35%

  3. I like the new idea's I would use the Hell-Forge way more (313 votes [79.85%])

    Percentage of vote: 79.85%

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#41 fs_ssgtm

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 00:02

it sounds great lieka cheap mans forge compared to crafting. Crafting usees the FSP and the forge would use gold. a Great thing the game needs a gold sink. i mean there are people with Millions of gold laying around for nothing. and gold to FSP costs have gone up a heck of a lot since i started here. i mean its hard to find under 30K on the marketplace.
Great idea keep it up

#42 Mowglik

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 00:04

perfect idea !

The first & second are online 24/24 :

1st : ======>>>  http://rfsa.atwebpages.com/ <<<======
2sd :======>>> http://rfsa.eu5.net <<<======
 
3rd :  ====>>> http://rfsa.000webhostapp.com/FS/ <<<====
so, this last one is free too, BUT every day, around 05:00 A.M., the web site will be in sleep for 1 hour.

 

 


#43 fs_lordatog

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 00:16

well an idea on the refunding forge let people unforge and walk off with 25 fsp on own by a certain time or have em automatically reforged with new forge to same lvl

#44 Redfay

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 01:12

well i like the idea the only problem i find with this is that


refunding ALL fsps all spent on forging that sounds a little off to me since those items may already be sold and bought the owners might be upset.....

#45 fs_matto

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 02:05

Ok, I like the idea, but I have a few questions/comments...

1) Pricing - I agree with what a bunch of higher lvl players said. Gold isn't THAT much easier to get at higher levels. I'm only getting maybe twice the gold per kill that I got when I was lvl 45/50. So it doesn't make much sense to make it an exponential increase, but maybe have set increment lvls as we do for our lvls in game. I know the math is easier, but soon it would cost some of us 1 million gold to upgrade an item, and most people won't bother.

2) 'Un-forging' is stupid, please don't consider it. Forging should work the exact same way it did before. You pay for the first lvl, you get a set result. If you want variety and risk, use the crafting system. My only argument is that for many items, crafting might not be worth it anymore (the ones with lower bonus) but that's another issue. With the new forging system idea, a forge should be just as it sounds. And it shouldn't differ per item with varying stats, it should work just as it always worked, equal bonus per stat, regardless of number. That was one of the benefits of forging items with multiple stats before, it should remain now.

3) Easy one, there should be the ability to do all 5 lvls of forging in 1 click. Would save time with slow refreshing. Just charge the total for all 5 forging lvls in 1 click. Easy.

4) Crafting and Forging should be mutually exclusive. Change of better crafting should not be determined based on lvl of forging. I saw this proposed somewhere and I don't like it. These are 2 very different tasks/actions. You don't get more xp from monsters for having a higher pvp or better crafting bonus on an item because you're a higher lvl wearing it, so why combine effects of two seperate processes. Leave them to themselves. This is about forging and it should stay that way.

5) IMPORTANT QUESTION! - Would the % change on an item be based on it's current stat values (like buffs are) or would they be based on the items base values (before crafting)???


Also, on a side note, I think that this will surely bring down the prices of fsps seeing as how the second I read this idea, my first thought (and I've never had this thought as long as I've been playing FS) was, man, I might have to sell some fsps...

Alright, thanks for listening. If a mod/dev could get back to me on this, that'd be great. And thanks for doing this, the last time I forged something was the carnage set, and I felt like I wasted so much on it, that I've never used forging since. If this is implemented, and the gold amount is more realistic, I will probably forge most sets and even some common items.

#46 fs_eyvind

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 03:04

i like the sound of it :-) i have personally never hell forged anything previously largely due to the price...but this would now give further incentive to it :-)

#47 fs_skylock

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 04:16

Sounds like we're on the right track with this topic, but the high level players are in no way making more gold than players 100 levels below us to justify the gold hike increase to hell forge (we just use more stamina to gain it). Seeing after level 140 it takes us 2 hits to kill a creature to gain the same amount of gold just one level before for a 1 hit kill sounds kind of sad. An example is a level 115 player gets around 140 gold for a one hit kill. Higher level players (such as myself) are using 2 hits to get 200 gold. Doing the math we are only getting 100 gold per stamina, while lower level players gain more gold per stamina used.

I don't really have an answer to balance the gold gained for those who use double stamina at level 140 except (and this may be a reach), but if it takes you 6 stamina to kill a creature then you get 6X's the base gold for each stamina used. This way if you one hit kill creatures then you get the base amount, but if you take (an example) 6 stamina to kill a creature then you get 6 times the base gold. Again it may be a reach but it's a thought.

#48 fs_ravana

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 04:17

Ok, I like the idea, but I have a few questions/comments...

1) Pricing - I agree with what a bunch of higher lvl players said. Gold isn't THAT much easier to get at higher levels.


Then don't use it. This would make a good mechanism to prevent the higher-level characters from "abusively" (in some people's eyes) using the Hell Forge to jack their stats even higher. More to the point, it will prevent higher-level characters from walking around with quintuple-Forged everything... or at least make them think twice about doing it every time they swap out a piece of equipment. And it might even encourage people to use some lower-level items that they can more cheaply Hell Forge, rather than higher-level ones with only slightly greater benefits.

That's assuming it works out as you suggest. Me, I intend to use it extensively... because gold is "THAT much easier" to get at higher levels. My level, at least. Should I stay here where it's comfy and not level up anymore? :lol: I mean, I'm raking in somewhere between 70k and 100k a day—depending on whether I remember to ask a buddy for a TH buff or not... which should tell everyone just how important gold isn't at higher levels—without selling a thing at AH for gold. Oh, dear me, I might actually have to wait a day or two to quintuple-Forge an item. Boo hoo.

soon it would cost some of us 1 million gold to upgrade an item


I wouldn't be too worried about that until you reach level 333, honestly. That's for a complete, five-level upgrade, by the way: a single-step upgrade wouldn't become that expensive until level 625.

And even if it did, that would just mean some of the richer players would need to start cleaning out some of their 5-to-10M gold stashes....

2) [snip] And it shouldn't differ per item with varying stats, it should work just as it always worked, equal bonus per stat, regardless of number. That was one of the benefits of forging items with multiple stats before, it should remain now.


Which would mean that two-thirds of the items currently in the game will still never get used. By distributing (or, perhaps instead, concentrating) bonuses so that one- and two-stat items get greater effects, you could at least begin to address that problem.

4) Crafting and Forging should be mutually exclusive.


No.

Can you come up with an even remotely coherent reason why they should be—in terms of either game balance or game-world rationale?

5) IMPORTANT QUESTION! - Would the % change on an item be based on it's current stat values (like buffs are) or would they be based on the items base values (before crafting)???


That is an important question... though if we went with your suggestion #4, it would be rhetorical. I think it should be based on the base values—which might help address your objection to combined Crafting/Forging. More importantly, even if Forging remains at a set value per level (which it probably will, my suggestions notwithstanding), you can always change the Crafting value on the item. It would probably be simpler for the game to "remember" the stat values on the items if the two came from completely different sub-routines. (I think; depends on how the values of items are stored in the database. I can see it going either way.)

#49 fs_ravana

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 04:24

Matto—current gold in bank: 10,123,537

My heart bleeds for you, chum.

delux906—current gold in bank: 1,756,730

So you could only fully upgrade six of the items you presently have on hand without going out and collecting a bit more.

At least everyone else who has objected to the price had the decency not to be sitting on well over 1M gold when he/she did it.... :D

#50 ScarletTestAce

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 04:54

lol im working on getting 1 mill...in fact if i sold my 1000+fsp i think that would more then cover it :)

#51 fs_davidjames

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 04:55

there is nothing wrong with the costs since Radneto said himself he was just throwing out some numbers to use as examples and once you get past lvl 50 its not hard to get over 100k a day just killing creatures.

the way the hellforge works now its pointless to forge anything at higher lvls since a plus 6 to any of my stats is not going to make any difference in my ability to kill creatures. I really don't care what kind of change they make as long as they make a change and i think that what Radneto has proposed here is an awesome solution to the now useless Hellforge.

#52 fs_matto

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 05:59

Ok, I like the idea, but I have a few questions/comments...

1) Pricing - I agree with what a bunch of higher lvl players said. Gold isn't THAT much easier to get at higher levels.


Then don't use it. This would make a good mechanism to prevent the higher-level characters from "abusively" (in some people's eyes) using the Hell Forge to jack their stats even higher. More to the point, it will prevent higher-level characters from walking around with quintuple-Forged everything... or at least make them think twice about doing it every time they swap out a piece of equipment. And it might even encourage people to use some lower-level items that they can more cheaply Hell Forge, rather than higher-level ones with only slightly greater benefits.

That's assuming it works out as you suggest. Me, I intend to use it extensively... because gold is "THAT much easier" to get at higher levels. My level, at least. Should I stay here where it's comfy and not level up anymore? :lol: I mean, I'm raking in somewhere between 70k and 100k a day—depending on whether I remember to ask a buddy for a TH buff or not... which should tell everyone just how important gold isn't at higher levels—without selling a thing at AH for gold. Oh, dear me, I might actually have to wait a day or two to quintuple-Forge an item. Boo hoo.

soon it would cost some of us 1 million gold to upgrade an item


I wouldn't be too worried about that until you reach level 333, honestly. That's for a complete, five-level upgrade, by the way: a single-step upgrade wouldn't become that expensive until level 625.

And even if it did, that would just mean some of the richer players would need to start cleaning out some of their 5-to-10M gold stashes....

2) [snip] And it shouldn't differ per item with varying stats, it should work just as it always worked, equal bonus per stat, regardless of number. That was one of the benefits of forging items with multiple stats before, it should remain now.


Which would mean that two-thirds of the items currently in the game will still never get used. By distributing (or, perhaps instead, concentrating) bonuses so that one- and two-stat items get greater effects, you could at least begin to address that problem.

4) Crafting and Forging should be mutually exclusive.


No.

Can you come up with an even remotely coherent reason why they should be—in terms of either game balance or game-world rationale?

5) IMPORTANT QUESTION! - Would the % change on an item be based on it's current stat values (like buffs are) or would they be based on the items base values (before crafting)???


That is an important question... though if we went with your suggestion #4, it would be rhetorical. I think it should be based on the base values—which might help address your objection to combined Crafting/Forging. More importantly, even if Forging remains at a set value per level (which it probably will, my suggestions notwithstanding), you can always change the Crafting value on the item. It would probably be simpler for the game to "remember" the stat values on the items if the two came from completely different sub-routines. (I think; depends on how the values of items are stored in the database. I can see it going either way.)


I think you looked too closely at my lvl and gold before objectively reading my post.

At my lvl, it would cost me about 500k and 2 fsps to fully hell-forge 1 item. With 500k i can buy 20-25 fsps. Currently, it costs 50 fsps to forge an item to the same degree, but you can extract 25 fsps whenever you want. The new system won't allow this. Think about it, in the end, the new system will cost MORE, especially once you get over lvl 200, and you can't get anything back from it. Where's the sense in that?

Also, if you had read my 4th point properly, you'd have understood why my question raises a different issue. Someone posted earlier saying that hell-forging should determine how accurate your crafting is (whether you get perfect or excellent). I even said that, even though you didn't quote me properly. My point is that I don't think one should influence the effects of the other. Hell forging has nothing to do with one's potential crafting lvl.

Now for my question, which is different, currently buffs (say EW for instance) on a weapon add the percentage based on the items current stats. I'm asking will the hell forge bonus, if it ends up being a percent as Radneto has suggested, be added as a percent of base stats, or current stats. Depending on the answer, your hell forge value could be ever changing. However, this is a question for the devs, and I still hope they will answer.

Btw, your reply to my 2nd point completely condescends your reply to my first point. If you think there should be a set point bonus, fine. But don't say one minute that you think it would be unfair to have the bonus distribute evenly to each stat regardless of the number of stats, and then the next second say that because the high cost of gold for high level players will make it more difficult for them to upgrade than lower lvl players that they just shouldn't do it because it's abusive anyway. That's highly biased, and seemingly towards only people above your lvl, which I hate to remind you, but you will eventually get to this lvl and be stuck in the same position.

My point is while it will cost me twice as much gold to upgrade as someone half my lvl, they actually make nearly the same gold with the same stamina because a) they can kill in 1 hit while it takes me 2-3, and B) they get a little more than half the gold I get. If that sounds fair to everyone, fine, keep the system the way it is. Just means that in a few weeks when no one has gold anymore, that the huge amount of complaints will make for another change to the system.

And btw, don't list my total gold as if you've proven something. I deposit to my guild everyday that I use stamina, and I have NEVER sold an fsp, and have so much gold because I don't buy many either. I have simply stored in my bank the leftover gold (aside from guild depos) I've made from 166 lvls of killing monsters because I have no real use for gold in the game, even though the devs have been saying for 3 months that they will incorporate something to use it for.

And as I said earlier in this post, with this change to the system, anyone at or above my lvl would be better off with the current hell-forging process as it would cost less in the end. That means that only low lvl players would use it, still defeating the purpose of a change. In a few months, there will be hundreds of players at my current lvl or above, so don't say that it doesn't matter, because the majority of them have paid real money and been faithful to the game for a long time and their opinions matter as well. Besides I don't see why you're so worried about people getting higher stats. You talk above higher lvl players as if they're evil. Why would it bother you that we get higher stats? You will too in the future, but maybe you didn't think of that. Do you even know how hard it is to kill creatures at this lvl, especially for the top 3? All the bugs they face, all the tickets they send in, all the time they spend fixing problems? Have you even talked to any of them? Most of them are the ones making sure your gaming experience is fun and bug-free. They are the ones inspiring the changes that allow you to enjoy the game more. And if you want real perspective, realize that there are thousands of players lower than you in rank who would view you the same way as you seem to view us.

I just don't see why everything has to be an attack on the people who are in the top rankings...

#53 fs_matto

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 06:04

Sounds like we're on the right track with this topic, but the high level players are in no way making more gold than players 100 levels below us to justify the gold hike increase to hell forge (we just use more stamina to gain it). Seeing after level 140 it takes us 2 hits to kill a creature to gain the same amount of gold just one level before for a 1 hit kill sounds kind of sad. An example is a level 115 player gets around 140 gold for a one hit kill. Higher level players (such as myself) are using 2 hits to get 200 gold. Doing the math we are only getting 100 gold per stamina, while lower level players gain more gold per stamina used.

I don't really have an answer to balance the gold gained for those who use double stamina at level 140 except (and this may be a reach), but if it takes you 6 stamina to kill a creature then you get 6X's the base gold for each stamina used. This way if you one hit kill creatures then you get the base amount, but if you take (an example) 6 stamina to kill a creature then you get 6 times the base gold. Again it may be a reach but it's a thought.


My point exactly, thanks for summing it up better than I did... as opposed to others who attack my 'common decency' when I make a suggestion...

#54 fs_ravana

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 09:41

[quote name="Matto"]I think you looked too closely at my lvl and gold before objectively reading my post. [/quote]

Actually, I didn't look at your gold until after I had finished writing my post. I just became curious as to how much you were really going to end up hurting....

[quote]At my lvl, it would cost me about 500k and 2 fsps to fully hell-forge 1 item.[/quote]

498k... close enough. I was responding to your "eventually cost 1M gold" comment... which will happen when you hit L333 (actually, 334, but who's counting?).

[quote]With 500k i can buy 20-25 fsps. Currently, it costs 50 fsps to forge an item to the same degree, but you can extract 25 fsps whenever you want.[/quote]

Which means that, if you purchase 23 FSPs with that 500k, you will exactly break even between old and new systems.

[quote]Think about it, in the end, the new system will cost MORE, especially once you get over lvl 200, and you can't get anything back from it. Where's the sense in that?[/quote]

Rhetorical question... irrelevant. I could just as easily respond "where's the lack of sense in that"?

I'll answer it anyway, though. The sense in it is that this system you might use, while the current system you won't. Or, at any rate, the vast majority of players won't—clearly, because they already don't, and are saying so in droves.

[quote]Also, if you had read my 4th point properly, you'd have understood why my question raises a different issue. Someone posted earlier saying that hell-forging should determine how accurate your crafting is (whether you get perfect or excellent). I even said that, even though you didn't quote me properly. My point is that I don't think one should influence the effects of the other. Hell forging has nothing to do with one's potential crafting lvl.[/quote]

"Mutually exclusive" means "cannot be used together, function together, occur at the same time," etc. If you had written your fourth point correctly, there would have been no confusion. If you notice (which you appear not to have), I agree with what you intended.

And DON'T ACCUSE ME OF NOT QUOTING YOU PROPERLY when it is a direct quote from your own writing—as anyone go back and can see. That's beyond insulting... it's libelous. You show me where I altered, added or omitted a single letter of or to that sentence. I don't even correct spelling errors when I am quoting people (nor should one). Whether I took your meaning correctly or not has nothing to do with whether or not I was quoting you properly. And if I did not take your meaning properly, you may simply correct me on my misreading.

[quote]Now for my question, which is different, currently buffs (say EW for instance) on a weapon add the percentage based on the items current stats. I'm asking will the hell forge bonus, if it ends up being a percent as Radneto has suggested, be added as a percent of base stats, or current stats. Depending on the answer, your hell forge value could be ever changing. However, this is a question for the devs, and I still hope they will answer.[/quote]

And so do I. If you'd read my post carefully before responding—as you rather disingenuously accuse me of not doing, it seems—you'll notice that I raise precisely this point. On which I also agree with you.

[quote]Btw, your reply to my 2nd point completely condescends your reply to my first point. [/quote]

"Condescends" my reply to your first point? You can't "condescend" a reply. Or anything else. It's an intransitive verb.

[quote]If you think there should be a set point bonus, fine.[/quote]

I don't. I merely conceded that this would be the likely outcome. Read my post. Carefully.

[quote]But don't say one minute that you think it would be unfair to have the bonus distribute evenly to each stat regardless of the number of stats, and then the next second say that because the high cost of gold for high level players will make it more difficult for them to upgrade than lower lvl players that they just shouldn't do it because it's abusive anyway. [/quote]

I didn't. I said that some people would consider it "abusive" (which, as previously, I put here in scare quotes). Nor did I say they shouldn't do it—I said that you shouldn't, if you consider it too expensive. As with any other choice any of us makes in using our resources. Read my post. Carefully.

[quote]That's highly biased [/quote]

I agree. I neither hold nor endorse such a view. I was merely observing that there are those who do. And I'm quite certain we'll be hearing from them—something I sought to forestall.

[quote]and seemingly towards only people above your lvl, which I hate to remind you, but you will eventually get to this lvl and be stuck in the same position.[/quote]

I believe I implied recognition of that fact when I asked if I should stop leveling now. Read my post. Carefully.

[quote]And btw, don't list my total gold as if you've proven something. I deposit to my guild everyday that I use stamina, and I have NEVER sold an fsp, and have so much gold because I don't buy many either. I have simply stored in my bank the leftover gold (aside from guild depos) I've made from 166 lvls of killing monsters because I have no real use for gold in the game, even though the devs have been saying for 3 months that they will incorporate something to use it for.[/quote]

I deposit gold to my guild every day that I use stamina, I have never sold an FSP, nor have I ever bought any. I have no real use for gold in the game either. None of which is the point. My point is that the people who are complaining loudest about the gold cost are the ones who have the greatest amounts of it. And that claiming that gold isn't that much easier to get for high-level players than mid-level ones (much less low-level ones) is a snow job. In order for you to have that much gold in your bank, then no less than 40 million gold has passed through your hands during the game—indeed, much, much more than that if you're only depositing the "leftover" gold after purchases and guild deposits... and I have every reason to believe that you are. Precisely because it is possible to accumulate such levels of gold at higher levels.

[quote]And as I said earlier in this post, with this change to the system, anyone at or above my lvl would be better off with the current hell-forging process as it would cost less in the end.[/quote]

In absolute terms, perhaps; not in terms of time and effort. You can get gold any time you like just by going out and killing things. You can't do that with FSP... unless you already have the gold lying around to buy them with. Or spend real money on them.

[quote]That means that only low lvl players would use it, still defeating the purpose of a change. [/quote]

A change that makes something useful to 95+% of the players, rather than to its current utility to 0% of the players, is not a self-defeating change. It could be improved upon, perhaps... but it certainly does not defeat the purpose of making it.

[quote]In a few months, there will be hundreds of players at my current lvl or above, so don't say that it doesn't matter[/quote]

Okay, I won't. Nor did I.

[quote]because the majority of them have paid real money and been faithful to the game for a long time and their opinions matter as well. [/quote]

Do you purport to have inside information to the contrary about me? If you do, someone is lying to you. Did I claim, or even imply, that your (or anyone else's) opinions don't matter? No, I did not. If your opinions didn't matter, I wouldn't have taken the time (rather, wasted the time) responding to them. I was arguing against them... quite another matter.

[quote]Besides I don't see why you're so worried about people getting higher stats. [/quote]

I'm not—even though I do mention (elsewhere, though not in the post you're responding to) that I feel the proposed stat increases for Hell Forging are too great.

[quote]You talk above higher lvl players as if they're evil. [/quote]

No, just ruthlessly self-interested, to the potential expense of others... and even then only in certain cases.

[quote]Why would it bother you that we get higher stats? You will too in the future, but maybe you didn't think of that. [/quote]

Or maybe I did. And I will gladly pay the prices currently proposed for them when the time comes.

[quote]And if you want real perspective, realize that there are thousands of players lower than you in rank who would view you the same way as you seem to view us.[/quote]

If you possessed any "real" perspective, you would realize that I'm well aware of this, and am advocating something that is to their immense advantage—something you seem bent on killing, though I may be deceived in that due to your own rhetoric.

[quote]I just don't see why everything has to be an attack on the people who are in the top rankings...[/quote]

And I don't see why you considered my points—many of which you didn't respond to—to be an "attack" on higher-level players. How many people in the top rankings have I "attacked" on this thread? Or any other? Did I "attack" LordAtog? Or seath? Or anybody else? Or are you just personally embarrassed because I pointed out that you have so much gold hoarded that this change would have little effect on your play even if made in its current form—and are trying to cover it by posing as the defender of all people over... what? Level 140, to take the example from your first post? Level 150? You could max-forge 20 items of your current level tomorrow, if they instituted this. I certainly hope to reach and exceed that level some day, but I'm not going to have that kind of gold on me when I do. And you know what? That doesn't bother me in the least.

For that matter, I don't even see where you derive the implication that I do not regard myself as a "high-level" player myself. I believe I mention how much gold I make in an average day's play... where do I imply that you made more? I believe I was being quite clear in saying that I might have to wait a day or two to max-Forge an item. Do you really believe that Hell Forging ought to be so cheap that a player can max-Forge a new item daily? That makes it rather less "special," don't you think? Puts it in the realm of "routine," almost in the realm of "compulsory," even—if you want to keep pace with everyone else your level. I don't particularly care for that. Maybe that's just me, though.

In the meantime, though, do us all a favor: save your straw man tactics for someone they'll work on (or, better yet, discard them altogether), and address my points instead. As I do yours.

#55 fs_gamer0

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 10:02

ive never used the hell-forge because of the fsp prices are a bit too high for me but ive always got plenty of gold so i think this would make people use the hell-forge more so yeah thumbs up

#56 fs_leannesara

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 10:13

I haven't read all nine pages, I confess, I read the first and sort of the last page.

I do agree that the hellforge would likely be used more if people could spend gold rather than just fsp on it...

...but...

I'm not swayed on bumping up item bonus' like it does now anyway.

My only reason for saying this is cos we have crafting now, which offers some additional item bonus' on a single crafting.

I know hellforging is a bit different as you can hell-forge for up to five levels. But still, would it not be more interesting if the hell-forge upgraded something other than item bonus'? I'm not sure what, I haven't really thought that far ahead to be honest, I just like variety is all :)

#57 fs_crace

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 11:04

How about using hell forge to bump bonus skill stats instead of standard stats?

I'm not sure about the against 'un-forge' arguement. Surely if someone has sold on an item it really doesn't matter to them any more if the new owner gets the FSP or not? When they sold the item, surely the price could have taken into account the value of at least half of the FSP (if not more)?

#58 Prezze

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 12:00

At level 1 forging would now cost 2 FSP.
At level 2 it would be say 200 gold multiplied by item level. (so 20000 gold for a level 100 item)
At level 3 it would be say 400 gold multiplied by item level. (40000)
At level 4 it would be say 800 gold multiplied by item level. (80000)
At level 5 it would be say 1600 gold multiplied by item level. (160000)




not bad but level 1 forging should be cheaper it doesen't make sanse if it cost's more then lv 2.


and in what way is this cheaper? If I understand it correctly you always have to pay the 2 fsp, so I assume to get to a lvl 5 hellforge you also need to go through lvl 2,3 & 4. That would make the total cost 300000gold and 2 fsp? At the current rate's in the marketplace that makes 12 fsp for a lvl 5 hellforge on a lvl 100 item. Damn if I want to hellforge a lvl 150 item that costs me 240 000 gold for the lvl 5 only. And then again I make less money then a lvl 120 since I'm still facing the 2 hitters ...,

#59 Mowglik

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 12:07

At level 1 forging would now cost 2 FSP.
At level 2 it would be say 200 gold multiplied by item level. (so 20000 gold for a level 100 item)
At level 3 it would be say 400 gold multiplied by item level. (40000)
At level 4 it would be say 800 gold multiplied by item level. (80000)
At level 5 it would be say 1600 gold multiplied by item level. (160000)

not bad but level 1 forging should be cheaper it doesen't make sanse if it cost's more then lv 2.


and in what way is this cheaper? If I understand it correctly you always have to pay the 2 fsp, so I assume to get to a lvl 5 hellforge you also need to go through lvl 2,3 & 4. That would make the total cost 300000gold and 2 fsp? At the current rate's in the marketplace that makes 12 fsp for a lvl 5 hellforge on a lvl 100 item. Damn if I want to hellforge a lvl 150 item that costs me 240 000 gold for the lvl 5 only. And then again I make less money then a lvl 120 since I'm still facing the 2 hitters ...,


so at level 150, you'll make golds very fastly, compare at players level 25, 50 or 75...
you'll find easyly 300 000 golds in about 3, 4 or 5 days max... depending of how staminas you play...

that system will rebalance the value of golds versus FSP

a lower level player will can too have good items boost with forged...

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#60 Prezze

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Posted 31 July 2007 - 12:21

At level 1 forging would now cost 2 FSP.
At level 2 it would be say 200 gold multiplied by item level. (so 20000 gold for a level 100 item)
At level 3 it would be say 400 gold multiplied by item level. (40000)
At level 4 it would be say 800 gold multiplied by item level. (80000)
At level 5 it would be say 1600 gold multiplied by item level. (160000)

not bad but level 1 forging should be cheaper it doesen't make sanse if it cost's more then lv 2.


and in what way is this cheaper? If I understand it correctly you always have to pay the 2 fsp, so I assume to get to a lvl 5 hellforge you also need to go through lvl 2,3 & 4. That would make the total cost 300000gold and 2 fsp? At the current rate's in the marketplace that makes 12 fsp for a lvl 5 hellforge on a lvl 100 item. Damn if I want to hellforge a lvl 150 item that costs me 240 000 gold for the lvl 5 only. And then again I make less money then a lvl 120 since I'm still facing the 2 hitters ...,


so at level 150, you'll make golds very fastly, compare at players level 25, 50 or 75...
you'll find easyly 300 000 golds in about 3, 4 or 5 days max... depending of how staminas you play...

that system will rebalance the value of golds versus FSP

a lower level player will can too have good items boost with forged...


A lvl 75 player makes gold faster if you give him the same stamina gain and stamina as me ..., but a lvl 75 player has to pay only half of me to get his item fully helfforged. So he needs 1,5-2,5 days max to hellforge one item.
Then again I deposit daily in the guild making again that the max days rises up.

It's just if they want to create a system like this with the item lvl's it should be thought out more thouroughly, since now some people are being discriminated. If they plan on making it lvl based keep the lvl multiplier but change the gold prefix to something more according to the lvl item. For example if you have an item of lvl 150, take an avarage a lvl 150 can earn on a day and base the gold cost on that..., and do it in that way with every itemlvl. That's seems to be a more fair base in my opinion.

And making the value between gold and fsp more the same isn't something that will be done with this. An item fully hellforged will cost alot more fsp then a non hellforged item => making either fspprices drop alot or more likely make fsp more expensive, since the fspsellers now have to make even more money so they can hellforge all their items.

Like said here no one uses the hellforge since it's to expensive. So no of the fsp that are bought in the marketplace are used for this. So the demand and offer of the fsp will be more or less the same.
But the seller of the fsp now also needs more money to hellforge his items, he doesn't only sell fsp more for the guildbank or his own bank, but there comes this major cost in gold to hellforge an item. And in my opinion it won't make fsp more accessible to lower lvl players due to this reason


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