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#201 Kedyn

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:14

I agree on the fact that prestige should be based on the bounty board.. this way trading is cut off due to any number of people being able to hit the person being bountied.. One thing I would like to see if this is implemented is a lowered cost for taking bounties.. most bounties that go up cost higher level players (500+).. almost 1 FSP for anyone below level 200..

This above mentioned fact is one reason I have thought of following suit of players who have deleveled themselves to enjoy other aspects of the game. I don't feel like spending 1000+ FSP to get a bounty hunter's medal for something I didn't know when I was a much younger player ( I know it's due to my own ignorance in this case, but if other people can complain.. so can I ;-)). The idea of people who lowered their virtual level to reap the rewards of the buffs.. that was their choice.. if you introduce new buffs into the equation, then they will have to level up again. I'd say double or even triple stamina costs would be fine.. granted most of them have nothing to do with their stamina except walk around, PVP, GVG and buff. Buffmaster does help reduce stamina costs, but it doesn't kick in so often to offset the gained stamina usage.

As for 7 days.. I don't think that the number is wrong.. please read that you cannot gain prestige from the target every 7 days.. it doesn't mean you still can't attack them.. it won't stop PVPing for money or PVP score.. it will stop the prestige farming.. If you go by 'bry's bounty board suggestion.. then this won't even be a factor to begin with..


As for GVG.. I think that relieving the set number of participants would be a good first step. If would allow more people to retaliate then it would help make it to be what the name provides.. Guild vs Guild. As for a number restriction on the amount of people in a guild.. that would punish the small guilds and chalk another point up to the larger guilds. I understand there are lots of 1 member guilds.. maybe you can do a tiered ratio for price on GVG.. rather than rating going by price.. how about number of people in the guild. 1 member guilds will pay more to do conflicts (making them want to recruit more players to lower costs) while larger guilds pay less. Sure I know this at first seems backwards, but think about it.. bigger guilds want to GVG.. remove the max number of participants.. they have more members to retaliate against.. giving them more risk in the GVG when retaliation comes around.

Also, there should be some type of reward for attacking back/defending your guild. When another guild lands 50/50 attacks, there is no reason to fight back right now unless you are going for GVG Rating or win/loss ratio. If you were to say add a 5 RP reward if you tie for that, then it would at least give some people a reason to retaliate back. One last point before I finish (starting to run out of breath).. and I'm not too sure if there is somethign in place for this already, but why not add the idea of a 7 day time period before initiating GVG against a guild you've already fought.. it would cut down on RP trading (it will probably never be completely cut out).
*end rant*

#202 fs_mathcam

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:15

have you ever found yourself on the BB for a random attack that was deflected? if not... its infuriating >.<... the other person didnt lose anything, and yet they felt the need to cost me some xp lol... and once i was deleveled over a deflected hit :(


Yeah, and how come they put people in jail for attempted murder? It's not like anyone died. Infuriating.

#203 fs_tangtop

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:17

Putting the cat amongst the birds ...

How about a pvp rating reset when the new system is implemented. Everyone gets reset to 1500 and has to start again. After all, the rules are changing.

#204 misterpoo

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:18

If you are going to update the GvG system, can we get rid of the damage to items worn during Gvg? The rest of the experience is virtual, so why not that part? Gear is not damaged in the arena, so this also shows it as a possibility.

#205 SandisMan

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:18

if you dont trade then respect to you on that. i just dont see the point in not hitting back if they start it. besides it is a freebee for you as you didnt have to pay for it. especially if they dont get 50/50 and you are able to fight them back and get some wins.


I have a couple issue with this. First off, I do trade for rp. I do it for profit to better my guild. We do not have a bunch of gold or fsp. And this is a way for us to upgrade the guild, I see no problem with it at all. We do not attack back for several reasons. First is the cost to initiate. The lower the better, and the more profit for the guild. second, it is a waste of valuable stamina in my opinon. I have players that do 1 gvg a day. they do not have stamina upgraded, and this is a way for them to earn fsp to upgrade their character. Third, we do not have high level players in the guild to buff with level 175 buffs to attack or defend. So if we have to buy the buffs, it is not only costing the 500 stamina, but 2-3 fsp for buffs. Why spend that 2-3 fsp and stamina by fighting back? We take the loss, lower the rating, and initiate with guilds that have better targets, and it is cheaper.


I for one do not look at this as exploiting the rules. I consider it playing the hand we are dealt. Being small and poor, we are making the most of the situation. What is the harm in that? Everyone is saying how bigger guilds have advantages with titans, because the amount of players and their levels is greater. Then that should be an exploit of the rules as well. There is no way to make everything in this game fair for everyone. We are just doing what we think needs to be done to further our characters and guilds. No harm there.

#206 deadjoe

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:20

If you are going to update the GvG system, can we get rid of the damage to items worn during Gvg? The rest of the experience is virtual, so why not that part? Gear is not damaged in the arena, so this also shows it as a possibility.




i like that idea.

#207 evilbry

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:20

Putting the cat amongst the birds ...

How about a pvp rating reset when the new system is implemented. Everyone gets reset to 1500 and has to start again. After all, the rules are changing.

Still going to encourage trading. Any experienced person in pvp knows who the people who deserve to be up there are. I sould hazard a guess at say 10-15% (maybe a little higher) of the top 100 deserve to be up there, and most of the others will trade their way back up pretty quickly.

#208 evilbry

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:21

If you are going to update the GvG system, can we get rid of the damage to items worn during Gvg? The rest of the experience is virtual, so why not that part? Gear is not damaged in the arena, so this also shows it as a possibility.

Damaged gear is one if the key factors in successful defending. I say no.

#209 shdowdrgn

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:21

have you ever found yourself on the BB for a random attack that was deflected? if not... its infuriating >.<... the other person didnt lose anything, and yet they felt the need to cost me some xp lol... and once i was deleveled over a deflected hit :(


Yeah, and how come they put people in jail for attempted murder? It's not like anyone died. Infuriating.



LMAO!!!!

#210 shdowdrgn

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:22

If you are going to update the GvG system, can we get rid of the damage to items worn during Gvg? The rest of the experience is virtual, so why not that part? Gear is not damaged in the arena, so this also shows it as a possibility.

Damaged gear is one if the key factors in successful defending. I say no.



+1 so many reasons not to take away damage to gear

#211 Dulcharn

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:23

I disagree with the 7 days period before the next PvP attack on the same player. Give it 1 day or so, not 7. That's just being silly.

#212 Mordedura

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:26

If you are going to update the GvG system, can we get rid of the damage to items worn during Gvg? The rest of the experience is virtual, so why not that part? Gear is not damaged in the arena, so this also shows it as a possibility.

Damaged gear is one if the key factors in successful defending. I say no.


+1

Further, using a GvG to target crystalline items can be an effective response tactic when an all-out war is uncalled for. It would be a mistake to implement a "no GvG gear damage" rule.

#213 fs_adda1978

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:27

Fact is HCS deems what the rules are, and no one else. If HCS, with or without player approval says they want to change something, they have every right to. If you do not like it, then play another aspect of the game. You do not have to play that aspect of the game. Some will just retire (in some cases for the 723rd time) and some will adapt. Thats what makes great players. Being able to adapt and still be successful. If being a great player means you take the easiest route to success, live to take advantage of every corner cut you can, and throw every last cent you have from your job or unemployment towards a game...then I hope you sleep well at night knowing you are a "great player" This is a game, and it is designed to be fun. HCS is just trying to make everyone happy within a game. Some things may not be to your liking, but you don't always get what you want. PvP prestige should be added to the BB as that is where there are a lot of really impressive things that happen from people who really know and learn the art of PvP. GvG should have some slight adjustments as to how it is ran. But they have said thats in the works. And buffs should be held by people at that level. If you choose to go to level 200, you should be bound by what a level 200 player is bound by. You made the choice, now live with it. You made the choice to throw away all the money you used to level to the high level, and then leave it all behind. Good job HCS for making an attempt to make the game better.

#214 fs_ordermaker

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:30

I won't comment on the PvP, since I only did it to be able to complete earlier quests.
I do agree with a few points though:
1) reset the level so everyone has an equal chance, and
2) make the loss of PvP not only possible, but also level-based. The higher the level, the higher the
potential loss of PvP, xp and gold.

Since I live in the Netherlands and a lot of my fellow guildmembers live outside of the USA, getting free fsp is a problem on it's own. The trade-offs of the GvG conflicts presents us with a possibility to gain the new Epic items, since those prices are way too high for us to buy them.
If you guys (and gals) remember a time not so long ago that the only ones who were doing titan hunts, were the Frackers. Ever since the Cows changed the payout for the Titans, a lot more guilds are hunting the Titans and prices have dropped.
In lieu of that, wouldn't it be a solution (possible) to reward the GvG conflicts based on the result?
Not participating means not getting any points, whereas attacking back, regardless of win or loss, would be rewarded with some amoint of points. That way you would have far less deals being made (not really needed anymore), allow everybody in the guild to attack everybody (or, if this is too drastically, make it a +/-50 level), and lower the prices of the new Epic items at the same time, since they would become more easily available.
Just an opinion, maybe you could use it as a fresh view.

Besides, let's be honest about the following:
No matter how many changes you make, there will still be players smart enough to outwit the changes as soon as they are implemented. Sadly, but a plain fact.

#215 evilbry

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:31

Fact is HCS deems what the rules are, and no one else. If HCS, with or without player approval says they want to change something, they have every right to. If you do not like it, then play another aspect of the game. You do not have to play that aspect of the game. Some will just retire (in some cases for the 723rd time) and some will adapt. Thats what makes great players. Being able to adapt and still be successful. If being a great player means you take the easiest route to success, live to take advantage of every corner cut you can, and throw every last cent you have from your job or unemployment towards a game...then I hope you sleep well at night knowing you are a "great player" This is a game, and it is designed to be fun. HCS is just trying to make everyone happy within a game. Some things may not be to your liking, but you don't always get what you want. PvP prestige should be added to the BB as that is where there are a lot of really impressive things that happen from people who really know and learn the art of PvP. GvG should have some slight adjustments as to how it is ran. But they have said thats in the works. And buffs should be held by people at that level. If you choose to go to level 200, you should be bound by what a level 200 player is bound by. You made the choice, now live with it. You made the choice to throw away all the money you used to level to the high level, and then leave it all behind. Good job HCS for making an attempt to make the game better.

I love this post. +1 does not do it justice.

#216 fs_jperk31260

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:32

Ok read all 15 pages of post Holy Hunted Cow Batman...

I think Prestige should be linked to Bounty Kills or Arena.
I would really rather it be tied to stam use... some formula like (Stam use /500) = %bonus.
then active people get weather they are leveling or PVPing or just handing out buffs.
people with only 500 the basic can still get it by logging in more... people that have stam up grades can get more because they paid FSP for it.

I like the 7 day rule... but it might be a little bit much nice place to start though.
I wish you would tie XP loss to that too. (Yeah I'm a leveler not a PVP Person)
I don't mind losing the gold as much as I mind losing the XP.
Right now I am getting 8 100 stam hits a day from people in a rival guild. Really hard to level with that going on.

GVG any way to link it to Guild size? or Guild rating? probably not practical

Don't like the bonus idea... maybe you could keep track of PVP on weekly basis and reset each week that way at the end of the week you could give out PVP bonus if you really wanted to give bonus to those working that aspect of game and are active at it. Then those that have earned the high PVP rating don't lose anything and those that are working at it get a reward.

Like the idea of PVP losing something for a failed attack.

#217 DaleJunior

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:32

If you are going to update the GvG system, can we get rid of the damage to items worn during Gvg? The rest of the experience is virtual, so why not that part? Gear is not damaged in the arena, so this also shows it as a possibility.

Damaged gear is one if the key factors in successful defending. I say no.



+1 so many reasons not to take away damage to gear


EDITED! WHOOPS! I MISREAD YOUR COMMENT! Sorry! :lol:

#218 watagashi

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:32

Well whatever changes to GvG please make them very clear. The whole thing where you can hit an active player and unlock all guild members took some of us a while to realise.

And please give us an option to give permission to enter! Too many idiots jump in and screw them up already!

Since so many have given their 2 cents ill give mine. I've heard a lot of crying about us giving out wins so we can start once again on the ladder and see how long it takes to rise again. Im told a "real" GvG guild stays on top of the ladder as long as they can. I say a real gvg guild takes up the challenge to rise and fall again. Professional sports have a season,,Like football with the super bowl theres a final game where the champion is declared and next season everyone starts again with equal footing (not a bad idea there! How about a reset of the ladder every month?)

Long and short it seems like again fixing things that arent broken, people still spend FSP and gold to initiate and burn the stam getting a win,,becasue a small minority crys about their monopoly being broken up shouldnt mean you are forced to make a change to something that frankly has brought new life to a game I was rapidly getting bored with.

And should I point out that losing to get to the bottom gave me an excellent chance to teach new and old players the ways of gvg? This has given a new intrest in this to many more people as well.

Those who sit in the shadow of their lvl700s and multi around to keep their guild buffed to the hilt for 24hrs have nothing to say about "cheating'.

There are pleanty of restrictions to gvg already,,have to have someone on in last 48 hours,,have to have one active target to hit before you can hit inactives and the cost of rating gap are enough to justify moving up and down the ladder,,,,besides when TGD was in top 25 we were SO bored fighting the same 10 guilds every week!

So fix what isnt broken,,,someone spent $500 on the FSP that eventually was paid to us for 50000 stam spent hitting both free wins (yea they are SO boring) and taking wins alike, that FSP then went into the bank and points into the guild to do more GvGs. i spend about 10FSP each time I give wins. If I could pay to reset our rating I would do that instead.

I guess my final point would be unless you intend to hire 100s more moderators and admin someone is always going to find a way to swap wins. Making it pay no RP if the other side doesnt fight back (the only way I can see you can stop hit swaps) will only make people go into agreements to hit back nekkid or something. And of course theres potential for abuse too,,,if I know the attacker wont get RP if I dont fight back I just wont if they arent in a hitswap deal with us :P

So As i see it putting more restrictions on GvG will only break the system even more.

Some suggestions I DO have to improve it

expand the ladder!! there are a TON of guilds in 1k-1100 rating range but very few under 1k if it was up to me all guilds would start with 0 rating losses would not take it into negative but wins would raise it up,,,having a bigger spread of rating would make a difference

Get rid of all the dead guilds! When we hit 500 rating I spent a day looking at a-z list,,is it just me or are half the guilds out there dead? I understand people paid for the guild and may one day come back but there are lots of guilds full of termed players that could have been removed,,how about if a guild isnt active for say 6 months its deleted?

How about a RP reward equal to the stam spent? expand gvgs to go higher than 100 hits and pay 5 for 50s, 10 for 100s and such? you arent going to fix hitswaps but at least you get more stam sink

Make other ways to get RP. (and where is the bonus for guilds on top GvG???) im sure a creative new way to obtain RP can be found to give us more ways to burn our stam.

#219 MaximusGR

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:33

Putting the cat amongst the birds ...

How about a pvp rating reset when the new system is implemented. Everyone gets reset to 1500 and has to start again. After all, the rules are changing.

Still going to encourage trading. Any experienced person in pvp knows who the people who deserve to be up there are. I sould hazard a guess at say 10-15% (maybe a little higher) of the top 100 deserve to be up there, and most of the others will trade their way back up pretty quickly.


Quoting both for time's sake.

Awarding skilled PvPers is a very challenging feature to introduce because of their type of activity. PvP rating can fluctuate a lot when bounty hunting or hitting people for gold, therefore it cannot always reflect someone's efforts in that area of the game..

The solution that will be implemented has to take that into account, rather than being a top list that people will try to avoid PvP to remain in. How about a reverse list?? top 100 having a daily reduction of PvP by a number therefore forcing them to actively PvP to stay on top?

#220 Roan

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 21:35

The solution that will be implemented has to take that into account, rather than being a top list that people will try to avoid PvP to remain in. How about a reverse list?? top 100 having a daily reduction of PvP by a number therefore forcing them to actively PvP to stay on top?

Very very interesting! I like that!

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