Alternative Allegiance Potions
#401
Posted 14 March 2010 - 12:26
Wait.. Pink one?? :shock:
#402
Posted 14 March 2010 - 12:33
And yeh.....pink one....you know why
#403
Posted 14 March 2010 - 12:36
#404
Posted 14 March 2010 - 13:05
Damn it...fixed again..i new i forgot something.....
And yeh.....pink one....you know why
...
No comment
#405
fs_ananasii
Posted 14 March 2010 - 13:11
#406
Posted 15 March 2010 - 19:35
The basic idea would be for a transformational potion that would be bound - whether it confers bound status upon the item would be left to HCS discretion.
I envision it working similarly to crafting or forging with a separate action that can be accessed if the appropriate potion is in your BP. Once accessed, any item in your BP could be transformed (much as any such item could be crafted or forged).
Using the potion on a given item would imprint the total points available on that item but allow players to place that number of points in any of the 5 attributes on a 0-100% basis.
The item would show as transformed which would preclude it from ever being transformed again.
Forged items and perfect items would have more points available (obviously) than non-forged or less than perfect items - whatever points exist would be transformed.
Once transformed, the item could be forged again but crafting should be set as was when transformed - i.e make it perfect first if you want that. The ability to reforge would be quite expensive but it would offer the ability to make forging mean more than it currently does for high level items. This ability to re-forge isn't vital to the idea though; I just like it
A few examples of how the mechanics would work:
My excellent twice forged Ice maiden blade has 220 armor and 1540 damage for a total of 1760. 1760 points go into a pool and I can choose to make it 1760 damage with no other stat or I can split the points evenly between attack and damage at 880 each. Or I could make it 90% damage and 10% attack for totals of 176 attack and 1584 damage. Or any other option between 0 and 100% for the five attributes (HP, Armor, Damage, Defense, and Attack).
Whichever I chose, the blade remains Excellent, retains its enhancements, remains part of a set and becomes unforged while getting "Transformed" added to its title instead of (or in addition to) "Unique."
This would also allow me to take a fully forged perfect Master of Magic Spear which has 990 damage, transform it to where it still only provides damage and then re-forge it to a total of 1080 damage. It would become transformed so it couldn't be done again.
I am ambivalent over whether such a potion should result in the transformed item being also bound. Binding it would seem to limit it to people who have donated/participated and leaving it not bound would allow people to turn a profit. There are pros and cons to either choice, which is why I leave it to HCS.
However I will say that transformed items ought not be allowed in the arena - the cost of having the right items there is already extensive; adding more cost to the process doesn't seem right to me even though I'm not a participant
#407
fs_kirst
Posted 15 March 2010 - 21:04
Earlier in this thread I made a casual mention of an idea for a transformational potion. Since I've given it at least a little thought since then I figured I'd put it out there.
The basic idea would be for a transformational potion that would be bound - whether it confers bound status upon the item would be left to HCS discretion.
I envision it working similarly to crafting or forging with a separate action that can be accessed if the appropriate potion is in your BP. Once accessed, any item in your BP could be transformed (much as any such item could be crafted or forged).
Using the potion on a given item would imprint the total points available on that item but allow players to place that number of points in any of the 5 attributes on a 0-100% basis.
The item would show as transformed which would preclude it from ever being transformed again.
Forged items and perfect items would have more points available (obviously) than non-forged or less than perfect items - whatever points exist would be transformed.
Once transformed, the item could be forged again but crafting should be set as was when transformed - i.e make it perfect first if you want that. The ability to reforge would be quite expensive but it would offer the ability to make forging mean more than it currently does for high level items. This ability to re-forge isn't vital to the idea though; I just like itSo HCS could easily leave a FF item FF after transformation.
A few examples of how the mechanics would work:
My excellent twice forged Ice maiden blade has 220 armor and 1540 damage for a total of 1760. 1760 points go into a pool and I can choose to make it 1760 damage with no other stat or I can split the points evenly between attack and damage at 880 each. Or I could make it 90% damage and 10% attack for totals of 176 attack and 1584 damage. Or any other option between 0 and 100% for the five attributes (HP, Armor, Damage, Defense, and Attack).
Whichever I chose, the blade remains Excellent, retains its enhancements, remains part of a set and becomes unforged while getting "Transformed" added to its title instead of (or in addition to) "Unique."
This would also allow me to take a fully forged perfect Master of Magic Spear which has 990 damage, transform it to where it still only provides damage and then re-forge it to a total of 1080 damage. It would become transformed so it couldn't be done again.
I am ambivalent over whether such a potion should result in the transformed item being also bound. Binding it would seem to limit it to people who have donated/participated and leaving it not bound would allow people to turn a profit. There are pros and cons to either choice, which is why I leave it to HCS.
However I will say that transformed items ought not be allowed in the arena - the cost of having the right items there is already extensive; adding more cost to the process doesn't seem right to me even though I'm not a participant
I would be against this idea because it simply makes the variety of items/stats useless if you could just throw a potion like that on an item and make it whatever stats you want. If this is implemented, there would be no need to have different items of the same level because people would just make it the same stats for levelling, gvg or pvp.
#408
Posted 15 March 2010 - 21:33
Earlier in this thread I made a casual mention of an idea for a transformational potion. Since I've given it at least a little thought since then I figured I'd put it out there.
The basic idea would be for a transformational potion that would be bound - whether it confers bound status upon the item would be left to HCS discretion.
I envision it working similarly to crafting or forging with a separate action that can be accessed if the appropriate potion is in your BP. Once accessed, any item in your BP could be transformed (much as any such item could be crafted or forged).
Using the potion on a given item would imprint the total points available on that item but allow players to place that number of points in any of the 5 attributes on a 0-100% basis.
The item would show as transformed which would preclude it from ever being transformed again.
Forged items and perfect items would have more points available (obviously) than non-forged or less than perfect items - whatever points exist would be transformed.
Once transformed, the item could be forged again but crafting should be set as was when transformed - i.e make it perfect first if you want that. The ability to reforge would be quite expensive but it would offer the ability to make forging mean more than it currently does for high level items. This ability to re-forge isn't vital to the idea though; I just like itSo HCS could easily leave a FF item FF after transformation.
A few examples of how the mechanics would work:
My excellent twice forged Ice maiden blade has 220 armor and 1540 damage for a total of 1760. 1760 points go into a pool and I can choose to make it 1760 damage with no other stat or I can split the points evenly between attack and damage at 880 each. Or I could make it 90% damage and 10% attack for totals of 176 attack and 1584 damage. Or any other option between 0 and 100% for the five attributes (HP, Armor, Damage, Defense, and Attack).
Whichever I chose, the blade remains Excellent, retains its enhancements, remains part of a set and becomes unforged while getting "Transformed" added to its title instead of (or in addition to) "Unique."
This would also allow me to take a fully forged perfect Master of Magic Spear which has 990 damage, transform it to where it still only provides damage and then re-forge it to a total of 1080 damage. It would become transformed so it couldn't be done again.
I am ambivalent over whether such a potion should result in the transformed item being also bound. Binding it would seem to limit it to people who have donated/participated and leaving it not bound would allow people to turn a profit. There are pros and cons to either choice, which is why I leave it to HCS.
However I will say that transformed items ought not be allowed in the arena - the cost of having the right items there is already extensive; adding more cost to the process doesn't seem right to me even though I'm not a participant
I would be against this idea because it simply makes the variety of items/stats useless if you could just throw a potion like that on an item and make it whatever stats you want. If this is implemented, there would be no need to have different items of the same level because people would just make it the same stats for levelling, gvg or pvp.
you have a point about variety but much of the variety now available is already useless for any action, be it gvg, pvp, leveling or whatever. And I specifically noted that a transformed item could not be transformed a second time, so if people wanted a specific item to be structured in different ways, they'd have to own more than one of that item.
I note that the potion would not be readily available and should cost quite a bit in the way of AT as well - something I didnt say earlier
#409
fs_coyotik
Posted 16 March 2010 - 01:00
Even the meanest creep near me needs only 30k dmg to 1hit. Common equip level 850 = 1700 stat points per item. 9*1700 = 15300. Throw in extra 0.2 (EA) + 1.5 (EW1500) + 1.7(base dmg + Be350) - all this * 1700. A nice total of 21k dmg from totally crap items originally.
21k * DD bonus * 1 empowered relic and you're at 28k dmg. If you add acheron set to the picture, even without transformation it already has about 1700 dmg per item and provides enough attack to breach 6k def. Throw in some forging and crafting - and heyho, 30k dmg in a breeze.
#410
Posted 16 March 2010 - 02:04
#411
Posted 16 March 2010 - 05:53
I'd still prefer to have AT usable for epics in some fashion because I like the idea of a variety of ways to get the same desired items. But a potion that lets you play around with items could be nearly as good.
Oh and if I am underestimating the power of this, the idea certainly can be adjusted accordingly by HCS - after all by posting it here I did give it to them
#412
fs_coyotik
Posted 16 March 2010 - 08:39
You are assuming that all of the 1700 stats are allocated to damage? And not everyone has relics :?
Well, I did assume that based on my current position. Our guild has an acheron, so I would definitely get 7*1700 dmg to go with it. And it doesn't really matter that not everyone has relics. What matters is the principle - that this idea would almost completely obliterate any challenges for levelling for people with lots of AT points (or let alone guilds, if these items wouldn't be bound).
The best damage items at my level have a total of about 3900 points outside damage and attack, 2800 points if I replace two of them with Acheron (and especially in the latter case, I don't need any more attack in most places than what Acheron alone gives me. So, as much as I would "like" to have extra 2800 dmg, I have to say no, because this is simply too overpowered.
In my opinion, even for good business reasons, gear should be slowly improving so that guild would tag and forge a lot of items (plus get storage space for them). New items shouldn't be a product of random generator with given constraints. They should be thought out and designed with some reasonable formula behind them...
Every best damage item should be obsolete in some 20 to 50 levels or so (20 for common, 30 for elite, 40 for legendary and 50 for epic). It's IMHO a show of bad design that there are items that are used for 150 levels... that means that out of the 50-150 common items in that slot, maybe a dozen are EVER used.
#413
fs_coyotik
Posted 16 March 2010 - 08:50
I'd still prefer to have AT usable for epics in some fashion because I like the idea of a variety of ways to get the same desired items. But a potion that lets you play around with items could be nearly as good.
Maybe making potions that would make the items bound and somewhat improved... maybe potions that would add new, possibly otherwise unobtainable enhancements - but nothing that would seriously change the player-vs-creep balance (and especially not something that would give you advantage in Arena).
I would like allegiance tokens to offer many "small" things, features of gratitude that would be pleasant but not seriously gamebreaking. dbl1200 is a nice one, LF 1250 possibly too. A few safety buffs, stronger brewmaster, invincible shield IMP (that will restore HP after each combat, so in combat it still only last 6 HP, but you don't have to worry about recasting it), stuff like that.
#414
Posted 16 March 2010 - 11:45
You are assuming that all of the 1700 stats are allocated to damage? And not everyone has relics :?
Well, I did assume that based on my current position.
The highest damage on a single item is 1490 according to the official guide. Even at your current position you aren't getting 1700 damage. ~250 damage times 10.7*1.2 for EW1.5k, EA200 and DD means an overestimation of 3.2k, with relics 3.7k damage. Which is not negligible.
However I agree that epic AT items are simply unneeded. What has happened that everyone expects to just get access to a bunch of epics at relatively no costs? The potions that AT give access to are a huge boost to daily activities already, be happy with that.
#415
fs_coyotik
Posted 16 March 2010 - 11:53
The highest damage on a single item is 1490 according to the official guide. Even at your current position you aren't getting 1700 damage.
Of course I am not. I WOULD be with the transformation potions. I was using those numbers to show how horribly overpowered would THAT be
#416
fs_demoknight
Posted 17 March 2010 - 14:30
#417
Posted 17 March 2010 - 15:01
Meanwhile, I also support the idea of Allegiance tokens going towards gear instead of pots. Your being rewarded for loyalty it seems that something more than a 1x use is a better reward. Spending money to earn more tokens is good, but who's it benefiting in the long run with a 1x use pot?
Maybe the Allegiance tokens could be sold on the Marketplace? Not sure if this has come up already, but this would help those who haven't donated/played as long as some to aquire more tokens quicker.
I like that the game is free, I do support it with my real cash from time to time hince the 45K tokens I have aquired. But something else to dump gold in surely cain't hurt, right?
Removing the ability to Bounty a PvP Ladder attack is something I've been thinking about. If enough people want it, I don't see why not. It might be a relatively easy tweak, unlike the rest of the suggestions.
#418
Posted 17 March 2010 - 18:32
I'd still prefer to have AT usable for epics in some fashion because I like the idea of a variety of ways to get the same desired items. But a potion that lets you play around with items could be nearly as good.
Maybe making potions that would make the items bound and somewhat improved... maybe potions that would add new, possibly otherwise unobtainable enhancements - but nothing that would seriously change the player-vs-creep balance (and especially not something that would give you advantage in Arena).
I would like allegiance tokens to offer many "small" things, features of gratitude that would be pleasant but not seriously gamebreaking. dbl1200 is a nice one, LF 1250 possibly too. A few safety buffs, stronger brewmaster, invincible shield IMP (that will restore HP after each combat, so in combat it still only last 6 HP, but you don't have to worry about recasting it), stuff like that.
All of which you suggest here is OK by me, just not at the top of my list
I'd still prefer having epics attainable from AT, for example.
I also do not have any problem with changing how the transformation potion works. It doesn't have to allow total control to the player to change a 3 stat item into a 1 stat item. Maybe require that at least n% be placed in each stat the item initially had.
Frankly I don't think the idea I proposed would be as powerful as allowing guilds to have multiple relics with each having 10% damage - it would just be a way that anyone could play around with cool stuff and experiment along the way.
#419
fs_gravely
Posted 17 March 2010 - 19:00
We've had conflicts now with a guild in the top listings on the GvG ladder twice in the last week. Normally we have no problems with any conflict, but one of the main things bothering me in this instance is the fact that this guild goes offline entirely in suicide suits.
Basically, at the 350 level range, the 415-425 level range, and several other ranges, it's possible to build a 3 set suicide suit that CANNOT be successfully cleared 50 times, assuming four basic buffs: KE, shatter, dark curse, and last ditch.
Right now it's possible for initiating guilds to start a conflict against a guild with few or no members online, get their hits in versus unbuffed or weak targets, then swap to suicide suits, get deflected and then buff whenever they see hits start to come in, ESPECIALLY if they're a smaller guild.
Con400, Terrorize 250, Sanctuary300 or several of the other proposed potions would go a LONG way towards addressing this.
#420
fs_ithangor
Posted 18 March 2010 - 00:32
Just want to bring this back a little bit to the original suggestion.
We've had conflicts now with a guild in the top listings on the GvG ladder twice in the last week. Normally we have no problems with any conflict, but one of the main things bothering me in this instance is the fact that this guild goes offline entirely in suicide suits.
Basically, at the 350 level range, the 415-425 level range, and several other ranges, it's possible to build a 3 set suicide suit that CANNOT be successfully cleared 50 times, assuming four basic buffs: KE, shatter, dark curse, and last ditch.
Right now it's possible for initiating guilds to start a conflict against a guild with few or no members online, get their hits in versus unbuffed or weak targets, then swap to suicide suits, get deflected and then buff whenever they see hits start to come in, ESPECIALLY if they're a smaller guild.
Con400, Terrorize 250, Sanctuary300 or several of the other proposed potions would go a LONG way towards addressing this.
Isn't this called tactics?
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