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Victimize the Levelers: thieves and bullies rule!


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#821 Spitfire666123

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 16:17

don't know what i did to tinkle off wk but there was no need to take 5 levels from me ?


i would put my 2 FSP on the possibility that it's to see if you're really into PvP like you claim to


i tried a bounty and the player that put 1 on me told me to quit it


that makes no sense, lol

#822 Spitfire666123

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 16:29

i took a bounty and the player told me to stop trying to clear it then he put a bounty on me


Rule # 742: Never Quit a bounty when the player you are hitting tells you to.

Didnt you read the manual when you started? :o

#823 Maehdros

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 16:44

How the heck did this thread get to be 60 pages? :shock: Oh i forgot..some players like to chat on the forums instead of Pm's :wink: hehehe.... Hoping the cows pluck some good ideas out of this long winded thread... unless they already have their plans for the Ladder and PvP already decided ;) ( which is what i think)

#824 sweetlou

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 16:53

How the heck did this thread get to be 60 pages? :shock:

It's a common venue to vent, where like minded individuals can voice displeasure. Then again this was the original intention of this thread.

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#825 fs_coyotik

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 17:34

all I'm asking for is evening the odds a little, fixing some of the past design mistakes/oversights - PLUS an option to make real (not arranged) PvP attractive even to levellers.


The risk to lose levels is not a design mistake, while other games offer 2 areas - one less rewarding without pvp, and other more rewarding with higher risk to lose hard earned, Fallensword offers just one area with higher rewards and higher risk to lose. What would make PvP attractive to levelers is changing the reward system - remove skill points from all players and make them available from pvp activities only ;)


I never claimed that the risk to lose levels is a design mistake. There's VL implementation (an attempt to protect a few against a rarely-significant disadvantage by opening everybody to harassment), lots of buffs (starting with DC and KE) giving further stat advantage to attacker that is already as strong as the defender, possibility to hit repeatedly and be bountied only once, generally faster/easier levelling making XP loss for the bountied attacker a smaller punishment than before. These are all things that help the attacker much more than in the days when I did my (albeit small) share of bounty hunting.

#826 Spitfire666123

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 17:41

all I'm asking for is evening the odds a little, fixing some of the past design mistakes/oversights - PLUS an option to make real (not arranged) PvP attractive even to levellers.


The risk to lose levels is not a design mistake, while other games offer 2 areas - one less rewarding without pvp, and other more rewarding with higher risk to lose hard earned, Fallensword offers just one area with higher rewards and higher risk to lose. What would make PvP attractive to levelers is changing the reward system - remove skill points from all players and make them available from pvp activities only ;)


I never claimed that the risk to lose levels is a design mistake. There's VL implementation (an attempt to protect a few against a rarely-significant disadvantage by opening everybody to harassment), lots of buffs (starting with DC and KE) giving further stat advantage to attacker that is already as strong as the defender, possibility to hit repeatedly and be bountied only once, generally faster/easier levelling making XP loss for the bountied attacker a smaller punishment than before. These are all things that help the attacker much more than in the days when I did my (albeit small) share of bounty hunting.


wouldnt 'easier levelling' make the damage a PvPer does to a leveller even more insignifiant than before as well?

#827 fs_coyotik

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 17:55

wouldnt 'easier levelling' make the damage a PvPer does to a leveller even more insignifiant than before as well?


To some extent, yes - but levelling is mainly about competition with your monthly top and overall top - and any setback hurts, because those you compete with have the levelling easier, too.

#828 Bleltch

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:04

lots of buffs (starting with DC and KE) giving further stat advantage to attacker that is already as strong as the defender

And when you turn around and attack them back you would have the advantage. Now tell me again how the system isn't fair? Just because you choose not to hit back makes the system unfair? The tools are there for you to use just like everyone else. If you choose not to is your problem.

#829 Windbattle

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:06

i can't believe this went past 10 pages, we are at 61 pages and still going.

#830 DomCorvis

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:08

WOW JUST WOW....I have been following this thread since day 1 and its been like 10% suggestions 80% whining and 10% name calling/slander.

Yes some guilds band together for PvP and others leveling,etc. Its a GAME we all take it very seriously I get this. And if a certain guild took 5 for quitting a bounty it will give you an idea NOT TO QUIT. They've told me I could quit and about 95% of the time I'llk keep hitting till the bounties cleared EVEN IF I AM LOSING.

MOST PvP players take pride in what they do.

As for making leveling easier....ISNT THAT EASY ENOUGH?? REALLY?? doubler 1200 and lvl200+ potions not good enough??? xp gain not good enough?? rewards to get fsp to buy more stam not easy enough?? come on you of all people should know how easy it is to level...

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#831 Bleltch

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:08

i can't believe this went past 10 pages, we are at 61 pages and still going.

Anti-pvp threads usually get a lot of action til they get locked.

#832 fs_regnier7

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:10

blahhh.... both sides have gotten back to their little trenches and started the mindless fighting again. Watering down the valid discussions that did go on here.


ahhhh the usual. lol

another way of going about it..

VL would limit your target range..but your AL could limit the damage you can do

your AL/VL is 100...target range is 95-105..pvp rating exchange, xp/gold loss occur to all..

your AL is 99 and VL is 100- target range is still the same but if you attack someone at level 105, you only take pvp rating..they would have to level up once to be able to take xp/gold from a level 105

Edit:
Gold loss would still be included since the PvPer is still risking 5 and to keep up that vital part of PvP as a market control.



#833 Windbattle

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:11

True, but neither one of you are going to change your mind on the topic. People who like PvP will always like PvP. People who would rather not be bothered with it are always not going to hate PvP. So I fail to see how this thread does anything. Except perhaps to vent.

#834 avvakum

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:12

lots of buffs (starting with DC and KE) giving further stat advantage to attacker that is already as strong as the defender, possibility to hit repeatedly and be bountied only once, ... These are all things that help the attacker much more than in the days when I did my (albeit small) share of bounty hunting.


Yes, the attacker has the advantage because he is taking a higher risk (=> to lose 5 lvls), what's so surprising about that? Want the same advantage? Initiate the attack first!

Hitting repeatedly? Well, the game developers want your activity, your clicks, your worries about account... the profit is one thing, but value of the project on the market is not bad too.. I suggested "active buffs for stamina gain" 2 years ago and the answer was that it was too close to automation and so you should login more often instead. Login every hour and bounty your attackers, or let it go, it's just the game.

#835 DomCorvis

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:16

IF YOU DONT LIKE PVP THEN GO PLAY MONKEYBALL

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#836 Maehdros

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Posted 26 July 2010 - 18:18

Yes, the attacker has the advantage because he is taking a higher risk (=> to lose 5 lvls), what's so surprising about that? Want the same advantage? Initiate the attack first!



Oh so true ;) well said

#837 fs_mystraven

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 03:42

Yeah, just ignore the blatantly obvious reasoning behind the lack of opposition.. :roll:

What you people seem to constantly overlook is, some people simply do NOT want to partake in the pvp aspect of the game, they see it as an irritation, nothing more.. :?

There are plenty of other things to do that aren't 'basic'.

Some people enjoy hunting or hunting titans. Some people like stalking out SE's. Some people see the game as a business and potion craft and merchant out their goods. Some play the arena while others come on mainly to chat and have a laugh in guild chat. None of these aspects of the game come with consequences like pvp does, maybe 'this' is why it generates the repulsion etc that it does.

Couple that with the blind ignorance of anyone else's perspective and in-game threats when it comes to debating it and you are stuck with something many don't like but are afraid to speak-up about.

If pvp was truly about fun and not sadism pvp'ers wouldn't complain so much whenever anyone mentions removing exp-loss from the equation. Gold-loss and loss of rank should be more than enough, exp loss makes no sense to me anyways, never has. How can losing a battle make you dumber? :S You 'learn' from your mistakes, no?

I know why exp-loss is always argued for in these 'pvp discussions', it's because like the OP said, many MANY pvp players get their sadistic kicks in this game by intentionally ruining someone else's FS day. Exp loss could be restricted simply to the bounty board for high-stam hits.

THIS would encourage far more players to 'want' to play in the pvp aspect of the game, but it would take away the sadistic 'thrills' many of the people who have posted in this very thread enjoy so they will argue against it.


Succint, well-reasoned, well presented - I salute you!
What most of the proponents of the current PvP "system" constantly (and perhaps deliberately?) overlook is the fact that many of us who criticise this so-called "system" are not opposed to the notion of PvP per se - I can't speak for others, but I can say that for me the problem is that currently this "PvP" is non-equitable - it is totally lop-sided, and consequently a thug/bully-fest. It totally fails to appeal to me because my idea of a challenge is not walking around looking for and attacking sleeping victims - where's the sense of accomplishment there? That's not "PvP", it's Thug-vs-HelplessVictim.

Yes, Shardoom, you've hit the nail on the head: it's the forceful and largely unavoidable imposition of one camp's preferences on the rest of the game's population that is distasteful, the fact that the majority of playstyles are subjugated by one dominant one, and not even one that is particularly interesting (in its current implementation, at least - it could be so much more!) In fact, it's not even all "PvPers" that are to blame, I reckon: it's a minority within the minority, those individuals who delight in causing grief, who in this manner reassure themselves that they matter. I think there are players who truly seek an honorable PvP challenge - too bad the rotten apples give them a bad name....

#838 fs_mystraven

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 04:00

revamping the pvp ladder and having 10 stam attacks only affect pvp rating and gold.. What are you afraid of? :?

Where is the fun... XP loss from hits is fun to see.
PvP really wouldn't be the same :(


That's sadist-talk, plain and simple. Where the hell is this "fun" you speak of? You're talking about laughing at someone's misfortune (presumably after having had a hand in causing it!) Another player's XP loss gains you nothing, so it's a purely destructive and malicious act, it is not even motivated by greed. Hit someone for their gold (and gain some rep of some sort - rating, prestige, whatever), that's fine by me, it has a RATIONAL motive and advances you in some way within the game. But hit someone just to ruin their day and set them back? That is just demented and sociopathic (unless that other person provoked it and deserves it, I'll grant.) Especially if the other person wanted nothing to do with your little sadistic game.

[disappointed to find no "disgusted" emoticon]

#839 fs_regnier7

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 04:09

*shakes head and sighs*

#840 avvakum

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Posted 27 July 2010 - 04:22

hi MystRaven, there is a perfect game for you and Mr.Doom, no? try to progress each other to a higher level :lol:

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