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PvP Ladder Suggestions (Take 3)


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#201 Mister Doom

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 12:21

MORE pvp in this way would be only beneficial.

Only thing I agree with you about, lol.

I'm the biggest proponent of one word: RISK! Prove it it isn't a necessary component of PvP, please...
How is any player dominanting in PvP is THE question. Why not continue the staus quo and allow players to manipulate the game for their own self-interest(accomplishing medals)? Because they are NOT dominate. Thankfully the devs have recognized this and are willing now to listen to the community...


Not that big of a proponent I don't think luiss lol

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#202 fs_boscosuma

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 12:40

Is the simplest way to have people who do not want to PvP just "Opt-Out"? Have a one time option to remove your character from PvP entirely, never being able to PvP again? Anyone who tries to attack you either gets an "Invalid Target" or does not even come up on a list.

Would that affect GvG? If you opted out of PvP, mechanically would that affect the GvG system?

How would this affect the PvP system?

What percentage of people in the game are pure Level/RP vs. PvP players?

Anyone know?

#203 Mister Doom

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 12:45

Is the simplest way to have people who do not want to PvP just "Opt-Out"? Have a one time option to remove your character from PvP entirely, never being able to PvP again? Anyone who tries to attack you either gets an "Invalid Target" or does not even come up on a list.

Would that affect GvG? If you opted out of PvP, mechanically would that affect the GvG system?

How would this affect the PvP system?

What percentage of people in the game are pure Level/RP vs. PvP players?

Anyone know?


Would be interesting. I was thinking about this earlier... A while ago HCS introduced this 'pop up' feature, they could use this, tied to a datebase to create a true, honest, anonymous poll that would reflect peoples true play-styles.. I wonder if the results would be what are expected...

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#204 vegasmark

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:00

Im not thinking an opt out for good is an answer to "how to fix the PvP problem" or the BB problem. PvP is a major part of this game. Even though I personally do not PvP a lot, I do dabble and I want that option for when the game gets boring (linear leveling.) PvP is a major attraction in FS.

Perhaps new relics (or something else) that cancel PvP ... that would be exciting to fight for. BUT ... there are (I will not name names) guilds who think they OWN relics (they belong to Hoof, idiots) and that could be abused too. I have been PvP attacked multi times (no names ... but you know who you are lady) just b/c a guild mate took a relic from another guild that thought they did OWN it. (If you take OUR relic we will attack you) That is a load of bullying BULL. So is "if you out bid me in the AH I will attack you." YES ... we all know this happens ... and yet it is allowed to continue unchecked by the Devs.

I am just thinking of the players who are abused and intimidated into submission by some PvP specialist guilds ... and YES you ALL know this happens (both players and Devs) and YES it is a problem that needs to be fixed more than any in the game. We are not all adults here in FS and this is showing kids that they cannot escape bullies even in a virtual environment.

SO ... PvP YES ... perm opt out NO ... Temp PvP off YES.

#205 sweetlou

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:01

Add a little delight to it though, and make the bounties for 10-20 hits, or even 5-15 hits for those who think 40 mins spend on 1 bounty is too much. Heck, set the waiting in between hits on the board to 1 min instead of 2, and put a min of 10 kills on bounties, maximum of 20 :)
With this in place, you add the possibility for extra punishment for the one being boarded, and you can stay away for the min stam required for clearing bounties aspect.

No problem with this suggestion. Would allow players to play more and dish out more punishment. Costs to place bountys should be appropriate tho(ie more).


Of course you would agree, this would get you off of the BB even quicker.. :roll:

Sorry my power went out and couldn't repond...

I'm not worried about staying on the bounty board for any length of time for any reason! It is part of the inherent risk involved.

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#206 sweetlou

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:02

I'm sorry Luiss but I quite frankly dissagree with your opinion.

Fair enough. It's what open debates are all about.

At least you were outright and honest about the fact you simply want more people to play YOUR game though. However your opinion isn't the main priority here, people could be easily led to believe that the overwhelming opinion of all players follow your ideals by reading what you write on here. The fact is they do not, its simply that you and some of your friends and guildies speak up a lot more when it comes to possible changes to be made to 'your' gameplay. What you really often fail to recognise is that, as you have stated its not even that difficult for you to avoid the current harsher punishment that the BB offers there is no way for people that wish to have no part in that particular aspect of the game to avoid it.

It isn't MY game nor MY style. I choose to play ALL aspects of the game, period. I'm trying to be as objective to the argument as possible. I've been successful arguing points about leveling as well. Look at the cap at EOC. That took a few of us a long time to convince Hoof that it was needed and now it is much more a competition(a game) about who plays more then who clicks on the +1% toward next level upgrade. Players spend much more subleveling buying stam then they ever did buying the +1% upgrade. A win for all! lol

Just because some players manage to avoid the harshest of punishments, and not all the time, doesn't mean that there needs to be an automatic 'win' to retaliate. This retaliation needs to be earned as well through playing. What you are looking for the devs to institute is a simple non-PvP type of harsher punishment. I'm opposed of course because players need to play the game. Not all players are equal. This comes down to each individual player(and their guilds with friends and allies). This is fundamental to how the game works.

Now excuse me if I'm wrong here but it seems to me like you have recently chosen this particular path to follow, you joined a prestigious guild that will help you 'foil' much of the current punishment methods and now because HCS has expressed interest in making pvp a little less unbalanced in favour of the attacker you have a problem with it. This has needed to be adressed for such a long time now, the timing is unfortunate for you sure, but nevertheless.. Well, you know..

I haven't always PvPed, but have since about level 150 with the King Au Xenahs set. I was in the same guild for 823 levels. I became a founder out of necessity and I wasn't a very good founder because eventually the guild became too costly to maintain and I never enjoyed the recruitment aspect that is required to run a guild, nor did anyone else. lol. So we chose as a group to bury the guid. It happens... I'm not exactly sure why some friends asked me to join my current guild but I would suspect it was because I enjoy the strategies of PvP, always have.

Also, before the pvp ladder is adresses it makes sense that they would firstly deal with the inherent problems that pvp causes to the other aspects of the game. Let people see the risks, see what 'can' and 'should' happen and then make the choice on whether or not to pursue that line of gameplay.

If they were to just implement a bunch of changes to the pvp ladder without fixing how the system works first then it would be even harder to get the needed changes pushed through.

I truly believe if it ain't broke don't fix it and i see nothing broken about how the Bounty Board works. The PvP Ladder on the other hand has been a mockery in the game for as long as I've been playing. Cheers to the devs for finally making attempts to rectify their original mistakes not taking into account the cleverness of players to manipulate the system.

Also, I'm not the only one that feels this way either, not everyone has the means to negate much of the problems pvp causes however and are duly fearfull of reprisals to them opening their mouths..

I'm well aware of the 'good vs. evil' stance you and a few others take. I think this is ONLY because you CHOOSE to play only part of the game. That is your choice but please don't try to dictate via posts that players are helpless victims. Play the game!!!

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#207 Mister Doom

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:07

We seem to be just going around in circles luiss..

I would like to point out though that because people don't partake in pvp doesn't mean they are only enjoying 'part' of the game, in fact they are only missing out on a rather small aspect of the game in comparison.. There are many other things to do that don't require you to damage someone else's FS 'playtime'.

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#208 fs_eddyd

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:08

This thread seriously needs to be pruned/get back on track/some people get a forced forum vacation. :D

#209 Mister Doom

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:13

Get back on track/some people get a forced forum vacation. :D


Indeed, either that or limit the amount of people who can all come here and back each other up from the same guild.. ;)

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#210 fs_regnier7

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:14

We seem to be just going around in circles luiss..

I would like to point out though that because people don't partake in pvp doesn't mean they are only enjoying 'part' of the game, in fact they are only missing out on a rather small aspect of the game in comparison.. There are many other things to do that don't require you to damage someone else's FS 'playtime'.



I will agree with you on the Xp part. Not on the gold part, if you mean that too. But you know my thoughts by now. lol

Currently no opinion on the rating bit.

Gold stealing, important for market control.

Xp loss..... not much use for anything, aside from someone able to be a 'villian'
so I don't care for it. It serves no constructive use, other than 'punishing other players.

A good middleground though, since neither side will budge, would be jedi suggestion with the VL thing. The board would still be active, since people could actually stop people from 'hurting' their progression that way. Which is currently not possible, unless you knock the player down 100's of levels at times.

[Note]


______________

I honestly think the bounty board is fine as is, but I wouldn't be against delevel bounties made at a substantial cost, while also still maintaining some risk for the hunter. Maybe not as harsh as 5 levels (or maybe 10, if the range is extended).... 2 or maybe 4 at most with an extended range.

#211 fs_eddyd

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:16

Get back on track/some people get a forced forum vacation. :D


Indeed, either that or limit the amount of people who can all come here and back each other up from the same guild.. ;)


Maybe if that guild wasn't called out to begin with we wouldn't have the problem at all. ;)

#212 sweetlou

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:19

We seem to be just going around in circles luiss..

I would like to point out though that because people don't partake in pvp doesn't mean they are only enjoying 'part' of the game, in fact they are only missing out on a rather small aspect of the game in comparison.. There are many other things to do that don't require you to damage someone else's FS 'playtime'.

Sure we will, lol. You might call it a 'small' portion of the game however look at any players' profiles and a very few have PvP ratings around 1,000(where we all start). You can't deny that the animosity created by the interaction doesn't make it a game, can you? I think HCS banks on it, hence this thread staying unlocked and the typical PvP vs. leveling flames appear.

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#213 Maehdros

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:20

Get back on track/some people get a forced forum vacation. :D


Indeed, either that or limit the amount of people who can all come here and back each other up from the same guild.. ;)



sigh... a majority of WK participate In the PvP aspect of the game ;) whether it be bounties, gold hits, or both, etc. Hence alot of us post here. Since we ( and many players from the other PvP guilds) have alot of knowledge, suggestions and experience to contribute to this thread. Do you? Besides saying you don't like PvP? And it's all "broken"?

I for one am finally glad to see the Hoof and fellow cows reading these threads, and taking time to consider options for both fixing the ladder and improving PvP in fallensword. Cheers. They know it's a very important subject, and you can see that from the amount of feedback AND suggestions he has come up with. thanks hoof.

#214 Maehdros

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:27

The amount of feedback is great,there's positive and negative..as there always will be,pertaining to a looming update that has the potential to be game breaking.Most important points in my mind is that there is NO opt out of PvP, Xp loss above and below 5 (or 10 as has been suggested ) levels <-- hoof said he could easily do this..which is awesome. Also Remove PvP rating from the board., Open up the range in higher levels, say post 500? or 600? Link Rating to 100 stams as Lou has suggested on a different thread... but have it off the BB. Once I'm a bit more awake..I'll throw some other thoughts in here ;)

#215 Mister Doom

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:30

sigh... a majority of WK participate In the PvP aspect of the game ;) whether it be bounties, gold hits, or both, etc. Hence alot of us post here. Since we ( and many players from the other PvP guilds) have alot of knowledge, suggestions and experience to contribute to this thread. Do you? Besides saying you don't like PvP? And it's all "broken"?


Sigh... You and your guildies have a weird perspective on this whole subject.. Sure you definitely know how to make the attacks and you know how to minimise the risks that you all brag about, what you always fail to see is that people on the receiving end of pvp also have experience and valuable opinions.. Or don't the 'victims' matter?

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#216 Bleltch

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:33

Indeed, either that or limit the amount of people who can all come here and back each other up from the same guild.. ;)

Members of my guild pushing for reform of the ladder is a big reason this thread even exists. We've been trying to get hoofs attention on it for ages now.

#217 Mister Doom

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:36

Members of my guild pushing for reform of the ladder is a big reason this thread even exists. We've been trying to get hoofs attention on it for ages now.


Yes, and when HCS gives you an idea that they might be changing the pvp system into something that wouldn't be quite advantagous as you are used to you have all come out in force to try and 'force' your ideas across. You want everything your way, say what you like Bleltch but you are not posting for the good of the game, you are posting for the good of 'your game'.

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#218 sweetlou

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:38




sigh... a majority of WK participate In the PvP aspect of the game ;) whether it be bounties, gold hits, or both, etc. Hence alot of us post here. Since we ( and many players from the other PvP guilds) have alot of knowledge, suggestions and experience to contribute to this thread. Do you? Besides saying you don't like PvP? And it's all "broken"?


Sigh... You and your guildies have a weird perspective on this whole subject.. Sure you definitely know how to make the attacks and you know how to minimise the risks that you all brag about, what you always fail to see is that people on the receiving end of pvp also have experience and valuable opinions.. Or don't the 'victims' matter?

I'm a guildmate of his and our perspective is nothing but that of players that chose to actively play, and enjoy, an aspect of FS that you don't! There is no bragging. I truly believe that you are pissed off because you have hit the end. Now what do you do?

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#219 Maehdros

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:39




sigh... a majority of WK participate In the PvP aspect of the game ;) whether it be bounties, gold hits, or both, etc. Hence alot of us post here. Since we ( and many players from the other PvP guilds) have alot of knowledge, suggestions and experience to contribute to this thread. Do you? Besides saying you don't like PvP? And it's all "broken"?


Sigh... You and your guildies have a weird perspective on this whole subject.. Sure you definitely know how to make the attacks and you know how to minimise the risks that you all brag about, what you always fail to see is that people on the receiving end of pvp also have experience and valuable opinions.. Or don't the 'victims' matter?




I never said their opinions didnt matter.It just seems..as usual... you speak for a majority of them ;) And when it is often in a sarcastic, rude, and plain Ignorant tone? It gets similar responses. And then thread gets off track. As of now, its a wait and see... wait for hoof to read a bit more, and see what he deems good suggestions to implement.

#220 fs_eddyd

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 13:39

sigh... a majority of WK participate In the PvP aspect of the game ;) whether it be bounties, gold hits, or both, etc. Hence alot of us post here. Since we ( and many players from the other PvP guilds) have alot of knowledge, suggestions and experience to contribute to this thread. Do you? Besides saying you don't like PvP? And it's all "broken"?


Sigh... You and your guildies have a weird perspective on this whole subject.. Sure you definitely know how to make the attacks and you know how to minimise the risks that you all brag about, what you always fail to see is that people on the receiving end of pvp also have experience and valuable opinions.. Or don't the 'victims' matter?


I fully agree everyone's opinions matter, but when some posts are just about flaming one guild and have not one bit of relevance to the topic then it has no place in said topic.


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