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PvP Ladder Update Announced!


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#101 Roan

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 20:50

Can I at least have the option to dump my PvP raiting? I got it long ago doing bounties to defend my guildmates. I don't deserve it or want it. [Edit]

It will be reset, just wait a bit...

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#102 avvakum

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 20:53

Remember, this is a PvP game.

This makes me smile :) Thanks to all of HCS staff for working on PvP ascpect :D


Actually, it's a game where you can do all, level up, power level, risk with your levels pvp'ing and delevel others for revenge.. some players enjoy all these activities..

#103 Swagger

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 20:55

Nice update.

All seems to be fairly reasonable,no doubt there there will be ups and downs with the new updates but a step in the right direction neverthless. will have to sharpen me axes havent pvped for some time :)

#104 Roan

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 20:55

Yes I know avvakum :) I enjoy all of those myself.
Was just happy to hear this sentence from a mod. Been a while since I didn't hear a strong statement about PvP from HCS.

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#105 Mister Doom

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 20:55

Well I'm not overly impressed, I'm not overly surprised though either tbh.

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#106 dowuones

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 21:22

Target Range Increase.

Fine, it seems almost everyone agree with it.
I see only only a problem: if xp loss goes both way, theres no more chance to outlevel someone that is hitting you. You can be targeted for 20 level (it might take weeks to do it). There are some nice suggstions about VL change. I think something should be done about it.

The PvP Ladder Reset every two weeks.

Honestly a decay system would have been much better.

If the main reason of all these changes is to reward true PvPer, with a two weeks reset you reward a "two week PvPer".

All efforts of someone building their rating vanish in two weeks...
...as well as efforts of people wanting to keep their rating low to be a less attractive target.
At the beggining of each two weeks period all those who choose to not compete will be "farmed", i see a lot of bad feelings coming from this.

I saw a suggestion about different starting PvP rating, i think it should be at least considered. If someone compete for Dominance should show to be able to dominate players that are actually actively involved. Those that dont compete are already dominated, no reason to try to dominate them more than needed.

Minimum Bounty Board Attacks.

I dont understand this. It means there will be bounty placed for more than 10 hits? i dont see reason for it

Counter Bounties limited to 'x' stamina attacks.

It solves the problem of 10 stam Bounty clearer, but i dont get... theres an issue with mercenaries on BB??

Failed Attack Repercussions.

Also on BB? Doesnt it punish low level player who wants to try to clear a bounty?

Attacking Inactive Players.

Im afraid this is abusable. If you cant attack them make that you cant send them gold.

#107 Tharsonius

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 21:24

[Didn't read through all posts, so maybe I'm just repeating someone else's thoughts]

Did someone think about the fact that there will be more PvP rating available at lower levels (more players), and that two weeks might not be enough to transfer enough of it to higher levels (via the bounty board or also direct PvP) in order to allow higher level players to get significant rankings in the new PvP ladder (at least on average, of course some will manage)? The new system sounds fair, but given the skewed distribution of PvP rating (with less for higher levels) it will not be easy to balance.

Don't get me wrong, this isn't really a complaint, just a thought.

#108 RebornJedi

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 21:26

tis why PvP rating exchange so stay how it is now on the Bounty Board..but it might get Higher level players taking lower level bounties..atleast it gives some use for Gloat

 


#109 fs_varim64

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 21:51

Where are the pvp tokens, and what can u get with them? i dont see a page for them under upgrades or character

#110 fs_evfisher

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 21:55

LawDog26 wrote:
Yeah, I admit it, I was wrong to believe HC gave a dang about levelers and how PvPers abuse them.

BigGrim wrote:
Rubbish. You noticed that some of these changes are frowned upon by PvPers? We care about all our players to say otherwise is foolish. Remember, this is a PvP game. If you feel someone is abusing you, contact Support.

Do not derail this thread.

I write:

Target Range Increase.

Increase the PvP target range to +/- 10 over level 200
This is going to help the PvPer's, it will give them more "soft" leveler targets to hit repeatedly.

The PvP Ladder Reset every two weeks.
This will help the PvPer's. But the "soft target" levelers will be farmed every 2 weeks repeatedly.

Minimum Bounty Board Attacks.
OK, stops abuse with the 1 hit bounties and rating farming, but still will not allow levelers to bounty every hit placed on them by rating farmers who have just hit them repeatedly.

Counter Bounties limited to 'x' stamina attacks.
If a bounty clearer is using mercenary tactics to clear a bounty, this will do nothing, except stop other BH from clearing the counter bounties because they could be then counter bountied subjecting themselves to the same 100 stam attacks, thereby accomplishing nothing.

Deflected Message
I always knew when one of my attacks were deflected, I read the combat logs.

PvP Rating Transfer during Bounties.
Again, does nothing to help prevent the mercenary clearers who care not for the PvP rating. They are not concerned with finishing the bounty and getting the rating, they only care about deleveling someone who has ticked them or one of their friends off.

Failed Attack Repercussions.
OK, so the attacker fails the first time on a 10 stam, loses, then comes back with a whopping 100 stam hit in an hour, and takes even more than they would have in the first place. And, if I bounty on the first hit, and no one has cleared him in that hour, I can't bounty him for the susequent 100 stam attack. I could definitely see a "hard core" PvPer exploiting this one. "Oops, I lost, I lost 10 stam of xp and gold, please bounty me"

Bounty Medal Alteration.
The system already is designed that you don't get bounty medal credit until you have cleared the bounty.

Attacking Inactive Players.
OK, so this does stop the temporary farming of inactives for PvP rating, but if someone has a multi-account (and we all know they exist) that they shift gold to "after" they become inactive, then when a sufficient amount of gold is collected on the inactive they quietly become active ad shift the gold back, this accomplishes nothing.

All of the "repeatedly" ones, does nothing to improve the PvP rating ladder, except make it more abusable.

#111 Roan

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 21:55

Where are the pvp tokens, and what can u get with them? i dont see a page for them under upgrades or character

This update is not implented yet.

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#112 Khanate

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:05

DECAY DECAY DECAY DECAY DECAY DECAY

No matter what, someone who doesnt defend themselves should never be worth as much as a real PvPer for rating. This just means for 2-3 days PvPers will farm rating off people who do 0 PvP or barely bother to log in.

DECAY DECAY DECAY DECAY DECAY DECAY

Besides that awesome update.

#113 kingtyrin

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:11

I still think an idea from the previous thread was really good if you do decide to use the reset system. That idea was to have the choice to reset you rating down to half the others would be good. For instance, if 1200 is the default, you could choose for the reset to knock you down to 600 instead so you wont be farmed for rating. Doesnt anyone else think this is a way to at least mildly make yourself less attractive of a target if you dont want to partake in the rating race?

Im like the update overall, so along as the xp loss works both ways so I dont have to use the bounty board to fight my battles for me when someone lower hits me.

#114 fs_gothangel6

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:16

Okay this is just an ideal that may work. What about an option in the preference page that turns pvp on or off. In order to turn it off you can not attack anyone with in 48 hours and it would cost fsp to turn it either on or off. Everyone would start with it on and would have to pay to turn it off. if it is off they can not attack or be attack by anyone. This would allow the people that are trying to level and at the same time buff every one in the guild to still be able to level. when i get hit i lose xp and it is very hard for me and A lot of others i know i to make it back up. ( also there could be a list of people that can be pvp; other words those that have pvp turned on show up on a pvp list)Also HC why did you add so many more crystalline gear and then changed the pvp. Now everyone that has those new items on will have them broken and become useless and some of them are not cheep. All so like it was stated before in the form there are going to be a lot of low levels getting the pvp awards since there is an abundance of low levels and they have nothing to lose. I know you guys are trying to make pvp more fun and get more people in to it but there are a lot of people already having issues leveling/buffs/ and now to add more pvping on to them even worse. These would make finding people to pvp easier and since you guys increases the pvp levels form 5 to 10 there should still be a lot of people on the pvp list. If you are worried about only have a small percent of people pvping then it should tell you that making pvp a bigger thing may not be the best ideal. If it is a big thing and only the small percent of people just want to level only then at lest they will be happy and not complain. And you will still get money from those people maybe even more since they would be more likely to buy those crystalline items since they will not have to worry about having them broken not to say but people spend more money on things that make then happy not irritated about getting the crap beat of them . any way i hope that this ideal is decent or attest helps some one come up with a better ideal :D

#115 fs_scarybug

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:18

It's probably too late now for any significant changes, but I'd like to second the notion that losing xp for failed attacks on the board is a bad idea. If the target is online and around the level of the attacker, or offline but a 100+ levels higher, and assuming it has at least a moderate amount of gear and desire to defend itself, the attacker is bound to lose at least one or two of the battles. This change would discourage bounty hunting for a challenge, and would make people that want to get their bounty medals do so slower, and with less risks than now. Bounty hunting is not a very profitable activity, most of the time, there's no need to make it less pleasant than it already is.

#116 fs_sinfulsam

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:31

i feel that the on and off pvp is fair more fair than getting robbed of your gold all i feel more lvl and potion maker buy fsp with real money more than a pvp so that would mean you want more pvp so us lvler and potion maker s have to spend more real money to stay while gold steelers get a free ride FAIR ?

#117 kingtyrin

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:32

Okay this is just an ideal that may work. What about an option in the preference page that turns pvp on or off. In order to turn it off you can not attack anyone with in 48 hours and it would cost fsp to turn it either on or off. Everyone would start with it on and would have to pay to turn it off. if it is off they can not attack or be attack by anyone. This would allow the people that are trying to level and at the same time buff every one in the guild to still be able to level. when i get hit i lose xp and it is very hard for me and A lot of others i know i to make it back up. ( also there could be a list of people that can be pvp; other words those that have pvp turned on show up on a pvp list)

Opting out so you guys could hold all the gold for everyone without repercussion? Didnt you read the debate on this matter? Even alot of levelerss conceded a complete opt out option would be really bad for the game with far reaching consequences :(

Also HC why did you add so many more crystalline gear and then changed the pvp. Now everyone that has those new items on will have them broken and become useless and some of them are not cheep.

Crystals are made to be broken, thats the point. They are supposed to be expensive and powerful and only use so long before they are useless. If anything, the cows give us to many ways to slow this (imo) with the UB190 and UB200.

All so like it was stated before in the form there are going to be a lot of low levels getting the pvp awards since there is an abundance of low levels and they have nothing to lose.

Everyone has something to lose. Eventually the bounties placed by other low levels will trickle the rating up the BB, so Im not sure what your talking about here.

I know you guys are trying to make pvp more fun and get more people in to it but there are a lot of people already having issues leveling/buffs/ and now to add more pvping on to them even worse. These would make finding people to pvp easier and since you guys increases the pvp levels form 5 to 10 there should still be a lot of people on the pvp list. If you are worried about only have a small percent of people pvping then it should tell you that making pvp a bigger thing may not be the best ideal.

The problem isnt that a small % pvp (look at the BB right now, and thats just scratching the surface) but that the ones who pvp were unhappy with how the ladder system, which in general was manipulated by players who tend to call themselfs levelers, and asked the cows in may threads to change how it worked.

If it is a big thing and only the small percent of people just want to level only then at lest they will be happy and not complain. And you will still get money from those people maybe even more since they would be more likely to buy those crystalline items since they will not have to worry about having them broken not to say but people spend more money on things that make then happy not irritated about getting the crap beat of them . any way i hope that this ideal is decent or attest helps some one come up with a better ideal :D

Im sure the monsters your killing wouldnt be happy about you beating them either if they had emotions. This is a Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game. Why are you trying to limit interactions between the characters?

#118 kingtyrin

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:36

i feel that the on and off pvp is fair more fair than getting robbed of your gold all i feel more lvl and potion maker buy fsp with real money more than a pvp so that would mean you want more pvp so us lvler and potion maker s have to spend more real money to stay while gold steelers get a free ride FAIR ?

You make an aweful lot of assumptions saying pvpers get free rides. The cost to regain your levels for those who pvp up in the higher reaches is almost always greater then any gain from pvp. And I dont see why potion makers would have to spend money on the game, this doesnt make sense, last I checked potion making was a profitable alternative to donating. Either way, you keep using the argument of who spends money on the game, but its a moot point because all those who do should be aware of the pvp/gold stealing system in place of the game they are making money to. I mean, there are ALOT of ways to hide your gold, if you were worried about xp loss, I would be more understanding, but the gold stealiong system in this game is just fine

#119 Windbattle

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:36

First Off, this is an EXCELLENT start at fixing both the PvP Ladder, PvPing, and the Bounty Board. So congratulations are in order for the developers.

HOWEVER, I have a few suggestions still ...

1) The increased hitting range should be +/- 10 from Level 100, instead of 200. The level refers to your Virtual Level. I feel by level 100 you should have a grasp of PvP and it shouldn't be an issue.

2) As for the PvP Ladder reset, I feel it should be every week, instead of every two weeks. I feel two weeks is long enough where point trading could still be a HUGE factor.

Please consider my 2 suggestions before implementing any changes. Despite my small suggestions, I like the rest of the updates. I advocated for a lot of them, in the previous PvP Ladder feedback threads.

#120 Windbattle

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 22:39

Hoof answered the question at hand.


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