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#581 aa0007

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 18:36

I think the first step that is needed to be taken in this direction is UP THE FREAKING MULTI DETECTOR!

#582 fs_jinxxx

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 18:37

Here is an idea to fix the ladder .. SCRAP IT! Just like conflicts, you would gain a certain fraction of a token for each pvp attack that you did - so there would, in theory, be no pvp ladder abuse :D

And bounties hits would have 1/10 of that fraction of tokens.



I could see how that would promote a lot of multiple accounts with low levels just hitting like crazy to rack up tokens


As opposed to now where they are doing it for PvP Rating.

System = corrupt, players = corrupt. If you wont fix the system, or are uncapable, start scrolling through peoples logs who are at top of the ladder. If they are setting up deals to not be hit/bountied, ban them. End of story. Ban them for a full week and tell them to stop being childish little brats and play the game the way the admins meant it to be played.

Honestly, I can't believe how many people are allowed to cry, bitch, moan, threaten, circumvent, and flat-out CHEAT in this game.

Start mass-temp banning people, guarantee you 90% of the trading stops and the brats straighten out. If you have to ban some moron who happens to have a credit card, fear not, 10 more will replace him/her within hours. In fact, one of those ten will be that same person with a new account because lets face it, you have a serious addiction to this game if you're dropping enough money on it to get special treatment. You aren't going anywhere, stop acting like you are. 99% of this community would continue forking over cash if Hoof got on here right now and said there wouldn't be another update for a year unless HCS raised $10,000 in the next 30 minutes.

#583 Leos3000

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 18:40


you want to keep the stats how they are, change the helm to another slot so it at least pairs with the archeons, and It would be a more of a must have again.


Why on earth should it be a must-have? (Apart from 'our guild has it').

It's supposed to be a PvP set (as BG says) and a reward for PvPers. Making it useful for levelling is the worst thing they could have done, because it leads to trading, abuse of the system and cheating. It should be even MORE nerfed damage-wise and made into a real PvP set, but unfortunately they first had to ask what that would be... and then ran a short poll where less than a guildfull of votes convinced them to leave it as a uber-levelling gear.



why would it be a must have you ask? there are several answers, but best 1 for HCS is revenue

when it was released numerous people wanted to either buy it, or earn it. It made higher level people have a desire to pvp, which is great thing for hcs, as it inspires more interest in the game.

There are "pvp" sets all over the top levels already from the caves, arena, SE's or the numerous elite sets that are worthless to levelers. If levelers are forced to pvp more then those sets become more desired and bought up, its a cycle of events that with 1 nerfing hcs killed a lot of future revenue 1 set could have brought them. For hunting at level 950+ you are still using 3 of 9 items that are level 700...this suit changed this to where you were now still using 1 level 700 EPIC item and the rest were above 890, while u can still do this at its current stats, its not really that pointful or desired tbh

#584 fs_coyotik

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 18:42

The 'beef' as you put it is the treatment of loyal players who, after words direct from admins go ahead and buy/forge/craft items in good faith only to have the items they bought nerfed into oblivion.


Two items with extra 800 damage compared to next best current gear in these slots, that's what you call oblivion? I could understand such statements if they changed damage to defense, maybe...

They were nerfed from "terribly game-breaking" to "just normally gamebreaking".

#585 webhosting

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 18:51

Un-thought out rant


You completely ignore the fact that TWO HCS representatives were told the items were overpowered, massively. TWO HCS reps responded in like that the items were fine, even fixed the bug I posted about them. The 'beef' as you put it is the treatment of loyal players who, after words direct from admins go ahead and buy/forge/craft items in good faith only to have the items they bought nerfed into oblivion. As I stated it wasn't so much about the cash/FSP, I actually kind of figured they would refund. It's the principle of bad treatment of players.


Actually my comment was WELL thought out, and you just don't like it because it's true.
Quit crying, accept your refund, and move on.
Like I said you didn't even know what the item stats were when you invented them, therefor you would have spent the FSP anyways.

#586 fs_coyotik

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 18:54

why would it be a must have you ask? there are several answers, but best 1 for HCS is revenue


I cannot judge that - but I am convinced that if HCS start milking donors by releasing uber-strong gear, it will be a very short-term strategy. It might bring some cash from those, but it might annoy a lot of other potential customers, especially since they would be likely to make the gear obsolete soon by yet another milking attempt...

It made higher level people have a desire to pvp, which is great thing for hcs, as it inspires more interest in the game.


Do you think it's a great thing for HCS that people are now paying others to attack them and lose? Higher level people have no desire to pvp. They only have desire to obtain the ladder tokens, which has very little to do with actual PvP.

[q]its a cycle of events that with 1 nerfing hcs killed a lot of future revenue 1 set could have brought them.[/q]

I'm quite sure that if they worry about revenue from a single set, they'll find a way to release another "must have". But seeing the gear stats in the last year, I would say that they don't have any PLANS with gear (BG asking about hunting and PvP sets kinda confirms that).

For hunting at level 950+ you are still using 3 of 9 items that are level 700...


No, I'm not. I'm using one item 872, one item 876, rest 900+ - and the bloody Acheron that IS unnecessarily overpowered (and I whined about that the very day they released it, asking them to nerf the damage so that it won't be good for 400 levels) - and of course the bloody 700 elemental epic that is a colossal failure in game balance, where yet again HCS showed that they don't introduce items for revenue or for any other "reason".

this suit changed this to where you were now still using 1 level 700 EPIC item and the rest were above 890, while u can still do this at its current stats, its not really that pointful or desired tbh

.

No. This suit only adds another 800 damage to 80 levels of content that is already trivial to beat in most cases, thus practically removing the last bits of challenge in levelling. With this gear, even AFTER the nerf that slashed about 2k damage, the last few creeps that required two relics or CA are probably a history. Having the extra 2k damage in here would be absolutely pointless.

#587 RebornJedi

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 19:02

Like I said you didn't even know what the item stats were when you invented them, therefor you would have spent the FSP anyways.

you can see the item stats in the recipe before you invent it..unless im not understanding your statement right

 


#588 fs_regnier7

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 19:05


Like I said you didn't even know what the item stats were when you invented them, therefor you would have spent the FSP anyways.

you can see the item stats in the recipe before you invent it..unless im not understanding your statement right



and the individual item stats alone beat Acherons. lol - Not really a gamble, if you are sure it'll have even a decent set bonus

#589 webhosting

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 19:16

*Shrug* .. The point I suppose Mr Jedi, is that Shardoom received a refund anyways so if they weren't happy with the item stats after nerf, they should at least take solace in the fact that they got their FSP back. I do understand a degree of piss-off factor but it's not the end of the world so long as they received a refund, is what I'm saying.

Problem solved.
I guess you can't have your cake and eat it too.
If they nerfed the item stats, you got FSP back.
Of course it's settled, and you're free to invent something else, but to carry on after gloating well...



Oh well.

#590 kingtyrin

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 19:57

For now more than a weeks worth of work seeing the recipes was very diaspointing!! Ripple and I have dumped way more stam into bounty hunting than it would have taken for a titan,,why arent these epic? And is it just me or are they all armor set? The Hel looks like the only one worth getting (again havent seen set bonuses but compared to the work of getting TKP these items dont compare to stam cost).

then theres the items cost to make,,being #1 or #2 is the only way to get a hatchling,,an item that takes it as resource should be AMAZING, game changing like a javelin, fush set or back in the day a WW, these dont seem to be anything but arena toys to me. Time will tell which brings my final point,,7 days i between resets means its going to be weeks before these are going to be made and weeks of fixes and changes that are obviously causing a lot of grief too. Again please make the resets no more than 7 days in between and not at least 7 days as it is now

Arena aside, just taking regular pvp into account, the 173 set is pretty sweet. I have not seen the full set bonus, but compare it to the best unforged armor boots (boots of Nenshal, level 172) of my level have -16 attack, 310 armor and 50 damage (Compared to Augilts 264 armor and 176 attack uncrafted unforged) and the best armor ring at my level unforged (Ring of Ledfar, level 151) has 25 attack, 242 armor, and 42 defense(compared to Augilts 249 armor and 191 attack also unforged and uncrafted) then factor in the KE bonus of the full set, and it looks pretty nice to me before considering about how craft or set bonus will effect it.

I dont think its really game breaking though, I will say that. Its actually a long needed upgrade to some extent called for from how unbalanced the damage vs armor maximum stat totals possibilities obtained via gear are in this range(Much of that unbalance due to the level 100 Epics: Kardic,Javiline and Grasp)

#591 Windbattle

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 21:14

Guys. Do try to keep things civil please.


BigGrim, REMOVE token items from the game till you figure this out with Hoof. That is a GREAT SOLUTION to this problem. And IF you decide to release tokens again, make sure the resources are BOUND and that the resulting items are BOUND. That would also solve a lot of the bickering over the items, such as "OMG that item is soo expensive" or "wow I will never be able to afford that item" or "lets go pvp farm cause it is so profitable".

There will be no more fighting about Rating if you Step Up and act like a game developer. Sorry but I had to say my thoughts on this matter.

The fighting and bickering will ONLY GET WORSE the longer you put off fixing the REAL PROBLEMS WITH PVPING!!!

Currently This is what is happening

1) Rampant cheating for rating (aka farming rating, hitting people on the BB just for rating and not finishing the bounty, paying people not to bounty you or hit you back AFTER you have hit them, etc.)

2) People selling PvP token items for 1000's of FSP (i'm sure that is not what you meant to happen)

3) Items created from tokens are overpowered and not well thought out.

ETC, ETC, ETC

~~~~~~~~~

@BigGrim the time for being civil is LONG past. I don't think anyone is calm or civil about this situation, except for maybe you.

#592 fs_balmaina

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 21:17

BalmainA.. does not care.. as he wont have any of the sets.. anyway.. as he does not PvP !

#593 HaruHaru

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 21:21

The only thing that the new PvP ladder successfully added to the game is more bullying of players for bountying a bounty hunter who farms rating on the board and expects not to get bountied. Then when they do they get all puffy because they get knocked of the top 50. It's not supposed to be easy to be in the top of anything. Besides they know that they are taking the risk to be put on the board the second they decide to start a bounty. So I think taking away the rewards for the ladder all together and maybe making a Slaughter-fest type game for FS and put the current ladder rewards on that so people can actually earn it.

#594 fs_thanos

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 22:57

can i ask how one at higher levels is supposed to participate in the pvp ladder system without being accused of "farming"?


If you need to know PvP off the board....

if i pvp off the board, i will almost certainly tinkle someone off because at my level, very few participate voluntarily in pvp...


Ummm... it happens at all levels that way... dont believe me... check my level... and its not caused by me bounty board farming....

if i pvp on the board, i am sure that i am hitting someone who participates in pvp because thats the only way to get on the board.


No, this is not entirely true... alot of times you are just hitting someone that was helping defend their own guild members... if your guild dont do it like mine does, I do apologize.

if i wait around for a bounty that is a higher level than me (the only bounty i have done since the last reset was on a level 952) I won't be able to get onto the top pvp ladder in 1 week.


So PvP off the bounty board and take a real chance... its what a real PvPer would do.

this leaves me forced to hop on any bounties i can get when i have the RL time to do so to gain points and get a ladder award....


So do it and deal with being called a farmer....

so, can someone tell me how me, as a level 800+ player, is supposed to build up my pvp rating without being accused of "point farming"?


Follow my previous message and it will answer your question.


And now I ask... why are we even arguing about this issue... the bigger issue is that we have a real NEED for FORUM MODS!!

This like all other important postings has been hijacked taken in other directions, the postings have been split up between arguments and points lost through them in the end result... again I ask that we STOP with these BS postings and get some MODS in here to keep us on track.

#595 fs_door23

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Posted 20 August 2010 - 23:21

what are the levels of the new sets?

#596 Thoran

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Posted 21 August 2010 - 00:55

...

There will be no more fighting about Rating if you Step Up and act like a game developer. Sorry but I had to say my thoughts on this matter.

The fighting and bickering will ONLY GET WORSE the longer you put off fixing the REAL PROBLEMS WITH PVPING!!!

Currently This is what is happening

1) Rampant cheating for rating (aka farming rating, hitting people on the BB just for rating and not finishing the bounty, paying people not to bounty you or hit you back AFTER you have hit them, etc.)

2) People selling PvP token items for 1000's of FSP (i'm sure that is not what you meant to happen)

3) Items created from tokens are overpowered and not well thought out.

ETC, ETC, ETC


Well duh, those of us who actually Pvp often saw this in the very first when the PvP ladder was discussed, Im glad to see more players noticing this, though too late now, for what it really is...

Greed and disregard for the game as a whole. :roll:

HDBus.gif

I'm also known as @UnoWild

For Fracks Sake, Forum


#597 fs_robotussin

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Posted 21 August 2010 - 01:48

thanos, you are out of your mind bro...


i was being rhetorical...

trust me that your level band is QUITE different than my level band. i have about 20 active players (not including guildmates and exguildmates) only about 5 of which have a rating other than 1000.

and, by definition, if you are ON the bounty board you have VOLUNTARILY PARTICIPATED in PVP...

why the hell did you go through every line of my post then ask for forum mods? you're a maniac.



why am i even dignifying you with a response?

#598 fs_regnier7

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Posted 21 August 2010 - 01:56

why am i even dignifying you with a response?



boredom?

#599 fs_thanos

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Posted 21 August 2010 - 02:24

thanos, you are out of your mind bro...


i was being rhetorical...

trust me that your level band is QUITE different than my level band. i have about 20 active players (not including guildmates and exguildmates) only about 5 of which have a rating other than 1000.

and, by definition, if you are ON the bounty board you have VOLUNTARILY PARTICIPATED in PVP...

why the hell did you go through every line of my post then ask for forum mods? you're a maniac.



why am i even dignifying you with a response?



Actually I found a total of 47 people in your range that are all valid targets for you to attack.... really now are you gonna attack that many people in 1 day, if you do then great job... and learn to defend yourself.

Oh and yes I am bored....

#600 Admiral Memo

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Posted 21 August 2010 - 04:38

Well, I doubt they'll give back real-world money (that's your risk all the time for donation), but they can easily revert back FSPs, gold, items, etc.

Everything is easily fixable by restoring the stats and leaving all the sets intact. They were released, the time for changes was before the release.

Then the devs could concentrate of further adjusting PvP/ladder.

As I said, I totally agree that this should have been fixed before release. My statement was a caveat to that, in that if HCS is completely decided to do a change after release, it's best to do it sooner rather than later, to keep the amount of problems caused at a minimum.

He's taking advantage of a broken system, then whines if he loses. ;) What? You call that PvP?

+1

Thanks for the post, evilbry -- now can the discussion continue in a constructive direction while the kids insult each others in PMs instead?

+1

It is starting to become a bit embarrassing actually.. sure, we all had a good laugh when the point farmer from hell finally got nailed... but nomatter how we may or may not feel towards Shin, it is not his fault the system is flawed, and it is really not his fault for being the best to take advantage of it either.. it's not like a bunch of others didn't try to outbest him at it.
He even said so himself, it is all about point farming, so leave it at that.

The issue is the broken system the cows have put in game. How they managed to mess it up even beyond what anyone could imagine.

Had it only had a different name from the get go, then maybe we wouldn't be so offended by it? Now, it has become a religion to a bunch of the old schooled, hardcore PvPers to get it done right, and for that, we can only applaud y'all - but pls do try to keep the focus on the target.

+2

But all this is a distraction from the real issue, that the PvP ladder has become a farmer's ladder.
As a leveler, I don't want that, since I'm likely to wind up one of the plots being plowed. :)

+216 :)

I think the first step that is needed to be taken in this direction is UP THE FREAKING MULTI DETECTOR!

+1

I had to give the items back, and I'm still out about 648 FSP.

Holy crap... I've never even SEEN 648 FSPs at one time. If begging were allowed, I'd be begging the crap out of you until you put me on ignore, and then I'd find other ways to beg. If you're missing that much, it makes me wonder how much you actually have total.


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