Eliminate Titan Events, Until LW is removed
#1
Posted 08 May 2011 - 06:00
I don't think people should be able to profit from blatant cheating. It is basically a GIANT win button for epics.
I presume since the problem hasn't been fixed yet, that they can't detect LW users. So, this seems like a logical way to slow down the proliferation of unearned epics into the game.
COWS, look at the titan kill log. There is a reason only 2 to 4 guilds bother to really try anymore. because they have mastered LW use and have taken away any chance for anyone else to compete.
P.S I know this is drastic, but Titan Epics have no meaning if you can use a program to help you auto win them.
Last ditch effort to fix titan hunting,
Windbattle.
#2
fs_labaduba9
Posted 08 May 2011 - 06:34
#3
Posted 08 May 2011 - 06:38
2. LW save your time. It took me 90 minutes to racked up 500 kills wit LW. Would take 10 times longer withour it. So you're saying that you're willing to waste 4 hours killing titans? I call bull.
LW ease movement, speed things up, and levels the playing field. From my point of view, you're not trying to make titan hunting fair for everyone. On the contrary, you want to get back the unfair advantage of people with faster connection, which was lost since LW was introduced. I need roughly 8 seconds to load a page, I'd rather have the cows take away Titans forever than losing LW.
So you're saying you're losing titans since people has more skills in LW than you? It is so sad, I just cried you a river. Live it, and learn it. Sheez...
#4
Posted 08 May 2011 - 08:25
What do we actually see?
The same 3 or 4 guilds winning all the time. Why is that? LW makes great hunters into insanely good hunters and kills any chance of competing.
I don't use LW if your wondering. I think it defeats the purpose of titan events, to actually have to move, use some strategy, and finally click the kill button. Automation of that process is silly to me.
NOTE: Titan events have gotten longer because less people are out in the field. I think that is because people are tired of losing out to LW users dominating the field. I know several other players that feel the same way.
#5
Posted 08 May 2011 - 08:30
#6
Posted 08 May 2011 - 08:31
I have seen posts from Big Grim and Hoof saying that LW will not work in the new proposed interface because it gives an unfair advantage in the first place.
So I scratch my head with this one ...
#7
Posted 08 May 2011 - 10:05
Hoo boy, where do I start...
Yes it does. I know that for a fact. I can't hunt titan before LW, but I can hunt a little after I used it. It's a fact from a 3rd world user with 8 seconds load time per page.1) The leveling of the playing field argument is COMPLETE NONSENSE. If that were true, then you would see many different guilds placing in the 1st and 2nd on the titan kill logs.
Wrong. Titan hunting was, is, and will always be dominated by dedicated guilds. That's the way it was before LW, that's the way it is now he have LW, and that's how it will always be. If you insist Titan hunt wasn't dominated by certain guilds before LW, I call Bull number 2.The same 3 or 4 guilds winning all the time. Why is that? LW makes great hunters into insanely good hunters and kills any chance of competing.
I've heard this one from my 10 years old nephew. He said "Mommy, I lost a math competition to a guy who cheated, because he used a calculator which was allowed by the jury". I think it was pretty much the same.I don't use LW if your wondering. I think it defeats the purpose of titan events, to actually have to move, use some strategy, and finally click the kill button. Automation of that process is silly to me.
Probably the only line I agree with. But I don't blame you. For all these years, cows implied to the costumers that their policy is pretty much "Whoever cry the loudest, wins" or something like that.I think that is because people are tired of losing out to LW users dominating the field. I know several other players that feel the same way.
#8
Posted 08 May 2011 - 14:39
LW by and large levels the field to a degree.
I can now compete with players who before were so much faster than me.
Once you take the time to learn to use LW, you can be very fast.
If its banned, even fewer guilds will compete because some players have such ultra fast connections, if they are hunting, you're going for TKP and nothing else.
I'm not saying players should be disadvantaged because they live in an area that has good connections, or they can afford a fast connection, but get rid of LW (which i think HCS plan to do anyway) will make titans even more elitist.
*edit
Reading back, I wonder if you know what lightwalk is and how it works?
You still have to click the move buttons, land on the titan and hit the kill button. The only thing LW does is removes the need to wait for the page to load each movement. If the titan is 4 squares to your right, you click right 4 times and the page loads 4 squares to the right, you then have to click to kill it same as if you didnt have LW.
There is no automation of moving or killing as you have to click the buttons yourself still.
#9
Posted 08 May 2011 - 15:01
Only a couple of guilds seemed to win all the titans, and people were just SURE it was unfair.
I was wrong.
Those same guilds will win titans with or without fastwalk. And that's the key: it's the GUILD that wins. They text/skype/call each other, go after that titan, and clean up the kills as quickly as possible. Everyone leaves after 50% is secured. The kill logs reflect that the first guild with 3 or more good hunters on the titan WON. Everything after that was probably mopping up for TKP.
Start new titans. Same guilds will compete.
Reduce titans, and same guilds will be even more competitive.
Change the titan hunting system and guess what?
I'm sure there are guys with better connections and faster computers, but if I can key-stroke faster and not "miss" the spot... I'm competitive. Even if my guild isn't. Yet. :wink:
#10
Posted 08 May 2011 - 17:54
I think a reasonable movement speed limiter would do a lot to level the field, just as the limit on attacks (once every 2 seconds) helped do. Many people hope the new map interface will impose such a limit - but not too low a limit. The fun of Titan hunting is based on the speed. It is not a part of the game you can effectively play while sipping on a stout. Making it too slow will make it no fun.
This is the best suggestion I have heard so far. What most of you have MISSED is that LW makes securing the 50%+ of the kills EASIER than it was before.
I'm not saying the top guilds don't have good teamwork, they have some of the best teamwork. I have spent some time trying to copy or improve upon that teamwork they demonstrate, since that is legit strategy. Some of their dominance comes from having more hunters out in the field and using zone areas on the maps to maximize kills. I have no issue with that at all.
I do not see the strategy in being able to move from one square on the map to the other side of the map in 1 to 2 seconds. Especially, when others who do not have the program or the hardware to implement the same advantages.
If they implemented this feature game wide for EVERYONE to use, I wouldn't have a problem with LW. understand that.
Your advocating that players with LW should have a HUGE ADVANTAGE over everyone else. how is that fair?
#11
Posted 08 May 2011 - 17:59
Wrong. Titan hunting was, is, and will always be dominated by dedicated guilds. That's the way it was before LW, that's the way it is now he have LW, and that's how it will always be. If you insist Titan hunt wasn't dominated by certain guilds before LW, I call Bull number 2.
I never said that. your putting words into my mouth. My claim is that it is far EASIER to secure the titan drop now than it was before LW. That isn't in the best interest for the game or for the players.
Before LW, the top guilds secured LESS 50%+ victories (say 1 out of 3 or 4) versus them now securing (say 1 out of 2) events. I would say that is an EDGE.
Everything else you said was just a Troll attempt to derail the argument, because you know I have a legit point.
#12
Posted 08 May 2011 - 18:12
Of course, you don't seem to be taking into account that there are thousands of other variables that play a part in titan hunting - and most of those can be improved on your end. For example, your reaction time. From the time that it takes you to look at the titan moving, to the time that it takes you to move your fingers .. that can make all the difference in titan hunting. PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE.
Another thing to consider is that some people will have an advantage geographically. There is nothing you can do about that - not until HCS makes its servers spread out world wide, at least. So deal with it :|
Also realize that the changes that you make to both your registry and your browser can greatly impact your speed - for better or for worse. Trial and error will give you the best results
There is also one thing approved by HCS that greatly reduces the time needed to click on the creature itself. But I ain't telling you what that is
My two.
#13
Posted 08 May 2011 - 18:16
LW isn't out of their control, in my opinion.
So I am to be punished for not automating my titan hunts. Nice ... (sarcasm)
Btw, I made this argument when LW first was introduced on the Forums and my stance hasn't changed since.
Just throwing this out there, but it seems like We are Legends and For Frack Sakes are the only ones advocating LW use. They tend to be the main users of LW in the first place.
#14
fs_tawebyrd
Posted 08 May 2011 - 18:36
No other part of the game is as dependant on real-life factors, because no other part of the game puts such a premium on speed. Titan hunting is real-time: jump on it as fast as you can, hunt as fast as you can. The rest of this game (other than sniping special and other open-priced items in the Auction House) is pretty relaxed by comparison. For some of us, it's the need for speed that makes Titan hunting addictive. That and the shiney baubles.
Lightwalk makes people faster. Whether it levels the field or not, it makes Titan hunting even more speed dependant. People with slow machines, slow connections or high ping times have a longer and harder row to hoe if they want a gold Titan Hunting medal as a result.
Melyana and I are among the faster hunters out there these days. We love the intensity of the hunt, we love competing against others who are just as fast. I personally would like it if MORE people were just as fast. I think the game would be better off if that were the case. But we can't educate everyone on how to tune their systrem for maximum speed, we can't get everyone a 3GHz dual-core systems with a pair of 21" monitors and an ergonomic gaming keypad, and we can't get everyone a 50mbps internet connection with half-decent ping times. So what can we do ?
What we CAN do is ask HC to simply limit how quickly people can move across the map to a reasonable number. To me, a reasonable number is finger speed - maybe 6 keystrokes per second. On a typical 16x16 active-area map like Dark Blade, that would mean it would take me 3 seconds to cross the map : enough time for someone already on the other side to at least get one or two kills before I arrive. Such a limit would eliminate any concerns about the super-human speed and accuracy that a script can achieve. And it would not slow down most hunters.
I think a reasonable movement speed limiter would do a lot to level the field, just as the limit on attacks (once every 2 seconds) helped do. Many people hope the new map interface will impose such a limit - but not too low a limit. The fun of Titan hunting is based on the speed. It is not a part of the game you can effectively play while sipping on a stout. Making it too slow will make it no fun.
Another thing HC (or FSH) could do is (as a user-controlled option) AJAXify the world map so that it only refreshes when something changes (the Titan moves or you move). It's a waste of client and server processor speed and of network bandwidth to keep reloading the map when nothing has changed."
THANKS LAWDOG YOU HAVE HIT THE NAIL SQUARELY ON THE HEAD WITH THIS POST and i could care less that all these scripts are legal or available to all why should i have to down load a bunch of stuff like this just to give me a better chance at a kill WHY isnt every one getting the same odds or advantages from INGAME
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#15
Posted 08 May 2011 - 19:07
1. Your claim is wrong. LW is only one part of Titan Hunting. There's a lot of other factors you just "conveniently" left out.Wrong. Titan hunting was, is, and will always be dominated by dedicated guilds. That's the way it was before LW, that's the way it is now he have LW, and that's how it will always be. If you insist Titan hunt wasn't dominated by certain guilds before LW, I call Bull number 2.
I never said that. your putting words into my mouth. My claim is that it is far EASIER to secure the titan drop now than it was before LW. That isn't in the best interest for the game or for the players.
Before LW, the top guilds secured LESS 50%+ victories (say 1 out of 3 or 4) versus them now securing (say 1 out of 2) events. I would say that is an EDGE.
Everything else you said was just a Troll attempt to derail the argument, because you know I have a legit point.
2. You didn't reply any of my arguments, just takes bits of it and use it to discredit me.
3. You threw us imaginary numbers which I know based purely on your imagination, and try to make it sounds like a fact. Gj.
There. I answer it nice, simple, and without much reasoning, just the way you like it.
Maybe I am a troll, but people seems to favor this troll than whine experts.
Gee I wonder why, I mean... we can't both be right, can't we? :|
#16
Posted 08 May 2011 - 20:17
You didn't answer why many guilds have stopped titan hunting after the introduction of LW. Perhaps, they couldn't use LW or didn't like the automation. See the logic?
#17
Posted 08 May 2011 - 20:42
Well ... this thread was never about convincing you. My point was to convince HCS.
You didn't answer why many guilds have stopped titan hunting after the introduction of LW. Perhaps, they couldn't use LW or didn't like the automation. See the logic?
You fail to recognize the fact that the same guilds who "stopped" never hunted in the first place! The most efficient, best organized guilds are almost always going to win the titans. Generally, that translates to big guilds. Titans were always a guild based activity - if your guild isn't good enough, maybe its time to consider upgrading
#18
fs_labaduba9
Posted 08 May 2011 - 20:59
Well ... this thread was never about convincing you. My point was to convince HCS.
You didn't answer why many guilds have stopped titan hunting after the introduction of LW. Perhaps, they couldn't use LW or didn't like the automation. See the logic?
If I remember correctly a long time ago.. no one titan hunted but FFS actually. In fact I see more guild on titans now then I have in my entire career playing this game. Stop complaining get organized with your guild and then try and titan hunt. We have 21 members in our guild, but still do pretty well on titans... especially considering only 4 of us hunt.
Titan hunting is not that difficult. Sorry that you don't have the experience or a fast enough connection to keep up. TItan hunting isn't for everyone. Honestly I just feel like all you're complaining about it you are not fast enough so you blame lightwalk. Well have fun when they remove it because the gap is only going to widen...
#19
Posted 08 May 2011 - 21:03
I can concede that I can see where LW might be script-able. I, frankly, am far too ignorant of software or networking to even begin to contemplate how.
However, count me as one, not in a "titan-hunting guild" that would hate to see LW go.
It has taken my regular hunts from hours to a matter of maybe 30 minutes.
I haven't tried SE hunting, but when I do I hope it's still there.
#20
fs_oblivion05
Posted 08 May 2011 - 21:49
Remove LW, I can guarantee you that people will then whine about people with faster connections are having an unfair advantage over the ones that don't have a fast connection, and we'll have this conversation all over again.
LW is helping people with slow connections to keep up more. The new map system however will prevent LW from being used, that's ok with me. 'Cause on that map everyone moves at the same speed so to speak, then you ain't need LW anymore. Everyone will be at equal speed. The main point will then be who can be more organized than other guilds that hunt.
My only concern on that new map system is that titan hunting will take at least 5x longer than it does now. It moves too slow. Watch, people will whine then about not having enough time to titan hunt actively lol. Anyways, to keep it short, if HCS speeds up movement on the new map, everything will be ok.
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