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Bounty Board Favors the PvPers -- here are some fixes


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#1 morderme

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 16:42

Most of us know that PvPers have no fear of losing XP. So, what do they cherish? For some, PvP rating; for others, Prestige points; for still others, just the gold. Lastly, there are just the miscreants. I can address the first three.

All these options could be included at an extra cost to place the bounty.

1.) Add an option so that the player clearing bounty takes/reduces PvP rating -- no matter the level player clearing the bounty.
2.) Add an option that clearing bounty can also reduce Prestige value.
3.) Add an option, "Pick Pocket", than can take gold from the bountied player's Bank -- up to 1% or 50,000, whichever is greater. The Pick Pocketed gold is lost, it doesn't go to a player. OR, it could be added to the "Gods" at the temple!
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For the miscreants who are just evil, or bullies, or both, not sure what to offer there. As anything else, this game too has evolved, and so why not this function. It is no longer a game of purely PvP, but one that many players enjoy for other reasons -- hunting, Arena, making Pots, etc -- that it is time the BB be changed to help those who don't have the riches others do, to keep the game going, to keep subscribership up and growing, to encourage more online players at any given time.

If you agree, or disagree, please let me know why, not just agree or disagree.

SORRY, just fixed the subject line -- shold be BOUNTY BOARD!

Thanks, so far, for the feedback. From past experience, looking at PvPers, equipped with gear that is much below the 5 level, de-leveling suggested, it just doesn't do enough to disuade.

So, the comments are a good start -- let's hear what counter-measures you're thinking of that could help the PvP target -- something beyond, and more creative, than suggesting a de-leveling party. Sure, the occaisional PvPer gets bountied and that solves the problem. However, just read the BIO of the "seasoned" PvPer -- they pretty much state that de-leveling doesn't bother them.

ADDED: Bounty Board definitely needs fixing in this area: You place a bounty, it hasn't cleared within the hour, and you get hit again, and you can't place another bounty! Let's change the BB so that you can place Bounties for every hit, any time, even from the same player when the current bounty hasn't cleared.

#2 Yeune

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 16:44

just no for all 3

#3 fs_liuskoj

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 16:49

No. Rating loss is would be too easily abused, prestige loss would mainly harm the levelers that pvp just for it and losing gold from bank would just stop players from banking it in the first place.

#4 morderme

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 18:30

No. Rating loss is would be too easily abused, prestige loss would mainly harm the levelers that pvp just for it and losing gold from bank would just stop players from banking it in the first place.


Yes, I figured on the last point...I don't think there is a fool proof method, but just trying to create some balance in the game. When players boast that getting bountied doesn't bother them, something's not working right.

#5 Maehdros

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 18:31

No. Rating loss is would be too easily abused, prestige loss would mainly harm the levelers that pvp just for it and losing gold from bank would just stop players from banking it in the first place.


Yes, I figured on the last point...I don't think there is a fool proof method, but just trying to create some balance in the game. When players boast that getting bountied doesn't bother them, something's not working right.



100 stam them a bunch and knock em outta some gear, and its gonna bother em ;)

#6 Kontiki

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 19:00

I hear this all the time, people claiming PvPers do not care about XP. It's probably one of the biggest false myths ever made up in Fallensword.
Some players hit 40 players a day. Not because they don't care about their XP, but because they know the risk/chance of losing the full possible 200 levels from this is practically non-existant. Losing even just 50 of these levels would be more than enough to make them think twice about risking that much again. They will lose access to gear and in most cases it'll make it nearly impossible to compete with other players in their range. When you take levels off a player that actively participate in PvP, you cripple and weaken them from playing the game at their full potential, until they either level back up or reset their level up points to get a new range.

If you place a bounty they will usually lose 20% of a level, which will not make much difference to them. If you got 4 guild mates together to 100 stam the attacker every single time, your guild will gain a reputation, and number of attacks against your guild would decrease drastically.

Its not about forcing anyone to PvP, its about dealing with PvP to avoid being a target. If people think that hitting you will result in 5 levels down, they wont hit unless they think its worth it.

So tired of the "PvPers don't care about XP" -excuse. MAKE them care!

#7 morderme

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 19:51

I hear this all the time, people claiming PvPers do not care about XP. It's probably one of the biggest false myths ever made up in Fallensword.
Some players hit 40 players a day. Not because they don't care about their XP, but because they know the risk/chance of losing the full possible 200 levels from this is practically non-existant. Losing even just 50 of these levels would be more than enough to make them think twice about risking that much again. They will lose access to gear and in most cases it'll make it nearly impossible to compete with other players in their range. When you take levels off a player that actively participate in PvP, you cripple and weaken them from playing the game at their full potential, until they either level back up or reset their level up points to get a new range.

If you place a bounty they will usually lose 20% of a level, which will not make much difference to them. If you got 4 guild mates together to 100 stam the attacker every single time, your guild will gain a reputation, and number of attacks against your guild would decrease drastically.

Its not about forcing anyone to PvP, its about dealing with PvP to avoid being a target. If people think that hitting you will result in 5 levels down, they wont hit unless they think its worth it.

So tired of the "PvPers don't care about XP" -excuse. MAKE them care!


Thanks, and that's a great start. However, there's enough gear out there to survive even a 5 level decrease.

#8 Maehdros

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 19:58

Thanks, and that's a great start. However, there's enough gear out there to survive even a 5 level decrease.



Taking 5 is just the tip of the iceberg. If someone bothers a guildy repeatedly, take_5_every_time.

#9 sweetlou

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 21:13

Thanks, and that's a great start. However, there's enough gear out there to survive even a 5 level decrease.

I read from this thread that you're tired of being attacked, your guildmates can't or won't take 5 from the attacker so you're looking for another way to punish an attacker. That's fine, but guess what? Making new ways to punish a player won't stop you from being attacked...

There needs to be more reward, especially for the stam cost, for taking 5 levels then more players would do it! Then the attacks would stop, or at least slow down...

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#10 morderme

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 22:24

Thanks, and that's a great start. However, there's enough gear out there to survive even a 5 level decrease.

I read from this thread that you're tired of being attacked, your guildmates can't or won't take 5 from the attacker so you're looking for another way to punish an attacker. That's fine, but guess what? Making new ways to punish a player won't stop you from being attacked...

There needs to be more reward, especially for the stam cost, for taking 5 levels then more players would do it! Then the attacks would stop, or at least slow down...


A quick survey of the top 3 PvPers from each ladder range shows that their gear is at least 10 levels aways from their VL, so again, a 5 level de-leveling party really doesn't affect a PvPer like that -- whether on the ladder or not. In fact, being de-leveled only helpss -- the PvPer gets to hunt and accumulate more gold -- on top of what they steal.

It gets back to what's important to a PvPer -- rating, prestige, gold -- one or more or all. Those are the things that need to be addressed - penalized - against a PvPer.

#11 evilbry

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Posted 18 September 2011 - 22:31

It gets back to what's important to a PvPer -- rating, prestige, gold -- one or more or all. Those are the things that need to be addressed - penalized - against a PvPer.

None of the above :)

#12 fs_musjacom

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 05:01

So, the comments are a good start -- let's hear what counter-measures you're thinking of that could help the PvP target -- something beyond, and more creative, than suggesting a de-leveling party. Sure, the occaisional PvPer gets bountied and that solves the problem. However, just read the BIO of the "seasoned" PvPer -- they pretty much state that de-leveling doesn't bother them.


If you can't beat a system, just join it! If you think PvP'ers have an easier life and all the advantages in this game then become a PvP'er. Simple. :lol:

#13 sweetlou

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 08:03

[...]so again, a 5 level de-leveling party really doesn't affect a PvPer like that -- whether on the ladder or not. In fact, being de-leveled only helpss -- the PvPer gets to hunt and accumulate more gold -- on top of what they steal.

Are you making this up?
Are these ideas from a poll?
From vast experience?

Because your summations are all wrong. As KJ mentioned earlier, it is a myth that players who PvP don't care about xp/levels. It's an impossible generalization. Also, it costs gold to sublevel under your VL unless you're fighting your virtual level's mob(ie in your VL realm). You don't accumulate more gold. As I mentioned earlier, you could see all 3 of your ideas implemented and you would still be attacked as often. Until your guildmates can defend you you will continue playing the "ROLL" of the victim. I'd ask for players to be rewarded to delevel players. You might get somewhere. Or you might find guildmates that don't play so selfishly as to defend you with their stam and then you get to defend them as well. Whaaat's that called? Oh yeah, teamwork. Upon something this game is based.

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#14 morderme

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 13:40

[...]so again, a 5 level de-leveling party really doesn't affect a PvPer like that -- whether on the ladder or not. In fact, being de-leveled only helpss -- the PvPer gets to hunt and accumulate more gold -- on top of what they steal.

Are you making this up?
Are these ideas from a poll?
From vast experience?

Because your summations are all wrong. As KJ mentioned earlier, it is a myth that players who PvP don't care about xp/levels. It's an impossible generalization. Also, it costs gold to sublevel under your VL unless you're fighting your virtual level's mob(ie in your VL realm). You don't accumulate more gold. As I mentioned earlier, you could see all 3 of your ideas implemented and you would still be attacked as often. Until your guildmates can defend you you will continue playing the "ROLL" of the victim. I'd ask for players to be rewarded to delevel players. You might get somewhere. Or you might find guildmates that don't play so selfishly as to defend you with their stam and then you get to defend them as well. Whaaat's that called? Oh yeah, teamwork. Upon something this game is based.


Look, a fact of life and my experience with PvPers:

1.) I have been asked for 100 stam hits by PvPers so they can stay below a level, and/or be reduced several levels. This has been especially true when clearing bounties.
2.) Read enough PvPer BIOs and a common boast is (or has been) “they are not afraid to lose levels”.
3.) Again, look at PvPers gear sets – often times more, much more than 5 levels below the VL for that player.

Yes, the BB is there as “retribution”, but it is not sufficient and has not kept up with changes to the game. Nothing against PvPers (not too much, anyway), except that non-PvPers need a better and more effective set of options to hit back on PvPers.

1.) Just attempting to hit back on a PvPer risks a bounty itself.
2.) Many times, the PvPer has far superior gear, so that placing a bounty for a de-leveling party may not be as effective as believed (if your friends cannot hit the player either). Yes, get better friends, blah, blah, blah… Therefore, higher level players hitting the bounty target only serve to help clear the bounty, not reduce PvP Rating – that’s a fact. No big deal to the PvPer.
3.) PvPers who do it for the prestige…pretty much the same thing applies as the second item above, so why not have bounty options to address that as well…

And, regardless of the suggested bounty options, the PvP target still has to pay out to “hit back” – a double whammy on the pocket-book. That is, first time, loss of XP and $$$; second time, pay out $$$ to place the bounty – either as the system exists or with any improvements.

So, what would you suggest to improve the BB?

#15 fs_musjacom

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 14:40

the BB is there as “retribution”, but it is not sufficient


I thought it is a luxury option for players who want “retribution” so badly. No bounty can be placed without Bounty Tickets that are available for FSPs in the Character Upgrade section. "Fallen Sword Points allow you to gain extra upgrades to your character." This is an extra option, when you don't want to risk with your own levels. The normal option is to hit your attacker back using free stamina. Every attacker reads this before hitting someone: " If you do attack another player, they will have the option to place a bounty upon you." The key word is 'option'.

#16 fs_amonkfish

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 16:24

[...]so again, a 5 level de-leveling party really doesn't affect a PvPer like that -- whether on the ladder or not. In fact, being de-leveled only helpss -- the PvPer gets to hunt and accumulate more gold -- on top of what they steal.

Are you making this up?
Are these ideas from a poll?
From vast experience?

Because your summations are all wrong. As KJ mentioned earlier, it is a myth that players who PvP don't care about xp/levels. It's an impossible generalization. Also, it costs gold to sublevel under your VL unless you're fighting your virtual level's mob(ie in your VL realm). You don't accumulate more gold. As I mentioned earlier, you could see all 3 of your ideas implemented and you would still be attacked as often. Until your guildmates can defend you you will continue playing the "ROLL" of the victim. I'd ask for players to be rewarded to delevel players. You might get somewhere. Or you might find guildmates that don't play so selfishly as to defend you with their stam and then you get to defend them as well. Whaaat's that called? Oh yeah, teamwork. Upon something this game is based.


Exactumondo, as the Fonz would say. I PvP a lot. I've got a good 13 level buffer right now for my essential gear. I use most of stam for PvP. I play the ladder and hit for gold and clear bounties and help allies, etc. But I'm gonna care if I lose 5 for every hit I make. A lot. I'm gonna start caring when I lose even one level for every hit. Just to reiterate what's been said - if you want me to stop taking your gold, give me a reason to stop. There a list of guilds I know that will take 5 from me if I hit for any reason. So you better believe that I'm not hitting them hoping to get a few 100K. Like kjeften said, give me a reason to care. I don't understand how people can complain about thieves, then put them up for minimum gold on the BB and wonder why they keep hitting. If I hit you, I deserve whatever I get.

Think of this way, most PvPers dislike leveling. I can't stand it. But if I keep losing levels, eventually I'm gonna have to level. Trust me, that's a far worse punishment than anything.

#17 Ryebred

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 16:48

Well duh...of course it favors the PvPers - you do have to PvP to BH.....I propose taking 5 fix...it works wonders..a friend who did it once told me it really detours those filthy thieves

#18 morderme

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 19:37

[...]so again, a 5 level de-leveling party really doesn't affect a PvPer like that -- whether on the ladder or not. In fact, being de-leveled only helpss -- the PvPer gets to hunt and accumulate more gold -- on top of what they steal.

Are you making this up?
Are these ideas from a poll?
From vast experience?

Because your summations are all wrong. As KJ mentioned earlier, it is a myth that players who PvP don't care about xp/levels. It's an impossible generalization. Also, it costs gold to sublevel under your VL unless you're fighting your virtual level's mob(ie in your VL realm). You don't accumulate more gold. As I mentioned earlier, you could see all 3 of your ideas implemented and you would still be attacked as often. Until your guildmates can defend you you will continue playing the "ROLL" of the victim. I'd ask for players to be rewarded to delevel players. You might get somewhere. Or you might find guildmates that don't play so selfishly as to defend you with their stam and then you get to defend them as well. Whaaat's that called? Oh yeah, teamwork. Upon something this game is based.


No, I am not making this up...this is what I have seen first hand in the game. PvP rating is important to those ont he ladder; Prestige is important to others just PvPing -- both achivements are integral to the game -- so those rules were made up a long time ago.

The real issue is bringing some balance into the game versus PvP.

1.) One response was: just hit them back! Well certainly – if you have the gear set with stats that are competitive, but that is often NOT the case. So, I am sure, the BB was born.
2.) The post is about adding options to bountying a player. Clearly, many of those within the range of the PvPer do NOT have the gear to match the PvPer, so clearing the bounty is left to higher levelers. When that happens, no Ratings loss. Period. And therefore the effects of the BB are greatly diminished.
3.) It is no fiction that players have asked to be hit; 100 stam hits; to remain at or below the desired level. Therefore, XPs are not as important as the PvP rating gained (for the ladderites); and the Prestige gained by other PvPers for the leveling boost during hunts. Thise are just facts associated with those activities.

So, if players cannot hit back, or prefer not to hit back, taking advantage of the BB is an option they have -- also part of the game. So really, the comments about where am I getting this information from are real and are from experience. What I am hearing is that improving the BB – or something along those lines – is upsetting to those who practice the fine art of PvPing, and maybe we are onto something concerning PvP Rating loss and Prestige loss…

#19 morderme

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 19:44

[...]so again, a 5 level de-leveling party really doesn't affect a PvPer like that -- whether on the ladder or not. In fact, being de-leveled only helpss -- the PvPer gets to hunt and accumulate more gold -- on top of what they steal.

Are you making this up?
Are these ideas from a poll?
From vast experience?

Because your summations are all wrong. As KJ mentioned earlier, it is a myth that players who PvP don't care about xp/levels. It's an impossible generalization. Also, it costs gold to sublevel under your VL unless you're fighting your virtual level's mob(ie in your VL realm). You don't accumulate more gold. As I mentioned earlier, you could see all 3 of your ideas implemented and you would still be attacked as often. Until your guildmates can defend you you will continue playing the "ROLL" of the victim. I'd ask for players to be rewarded to delevel players. You might get somewhere. Or you might find guildmates that don't play so selfishly as to defend you with their stam and then you get to defend them as well. Whaaat's that called? Oh yeah, teamwork. Upon something this game is based.


Nope -- not making it up -- have experienced it first hand. PvP rating is important for the ladder; Prestige a result of successful PvP hits -- both part of the game. Not sure that a PvPer on the ladder will come at you again if you were successful in taking away their PvP rating -- some would, some wouldn't. However, if you were an "easy" mark the first time, maybe they would think twice next time around. Same goes for Prestige.

And no, don't think PvPers have is "easy", but I do think they have, in many cases, a great advantage over those they pursue.

#20 morderme

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Posted 19 September 2011 - 19:47

Thanks, and that's a great start. However, there's enough gear out there to survive even a 5 level decrease.

I read from this thread that you're tired of being attacked, your guildmates can't or won't take 5 from the attacker so you're looking for another way to punish an attacker. That's fine, but guess what? Making new ways to punish a player won't stop you from being attacked...

There needs to be more reward, especially for the stam cost, for taking 5 levels then more players would do it! Then the attacks would stop, or at least slow down...


I don't think you are handing anyone a "WIN" key...but you are handing a player options to clear bounties that can be meaningful.


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