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Suggestions for PVP possible Revision 7


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#1 Leos3000

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 21:56

If we are going to FIX pvp lets address all the aspects and make everything work and move on to other parts of the game.

1st No Opt Out, Only PVP protection at a discounted Rate

PVP Protection:
-Protect a Maximum of 10 Million Gold Regardless of Players Level (when this is dependent on players level it is often unfair and confusing to players who are newer to the game, it is also unfair as it allows higher levels to manipulate the market more then others)

-Costs: 24 hrs(3 FSP), 7 days(15 FSP), 30 Days(50 FSP)

PVP Prestige:

-Change the amount of prestige People get per hit dependent on Stamina used

-10 Stamina hit gets 1 Prestige point

-100 Stamina hit gets 10 Prestige points

-Round down to the nearest point for any other stam used (19 stam = 1 point)

-This is for every attack Bounty Board or normal PVP

-Change to a 24 Hour Limit for normal pvp


PVP Attacks:

-Based on Stamina Used

-Defender Never Gains anything

-Winning Attack Gains: PVP points, Prestige, and Gold according to Stam used

-Losing Attacker: Loses 3x the PVP points, Gold and XP (this is a must to encourage people
to try and defend themselves as well as keep people from blindly hitting all the time, it also
keeps pvp bands with in the top 10 more competitive, and there NEEDS to be a reason to
defend)

-Everyone Starts Each Reset with a 0 Rating

-PvP Rating Gain = floor(Stamina Used * 0.5) + (floor(Stamina Used * 0.5) * (Opponent PvP Rating / Your PvP Rating))

-People with a 0 rating are always subject to 50% reduction to XP and Gold loss

Bounty Board:
-2x Xp loss for Defender

- .5 XP loss if the attacker losses (there is risk in normal pvp, there should be some risk to xp
for bounty hunters as well, to keep people from abusing the bounty system and just blindly
hitting on a bounty hoping to either steal buffs, or get lucky and win once, but to
encourage bonuty hunters this is at a lesser rate then normal)

-PvP Rating Gain = floor(Stamina Used * 0.1) * (Opponent Level / Your Level) + (10 * (Wins / (Wins + Loses)))

-change the ticket system


Leveling:

-Make Risking levels more appropriate

-Add a system that allows people to gain levels back a little easier
(My proposal is to add code that gives a person who has been deleveled bonuses to Xp according to how many levels they are
below their VL)

-10% extra XP per level Below your VL up to a Maximum of 100% (this means being 5 levels Below your VL you get 50% more Xp per kill on what ever
creature you are hunting, or anything 10+ levels below your VL gives a 100% bonus while hunting, i.e 2x xp until you get to less then 10 levels below
your VL)

-This should encourage more people to PVP as the risk is slightly lowered, and allows players to regain levels lost at a little faster rate (it does not let anyone level faster, just reagain
what was lost at a faster rate.)

General PVP:

-Increase the Thivery rate to 2x what it is now so 20% for 100 stam, 2% for a 10 stam

-To offset this Increase the Rate protect gold kicks in to 2x what it is

-Change Sealed to Only work for Defending like erosion, and deflect

-Change Gloat/Honor to take/protect Gold

-If you block someone they can not Buff you


Rewards:
-Add 4 or 5 Potions to be purchased via tokens
-Add 7-10 New sets from 100-1400

#2 evilbry

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 22:00

Leveling:

-Make Risking levels more appropriate

-Add a system that allows people to gain levels back a little easier
(My proposal is to add code that gives a person who has been deleveled bonuses to Xp according to how many levels they are
below their VL)

So by 'risking' levels, you suggest removing the risk?

Besides, isn't leveling easy enough as it it?
The cows have also significantly dropped the amount of stam required for levels (with level 1200 buffs, and from the last couple of contents.)

#3 fs_scrogger

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 22:08

Leveling:

-Make Risking levels more appropriate

-Add a system that allows people to gain levels back a little easier
(My proposal is to add code that gives a person who has been deleveled bonuses to Xp according to how many levels they are
below their VL)



There is already a very effective way to regain lost levels, DO NOT use all your LUP. I currently can lose 10 levels without fear of underleveling.

To be honest however, PvP is about risk, making it easier to regain levels is not needed in any way shape or form.

#4 Maehdros

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 22:11

Some of it sounds ok, I'm curious as to the xp loss for ten stam - 100 stams? In the past you wanted it reduced.

In this idea it would only apply to hits against 0 rated players? so .5 to 5% of a level for a 10 - 100 stam hit. And normal pvp hits against others with rating are 1 - 10% of a level?


Also your suggestion of 50% xp loss for ALL 0 rated hits would be fine on the FIRST hit. If theres less xp loss for all hits.. then pvp protection shouldnt BE cheap. And reducing gold loss by 50% will KILL pvp hits ;) Leave it at 100% gold loss.


Tweaking the PG enhancement isnt needed. Not with deflect and pvp protection.



As for an easier way to gain levels back. WHY? Players are complaining there is no punishment on the BB. Enabling levels to be gained back easier wont make things better. RISK is a good thing. Players dont want to delevel someone twice..only to have them gain the level back twice as fast ;) thats pointless.

#5 Leos3000

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 22:17



Leveling:

-Make Risking levels more appropriate

-Add a system that allows people to gain levels back a little easier
(My proposal is to add code that gives a person who has been deleveled bonuses to Xp according to how many levels they are
below their VL)

So by 'risking' levels, you suggest removing the risk?

Besides, isn't leveling easy enough as it it?
The cows have also significantly dropped the amount of stam required for levels (with level 1200 buffs, and from the last couple of contents.)


Hardly.... just lowering the risk to a more appropiate level, as well as possibly make it more fun to relevel as you could do it a little faster.

1 PVP hit could potentially cost someone 5 levels correct? Ranging anywhere from 500 stam to 25,000 stamina to gain them back, so very few want to "risk" that, but if there was a small aide to help people who lose levels some may be more willing to "risk" them.

#6 Maehdros

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 22:30

but if there was a small aide to help people who lose levels some may be more willing to "risk" them.




10% pvp prestige. Thats help..right?

#7 Leos3000

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 22:40

Some of it sounds ok, I'm curious as to the xp loss for ten stam - 100 stams? In the past you wanted it reduced.


Eh that was more for overall players I don't mind losing xp, it may or may not have brought more people into pvp that way, but maybe just having a solid system will instead.

In this idea it would only apply to hits against 0 rated players? so .5 to 5% of a level for a 10 - 100 stam hit. And normal pvp hits against others with rating are 1 - 10% of a level?


Also your suggestion of 50% xp loss for ALL 0 rated hits would be fine on the FIRST hit. If theres less xp loss for all hits.. then pvp protection shouldnt BE cheap. And reducing gold loss by 50% will KILL pvp hits ;) Leave it at 100% gold loss.
[/quote
Reduction is only for 0 rated Players, I guess it could strictly be for XP, but still think that the 50% reduction would always occur for 0 rated players, and why I said 50 instead of 75 like in the other thread for a single hit.



As for an easier way to gain levels back. WHY? Players are complaining there is no punishment on the BB. Enabling levels to be gained back easier wont make things better. RISK is a good thing. Players dont want to delevel someone twice..only to have them gain the level back twice as fast ;) thats pointless.


Well hopefully with a system set up that encourages many to take bounties for pvp points there will be some retribution, and with more people hitting a lot I thought a little extra incentive couldnt hurt

Just curious other then the leveling aspect does the rest sound reasonable? and agreeable

#8 evilbry

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 22:56



Leveling:

-Make Risking levels more appropriate

-Add a system that allows people to gain levels back a little easier
(My proposal is to add code that gives a person who has been deleveled bonuses to Xp according to how many levels they are
below their VL)

So by 'risking' levels, you suggest removing the risk?

Besides, isn't leveling easy enough as it it?
The cows have also significantly dropped the amount of stam required for levels (with level 1200 buffs, and from the last couple of contents.)


Hardly.... just lowering the risk to a more appropiate level, as well as possibly make it more fun to relevel as you could do it a little faster.

1 PVP hit could potentially cost someone 5 levels correct? Ranging anywhere from 500 stam to 25,000 stamina to gain them back, so very few want to "risk" that, but if there was a small aide to help people who lose levels some may be more willing to "risk" them.

Still fail to see a valid argument. Not needed in any way whatsoever. Gaining levels is easier than it ever has been. By this idea, you are effectively reducing the 'punishment' of the bounty board. I'm sure levelers will love that. Being hit more and more.

But sure if you like win keys, I am sure there will be some support. *shrugs*

#9 RD1542

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Posted 06 October 2011 - 22:59

my biggest suggestion to revision 7 is how it is layed out, why are we trying to find all the answers to multiple problems in the same thread at the same time, it becomes a dissorganised mess with really no direction.

start multiple threads, if xp loss is to be tweaked, not tweaked, starta thread for that, so we can put 1 trhing to bed at a time..
want to make ladder suggestions, don;t bury it with everything else, start a thread on it,, some form of organization and segregation from ideas in multiple threads just may help us find some solutions much faster,.

we may have been able to come up with some solutions to some of the revisions and instead of recreating the wheel each time, we can find answers to 1 thing at a time, i am so lost in what may have been accomplished between rev 4 5 and 6 is redicilous..

also maybe before an official thread is made, maybe the devs can have someone come on and snip out the useless banter, childish name calling and titan talk and what not, in what i hope maybe a few different rev 7 threads so people can follow it.

also some bugs i am hoping are fixed between now and then. also an answer on sealed may be nice too, as am sure many of us will just throw in the towel and not even bother to help fix a broken pvp system that will stay broke.

PVP Protection:
-Protect a Maximum of 10 Million Gold Regardless of Players Level (when this is dependent on players level it is often unfair and confusing to players who are newer to the game, it is also unfair as it allows higher levels to manipulate the market more then others)

-Costs: 24 hrs(3 FSP), 7 days(15 FSP), 30 Days(50 FSP)


absolutly not, will have players with 10 multies holding 10 mill gold playing the market at the same time,

-10 Stamina hit gets 1 Prestige point


this may stop the few mostly level minded players to stop dabbling in pvp ona lilited basis, i think it is currently fine as it is.

Rewards:
-Add 4 or 5 Potions to be purchased via tokens
-Add 7-10 New sets from 100-1400


i would also like to see new potions and equipment, i would also like to see a new token, or a version 2 token released so that everyone who wants these new potions, equipment will have to participate in the new ladders to start making these new items, potions.

#10 shindrak

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 13:01



So by 'risking' levels, you suggest removing the risk?

Besides, isn't leveling easy enough as it it?
The cows have also significantly dropped the amount of stam required for levels (with level 1200 buffs, and from the last couple of contents.)


Hardly.... just lowering the risk to a more appropiate level, as well as possibly make it more fun to relevel as you could do it a little faster.

1 PVP hit could potentially cost someone 5 levels correct? Ranging anywhere from 500 stam to 25,000 stamina to gain them back, so very few want to "risk" that, but if there was a small aide to help people who lose levels some may be more willing to "risk" them.

Still fail to see a valid argument. Not needed in any way whatsoever. Gaining levels is easier than it ever has been. By this idea, you are effectively reducing the 'punishment' of the bounty board. I'm sure levelers will love that. Being hit more and more.

But sure if you like win keys, I am sure there will be some support. *shrugs*

Sure pvper's wants their own win key too...every change on ladder didn't work on the way they like so they want it to change for the way they want... that's what i know from reading all this posts in forum.
current ladder is fine but we need a change to make more engage in pvp not one group dominate it against easy targets...

#11 Maehdros

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 13:13

current ladder is fine but we need a change to make more engage in pvp not one group dominate it against easy targets...



If the current ladder allowed hits every 2 minutes against those WITH rating ( ie: similar to being able to dance against someone on the BB) , didnt allow rating to be traded, based rating gain on stam used and the sealed/fist fight buffs were removed... it would be fun ;)

Until then i guess in order to have fun dancing between sets against players is either gvg or the BB.


As for one group dominating it, do you mean those who dont care about xp? And those who have PvP'd since the beginning of the game? Before rewards?

#12 shindrak

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 14:29


current ladder is fine but we need a change to make more engage in pvp not one group dominate it against easy targets...



If the current ladder allowed hits every 2 minutes against those WITH rating ( ie: similar to being able to dance against someone on the BB) , didnt allow rating to be traded, based rating gain on stam used and the sealed/fist fight buffs were removed... it would be fun ;)

Until then i guess in order to have fun dancing between sets against players is either gvg or the BB.


As for one group dominating it, do you mean those who dont care about xp? And those who have PvP'd since the beginning of the game? Before rewards?

before rewards and now same you still can hit for gold ...
Many players don't care about xp, but the problem imo is about who's online more the ones who win the competition... so you say who says i don't care about xp is real pvper?
and about sealed i voted for removing it since its unfair OP buff ...but fist fight still fair since its work for both sides

#13 Maehdros

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 14:41

the problem imo is about who's online more the ones who win the competition...



The more active someone is, the more rating they will have. I don't see a problem with that.it's the same with arena, for entering tournaments, and its the same for titans for hunting them all the time. the more a player plays..the more they can or might be rewarded.


The new system hoof is tweaking ( and mentioned showing us soon) promotes hitting players with rating. it promotes activity.It hopefully will promote more gold hits ( in my opinon the core of pvp is gold and xp loss)

#14 douglasj

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 14:42

Sounds good to me im a leveler and an aspiring pvper so i will join pvp ladders when a fix is made.

Its all looks fair to pvpers & Levelrs, i was a little unsure about levelers getting an xp advantage and it may need a little tweaking.

As for tickets either make them available to be bought with gold and be able to bought a certain amounts like 10 tickets, 100 tickets, 500, 1000.....Etc

#15 Bleltch

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 14:46

Them being online more than most is only part of the problem. The players with the best of the best equipment, and the ability to keep massive buffs and potions running the majority of the day adds to the lopsided effect. If not caring about exp loss was the only deciding factor of winning the pvp ladder i would be dominating. So would at least a dozen other pvpers i know, but they dont even bother either because they know they have minimal chance at doing well.

The system needs to be evened out, not more segregation as most of the ladder threads would cause.

#16 shindrak

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 14:57

the problem imo is about who's online more the ones who win the competition...



The more active someone is, the more rating they will have. I don't see a problem with that.it's the same with arena, for entering tournaments, and its the same for titans for hunting them all the time. the more a player plays..the more they can or might be rewarded.


The new system hoof is tweaking ( and mentioned showing us soon) promotes hitting players with rating. it promotes activity.It hopefully will promote more gold hits ( in my opinon the core of pvp is gold and xp loss)

Hmmm you say if someone offline cant win in arena? Arena most fair competition in this game man..wish they make it move faster to increase activity... and yes pvp and titans most unfair parts in game cuz of that.. titan isn't about who stays online win it... its about who got faster connection win it.. i saw 1-2 players from one guild beating 10 players from other guild...
so non of ur replay make sense man to whats going around in unfair pvp

#17 Maehdros

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 15:03

so non of ur replay make sense man to whats going around in unfair pvp



I said the more active you are, the more you can achieve. It's common sense shin. in ANY aspect of the game. The more you play, the more you win, the more your rewarded, the better you get at that aspect. etc. ;)


Players who play alot can win alot. That's how it should be? Activity? correct?


The suggestion of cumulative scoring.. an ever increasing rating system is good. Thos first out of the gate and actively pvping..be it bounties, gold hits, 100 stams randmoly..or prestige hits.. THEY will be tops on the ladder. They cant lose rating unless they HIT someone and lose. You would only gain rating from hitting someone else. Ie: you have to PvP. The more you hit, the higher ranked you are. The more active and online you are..the more you can hit.


The current system can be won simply in 2 or 3 hours by a player 100 stam gloating someone in their ladder after 24 hours have passed. No risk of a bounty unless they tinkled that player off..and still rarely ever are ladder hits posted. The opt out from pvp ladder Killed the BB, along with pvp protection on gold limits.

#18 Bleltch

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 16:07

I said the more active you are, the more you can achieve. It's common sense shin. in ANY aspect of the game. The more you play, the more you win, the more your rewarded, the better you get at that aspect. etc. ;)


Players who play alot can win alot. That's how it should be? Activity? correct?


It sounds good in theory doesn't it? In actual practice it drives most players away from the ladder as they know they have very little chance of winning. The pvp ladder as it is right now is the best it's going to get without some major change that makes it resemble pvp but little.

#19 KitiaraLi

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 17:33

Why make a thread for suggestions to revision 7? Was there anything wrong with the suggestions n discussions in revision 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6?


I will await the official revision 7.

No one can deny that we changed this game and influenced it in such a way that NO ONE could compete with us.. so much so that they changed the rules. ~Abhorrence, chosen founder of Cerulean Sins


#20 Maehdros

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 17:36



I said the more active you are, the more you can achieve. It's common sense shin. in ANY aspect of the game. The more you play, the more you win, the more your rewarded, the better you get at that aspect. etc. ;)


Players who play alot can win alot. That's how it should be? Activity? correct?


It sounds good in theory doesn't it? In actual practice it drives most players away from the ladder as they know they have very little chance of winning. The pvp ladder as it is right now is the best it's going to get without some major change that makes it resemble pvp but little.




Well I`m sorry it isnt easy bleltch *shrugs*


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