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#1 Chazz224

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 21:58

I've purchased the new recipes for all of our new Epics....

First I'd like to thank HCS for creating new epics for various levels... +1 - Very awesome ! =D

However, the bad news...
Most of theses Epics cost far too much RP to invent... Due to which not many are going to invent them at all. To make matters worse, the stats on all of theses new epics are good enough. Given the buffs that are available to us all, we are in a new age/error of fallen sword where it's overdue for players to see " Epic Sets not epic items" other wise not many are gonna have any interest in such epics.

Stam gain is great, the idea some of the new epics offer as much as 4 stam per hour is also great ! However the numbers are useless to all levels... I'm not saying this to just complain, I'm saying this to help our devs make improvements within the game.

If HCS has no intent on making " Epic Sets" than the Epics that are " NEW & Created/ Invented" have to be desirable in one fashion or another. Meaning that such Epics provide stats that are desirable. Please note that buffs like Coord Attack will NOT work if a player is using an Epic. There for the numbers on any such item should be just as good ... if not better, other wise ... what is epic about the item? Stam gain? No ... there are enough items for stam gain... and although Stam gain is nice, if players are gonna have to slave for 2500 RP or 3000 RP they want to be compensated for all that time, and so far I don't see that.

It might be in the best interest of the game to :

A) Lower the cost of such epics slightly from 2500 or 3000 RP to perhaps 1200 or 1800. Please understand that only 5 to 10 RP is awarded for Gvg's " WINS" ... Given buffs used, stam used, time spent. None of the Epic items are worth what was put into trying to get them... This should be fixed.

B) Beef up the numbers on theses Epics some, by a 40% margin at least so everyone wants them, " IF " there is no intent on creating EPIC SETS for players to use.

Another suggestion I'd like to share regarding Epics, is that the Writing ward was and still is a very successful Epic. Many use it and desire it. It's very likely that if " NEW " Epics were created in a similar fashion and also considering the ideas above, Epics would also be much more desirable.

My thoughts, feel free to share your own everyone... Opinions are welcomed.

- Chazz

#2 grimnok

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 22:13

Epic sets would make them more desirable, even with minimal set bonuses. These new epics have essentially 0 use for leveling, and they would not be all that great even if the stats were doubled. This point has been brought up before.

The lower ones have some arena value, but by and large, when inventing or purchasing these items, the only significant value is the stam gain bonus. If you hold them long enough, they will pay off in the (very) long run. Depending on the price of the RP components, it may take upwards of 2 years to pay off. Or, you may hit the Inv 2 jackpot.

#3 DragonLord

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 22:18

NO to epic sets. The epics are powerful enough as it is ... Sheesh, you want the extra stam/xp gains AS WELL as them being uber-powerful for hunting ?

The game is too damned easy as it is, without dumbing it down even further ... Keep the new epics, by all means, but for heavens sakes, NO EPIC SETS...

#4 grimnok

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 22:24

NO to epic sets. The epics are powerful enough as it is ... Sheesh, you want the extra stam/xp gains AS WELL as them being uber-powerful for hunting ?

The game is too damned easy as it is, without dumbing it down even further ... Keep the new epics, by all means, but for heavens sakes, NO EPIC SETS...


I don't see anyone saying uber-powerful for hunting. How about, worth considering for 5 seconds, before choosing an uber-powerful Crystalline set?

#5 DragonLord

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 22:27

NO to epic sets. The epics are powerful enough as it is ... Sheesh, you want the extra stam/xp gains AS WELL as them being uber-powerful for hunting ?

The game is too damned easy as it is, without dumbing it down even further ... Keep the new epics, by all means, but for heavens sakes, NO EPIC SETS...


I don't see anyone saying uber-powerful for hunting. How about, worth considering for 5 seconds, before choosing an uber-powerful Crystalline set?


If the epics were made into sets, they'd have even more bonuses right ? - otherwise, what's the point in them being made into sets ? - so, regardless of whether they become better as a whole on stam/xp gain, or increase their stats for hunting/pvp/gvg/whatever, I still say no - 'cos they're powerful enough as they are.

Fortunately, BG has repeatedly said that there won't be epic sets ... let's hope this is one of those irrefutable statements :)

#6 Maehdros

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 22:47

NO to epic sets. The epics are powerful enough as it is ... Sheesh, you want the extra stam/xp gains AS WELL as them being uber-powerful for hunting ?

The game is too damned easy as it is, without dumbing it down even further ... Keep the new epics, by all means, but for heavens sakes, NO EPIC SETS...



+ 1 they are already great for stam gain and highly valuable... asking for them to be made into sets is simply an attempt to add more value to them, nothing more.

#7 RD1542

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 22:50

i would have to say no to epic sets as well, the stam gain and other enhancements are what make these epics valuable, that and arena use, but i think these bonuses should come at a price, and i think that the lack of good stats for defense, or offence in PVP is where these should stop.

i like it that way, either you can dress for good stats for defense in pvp, for relic defense, for help in groups, or you can sit in stam gain and help nothing and nobody in your crap stats epic stam gear gaining stamina for your next hunt. . i think it works well that way.

as for leveling, there has not been a challenge to leveling in ages, you hardly have to use even as much as a brain cell to level efficiently and 1 hit in almost all levels in the game under, i cant remember now, 1300 maybe?


i do agree on the cost, although i havent looked at a recipe yet, 3K RP is quite a lot to spend. will be great for the gvg multis though as they will continue to dominate this part of the market.

#8 Chazz224

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 15:32

NO to epic sets. The epics are powerful enough as it is ... Sheesh, you want the extra stam/xp gains AS WELL as them being uber-powerful for hunting ?

The game is too damned easy as it is, without dumbing it down even further ... Keep the new epics, by all means, but for heavens sakes, NO EPIC SETS...



Epics are over powering? ROFLMAO You can't be serious? No one uses Epics to hunt with anymore because the stats are not as strong as any regular set with Smashing Hammer and Coordinated Attack. Those buffs are awesome, they work they way they are suppose to work and in which allows players to add up much stronger and better numbers without using Epics.

So considering Epics are no longer good for hunting, are they good for PvP at least? Answer is No... They are not even good for PvP for the same reason they are no good for hunting. No one uses Epics for hunting, no one uses Epics for Pvp, and Epics and only some of them have minimum use in the arena... But yet they are over powering? No ... you are wrong Pardoux, yes you are entitled to your opinion but just to say Epics are over powering and still at this time broken you are wrong. Epics are useless outside of gaining stam...and that is a FACT... :roll:

Epic sets would make them more desirable, even with minimal set bonuses. These new epics have essentially 0 use for leveling, and they would not be all that great even if the stats were doubled. This point has been brought up before.

The lower ones have some arena value, but by and large, when inventing or purchasing these items, the only significant value is the stam gain bonus. If you hold them long enough, they will pay off in the (very) long run. Depending on the price of the RP components, it may take upwards of 2 years to pay off. Or, you may hit the Inv 2 jackpot.


+1 Grimnok

You are sadly correct... Epics are only needed for stam gain, No one needs or desires them too much anymore, as they are garbage and no good for hunting or PvP.... :cry:

I'm not looking for a win button. Yes, with current in game buffs things have been proven to be easy. However this could change as well... HCS just needs to beef up some creatures and help force people to put a little more thought into hunting. However none of that changes the value of Epics... Epics are so post to be broken, they are so post to be over powering items which every wishes they had and everyone desires. However as I said they are none of the above ... Hence why I'm asking HCS to put the " epic" back into the game " EPICS" ... I'm pointing towards newer epics... Not at 3000 RP either...

New Epic Sets preferable... that are just as affordable as older Epics perhaps. A few Epics that are invented the same way the Writing ward was would be nice. If RP is to be used the prices have to be lowered other wise ... no one will be able to achieve them...

Theses are my thoughts and I'm always open to everyone's view points.

- Chazz

#9 evilbry

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 15:42

No to epic sets. Not needed.

This has been raised before and addressed. I trust that BigGrim will reiterate at some point in this thread the stance of HCS.

#10 BigGrim

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 15:49

Epic Sets will not be happening.

The Epics themselves are very powerul single items with abilities that other items do not have. They shall continue to follow the formula that has been used to create nearly all preceeding Epics.

#11 Maehdros

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 15:59

Epic Sets will not be happening.



<3

#12 DragonLord

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 18:03

Epics are over powering? ROFLMAO You can't be serious?


Seems most comments here - and, fortunately, the cow comment - agreed with me and not you :). So, guess I was being serious :)

#13 stringer6

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 19:20

How about an epic set that when worn means any PvP attack takes stamina instead of gold / xp ( i know its not going to happen I am just being mischevious :) )

#14 Chazz224

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 19:32




Epics are over powering? ROFLMAO You can't be serious?


Seems most comments here - and, fortunately, the cow comment - agreed with me and not you :). So, guess I was being serious :)




Yes it seems that HCS/ Big Grim and also Maehdros also agreed with you Pardoux. All of this means is that everyone has their own opinion. As to who is right or wrong on this topic depends on the individuals view point it seems.

My opinion stands. I feel Epics are currently useless outside of stam gains per hr. That has not been argued. You and Big Grim feel that our current Epics are already over powering.. I find this view point interesting. As I have argued and shown that if any such items were over powering than its only logical that many would use such items for more than stam gain, No?

My argument is sound, and for the interest of this game. Regardless as to whether Big Grim agrees or disagrees with my view point. HCS will soon see that theses new epics go no where. The older Epics that are currently in game will fade out. Big Grim will see my view point sooner or later.

Reason being is that Epics are not used to hunt with anymore ... If epics were " so over powering" why is it they are garbage and no one uses them anymore to hunt with anymore? Reason being is today's Epics regardless of being old or new are merely obsolete in contrast to the available buffs.. Inventing epics for any reason other than Arena use (which is questionable) or for stam gain is a waste.

Please explain your logic or "the logic" to me, since Epics are no good for hunting because they are proven to be obsolete , and no good for PvP, and only good for gaining stam... Than perhaps someone please explain in what way are any such items " Over Powering" ? I would love to understand.

PS.

Pardoux ... With all due respect to HCS and our game Devs and admins... Many mistakes have been made through this games history... You shouldn't be so quick to disregard my argument and say I'm wrong because 1 admin said so ... Let's keep in mind that our admins don't play this game all to often and again with all do respect are not as knowledgeable as some of our in game players as to what's really good or works, which is why we have a forum to suggest our ideas for a creative and fun future in fallen sword. Also note forums are also useful to help admins/devs fix and detect a variety of in game bugs as well.

- Chazz

#15 Chazz224

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 19:33

How about an epic set that when worn means any PvP attack takes stamina instead of gold / xp ( i know its not going to happen I am just being mischevious :) )



Terrible idea... lol :roll:

#16 Maehdros

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 19:55

Please explain your logic or "the logic" to me, since Epics are no good for hunting because they are proven to be obsolete , and no good for PvP, and only good for gaining stam... Than perhaps someone please explain in what way are any such items " Over Powering" ? I would love to understand.



Stam gain caps at 90 per hour with max upgrades, possible +4 stam with 2 stam relics


Epics allow stam per hour to be increased per epic worn, a single item giving more stam per hour IS overpowering, and indeed EPIC

Epics are also earned in gvg or via titans with FREE stam. They are powerful rewards for single or group efforts.


If I recall correctly hoof had tried making epics count as "set items" ie: coord attack/ coord defense bonus, and also as a smashing hammer bonus. The community was pretty vocal about how ridiculously overpowered they became.


Epics already sell for hundreds if not thousands of fsp, now, imagine if they did count as sets, value would skyrocket, as would cheating, mainipulation, and scripting.. via titans OR gvg.



It's been asked for many times, and shot down by the devs each time ;)

#17 stringer6

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 19:57

Chazz,
Whilst your argument stands with the addition of the 1000 and 1200 level buffs into the game the individual items themselves are still the most powerfull single items in the game. For example the fire sword has the most damage of any weapon for about 300 levels. Now I know this is not so relavent these days as almost all hunting /pvp/titan set are based around Co-A Co-D and SH. However if the epics where to be made into a set ( BG has already stated this will not happen so the point is moot) would that not make an epic set far too powerfull? If the individual stats where to remain and a set bonus where applied this would be far superior to any other set in the game already... And we dont need that..There are enough sets in the game already to have fun with

#18 3JS

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 20:07

I agree, other than stam gain - epics are pretty useless and not worth the cost (to me, at least).

On the other hand, making an epic set would be a terrible implementation. An epic set would resemble hooftests set (not quite, lol) and would be easily abused by those who could afford such novelties.

Imagine 1 player, wearing this epic set, dominating every arena tournament and ladder reset along with 1 hitting through EOC, and never switching gear. That, in a nutshell, is what you are asking to become possible.

Realistically, only a handful of people would ever be able to wear such a set, and that same handful of people would dominate every aspect of the game that revolves around gear. Classic example of the rich getting richer, and the majority of players would like to avoid that as much as possible.

#19 DragonLord

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 20:45


Please explain your logic or "the logic" to me, since Epics are no good for hunting because they are proven to be obsolete , and no good for PvP, and only good for gaining stam... Than perhaps someone please explain in what way are any such items " Over Powering" ? I would love to understand.



Stam gain caps at 90 per hour with max upgrades, possible +4 stam with 2 stam relics


Epics allow stam per hour to be increased per epic worn, a single item giving more stam per hour IS overpowering, and indeed EPIC

Epics are also earned in gvg or via titans with FREE stam. They are powerful rewards for single or group efforts.


If I recall correctly hoof had tried making epics count as "set items" ie: coord attack/ coord defense bonus, and also as a smashing hammer bonus. The community was pretty vocal about how ridiculously overpowered they became.


Epics already sell for hundreds if not thousands of fsp, now, imagine if they did count as sets, value would skyrocket, as would cheating, mainipulation, and scripting.. via titans OR gvg.


It's been asked for many times, and shot down by the devs each time ;)


Thanks Maehdros - you just saved me typing all that out :)

#20 BigGrim

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 10:43

If epics were " so over powering" why is it they are garbage and no one uses them anymore to hunt with anymore?


If they were so useless, why have the recently added Epics been warmly received? They are not overpowering. Not anymore, however they are still massively powerful individual items.

If I recall correctly hoof had tried making epics count as "set items" ie: coord attack/ coord defense bonus, and also as a smashing hammer bonus. The community was pretty vocal about how ridiculously overpowered they became.


Indeed. We suggested it and were shot down almost immediately and unanimously.


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