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PvP-Ladder Sollutions.


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#141 yghorbeviahn

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Posted 22 September 2014 - 23:30

WOW, that's not what I had in mind when I first created this thread...

I really agree with BG on this, taking off XP Loss is really the final answer to all our problems of Levelers vs. PvPers, that will get rid of all PvPers, what will make space for Levelers do some kind of "PvP" without losing nothing more than 10/100 stamina.

Why didn't I think on this before?
With No XP Loss we can:
1 - Level non-stop to conquer nothing more than numbers, without interaction or friends.
2 - Keep killing old and maybe new Titans using codes, or bragging for having a better internet connection.
3 - Kill the Bounty Board for good, what is a ugly place to be, no one like to receive buffs, swing on targets, change gear and use his own mind to prevent attacks on his head.
4 - Finnally everyone will have risk-free Smasher and Dominance Medals.

5 (And more important) - Levellers will not have any kind of problem against PvPers, because I'm sure a LOT (if not all) PvPers will stop playing, I'm not a PvPer all the time, but for sure I'll be one of many that will leave the game.

-

You want to know why XP Loss on PvP is so important?
To add reason, communication, fear, risk, consequence, learning and, more important, Player vs. Player enviroiment, what you think will happen when you add this, lets suppose a scenario, will be easy to imagine, once the Rating Rewards become worthless what will happen? That will take like a month, after that every kind of PvP will die, all PvP buffs, all PvP Gear (2x more present than hunting gear), you can also take off Defense and Armor from outr profiles, because SSi can cover that on mob killing. You see, 60% or more of the game IS based on PvP, and that includes XP Loss.

If you want to create a SEPARETED Ladder without XP Loss, ok, fine with me, but keep the XP Loss (I would like to see XP Gain included as well), if you want to get rid of XP Loss, just add an autoplay, because no one will need any kind of brain to play this game, just gear up, get buffs and press 1,2,3,4,R.



#142 wil72

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Posted 22 September 2014 - 23:47

XP loss removal, no risk in game then, nothing to get the juices flowing? Why Play? Who plays a game with no risk? No risk, no fun. Wait, mobs can beat you. Not the same.

 

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#143 BadPenny

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 00:00

WOW, that's not what I had in mind when I first created this thread...

I really agree with BG on this, taking off XP Loss is really the final answer to all our problems of Levelers vs. PvPers, that will get rid of all PvPers, what will make space for Levelers do some kind of "PvP" without losing nothing more than 10/100 stamina.

Why didn't I think on this before?
With No XP Loss we can:
1 - Level non-stop to conquer nothing more than numbers, without interaction or friends.
2 - Keep killing old and maybe new Titans using codes, or bragging for having a better internet connection.
3 - Kill the Bounty Board for good, what is a ugly place to be, no one like to receive buffs, swing on targets, change gear and use his own mind to prevent attacks on his head.
4 - Finnally everyone will have risk-free Smasher and Dominance Medals.

5 (And more important) - Levellers will not have any kind of problem against PvPers, because I'm sure a LOT (if not all) PvPers will stop playing, I'm not a PvPer all the time, but for sure I'll be one of many that will leave the game.

-

You want to know why XP Loss on PvP is so important?
To add reason, communication, fear, risk, consequence, learning and, more important, Player vs. Player enviroiment, what you think will happen when you add this, lets suppose a scenario, will be easy to imagine, once the Rating Rewards become worthless what will happen? That will take like a month, after that every kind of PvP will die, all PvP buffs, all PvP Gear (2x more present than hunting gear), you can also take off Defense and Armor from outr profiles, because SSi can cover that on mob killing. You see, 60% or more of the game IS based on PvP, and that includes XP Loss.

If you want to create a SEPARETED Ladder without XP Loss, ok, fine with me, but keep the XP Loss (I would like to see XP Gain included as well), if you want to get rid of XP Loss, just add an autoplay, because no one will need any kind of brain to play this game, just gear up, get buffs and press 1,2,3,4,R.

 

 

I've reached my limit of likes for the day, so I will just quote this... Does this answer your question, Big G?


Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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#144 Corrupted

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 00:04

WOW, that's not what I had in mind when I first created this thread...

I really agree with BG on this, taking off XP Loss is really the final answer to all our problems of Levelers vs. PvPers, that will get rid of all PvPers, what will make space for Levelers do some kind of "PvP" without losing nothing more than 10/100 stamina.

Why didn't I think on this before?
With No XP Loss we can:
1 - Level non-stop to conquer nothing more than numbers, without interaction or friends.
2 - Keep killing old and maybe new Titans using codes, or bragging for having a better internet connection.
3 - Kill the Bounty Board for good, what is a ugly place to be, no one like to receive buffs, swing on targets, change gear and use his own mind to prevent attacks on his head.
4 - Finnally everyone will have risk-free Smasher and Dominance Medals.

5 (And more important) - Levellers will not have any kind of problem against PvPers, because I'm sure a LOT (if not all) PvPers will stop playing, I'm not a PvPer all the time, but for sure I'll be one of many that will leave the game.

-

You want to know why XP Loss on PvP is so important?
To add reason, communication, fear, risk, consequence, learning and, more important, Player vs. Player enviroiment, what you think will happen when you add this, lets suppose a scenario, will be easy to imagine, once the Rating Rewards become worthless what will happen? That will take like a month, after that every kind of PvP will die, all PvP buffs, all PvP Gear (2x more present than hunting gear), you can also take off Defense and Armor from outr profiles, because SSi can cover that on mob killing. You see, 60% or more of the game IS based on PvP, and that includes XP Loss.

If you want to create a SEPARETED Ladder without XP Loss, ok, fine with me, but keep the XP Loss (I would like to see XP Gain included as well), if you want to get rid of XP Loss, just add an autoplay, because no one will need any kind of brain to play this game, just gear up, get buffs and press 1,2,3,4,R.

I second Penny, ran out of likes here. This sole post may as well explain it all folks!



#145 flar

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 00:43

yghorbeviahn, on 22 Sept 2014 - 19:30, said:snapback.png

WOW, that's not what I had in mind when I first created this thread...

I really agree with BG on this, taking off XP Loss is really the final answer to all our problems of Levelers vs. PvPers, that will get rid of all PvPers, what will make space for Levelers do some kind of "PvP" without losing nothing more than 10/100 stamina.

Why didn't I think on this before?
With No XP Loss we can:
1 - Level non-stop to conquer nothing more than numbers, without interaction or friends.
2 - Keep killing old and maybe new Titans using codes, or bragging for having a better internet connection.
3 - Kill the Bounty Board for good, what is a ugly place to be, no one like to receive buffs, swing on targets, change gear and use his own mind to prevent attacks on his head.
4 - Finnally everyone will have risk-free Smasher and Dominance Medals.

5 (And more important) - Levellers will not have any kind of problem against PvPers, because I'm sure a LOT (if not all) PvPers will stop playing, I'm not a PvPer all the time, but for sure I'll be one of many that will leave the game.

-

You want to know why XP Loss on PvP is so important?
To add reason, communication, fear, risk, consequence, learning and, more important, Player vs. Player enviroiment, what you think will happen when you add this, lets suppose a scenario, will be easy to imagine, once the Rating Rewards become worthless what will happen? That will take like a month, after that every kind of PvP will die, all PvP buffs, all PvP Gear (2x more present than hunting gear), you can also take off Defense and Armor from outr profiles, because SSi can cover that on mob killing. You see, 60% or more of the game IS based on PvP, and that includes XP Loss.

If you want to create a SEPARETED Ladder without XP Loss, ok, fine with me, but keep the XP Loss (I would like to see XP Gain included as well), if you want to get rid of XP Loss, just add an autoplay, because no one will need any kind of brain to play this game, just gear up, get buffs and press 1,2,3,4,R

I also like this!



#146 Raku

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 00:53

My statement holds true. It is facts. It's my views, and my experiences. So yes, facts of that. I honestly don't know why you feel the need to tell me my statement about my experiences are wrong and untrue? Yours may differ, but I can promise you that once people get bored, they find something else to do.

 

Those games you mentioned have a kill-ability that does not exist in FS. You can't die in FS. You can get a bruise or two through pvp, but that's all. Why is keeping it that way such a bad thing?  I can't stand so called games like farmville, and without xp loss, FS will feel like a weird take on that kind of game.

I already said in the post you quoted on why your statement is not a fact, and felt the need to dispute your so called fact. I also said that "your statement holds true for you and anyone that views your opinion" as your opinions are not facts. 

I also already agreed that boredom would be a factor in any games downfall. So why you needed to state this again to me I don't know.

 

FS does have a "kill-ability" factor in the sense that I attack you, you then win/lose, and we rinse and repeat. Are you not killing the person you attack by bringing their health to zero? Those other games just don't cost exp as a result of your loss. I don't remember claiming that keeping it this way was a bad thing.

 

I however feel that getting rid of level exp loss, and replacing it with a system that has pvp exp that can be gained/lost with pvp attacks would be the better way to go. Yes a reward system would need to then be added  that would add value to this gain or loss of pvp xp. This would separate the pvp and leveling aspect of the game, and you wouldn't have levelers against pvpers. What would be bad about separating them if there was a system that had value for the pvp exp? Or do pvpers care to much about taking exp from a leveler?


Edited by Raku, 23 September 2014 - 00:56.


#147 Removed18058

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 02:17

my idea personally would be an open ladder this means that every1 participates with an additional opt in for the high risk high reward ladder: the current ladder system with exp loss just the normal way only with 5x the prestige points where normal hits would give you 1x the prestige points and defended hits would give you 2x the prestige points being defeated loses you 0.75x the prestige points to stop prestige trading and also a possible negative prestige

 

 

the best of each band get's rewards that are actually worth it.

 

also add some special events that require x amount of prestige points to be able to participate in with sexy rewards for the participants if you do the math correctly then yes any1 could be able to participate due to the fact that you gain more prestige than that you lose

 

 

also would be nice to add a offensive win counter, defensive win counter and defeats counter

 

people would go insane for a good kills to deaths ratio and add a top rated for highest amount of kills

 

 

i'd personally suggest weekly resets where we have a special event on wednesdays for the die hard pvp'ers and then friday and  saturday for the follow up boys ^^

 

 

the bounty board would remain in place but dropping 5 while the person you attacked lost 0 exp would seem strange so keep these bounties for the people who take the risk and enter the ladder where people taking a bounty can also get a bounty on their head

 

personally i'd lower the cost of placing a bounty but i dunno bout the rest of you people

 

 

this way the levelers can stay away from losing exp, pvp'ers get more targets and still have their risk when they try to haul in the big amounts of prestige

 

 

this way new people might go and like the pvp aspect and also jump onto the ladder to get a shot at the big stuff.

 

 

and grim the more rewarding these special events are the more people you can find who are willing to participate in it.

 

if anyone even finds this just a little bit of an idea try to improve it give it your toughts or come up with something completely different :D

 

 

we all gotta work together here

 

in the end of the day we all love this game

 

and we all want to keep on playing it the way we like it right?

 

and possibly find new aspects that we might like? :D


Edited by crippla, 23 September 2014 - 02:17.

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#148 DeadParrot

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 03:04

If there are any questions with regards to the outcome of a proposed change.....

 

MOCK IT ON A BETA-TEST SERVER.  What can be more simple for goodness sakes?!?!  How many more times must I repeat this post.  Please see many other games...they beta-test, example DDO, I believe that beta server is called Lammania.

 

DP


Swearing, even starred out, is not acceptable on the forums. Cheers!

#149 yghorbeviahn

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 03:08

If there are any questions with regards to the outcome of a proposed change.....

 

MOCK IT ON A BETA-TEST SERVER.  What can be more simple for goodness sakes?!?!  How many more times must I repeat this post.  Please see many other games...they beta-test, example DDO, I believe that beta server is called Lammania.

 

DP

I remember we had a Beta Server in the past, to test the new map system, don't know what happened to that anyway...

If you guys don't want to create a Test Server, post a News Update asking for most of players to vote, and give a 1-2 weeks trial, where you'll not use any stamina and will not receive/lose anything, after that time you guys decide if the system will stay or not.



#150 justinian9

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 03:10

WOW, Grim.  What a bomb shell!  But i think a PvP leveling system is a good idea... it was discussed in the other forum on PvP.

 

EDIT:  Yes, I am a leveler.


Edited by justinian9, 23 September 2014 - 03:17.


#151 Maury Bund

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 03:39

BG, if you want to scrap the ladder as it has not worked they way HCS intended. Fine. Move the rewards to Arena store and convert all PvP ladder token to Arena tokens (1-1 would be a poor, poor ratio).

 

If you took out xp loss on PvP hits why would we need a bounty board after that? No loss would occur from pvp hits, so why would anyone have a reason to place a bounty? A gold hit? Those are already hard to make as is as the possibilty for loss is usually outweighed by slight return. Yes, I have made attacks for gold on players with xp protection. As the amount lost is somewhat tied to the amount of xp lost, I usually don't get much and so don't do it as often. With these kind of restrictions, I would go from making 5-10 attacks per year (yes a real bully type frequency attitude that ruins peoples game play) to zero per year. Did I mention that I don't consider myself a PvPer? But I do think this is an important part of the game that too often gets vilified. 

 

I understand that you probably get extremely tired of fielding complaints from players that claim to be harassed through pvp (and I don't envy the task). Maybe some bullying does occur, and maybe some politicians ACTUALLY are honest about the same number of times. Xp loss PvP allows the player base to police itself. By removing that, you are not only putting more of the power into the staff's hand, but more importantly the burden.

 

With much of the recent interactions my guild has had from you, my opinion is that you are pretty much settled into this coarse and we are making these posts in vain with little to no chance to sway you. I hope I am wrong in this regard.

 

And yes, I will also say that it would be extremely nice to have hoof chime in on this.



#152 midgetmanj

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 03:50

~CUT~

 

+1  I dont have any Likes left



#153 Algoa

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 04:04

I remember PvP back in the day, and then i quit for a couple years when it was wattered down so much. I started playing again around new years and pvp is still quite wattered down.(more infact) Its been said before in here, there are plenty of ways do defend you innocent little self if you dont want to loose xp. The only way players get bountied ("bullied") is when they them self hit someone. Making them the aggresor not the bounty hunter. Now why put smasher medals in the game and make a 10-100 stam range if a hunter shouldent get to use discretion as to weather or not to use 10 or 100. XP loss is doubled on the bb for a reason YOU GOT YOURSELF THERE SO QUIT CRYING ABOUT WHAT YOU GET.

 In my openion removing XP loss and consiquentially ruining PvP will turn a once great game into little more then FARM VILLE.

 

Iv got a better idea, lets remove XP gain...we can all just start at the end of content and see who can stay there (besides you guys cant crank out content fast enough to keep up with the levelers when we are taking their XP)

 

PS I also believe a bounty hunter should loose XP for a loss, and or be disqualified from a bounty, forfiting their entry, if they can be beat 10 times before they can win 10


Edited by Algoa, 23 September 2014 - 04:30.

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#154 Mister Doom

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 04:25

(Moved to new thread)


Edited by Mister Doom, 23 September 2014 - 04:41.

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#155 Melons

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 04:26

One thing that really saddens me is all this Anti-PvP hate going around.  This thread was started to simply fix the current Ladder system, not the mechanics of PvP overall.  Really frustrating to see how a simple suggestion has turned into this. *Sigh*



#156 avvakum

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 04:46

 

Remove normal xp loss altogether from pvp and replace it instead with losses and gains of PVPXP.

 

That's of course with a full game reset, so everyone could start this new game with lvl 1. Alternatively, give all lost normal XP back. ;)    



#157 Windbattle

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 04:51

At the end of the day, it causes too many issues. Yet NONE of you have managed to say why taking XP is more important than PvP Rating. Why do you HAVE to take XP? So you can keep beating someone down? Unacceptable. That kind of behaviour drives people away. Doing it to gain rating still gives you the reason, risk and consequence, just without the ability to ruin someone's game time, and if that is why you want XP loss, to be able to negatively impact someone else's game, then there is something wrong.

 

Probably your best post ever BG. 



#158 Algoa

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 05:03

AND


why is this being so drastically exagurated, the most anyone looses if they get a smasher clear is a couple levels, (thank the smasher medal) to get dropped 5 takes a group effort, which means you did something bad enough to warrent a group response......dropping 5 for a 10 stam hit isnt something a pvp player would do, its something a bent out of shape leveler would do


Edited by Algoa, 23 September 2014 - 05:05.

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#159 Removed18058

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 09:48

AND


why is this being so drastically exagurated, the most anyone looses if they get a smasher clear is a couple levels, (thank the smasher medal) to get dropped 5 takes a group effort, which means you did something bad enough to warrent a group response......dropping 5 for a 10 stam hit isnt something a pvp player would do, its something a bent out of shape leveler would do

 

however if i get on the bounty board for 10 stamming a pvp player i will most likely lose 5 so i think you are mistaken

 

this would be from my personal experiences


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#160 BadPenny

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 10:06

however if i get on the bounty board for 10 stamming a pvp player i will most likely lose 5 so i think you are mistaken

 

this would be from my personal experiences

no no no no.... We don't delevel for  10 stam hits.  PvPer's respect those who hit us.  We are the ones that are disparaged, not the other way around... I've been around this block a few times.... If you're being develed, it's for a more sinister reason ;)


Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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