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please extend pvp attack range


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Poll: should the pvp range be extended (130 member(s) have cast votes)

should the pvp range be extended

  1. no (79 votes [60.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 60.77%

  2. yes (51 votes [39.23%])

    Percentage of vote: 39.23%

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#101 yotwehc

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Posted 17 February 2015 - 23:03

the risk is getting bountied and lose XP or to get attacked back and lose the same XP. such is PvP.


But what's the point of losing more overrated xp? I'm using your words. It's no risk if it's overrated. No?

#102 Dulcharn

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Posted 17 February 2015 - 23:19

But what's the point of losing more overrated xp? I'm using your words. It's no risk if it's overrated. No?

 

Let's say you lose 1.500.000 xp with a 10 stam PvP attack. And let's say you can gain 600.000 xp by killing 1 creature with decent buffs (global event potions for instance). That means you will regain the lost XP with the first two or three creatures you bump into during your next leveling hunt. In the larger scheme of things, it's peanuts. Lose 5 levels while PvP'ing? No biggie: regain the levels later and add to your guild xp. But yeah, if you don't care about your XP, the risk is perceived differently than when you do care about it. But what I'm saying is care less about XP and have a happy slapping time in a larger range.



#103 thulekin

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Posted 17 February 2015 - 23:21

I think the PVP should be changed, if you want PVP, no gold should be involved, if you want to steel gold, no PVP points should be involved. And with this, if you PVP a player once, he should not be able to bounty you, only if you PVP him more than once, an the amount of times you can PVP a player should be limited.



#104 yotwehc

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Posted 17 February 2015 - 23:26

Let's say you lose 1.500.000 xp with a 10 stam PvP attack. And let's say you can gain 600.000 xp by killing 1 creature with decent buffs (global event potions for instance). That means you will regain the lost XP with the first two or three creatures you bump into during your next leveling hunt. In the larger scheme of things, it's peanuts. Lose 5 levels while PvP'ing? No biggie: regain the levels later and add to your guild xp. But yeah, if you don't care about your XP, the risk is perceived differently than when you do care about it. But what I'm saying is care less about XP and have a happy slapping time in a larger range.

If I was your level, I wouldn't care about xp either :) It's a bonus to lose xp so you can gain more gxp as you say :)

 

At least you do acknowledge that the perception varies. Here's what gets me... You don't care about xp... levelers in general care about xp. Take out xp loss or reduce it significantly and both camps are happy, no? Now, maybe more would be willing to try pvp and you get what Jedi wants. More pvp!



#105 Egami

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Posted 17 February 2015 - 23:35

I don't like to vote. I'm pro-PvP and, yet, not really a PvPer. 

 

I'm pro-PvP, because I think it's a good way for levelers to learn about the game. But I digress. 

 

I didn't vote. However... I did read almost the entire first page of this thread. If I had the time, I'd read more.

 

My only comment is that this is (in the first page at least) a great thread. There is tons of info here which everyone, no matter how they play the game, would do well to read.

 

My advice, put your opinions and reactions aside and just try to soak up the info that those on both sides are throwing out. 

 

Prosperous smacking everybody... whether your smacking mobs or players. (o0



#106 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 02:17

Let's see, PvP, with a wider range, with no losses of any kind (except expended stam), and no risks of bounties.... guys, that's pillow fighting (I think they call this GvG, she whispers) , yeah, we have that, it's what I have young students cut their teeth on.  IMHO ranges for raw straight run of the mill PvP could have the same ranges..........   


Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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#107 yotwehc

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 03:08

Let's see, PvP, with a wider range, with no losses of any kind (except expended stam), and no risks of bounties.... guys, that's pillow fighting (I think they call this GvG, she whispers) , yeah, we have that, it's what I have young students cut their teeth on. IMHO ranges for raw straight run of the mill PvP could have the same ranges..........


im just pointing out the hypocrisy of it all. Xp loss is no big deal or overrated or easy to gain back so why have it at all? For me, it's a big deal (until eoc). Anyone know if the other big mmorpg games have a system like FS where you lose tons of levels and xp? LoL? WoW?

Just get rid of the element of guild vs player and remove the ability that players have to punish what their eyes see as "bad" players. Do a true pvp system.

Extending the range of a broken system is as good of an idea as the original incarnation of the smasher medal. Not sure HCS wants to deal with that again.

#108 Raku

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 04:12

Let's see, PvP, with a wider range, with no losses of any kind (except expended stam), and no risks of bounties.... guys, that's pillow fighting (I think they call this GvG, she whispers) , yeah, we have that, it's what I have young students cut their teeth on.  IMHO ranges for raw straight run of the mill PvP could have the same ranges..........   

gvg and ladder also has your range increase.



#109 yghorbeviahn

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 04:33

If that idea see the light of the day, that should come together with a new tweak on PvP Prestige:

10 stam hit = 1 PvP Prestige.
100 stam hit = 10 PvP Prestige (still 1 Prestige if the hit is on BB)
Get rid of all other hits, there should be only 2 kinds of hits (10 and 100 stam)

If that makes possible to control your PvP Prestige to use as much as you want would be GREAT.



#110 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 05:12

gvg and ladder also has your range increase.

The ladder was born dead..... and when they spanked the baby, it did not come to life.  Supposed to be a new system for that anyway.   This isn't about the ladder (or GvG, for that matter) anyway.  This is about regular, run of the mill, old school type PvP.  It's been years since any improvements were made to that (to my knowledge anyway)  A range increase for the higher levels could be a shot in the arm for PvP.  

 

 

im just pointing out the hypocrisy of it all. Xp loss is no big deal or overrated or easy to gain back so why have it at all? For me, it's a big deal (until eoc). Anyone know if the other big mmorpg games have a system like FS where you lose tons of levels and xp? LoL? WoW?

Just get rid of the element of guild vs player and remove the ability that players have to punish what their eyes see as "bad" players. Do a true pvp system.

Extending the range of a broken system is as good of an idea as the original incarnation of the smasher medal. Not sure HCS wants to deal with that again.

I have played another game where XP and gold loss was a part of PvP.  It's a tiny game, still alive (just logged in, I'm still a player :) )  PvP is looked at much differently there, however, as part of the daily routine is to go through your own PvP list.  Get your "kills" for the day, as it were.  Only on FS is PvP such a hot issue, and it has been since I have been here.  And it's not the XP loss, or that gold I snagged, that I hear the whines about most.. it's the attack itself.  People, it ain't personal, just playing the game and the role I have chosen....   Please don't cry, just hit me back already.  It's great fun, and we both gain a new friend....


Edited by BadPenny, 18 February 2015 - 05:13.

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#111 yotwehc

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 05:42

I have played another game where XP and gold loss was a part of PvP.  It's a tiny game, still alive (just logged in, I'm still a player :) )  PvP is looked at much differently there, however, as part of the daily routine is to go through your own PvP list.  Get your "kills" for the day, as it were.  Only on FS is PvP such a hot issue, and it has been since I have been here.  And it's not the XP loss, or that gold I snagged, that I hear the whines about most.. it's the attack itself.  People, it ain't personal, just playing the game and the role I have chosen....   Please don't cry, just hit me back already.  It's great fun, and we both gain a new friend....

Hope your not talking about legacy. lol.

 

You confuse me... when you were being dropped levels for bounty clears and retired from bounty hunting, you were sort of "crying" and not making friends. Now you are preaching the opposite?



#112 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 05:52

Chewy, that issue had nothing to do with my levels or the bounty board. And what I was complaining about that day was a personal issue, and had nothing to do with PvP, per se, it was a completely personal matter, and I was wrong to even bring it up publicly, but I was upset and not in control of my emotions. If you want the particulars, you know where to find me.  I won't go into it here, however, that would be wrong.... 

 

I have not retired from bounty hunting at all.  Nor have I retired from PvP.  I'm just focusing on other things atm, as I do play the entire game, not just bits and pieces as most appear to do.


Edited by BadPenny, 18 February 2015 - 05:54.

Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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#113 Raku

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 06:00

The ladder was born dead..... and when they spanked the baby, it did not come to life.  Supposed to be a new system for that anyway.   This isn't about the ladder (or GvG, for that matter) anyway.  This is about regular, run of the mill, old school type PvP.  It's been years since any improvements were made to that (to my knowledge anyway)  A range increase for the higher levels could be a shot in the arm for PvP.  

I know its not about gvg/ladder. It's about a wider attack range. You and others talk about already having safe pvp well guess what, we already have increased attack range as well. Same argument is it not?

 

@everyone

What would be the harm in an update that removed xp loss from random attacks, increased attack range, even throw in the prestige slider bar for you.(adjust prestige earned on the board even since it would no longer apply to random attacks) The exp loss in random attack is a petty number right? After all this increase in attack range isn't about being able to attack to take exp from someone. You will still have your bounty board, so there is your risk still. You get a wider attack range to now have fun or box with your buddies that were just out of reach. You get a slider bar to control your prestige. Also helps make players earn prestige since this now has to be done on the BB. You will also help to reduce the animosity pvp receives. This would also reduce the malicious actions done to your fellow fallen sword players. The only thing you lost is being able to take exp from players with random attacks. 

How is this not a win/win?



#114 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 06:13

I don't want "safe" PvP, and I don't think leefy does either.  I have "safe" PvP... I GvG for my guild every weekend.  It's kind of fun, but not near as rewarding as run of the mill PvP.  The XP loss, the risk of the bounty, just add to the excitement.  Hoof has already said that XP loss will remain unchanged.  The debate about that was heated, and although I can understand both sides, I  still took a lot of heat about my opinion on that matter.  I won't rehash that here, some of the messages were nasty and downright rude, and I cba to have to look at such again.  This isn't about those things however, and I won't debate them further.  This will be my last post here, so I'll make it good:

 

I support this idea.  An increase in attack ranges for the higher levels is long overdue, like years long overdue.  The last increase was in 2009 (?)  and EOC was less than half what it is now.   FS has grown, attack ranges really need to grow with it.   Give the big dogs equal opportunities to appear on the bounty board, if that's what they want....  and if you don't want to be hit, buy PvP protection and put away your gold.  Unless you are actively provoking one and bringing attention to yourself, your odds of being singled out by a so-called PvP "bully" are actually quite small... and if you already have one of those, this kind of update really doesn't change things, now does it?


Edited by BadPenny, 18 February 2015 - 06:14.

Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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#115 3JS

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 06:27

I don't want "safe" PvP, and I don't think leefy does either.  I have "safe" PvP... I GvG for my guild every weekend.  It's kind of fun, but not near as rewarding as run of the mill PvP.  The XP loss, the risk of the bounty, just add to the excitement.  Hoof has already said that XP loss will remain unchanged.  The debate about that was heated, and although I can understand both sides, I  still took a lot of heat about my opinion on that matter.  I won't rehash that here, some of the messages were nasty and downright rude, and I cba to have to look at such again.  This isn't about those things however, and I won't debate them further.  This will be my last post here, so I'll make it good:

 

I support this idea.  An increase in attack ranges for the higher levels is long overdue, like years long overdue.  The last increase was in 2009 (?)  and EOC was less than half what it is now.   FS has grown, attack ranges really need to grow with it.   Give the big dogs equal opportunities to appear on the bounty board, if that's what they want....  and if you don't want to be hit, buy PvP protection and put away your gold.  Unless you are actively provoking one and bringing attention to yourself, your odds of being singled out by a so-called PvP "bully" are actually quite small... and if you already have one of those, this kind of update really doesn't change things, now does it?

 

 

^^^ Best post of the day.



#116 Gutie

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 06:44

If people thought all the people who left over PvP changes a couple years ago was a large exodus from the game, HCS will not be too pleased to see how many would likely walk if this got implemented. Not saying I would, but please this is a joke of an idea, and one I and several other eviscerated why it's a terrible idea last time it came up...

 

Content Acceleration will solve so many problems it's not even funny. Also, PvPers are just so unwilling to poke each other, that they're running out of targets to poke as they level up.

 

I doubt any of the people for this are willing to nerf the amount of times they can slam someone they don't like to once every 24 hours to compensate for the amount of people they will be able to target now will they? 

 

Of course not. We all know what the root motive of this push has always been about. It's about certain players being able to slam people en mass hourly they don't like over drama from 5 years ago they're still salty about. 

 

Being able to poke someone who has been offline for a couple days with no defensive response possible while you juice up buffs is plenty enough incentive to PvP imo. 

 

FS has to have and keep in mind revenue. If there ever was an idea to kill activity this might be high on the Top 10 bad idea list for HCS.


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#117 3JS

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 07:01

Let's face it folks. The current PvP system isn't good for anyone.

 

The ladder was garbage from day 1, and now it's just rotten garbage.

 

Because of the decreased player base, level ranges are too small. 

 

One thing I'll say that is against my norm....neither side is 100% correct, nor is either side 100% wrong. Both sides of this argument need to evolve together for the sake of the community. We don't necessarily have to agree, or even get along. We do, however, have to respect that no matter how we play...the only way we are going to get to continue doing so is to help this game get better. The flame wars every week are not going to accomplish this, though. 

 

There will always be players who get under our skin. Such is life. Hell, I have an uncle that I'd like to stab in the eye. For the sake of my family, I refrain. Let's all take a step back for a change, and refrain from stabbing each other. Maybe then we'll be able to come up with a better plan.



#118 3JS

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 07:08

If people thought all the people who left over PvP changes a couple years ago was a large exodus from the game, HCS will not be too pleased to see how many would likely walk if this got implemented. Not saying I would, but please this is a joke of an idea, and one I and several other eviscerated why it's a terrible idea last time it came up...

 

Content Acceleration will solve so many problems it's not even funny. Also, PvPers are just so unwilling to poke each other, that they're running out of targets to poke as they level up.

 

I doubt any of the people for this are willing to nerf the amount of times they can slam someone they don't like to once every 24 hours to compensate for the amount of people they will be able to target now will they? 

 

Of course not. We all know what the root motive of this push has always been about. It's about certain players being able to slam people en mass hourly they don't like over drama from 5 years ago they're still salty about. 

 

Being able to poke someone who has been offline for a couple days with no defensive response possible while you juice up buffs is plenty enough incentive to PvP imo. 

 

FS has to have and keep in mind revenue. If there ever was an idea to kill activity this might be high on the Top 10 bad idea list for HCS.

I'm only at 1503. Pretty middle of the road, I'd say. I currently have 13 active target players in my +/- 10 range. 

 

Will more content solve this? Maybe. I have no idea. You could be 100% right, so I'll not debate that. But, 13 players in my range, considering again that I am middle of the pack, is pretty bad.



#119 Raku

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 08:37

I don't want "safe" PvP, and I don't think leefy does either.  I have "safe" PvP... I GvG for my guild every weekend.  It's kind of fun, but not near as rewarding as run of the mill PvP.  The XP loss, the risk of the bounty, just add to the excitement.  Hoof has already said that XP loss will remain unchanged.  The debate about that was heated, and although I can understand both sides, I  still took a lot of heat about my opinion on that matter.  I won't rehash that here, some of the messages were nasty and downright rude, and I cba to have to look at such again.  This isn't about those things however, and I won't debate them further.  This will be my last post here, so I'll make it good:

 

I support this idea.  An increase in attack ranges for the higher levels is long overdue, like years long overdue.  The last increase was in 2009 (?)  and EOC was less than half what it is now.   FS has grown, attack ranges really need to grow with it.   Give the big dogs equal opportunities to appear on the bounty board, if that's what they want....  and if you don't want to be hit, buy PvP protection and put away your gold.  Unless you are actively provoking one and bringing attention to yourself, your odds of being singled out by a so-called PvP "bully" are actually quite small... and if you already have one of those, this kind of update really doesn't change things, now does it?

Alright no problem. Leave exp loss they way it is, increase your attack range, but give the players who want out of pvp an option to do so. This gives both parties everything they wanted. You now have your wider ranges. You still have your exp loss, your risk of bounties, and any excitement you already had. This also helps to prevent the actions of this bully against players who want nothing to do with it. The only thing you lose is the ability to attack those who don't want to be attacked. 

 

You want to point at pvp protection for those who don't want to get hit, I'm going to point at gvg and ladder for those who want a wider attack range. Same argument again isn't it? 



#120 3JS

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 08:51

Alright no problem. Leave exp loss they way it is, increase your attack range, but give the players who want out of pvp an option to do so. This gives both parties everything they wanted. You now have your wider ranges. You still have your exp loss, your risk of bounties, and any excitement you already had. This also helps to prevent the actions of this bully against players who want nothing to do with it. The only thing you lose is the ability to attack those who don't want to be attacked. 

 

You want to point at pvp protection for those who don't want to get hit, I'm going to point at gvg and ladder for those who want a wider attack range. Same argument again isn't it? 

If an "opt out" is put in place, there needs to be some limitations. For example, if you are holding "X" amount of gold, you can still be a target. If not, then the example I gave earlier would come to light. There needs to be a balance, I agree. On the other hand, you can't expect to sit around with 20 million gold on hand and not expect a sword swung in your direction.




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