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please extend pvp attack range


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Poll: should the pvp range be extended (130 member(s) have cast votes)

should the pvp range be extended

  1. no (79 votes [60.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 60.77%

  2. yes (51 votes [39.23%])

    Percentage of vote: 39.23%

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#121 Raku

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 08:58

If an "opt out" is put in place, there needs to be some limitations. For example, if you are holding "X" amount of gold, you can still be a target. If not, then the example I gave earlier would come to light. There needs to be a balance, I agree. On the other hand, you can't expect to sit around with 20 million gold on hand and not expect a sword swung in your direction.

I have no problem with something like that. 



#122 yghorbeviahn

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 09:31

Just to finish my arguments.

The problem against raise the PvP level range (for the people who see it as a problem) is not about the level range itself, is against the PvPers and what they will be able to do with that new 'power', the increase on the range should happen, it's obvious that there is not enough targets on the actual range, if you all don't like the idea, propose nice ideas about how to fix PvP, because being against the extension of the level range is not the answer.

But try to comprehend all the layers involded on this matter, that couldn't be done with few tweaks. Not even the PvPers like the actual PvP system.


Edited by yghorbeviahn, 18 February 2015 - 09:33.


#123 BigGrim

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 11:14

sounds like someone needs some education and some extra attention  in the find player list


Don't you see how this kinda action is part of the problem? "He said something I disagree with, so I'm gonna suggest everyone attack him!"? It's ridiculous! It's not how you win an argument or discussion!
 

If the idea is to improve PvP, then let's have a Live PvP Arena where online players can attack each other with full gears and buffs and without fear of being bountied or gained up.  What's the point of pvping if your target is offline?


We tried that on Sigma Storm 2 with the Slaughterfest. It kinda worked but was not as popular as we'd hoped it would be.

As for PvPing offline players? It's an easy hit with minimal risk. Why wouldn't people target them?
 

level 25 -  200 +/- 5
level 200 -500 +/- 10
level 500 - 1000 +/- 25
level 1000 - 1500 +/- 50
level 1500 - 2000 +/- 100
level 2000 - 2500 +/- 150.


While not bad, a +/- of 300 is a hell of a lot of levelling to have to do if you were wanting to level beyond unwanted PvP. How's this?

level 25 -  200 +/- 5
level 200 -500 +/- 10
level 500 - 1000 +/- 25
level 1000 - 1500 +/- 50
level 1500 - 2000 +/- 75
level 2000 - 2500 +/- 100.

I'd think that is a little more reasonable, right? That still gives the highest level players +/- 200 attacking levels (though I think that might still be a bit high.). I'd also be inclined to only attacking up is increased until you level fully into the bracket.

For example :

Level 1025. He/she can attack down 25 levels but up 50. Once they reach 1050, they have the full =/- 50.
 

see the problem is there is the odd player not many but enough to make ppls lives miserable who constantly attack anyone within range for no other reason then they can i have seen it so know it happens ...only advice has been to lvl out of there range ..can you imagine if they had a 100 lvls to kill in some poor sods would be hounded out the game


This is a concern, yes. Thus the request for feedback.
 

XP loss is overrated to me, hades.


Fixed that for you. While it may be over rated to you, it's not to others. We have to be aware of all viewpoints.
 

Take out xp loss or reduce it significantly and both camps are happy, no? Now, maybe more would be willing to try pvp and you get what Jedi wants. More pvp!


XP loss is here to stay. We've already discussed that option at length here in the pasture. Reduction? Possible I suppose but unlikely.
 

But give the players who want out of pvp an option to do so.


A PvP Opt out is not gonna happen I reckon. This is a game with many facets. PvP is a pretty huge part of FS. That's how it is. If you wanna protect your XP, there is PvP Protection.

#124 3JS

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 11:52

I think I may be entering the twilight zone.....

 

I agree with BG on every point. See? There's hope yet!



#125 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 12:34

Yay!  The boss speaks!  (Told you the cow gods listen).


Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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#126 thulekin

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 13:02

PVP'ers say that XP doesn't matter, neither does gold. But some people play the game to have fun doing the quests, making potions, or working the auction house. They are not interested in getting that thrill from pounding on a player when he's not on line and won't defend himself. Even if he is on line, he may not know how to defend himself, and the "Opt Out" only penalizes him more because he has to spend to get 24 hours. I think that the Opt In would be better, that way all the people that want to PVP could prey on each other and make the game better for those that don't. Opening up PVP so some players can have MORE TARGETS will only serve to chase some people out of the game.



#127 Uncle Beg

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 13:29

We tried that on Sigma Storm 2 with the Slaughterfest. It kinda worked but was not as popular as we'd hoped it would be.

As for PvPing offline players? It's an easy hit with minimal risk. Why wouldn't people target them? 

 

I tried SS2 before and I stopped because FS is better.  FS has more players, based on my observation, so I think it's a better platform to test the "Slaughterfest".

 

I thought the purpose of the discussion is to improve PvP by increasing level range so more people can participate.  If the purpose is find more easy and unwilling to participate targets then keep the range at -/* 10.



#128 thulekin

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 13:38

3JS, on 18 Feb 2015 - 02:51, said:snapback.png

If an "opt out" is put in place, there needs to be some limitations. For example, if you are holding "X" amount of gold, you can still be a target. If not, then the example I gave earlier would come to light. There needs to be a balance, I agree. On the other hand, you can't expect to sit around with 20 million gold on hand and not expect a sword swung in your direction.

This is not PVP, this just being a thief, I still say that you need to separate XP and Gold, Take the money out of PVP and I bet a lot of people will stop, if the only thing you can get is XP for PVP then only those who really enjoy the competition will PVP, those that use it as an excuse to be a thief will no longer have the " I was PVP'ing" excuse. They will just be thieves that can be dealt with. An they won't have the PVP'ers to back them up. In the real world you have fighters who gain Perstige from fighting other fighters, and you have Muggers who gain money from those that are weaker, this applies to the game as well, except a few use the PVP as an excuse to be a thief and have people defend their actions. The bounty board does no good if someone lets them off easy.


3JS, on 18 Feb 2015 - 02:51, said:snapback.png

If an "opt out" is put in place, there needs to be some limitations. For example, if you are holding "X" amount of gold, you can still be a target. If not, then the example I gave earlier would come to light. There needs to be a balance, I agree. On the other hand, you can't expect to sit around with 20 million gold on hand and not expect a sword swung in your direction.

This is not PVP, this just being a thief, I still say that you need to separate XP and Gold, Take the money out of PVP and I bet a lot of people will stop, if the only thing you can get is XP for PVP then only those who really enjoy the competition will PVP, those that use it as an excuse to be a thief will no longer have the " I was PVP'ing" excuse. They will just be thieves that can be dealt with. An they won't have the PVP'ers to back them up. In the real world you have fighters who gain Perstige from fighting other fighters, and you have Muggers who gain money from those that are weaker, this applies to the game as well, except a few use the PVP as an excuse to be a thief and have people defend their actions. The bounty board does no good if someone lets them off easy.



#129 Leos3000

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 14:28

I tried SS2 before and I stopped because FS is better. FS has more players, based on my observation, so I think it's a better platform to test the "Slaughterfest".

I thought the purpose of the discussion is to improve PvP by increasing level range so more people can participate. If the purpose is find more easy and unwilling to participate targets then keep the range at -/* 10.

Slater fest was 1 of the few things I liked about sigma and think FS is a much better platform to try it in. I would really enjoy events like that in FS and it's a more Controlled way to enjoy pvp.

Edited by Leos3000, 18 February 2015 - 14:29.


#130 CountFxUup

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 14:46

Ive actually been playing Sigmastrom the past few days shame its dead with the new map system we have here and a few other things it could be a very enjoyable game again the cows should consider fixing it and making it the open pvp game that everyone wants :)



#131 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 14:59

 

3JS, on 18 Feb 2015 - 02:51, said:snapback.png

This is not PVP, this just being a thief, I still say that you need to separate XP and Gold, Take the money out of PVP and I bet a lot of people will stop, if the only thing you can get is XP for PVP then only those who really enjoy the competition will PVP, those that use it as an excuse to be a thief will no longer have the " I was PVP'ing" excuse. They will just be thieves that can be dealt with. An they won't have the PVP'ers to back them up. In the real world you have fighters who gain Perstige from fighting other fighters, and you have Muggers who gain money from those that are weaker, this applies to the game as well, except a few use the PVP as an excuse to be a thief and have people defend their actions. The bounty board does no good if someone lets them off easy.

 

 
Attack Player (PvP)
Attack other players to take their gold and lower their experience
 
This has ALWAYS said this.  Stealing gold is part of the game, an important integral part of the game.  Without banditry, we wouldn't need banks or the bounty board.  If you're getting jacked for your gold, use some of the clever ways to secure it.... Not going to tell you these things, though, want my brothers and sisters to have a shot at it.   As for not being able to punish someone on the board, think of this.  Somebody hits me in PvP, at my level, I lose approx 90K XP.... that guy loses 180K XP every hit on the BB.... multiply that by 10, please.    Is that not 1.8 mill XP (averages here, at 588)   That's NOT getting off easy, now is it.... and if I call in friends to "bloody said player's nose", he's losing 5 levels (at 588 that's just about a billion XP)  This is not getting off easy, even a 10 stam clear takes a lot.   It's a game people.  Stop taking your pixelated currency so seriously.  It was free, basically, and you (the community) are always begging for more ways to get gold out of the game....  
Getting robbed is an easy way to accomplish that...

Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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#132 Teuchter

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 15:10

 

3JS, on 18 Feb 2015 - 02:51, said:snapback.png

This is not PVP, this just being a thief, I still say that you need to separate XP and Gold, Take the money out of PVP and I bet a lot of people will stop, if the only thing you can get is XP for PVP then only those who really enjoy the competition will PVP, those that use it as an excuse to be a thief will no longer have the " I was PVP'ing" excuse. They will just be thieves that can be dealt with. An they won't have the PVP'ers to back them up. In the real world you have fighters who gain Perstige from fighting other fighters, and you have Muggers who gain money from those that are weaker, this applies to the game as well, except a few use the PVP as an excuse to be a thief and have people defend their actions. The bounty board does no good if someone lets them off easy.


3JS, on 18 Feb 2015 - 02:51, said:snapback.png

This is not PVP, this just being a thief, I still say that you need to separate XP and Gold, Take the money out of PVP and I bet a lot of people will stop, if the only thing you can get is XP for PVP then only those who really enjoy the competition will PVP, those that use it as an excuse to be a thief will no longer have the " I was PVP'ing" excuse. They will just be thieves that can be dealt with. An they won't have the PVP'ers to back them up. In the real world you have fighters who gain Perstige from fighting other fighters, and you have Muggers who gain money from those that are weaker, this applies to the game as well, except a few use the PVP as an excuse to be a thief and have people defend their actions. The bounty board does no good if someone lets them off easy.

 

 Finally some one has come out and told the truth ,   the BB is hardly a punishment for thieving millions of gold  , That  a player may have needed for something else., PvP just allows them to do it under the guise of legitimacy, :angry:  besides contrary to  some opinions  there are choices in the game  and players should be able to choose what  parts of the game they wish to play without  getting told    to  take part in all aspects ,, 

 

 

sounds like someone needs some education and some extra attention  in the find player list

Don't you see how this kinda action is part of the problem? "He said something I disagree with, so I'm gonna suggest everyone attack him!"? It's ridiculous! It's not how you win an argument or discussion!

 

   , As for veiled threats like these   ,It is the very reason why PvP is unpopular with a lot of players in FS,   This attitude is responsible for  many who no longer play , They were simply bullied out of FS , 

 

 

 

 


Edited by Teuchter, 18 February 2015 - 15:17.


#133 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 15:19

Somebody explain to me how stealing your gold is bullying you out of the game?  It's a game, we get to be bandits if we wish... you don't want to be robbed, be prepared.  You don't go around irl with your bankroll in your hand for the next mugger to see, you stick it in your wallet and hide it in your pocket or purse. You have the same options here, bank it, send it away, convert it to dots.  Please, let's not confuse a little highway robbery with bullying, these are separate issues that rarely are connected except that PvP is used for both ends.   Bullying needs to go, so that PvP can be alive and vibrant again.  IDK how this can be accomplished, I don't envy the boss that task.  But stealing gold, that's an important factor in this game, it needs to be left as is (well, increase the average amount of gold stolen, that would be nice :D )


Edited by BadPenny, 18 February 2015 - 15:20.

Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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#134 thulekin

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 15:38

I didn't suggest that you take theiving out of the game, just out of PVP, they are two different things. You want to be a bandit, more power too you. If you want to be a PVP warrior, do that. Some people take gold out of the bank to use the scavenging caves, some people are still hunting, I have been hit both ways in the past. Each time it was, I'm only PVP'ing. To me, it was I'm only being a theif.



#135 yodamus

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 15:41

Somebody explain to me how stealing your gold is bullying you out of the game?  It's a game, we get to be bandits if we wish... you don't want to be robbed, be prepared.  You don't go around irl with your bankroll in your hand for the next mugger to see, you stick it in your wallet and hide it in your pocket or purse. You have the same options here, bank it, send it away, convert it to dots.  Please, let's not confuse a little highway robbery with bullying, these are separate issues that rarely are connected except that PvP is used for both ends.   Bullying needs to go, so that PvP can be alive and vibrant again.  IDK how this can be accomplished, I don't envy the boss that task.  But stealing gold, that's an important factor in this game, it needs to be left as is (well, increase the average amount of gold stolen, that would be nice :D )

gold hits to me are not the problem, plenty of way to get rid of your gold.....the problem comes from repeated hits and the ability to try and get away from them..big problem..the game (the cows) do not wish to get rid of the bullying, or they would have done something in the game to stop it..so far they have not....plain and simple..as has been said many times from the cows....pvp is part of the game..so bullying will come with it, with the way pvp is set up now..you cant get away from pvp unless you buy protection ( that is bullying in itself), some other player making me spend my money to protect myself from being hit from them...and that is what most pvper will tell someone..(buy protection)..bounty board as i have mention before is not a punishment..it is where pvpers ( most of them, not all) want to be, i get begged to have a bounty placed on the person attacking me 90% of the time i get hit..badge of honor..and a place for them to do more bullying and pvping..fix that..and maybe more would try pvp...as far as ranges go..up for debate..see good and bad in it..good for pvpers..more targets...bad for the rest of us..longer for us to get away from a bullying pvper..how to fix that..again up for deabte..personally hourly hits is the root of most of the evil...that would be a start..


Edited by yodamus, 18 February 2015 - 15:45.


#136 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 15:43

Sugar, you gotta PvP to get the gold, and believe me, if I have robbed  you, I did it on purpose.  No one is immune in my range, just ask the boss, I got him, too ;)   But I'm not trying to be mean, just having fun.... it's a game, dear, nothing personal is involved (speaking for me, can't say what's in anyone else's mind)

 

 

@ Yoda, yes they do, I can assure you of that.  


Edited by BadPenny, 18 February 2015 - 15:45.

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#137 yotwehc

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 15:46

Don't you see how this kinda action is part of the problem? "He said something I disagree with, so I'm gonna suggest everyone attack him!"? It's ridiculous! It's not how you win an argument or discussion!


We tried that on Sigma Storm 2 with the Slaughterfest. It kinda worked but was not as popular as we'd hoped it would be.

As for PvPing offline players? It's an easy hit with minimal risk. Why wouldn't people target them?


While not bad, a +/- of 300 is a hell of a lot of levelling to have to do if you were wanting to level beyond unwanted PvP. How's this?

level 25 - 200 +/- 5
level 200 -500 +/- 10
level 500 - 1000 +/- 25
level 1000 - 1500 +/- 50
level 1500 - 2000 +/- 75
level 2000 - 2500 +/- 100.

I'd think that is a little more reasonable, right? That still gives the highest level players +/- 200 attacking levels (though I think that might still be a bit high.). I'd also be inclined to only attacking up is increased until you level fully into the bracket.

For example :

Level 1025. He/she can attack down 25 levels but up 50. Once they reach 1050, they have the full =/- 50.


This is a concern, yes. Thus the request for feedback.


Fixed that for you. While it may be over rated to you, it's not to others. We have to be aware of all viewpoints.


XP loss is here to stay. We've already discussed that option at length here in the pasture. Reduction? Possible I suppose but unlikely.


A PvP Opt out is not gonna happen I reckon. This is a game with many facets. PvP is a pretty huge part of FS. That's how it is. If you wanna protect your XP, there is PvP Protection.

What's the point of the poll? The results thus far seem to show most prefer the range not be extended yet the idea is bring seriously considered?

#138 BadPenny

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 15:51

Maybe the poll isn't the only factor here, Chewy.  This debate is hot, and it's not a new request either.  There's a similar thread in here somewhere on this very same subject.  Debate was hot there as well..... Besides, a forum poll will always be skewed, as so few players actually visit here.  And not everyone who posts here will vote.... laws of averages.

 

I suggest (please listen to Pennah, Boss) that this matter be given to the entire community, make an ingame poll for all of Erildath to vote, don't forget our 25 reserve stam for voting, now.....


Just one old lady's opinion

 

 

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#139 thulekin

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 16:06

BigGrim, on 18 Feb 2015 - 05:14, said:snapback.png

We tried that on Sigma Storm 2 with the Slaughterfest. It kinda worked but was not as popular as we'd hoped it would be.

As for PvPing offline players? It's an easy hit with minimal risk. Why wouldn't people target them?

So were is the Honor, or Prestige in that. The point of PVP is "Player against Player" not who can I hit when their back is turned. Off-line players should not be able to get "Hit", that is where the biggest problem is.



#140 Rocknoor

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Posted 18 February 2015 - 16:10

It's no secret that I'm opposed to the range increase without some changes to increasing the risk to the PvP'ers, more risk to Non-PvPer's should entail more risk to the PvP'ers to effect a balance. Suggestions have been made to a no counter bounty bounty board with XP loss for the hunter as well as hunted, an off-line defensive buff that when activated takes levels from the PvP'er (Hades suggestion), a bounty exempt retaliatory strike on a PvP attack (Rebornjedi's proposal).  All these should be considered, not all enacted but, considered it the attack range is to be expanded. If Non-PvP'ers are to assume more risk there should be a corresponding risk increase assumed by the PvP population.  What should not be considered is the removal of gold loss from the equation.  Like it or not, PvP is an integral part of the game and a driving force behind PvP is gold acquisition, take that out of the equation and you effectively kill PvP and with you'll probably see a large exodus of players from the game. Who cares you ask, well for example  if you like selling items on the AH you should care.  Most non-PvP'ers use guild gear for leveling most don't have very much of their own, PvP'ers on the other hand in most instances purchase a lot of gear, they have to have multiple combat sets for different occasions, they buy potions the AH too. Want to collapse an already depressed AH, lose your PvP'ers.  We all agree, well most of us agree,  that PvP is in need of substantial overhaul and there are some pretty good proposals out there to start the process, what is not needed is the removal of gold loss from PvP. Ok, off my soapbox.


Edited by Rocknoor, 18 February 2015 - 16:13.

 



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