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#1 Ood

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 17:31

So, I've been out of game for a couple weeks now, haven't really missed the game much. The few weeks before that I was more or less only logging in to chat with people if they were on (TS and other things now serve that purpose).

 

Getting to the point, here's a list of reasons I no longer am playing Eldevin, in no particular order:

 

  • Lack of Variety
    • What content there is, is fun the first couple of rounds, after running BT/RG even 10 times it's no longer fun. Same thing for ASV, and all the other instances. Forced repetition is not enjoyable.
  • ​Lack of Dynamic Features
    • Every dungeon is the same. Every ICC run is the same. Every overworld kill is done the same way. Every quest follows one of maybe 3 basic formula. The only thing different, arguably, is PvP, which will never make a game like this successful. If every BT were not exactly the same as every other BT, more people would play this game.
  • Crafting is a Waste of Time
    • A crafted helm, is a crafted helm, is a crafted helm. Crafting is so static I do not even consider it worth my time to level. I can (or could at least, they may have all quit now) find trustworthy people to craft the handful of items that I needed. Throw crafters a bone, make them have something that makes crafting worthwhile.
  • Daily Quests are NOT an End-Game Strategy
  • There is no real end-game
  • New Players are Encouraged to Solo
    • People have said it in other threads, and perhaps other ways, but the way new players are introduced to the game can be overwhelming and more importantly it is driven towards solo play, not grouping, which makes later game content more difficult.
    • You get less exp/kill in a group, but don't necessarily kill any faster, or any more difficult creatures, most newbies recognize this, and don't group while leveling.
    • The overload of quests at the beginning of the game that are solo gets people in the habit of doing things solo.
  • No Guilds
    • ​The game has been out for 1.5 years now. How were guilds not a feature included during the initial release? The majority of content in game is group based, guilds help players make friends and find groups. The negative effect of not having guilds cannot be understated.
  • There's nothing enjoyable to do at maximum level.
    • ​I've finally made it to 47! What is there to do... Grind dailys, grind gems, grind dungeons. Hurray grind?!

 

Best of luck to Eldevin, HC, and the players. 


Edited by Ood, 31 May 2015 - 17:33.


#2 Eyylimanator

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 18:39

But...But....DID YOU SEE THE NEW VANITY AND SHINY MOUNTS?



#3 ComradeLewis

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 18:43

All valid points that many, many players have stated on a regular basis. Unfortunately, it's in the format of a "quitting thread," and thus, gives HC the authority to delete and/or close the thread. I really wished that they took these points into consideration over a year ago, and resolved the issues rather than make holiday events and mounts, and more holiday events and more mounts. It's quite clear why our peak player base is only around 250 players.

 

I also wonder about my own playing habits. I log on to do some of the dailies, and then log off for another day. I suppose the hope is that the game will be worth playing in the future, and then I'll have the benefit of the long haul, but I suppose the 2 year history of the game contradicts such a thing.


Edited by ComradeLewis, 31 May 2015 - 18:45.

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#4 Irradiated

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 18:56

Unfortunately, rather then respond, HCS will likely just delete this thread as a 'quit thread'.  Perhaps move to a 'suggestion' thread.

 

I know what you mean.  I'm finally going to have time to play again.  I am looking forward to finishing the new quests and trying ICC, and to finish leveling my mage so I can respec to healing.  And I'm especially looking forward to chatting with people I've missed in my time away. 

 

But I find my enthusiasm is tempered somewhat by open questions.  How long will the new content last me?  Will I be able to get groups for instances in a reasonable amount of time?  What will it take to get my friends list straightened out?  Are my friends even still playing, and do they remember me?  Do I really care about my dailies anymore?  Or leveling more professions?  When will we finally see guilds, markets, level 50, a real end game, etc?  And more, including the points you raised.

 

If the other open questions get answered incorrectly and nothing else changes, well, I'll have to wait and see.  Eldevin has so much potential to be a 'best in class' MMO.  If HCS can only reach that goal.


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#5 The Marienne

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 19:36

very well written :) if they delete and ignore they are shooting themselves in the foot.

 

and at this point, I think early game content is just as if not more important, and especially early game content being made relevant even to max lvl players. will take some juggling.


Edited by The Marienne, 31 May 2015 - 19:38.


#6 minddrag

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 19:42

i like this... but not enough bite you know... well you raise some good points, but the thing i, in none of the forum posts i have ever read has anyone actually said what a "REAL ENDGAME" is or how it can be achieved, or what they want to see in it.  also if we are still developing the game then what is the point in endgame when you are going to have more levels after the endgame...

 

  • No Guilds
    • ​The game has been out for 1.5 years now. How were guilds not a feature included during the initial release? The majority of content in game is group based, guilds help players make friends and find groups. The negative effect of not having guilds cannot be understated.

ok here is a thing that i have been wondering about for a while... we have out market forums and trade system, so why need auction house?  We have our friends and out player made guilds just not formalized... why will we need formal guilds... it will not change player alliences, just make you feel better


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#7 HolyGhost

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 19:56

i only come on for 4 things
marienne
skatty
pvp
teamspeak

 


5 actually
killing minddrag is added to that list



#8 Irradiated

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 20:09

"REAL ENDGAME" is or how it can be achieved, or what they want to see in it.  also if we are still developing the game then what is the point in endgame when you are going to have more levels after the endgame...

Good points, and IMO worthy of its own topic.  I don't have time right now, perhaps someone else can start it.  Otherwise I'll do so tomorrow.

 

why need auction house?
why will we need formal guilds... it will not change player alliences, just make you feel better

Many reasons.  For example, I just prefer to sell via an AH rather then forums.  But most important is player retention.  A new player joins the game.  No guilds to join for early help and support, no market to easily sell that coal for fast gold.  The first impulse of many (most?) is to quit the unfinished game, not to spam world chat or check the forums.

 

It's hard enough to retain players without big returns on crafting, and the interesting quests don't start until the 20s.  So yes, we need this.


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#9 Spirit

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 20:37

Two words: Indie MMORPG.

But I do agree on your points... most are which they are aware of including Crafting. Though for dungeons, how would they make it more interesting? Would it require a lot of work though when it could be time well spent on other things that still hasn't yet to come?

And I have posted an suggestion for encouraging group dungeons but no-one really posted on it... so at least I tried.

I am fed up going into dungeons with people using a dog as a tank, or a level 45 leaving because some of us didn't do it right in a low level dungeon? or the dungeon is too easy then it seems because of high levels helping.

It's just not story mode either, but people not learning group mechanics properly. Even I haven't really learned to heal with a tank... though the dog tank works for trying to run dungeons when there's no tanks offering to help lol.

9izzGSr.png Feb. 27th 2015 - First level 45 :)

 

 

 


#10 minddrag

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 20:52

Good points, and IMO worthy of its own topic.  I don't have time right now, perhaps someone else can start it.  Otherwise I'll do so tomorrow.

 

Many reasons.  For example, I just prefer to sell via an AH rather then forums.  But most important is player retention.  A new player joins the game.  No guilds to join for early help and support, no market to easily sell that coal for fast gold.  The first impulse of many (most?) is to quit the unfinished game, not to spam world chat or check the forums.

 

It's hard enough to retain players without big returns on crafting, and the interesting quests don't start until the 20s.  So yes, we need this.

i got the post


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#11 Ood

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 20:53

@Real end-game

End-game content consists of things that are:

 

  • Difficult for even the best geared players
    • While concurrently being not so hard as to make it impossible for 'undergeared' players to do, they instead complete the content with exceptional teamwork, or only partially complete things while still being rewarded (though not as much)
  • Dynamic
    • Be it raids of different maps with different creatures, or somehow tweaking crafting to be able to get that one item just right under certain circumstances. Something that is NOT the same every time, over and over again.
  • Replayable
    • Current content is not end-game because you do it twice and you can do it 100 times, again, hurray grind?

@ Spirit

 

I have not read your post, but as I said in OP, new players are encouraged to solo, that's generally a bad thing in a MMO. Making it more beneficial for players to group early on builds teamwork skills that are beneficial for later content. I'm sorry you haven't been able to heal many tanks. The culture of the existing community is 'skip levels 2-44' and focus on 45+ content, and since there  are relatively few new players who continue to play the game, those outside get little to no help or guidance. That part's on the player's for the most part, but having game mechanics that encourage low level group play would help change that to something more friendly to people on the outside looking in.

 

@ Quitting thread

This is a 'these are huge problems with the game, I am no longer playing' thread?

 

I understand that HC is a small company, and I have only salt and no chicken to give. That shouldn't make my salt any less beneficial to the recipe.


Edited by Ood, 31 May 2015 - 21:29.


#12 Ant

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 21:01

Hi Ood,

 

From what I've seen is TA causes the game alot of harm, from everyone backstabbing friends to killing a noob constantly this all has an effect on the game aswel. The game was built on the community we had in beta (I feel anyways) and all this has turned to brown. There is alot of nice people still playing but those numbers are dwindling, who wants to play a game where it's nothing but drama? and it's not like it wasn't hard enough getting a group together without now half the community hating each other. GL finding a group.

 

Like Fizban said on another post remove gathering nodes from TA, this would be a start.

I would like to see people like Ghost.png show these women running about TA atm how it's done. Anyone can be pathetic joey pvper thinking they're hard killing gatherers, when they wouldn't say boo to anyone their own level a few weeks ago lol. The only problem is all the decent pvpers they get these pvpers blowing smoke where the sun don't shine.

 

If you started the game today, you would have next to no space and when you reach level 14 you decide you want to gather. Someone tells you the best place is TA as everything stacks to 999, so you think that's great until you can afford some sacks/BP's or to see if you even like the game before you invest any IRL cash. Go in TA and get pulverized by some noob over and over again. You then try hopping the noob follows and keeps killing you with no consequences to the pvper at all, I guess they should have read that sign where it says you are gonna get bullied out of here. Would you play this game?

There are many issues I feel ingame but I really think TA would be a start in keeping some players playing.

 

It's a small world, if you're a douche we all know.

 

Build the community, not destroy it.


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#13 Ood

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 21:15

All valid points that many, many players have stated on a regular basis. Unfortunately, it's in the format of a "quitting thread," and thus, gives HC the authority to delete and/or close the thread. I really wished that they took these points into consideration over a year ago, and resolved the issues rather than make holiday events and mounts, and more holiday events and more mounts. It's quite clear why our peak player base is only around 250 players.

 

Did not see this before:

 

I have absolutely no idea how HC operates, however, I would guess that the 'art' department and the 'development' team are separate entities.  I also imagine HC has assets (or whatever the proper name is) that make quest generation relatively easy, as well as vanity item creation.  I would not think art development supersedes content development.

 

 @ Ant

 

TA is... an interesting aspect of this game. Honestly, I think there are sufficient warnings for going to and opportunity outside TA that if you complain about getting killed on TA, you're either being naive and/or stubborn, or you're just flat out in denial about the fact that TA is an open world PvP area.

 

Addressing TA perhaps should happen eventually, but with or without TA, the game just is not fun to play once you level out, gear out, and run the dungeons more than a handful of times, if you even make it that far.



#14 ComradeLewis

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 21:19

Getting rid of gathering at TA is not the answer. We would end up with an unused map like it was over a year ago. They need to implement a PK point system that restricts how many kills 1 player is allowed in a certain amount of time, or risk dropping gear, or a scaled system of valor lost depending on pk points to whoever kills you.

 

End game content:

Guild PvP

Hunting heroic+ random stat drops outside of dungeons (requires removal of set bonuses from dungeon gear)

Auction house to stabilize market prices

Rebirth system with rewards that make it worth doing

Arena, Toc, PvP Arena with their own reward system that is also worth doing

Balanced PvP that is fun, rather than just a quest to victimize the community

Buffing glimmering gem drops outside of dungeons so people actually have something solo to do

Guild leveling system for helping lower level players complete dungeons, resulting in larger capacity

Crafting items that are actually exciting, rather than 1 hat and a mount that's too expensive to make


Edited by ComradeLewis, 31 May 2015 - 21:29.

11/29/13 - 4/29/14 | 4/25/15 - 5/25/15


#15 Ant

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 21:37

I know there's many issues but what I am trying to say is the current aspects of TA are a joke ATM and need addressing simply saying "read the sign" is just a copout.

 

I have no need for TA, but it's what causes most of the problems ingame and I would like something done before the game is just full of retards.


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#16 ComradeLewis

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 21:58

I agree that something needs to be done soon. However, HC tends to always do what is easy, rather than what is right for the game. They will likely remove gathering because it's easy to do. Then half of our community will just quit (including me) because that's 1 less end game thing to do, out of the very, very small list.

 

They did it before. When gathering glimmering gems was too easy, instead of balancing it, they nerfed both TOC and solo grinding so that neither were worth doing anymore. They added ranged attacks, stun, snare or sleep to nearly every mob in the game because a few warriors were making far too much money AOE grinding. Take a trip to the Betex Void, and tell me the changes make the game better or worse. That was the easy way, not the right way. They didn't put a thought into the poor level 32 players that just wanted to do quests in there. Now it's a dead zone. The new level 46 area is the same, and there are many, many more areas that you will not see people at all in because of 1 very bad decision.


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#17 Ant

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 22:29

Having gathering in TA also doesn't help the outside world. If you had to gather outside then you wouldn't see dead maps everywhere because people need resources. Back when I foraged flat out I used to be in all different areas depending what I had to make. I made friends and I'm sure lots did because you would see someone nearby needing help and offer, now all you get is people spamming global asking for help but majority of people would just ignore and now there's a lot less people bumping into each other to socialise as much as they once could just cos TA was dead.

All the best nodes are in areas which players would be passing or questing around.
Everything stacking to 999 doesn't help the outside world either because people can hoard so many resources without the need of gathering again for a long time but wasn't possible in the past due to limited space.

Edited by Ant, 31 May 2015 - 22:31.

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#18 minddrag

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 22:40

There is a large group of people who love how trappers is now and spend a majority of their time in trappers atoll.  Removing the nodes will kill ta and many people will wuit.  Do you want this game to die?  Just because u were a community in beta dosent mean it was right... ok we have evolved, big games arent much for "travels"

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#19 Ant

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 23:10

TA could be made way better with some imagination. Wouldn't pvpers be respected more if they actually fought pvpers? The majority that attack gatherers run when actually attacked by a pvper and really it doesn't matter to them because they lose nothing at all but a bruised ego. That is a broken mechanic in my eyes.

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#20 minddrag

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 23:22

TA could be made way better with some imagination. Wouldn't pvpers be respected more if they actually fought pvpers? The majority that attack gatherers run when actually attacked by a pvper and really it doesn't matter to them because they lose nothing at all but a bruised ego. That is a broken mechanic in my eyes.

actually i really agree with you here but i dont know what to do to make it better here... what would u suggest?


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