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PvP Seasons / Bounty Preview


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#441 thering66

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:32

 

But no other part of the game is like this.

 

If I dont want to make potions, I just dont make potions.  If I dont want to hunt titans, I dont hunt titans.  Do you get it?

 

If you don't make any potions it doesn't affect me and how i play the game. If you don't titan it doesn't affect me and how i play the game. if you buy PvP protection it affects me and how i playthe game.

 

also pvp gives me prestige. I currently have enough prestige to use for the x2 event so i am not attacking anyone outside gold hits. after the event, i will be attacking players on my range to get enough pvp prestige for the next x2 event. do I hate players that i attack? no, i don't. do i utilized an aspect of the game that's present to further my enjoyment of the game? yes i do. want me to stop hitting anyone ever? then remove any benefits that i could get from PvPing.


Edited by thering66, 18 June 2015 - 00:32.


#442 EpicPiety

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:33

You're so tough I quiver at the thought... You continue to think with just the right amount of PvP watering down that you will become a better player one respects because you have hit 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 more often. You will never be! Not even with ALL the composed skills and ALL the tea in the world :P

I only level once maybe twice a year :P...i hate pressing 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8... ;)...Turning pvp into online pvp is watering it down??? Can't believe a self proclaimed TRUE pvper would even mutter that. You "TRUE pvper's" don't own pvp. your but a minority in the grand scheme of things.


Edited by EpicPiety, 18 June 2015 - 00:34.


#443 Windbattle

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:33

I only level once maybe twice a year :P...i hate pressing 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8... ;)

 

You guys need to take that banter outside the thread. so off topic its not funny. I regret derailing the discussion a bit with Dom earlier in this thread. 

 

Reminds me of all the PvPer VS Leveler debates we've had on the forums over the years. If you stop and think about it, its the same OLD discussion ONE more time. One group would prefer for PvP to get more intense and more rewards for pvpers and screw everyone else's opinion on the subject. The other group would rather not be bothered with pvping or do it as a hobby with some of their time and prefers for pvp not to get in the way of their game play.


Edited by Windbattle, 18 June 2015 - 00:36.


#444 Melons

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:36

You clearly have reading comprehension issues.  Levelers can not opt out of PvP, they can just become punching bags who waste their gold by creating a bounty so the friends of the person who hit them can clear them.  

 

I never said they didn't care about their levels at all, but it not usually a priority.  They care about staying within a certain range which they have gear for.  This is another disadvantage for levelers, it is really difficult to keep getting all the equipment needed.  This is why PvPers will stay at a certain level range for a while, it is to keep access to their gear.

 

Please, if you are intentionally strawmanning me, grow up, but if you really can't understand what I am saying then lets just stop posting to each other.  M'Kay :)

Oh please. When I meant opting out I meant the board. You simply asked what the purpose of the board was and I further went on to explain how so called "levelers" only end up on it when they PvP. Then you started throwing accusations about PvPers to help your side. Maybe, if you stop throwing baseless accusations about PvPers, like not caring about their levels or  PvPers only maintain their levels, your arguments could be slightly factual. There are plenty of ways already for "levelers" to keep their xp..PvP Protection, Honor, Deflect, Bodyguard, XP protect, etc. 



#445 EpicPiety

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:36

You guys need to take that banter outside the thread. so off topic its not funny. I regret derailing the discussion a bit with Dom earlier in this thread. 

 

Reminds me of all the PvPer VS Leveler debates we've had on the forums over the years. If you stop and think about it, its the same OLD discussion ONE more time. One group would prefer for PvP to get more intense and more rewards for pvpers and screw everyone else. The other group would rather not be bothered with pvping or do it as a hobby with some of their time and prefers for pvp not to get in the way of their game play.

Not quite derailing it just proving a point that it needs to be changed. The longer it goes on the more and more people will realize.


Edited by EpicPiety, 18 June 2015 - 00:36.


#446 Belaric

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:40

To reiterate while Hoof is here...

 

Why remove the dominance medal?

 

Why not simply change it and award points towards the dominance medal, points being earned by being in the upper echelons of the titan league? Dom medal was once based on rating, then on time spent at #1 on the ladder, it can be switched to a third criterion, no? Keep dominance - those at the top of the titan league will have shown that they have dominated the PvP tournament.

 

Have auto bounties set up by gold stolen AND by repeat hits on one target. that way you can't just hit on someone repeatedly for no gold and not be bountied. make it a random number of hits/48 hours, so the margin can not be marched up to and stopped at by a player wanting to max repeat hits and avoid a bounty. 


Good-bye and hello, as always.


#447 Kedyn

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:42

Important change suggestion...

 

Just to reiterate, what I'm suggesting is:

 

1) Continue ... stolen)

 

2) Keep ... bounty reward.

 

I think this keeps it more in-line with how the game is at the moment, but removes the 'uglyness' from it in regards to partially completed bounties and also keeps it more active with the addition of the auto posted bounties? Thoughts?

 

 

1) It is an improvement, but not perfect. All hits (whether XP loss, gold loss, or bounty board clears) should be able to be auto-bountied. However, if an auto-bounty is placed, then the player should lose the ability to post. Based on #2, if a player can post 2 bounties because I stole their gold or took too much XP, then I automatically lose at least 4 levels as I'd have 2 bounties requiring 10 hits (without taking conserve into account). I think that could be a start to the death of PVP.

 

2) I think it's a start. I'm not sure if I'm in favor, but I think it's better than a 1-hit and done type of thing. I'm not sure if more hitters mean that the denominator would increase, as that wouldn't solve the "ugliness" you're talking about.

 

Hoof - I wonder why the suggestion to "liven PVP" and head back more to the "original PVP". I feel like this is really an opposite reaction to what I had thought of during the past discussions regarding PVP and a PVP tournament system. I don't want to judge the league system too much until I would see it in action. I just feel that system feels like the original implementation of the PVP Ladder, except you're in bands of selecting people you can hit (higher level, same level or lower level).

 

Maybe my understanding of the bounty board is wrong, or maybe "old school". The "ugliness" you speak of really is what I thought the bounty board was supposed to be - a place of punishment for those who participate in PVP (and yes bounty hunting is PVP). While there are people who have abused it, I think that is true in any aspect of the game. People will abuse it and it ruins the game for many, yes. However, it is one way that players can police players (within a given range). I can say with 100% honesty that I've been on both sides - hitting players and being hit. I actually think that the players who are hit are much more nasty than the PVP'ers who are stealing gold. Some of the messages I've gotten from gold hits, lets say definitely weren't within the terms of FS.

 

One suggestion that I'd like to give is to bring some of the player base into team discussions. While I know that not everyone is out for the betterment of FS versus betterment for them, there are some players who are looking make the game a better place where it is reinvigorated for those who are old and new players.

 

Another suggestion would be to help us understand where you want to take the game. Based on previous posts, as discussed by many, we thought you were going to try to roll back PVP to it's more original roots. I feel like these discussions are moving the game in the same direction as we've seen in the past, away from a PVP oriented game. I think that would be fine, but you're slowly alienating the players who have continually given into concessions that HCS has continually made towards the leveling aspect of the game, which is fine if that's what your final goal is. However, if you're goal is to revitalize FS back to the days of 5-6 years ago, I'm not sure this is a step in the right direction by any means. 


Edited by Kedyn, 18 June 2015 - 01:41.


#448 sweetlou

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:47

I only level once maybe twice a year :P...i hate pressing 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8... ;)...Turning pvp into online pvp is watering it down??? Can't believe a self proclaimed TRUE pvper would even mutter that. You "TRUE pvper's" don't own pvp. your but a minority in the grand scheme of things.

I've never labeled myself as anything but a player, a long time playing one. Who's promising "PvP" will all of the sudden be an "online" only feature? I haven't read about it. What I am trying to preserve is the game playing right to punish you or anyone I want on the BB. Let's see the cows put together a Tournament system that is opt-in and sets up players who are "online" and I have no problem. It's what I thought we were getting! Not this notion of 1 hit bountys and all kinds of other crap that sees the game plummet straight into the gutter as far as competitiveness goes.


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“When you tear out a man's tongue, you are not proving him a liar, you're only telling the world that you fear what he might say.” -GRRM


#449 Kedyn

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:52

That would be a separate bounty, so yeah I think so. The gold on the players head would be automatically added based on the gold stolen and posted up by the game separately when it chose to do so. Whereas the bounty that was placed by the player manually would have a reward based on what the player wanted to give for the bounty as it currently works.

 

Based on my post before - I don't like this idea. Really comes down to double-taxation. This would be detrimental to PVP rather than promoting it. I though that was the idea behind this entire "PVP update" was to promote PVP. Not to promote only "league" combats, but PVP throughout the entire game. I would think that an auto-bounty being posted for any attack (gold or not gold related) would be a great way to combat some of the people "I don't want to spend my gold on bountying a player". I don't think you should have to get "punished" twice, as that would eliminate PVP for many of the players who want to dabble in PVP, stealing gold here or there, or helping delevel someone on the BB.



#450 sweetlou

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 00:52

Why remove the dominance medal?

I wholeheartedly agree!

 

Why not get rid of or make a "Legacy" of the Hoarder medal because of earlier PvP protection protecting gold?

 

Telling players who have spent time and $$ achieving something that that achievement is no longer possible is a slap in the face of the very customers that have made you, Hoof, and this game successful!


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“When you tear out a man's tongue, you are not proving him a liar, you're only telling the world that you fear what he might say.” -GRRM


#451 Melons

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 01:08

Ignoring the whole BB squabble, I like the league system. It allows those who want to participate in PvP to participate against other PvPers. It allows an actual skill match-up, however; the no level range removes that whole aspect. There is no skill involved when you have EOCs facing level 200s. I would have 0 problems if the cows added some sort of level range that was wide. It could be 1-500...501-1000..just throwing an idea. That way we can actually have some skill involved. If not, my friend had a great idea. When a higher level attacks a lower level, they don't receive much elo rating.  I'm not sure what the % would be, but it seems fair also. 

 

Just my 2 cents


Edited by Melons, 18 June 2015 - 01:28.


#452 Kedyn

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 01:12

This update encourages online pvp, glad we can be on the same page...?

 

Maybe I missed this, but I don't see how the suggestion for leagues promotes online hitting anymore than the current ladder system. Really, if you want to hit people, you'll hit those who are unbuffed in your range, and pay the gold cost to skip those who are buffed, or at least wait until they are unbuffed to hit.



#453 Tlingit

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 01:25

My eyes are crossed and I have had to take several deep breaths with all this reading.

 

I am a leveler ONLY and one of the guilds potion makers.

 

I do not and will not take part in PvP as it would cost me 6 mil + that I've spent on PvP protection so for. Just one hit and it's gone baby gone.

 

Prestige is not important to me as evidenced by the fact I still have the points from my first two years, or so, of play here. Started in Dec. 2008, I did.  I really do need to use it, I'll try to remember it for this coming 2x dub event.  Really I will try.

 

As to why a leveler hates PvP, read my bio. LOL That tells the story of my hate very well.

 

All this is  going to cost me is my hard earned gold, either stolen or spent to repair gear after hits, and the stress of all that brings with it.

 

I play the game because I it. I like rubber necking my way through each and every zone. I  look at beasts, relics, gear, in an ever changing rainbow of color and variety.   Things move too. Guess it's not for everyone from the posts I've read though.

 

I'm the shaman story teller, always looking for the next story to tell.

 

Sing for my breakfast.

Dance for my lunch.

Tell a story for my dinner.

It doesn't cost much.

 


Edited by Tlingit, 18 June 2015 - 01:30.


#454 Tlingit

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 01:28

Double post. Bleh.


Edited by Tlingit, 18 June 2015 - 01:32.


#455 Altiger

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 01:28

Post how you would run the pvp system then? I see a ton of people post their complaints / critiques of the new system, but ALMOST NO ONE has suggested a SOLUTION.

 

The cows work better on solutions than problems. If you love the game as I do, lets work towards a solution, not just complaints.

the online pvp they call league I do not have a problem with (from what I understood it is open ranges?)

 

the problem is what they did to the bounty board, it really has become a joke

(I read the first 9 pages then skipped the rest, too many posts, will read them later)


Edited by Altiger, 18 June 2015 - 01:30.


#456 WandKing

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 02:16

Thanks for def of ELO Hoof :)

 

I say let's give this idea of Zorg's a tryout! If we don't like it then just reset back to factory settings :D



#457 Lellarell

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 02:35

Why the hell the "system" would set a bounty on my head when players can spend their own Gold/FSPs doing that??

 

Why the "system" would set a bounty on my head if I never attacked the "system"??



#458 LuxFerre

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 02:37

I know that any time changes are made to a system, there will be those for it and those against it.  Never will everyone be pleased.  Sometimes small and more precise tweaks would be far less divisive and help game stability than huge and complete overhauls. 


Edited by LuxFerre, 18 June 2015 - 04:50.


#459 DomCorvis

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 02:51

since when does leveling make you a better pvp'r...i can say it doesnt...ask countless people 3-4x my level and higher occasionally...i can clear and defend quite easily...why should higher lvls=dominance on these "leagues"?...

i suggest 3 ladders or brackets..100-999,1000-1999,2000+...these are semi "fair" and a reasonable compromise...

winbattle-the fact you hide from me on bb says it all...you have asked hcs to make me stop hitting because youre too afraid to defend your guildmates...even lost mates over this...you truly think youre a better pvp'r thn me? just cuz youre eoc?....ill play this new system...if only to get my shots at you...you have talked trash here on the forums and in pm's over the years whle hiding behind those levels you worked for..
claiming to be better thn me but never stepping up...and im sure this will be removed but fact is they cany stop me from smashing my way to yyou in these leagues...see ya soon pal

hoof,grim,zorg...im sorry but you allow him to talk down to me but when i say something im too "aggresive"...

many people have expressed disgust for this system..

i propose simple chsnges to make it semi "fair"...eoc has advantage in every other aspect of the game...dontt ruin pvp and give them the advantage there too...


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#460 Mzzery

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Posted 18 June 2015 - 03:05

I agree with DomCorvis, there really needs to be SOME sort of bracketing between the levels, cuz it's not really gonna make new players enjoy the game very much if they get slapped around by lvl 2k+ players as soon as they get out off protection, and it's no challenge what so ever for anyone at EOC to smash someone 1000+ levels below, if the EOCer has the faintest idea about how to gear up. A pvp-newbie at EOC can be beaten by someone much lower level, but if that lower level player knows how to pvp, he/she would end up in a higher bracket and get pitched against other pvpers soon enough, and then he/she wouldn't have much of a chance to climb any more brackets. 

 

I think it'd be more fun for everyone, and less likely that people would quit over it if everyone had at least some chance to get somewhere, and that'd need a few level-separators, maybe at 1k and 2k as DomCorvis suggested, or at 500 and 1500.



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