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Something to help combat the simplicity of levelling these days.


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#81 Mister Doom

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 20:57

To answer your question Egami, yes I actually believe adding back some challenges to the game (in everything, not just levelling) will make more people WANT to play.

 

You get no sense of achievement without a challenge to overcome.

 

Sense of achievement = Happy players.


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#82 EpicPiety

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 21:09

Ideas to make levelling harder going forward.

 

Some of these have been suggested before.

 

1) Individual Monsters have new enhancements that can negate specific buffs - smashing hammer, KE, etc. This alone could provide plenty of challenge if the mobs are placed in a challenging order, and with stats to take advantage of the weakness they create by nerfing SH etc. (nerf SH on a mob with big HP or armour, nerf KE on a mob with high def etc.) 

 

2) Individual Monsters have an anti-magic shell/ability that drops the power of ALL buffs used against them/in their vicinity by 100-200 etc. with 175 as the lowest it can reduce the power of buffs. This might be easier for HCS to create, and is a simple counter to the presence of overpowered buffs.

 

3) New category of realm that does either or both of the above. Like a dark realm, but these Shadow infused areas negatively effect the power of buffs used in them.

 

4) New category of realm that renders legendary sets inert, another trap by the Shadow Lord to make it harder for the heroes of the realms to reach him. This will force players to use SE, Elite, Champ sets etc. This combined with mobs that can nerf some of the stronger hunting buffs could provide a stern challenge.

 

5) New category of realm that negates forging and/or crafting and associated buff bonuses while the player is there. Another way to reduce the statistical advantage the players hold. 

 

6) Go the whole hog and have a common items only realm - BUT - HCS would then need to ensure that there are common items available that would work. At EOC and many levels behind there is not a complete set of common items for players to wear. And there isn't much skill in putting that common set together, as the stats are what they are.

 

7) Realms that nerf relic bonuses to stats. 

 

8) Combinations of above realms and mobs to make it extremely hard to fight through. These kinds of areas - not small - 25 thick, would make sense as a final sequence towards an end game of actually defeating the Shadow Lord, if such a move were ever contemplated.

 

If you want it to be harder to level, these ideas will help I think.

 

I do not think they can be retroactive, however, only going forward with new content.

 

You could have an event during which the anti-magi/buff reducing power is activated over all monsters in the realms, but in return they yield more XP - they will be tougher to kill so the players gain more reward. that might be an interesting variant on 2x XP events...

 

We are left with the first 2875 levels of content. Retrospective changes to make those levels harder is difficult to justify,as it is very difficult not to see it as highly unfair on those players who are not already at EOC. But that would be HCS's call.

 

My few cents. 

@#1 I'm not a fan of chance luck buffs...Never have never will.


Edited by EpicPiety, 01 February 2016 - 21:10.


#83 Belaric

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 21:09

Shardoom - I see your point, and it makes sense, but I think HCS would find it a hard sell. Making changes part of a compelling storyline would be the best way in my opinion, but do they have the time for that? (see epic quest stall-out) 

 

Egami - I have no idea if making levelling harder will increase the player base. Not really if it only gets harder from 2875+, as that will have very little effect on newbies joining the game. Making it harder from the start? That could go both ways, some people like and respond to challenge, some will lose interest and drift away. It depends what people expect from this game, how it is introduced to them. The difficulty factor is something that HCS have to judge. Given their historical actions you have to think they favour making levelling easier, as that has been the general direction in which the game has gone. Does that correlate with game numbers? Yes, but is it causally linked? harder to say with any certainty. HCS have the data. I would say levelling, in common with many other aspects of the game has gotten easier due to overall slow power creep of gear and buffs over the years, hard for any game as long-lived as this one to avoid. 

 

 

I do know that many changes that in the past were asked for have made it easier to level (e.g. new buff designs, more 2 piece sets, changes to relic bonuses) - so you could argue that players in the past cast their votes for levelling to be easier, and now we are living with those consequences. Players tend, on average, to want everything faster bigger more, and do not really think long term. So here we are.

 

But. At every step along the way HCS made the decision on which buffs to implement, what to add to composing, what caps to put on potion levels etc. If HCS see a benefit in making levelling harder again I would assume we will see that happen. Until then those who want more challenge are out of luck.

 

What happens to keep new players interested in the aftermath of the mobile app is more important I'd think. Another ball that is currently in HCS's court.  


Edited by Belaric, 01 February 2016 - 21:27.

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#84 Pythia

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 22:38

I'm curious, I've read this thread and most of it has to do with making leveling harder.  (not favored)

 

Nerf the OP pots and alter SSI among other things.

 

SSI is not available til level 400.  

 

Would this nerfing also be applied to the new PvP potions that can and are used in GvG?

 

What about the OP gear I have only seen some of?  The suff that is made.

 

Killer stats, I have been looking forward to trying it out if I don't die of old age first.

 

Because, you know,  it would not be right to fold, spindle, and trash for one part of the playing base and the leave the other alone.



#85 Anonemesis

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 22:52

Swamping sets isn't possible as a majority don't have alot of inventory space.

If you want the game to be more challenging get on my level and join a low level guild with 3-5 structures or create one and quit piggy backing off of everyone else the game is already hard for those of us who don't have the perks of a top tier guild. I can tell you if I didn't have FSP's I'd be 100's of levels behind maybe level 600-700, paying for premium equipment, buffs, potions is a individual basis, quit using these items to level then you solve your problem. Any challenge applied needs to be on a EOC basis, not prior and should consider the average joe who isn't sipping on that purple drank.


Edited by Anonemesis, 01 February 2016 - 22:59.

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#86 EpicPiety

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:01

Swamping sets isn't possible as a majority don't have alot of inventory space.

If you want the game to be more challenging get on my level and join a low level guild with 3-5 structures or create one and quit piggy backing off of everyone else the game is already hard for those of us who don't have the perks of a top tier guild. I can tell you if I didn't have FSP's I'd be 100's of levels behind maybe level 600-700, paying for premium equipment, buffs, potions is a individual basis, quit using these items to level then you solve your problem. Any challenge applied needs to be on a EOC basis, not prior and should consider the average joe who isn't sipping on that purple drank.

Right so "gimp yourself" Like BG said lmao...Right

 

It's like saying hmmm i'll take the 10 dollars instead of 1000.


Edited by EpicPiety, 01 February 2016 - 23:08.


#87 Pythia

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:07

Don't get mean EP.  Insulting is not nice and doesn't accomplish anything.

 

Running a guild is hard work.  Harder still to make a go of it.


Edited by Pythia, 01 February 2016 - 23:08.


#88 EpicPiety

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:08

Don't get mean EP.  Insulting is not nice and doesn't accomplish anything.

 

Running a guild is hard work.  Harder still to make a go of it.

Wasn't being mean but that's essentially what he's saying.



#89 Anonemesis

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:10

Right so "gimp yourself" Like BG said lmao...Right

 

It's like saying hmmm i'll take the 10 dollars instead of 1000.

I don't know anyone who complains about having 1000 dollars over 10...except people in this forum :]

The whole point of guild perks, potions etc is your paying premium for it therefore you get premium perks that are meant to make the game easier. The problem is theres a low player base [we need at least 10k] so prices stay low because the chances of selling things are greatly lowered. The games challenging if you don't have all the premium perks infact I bought all my equipment...I can say 99% of the playerbase did not. They piggy backed off their guild one after another and profited as such. Now people complain because the games too easy =[ if its easy its your own fault learn to be self reliant.

 


Edited by Anonemesis, 01 February 2016 - 23:18.

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#90 EpicPiety

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:19

I don't know anyone who complains about having 1000 dollars over 10...except people in this forum :]

The whole point of guild perks, potions etc is your paying premium for it therefore you get premium perks that are meant to make the game easier. The problem is theres a low player base [we need at least 10k] so prices stay low because the chances of selling things are greatly lowered. The games challenging if you don't have all the premium perks infact I bought all my equipment...I can say 99% of the playerbase did not. They piggy backed off their guild one after another and profited as such. Now people complain because the games too easy =[ if its easy its your own fault learn to be self reliant.

 

Your not understanding my analogy...You have 10 dollars in front of you and 1000. You can only choose one...Your asking us to take the 10$ bill opposed to the 1000$ bill if we want challenge. Now why would anyone in the right mind do that? You'd have to be slow.

 

Edit...

The only reason prices are low is because there is way way way beyond way too much supply and next to no demand because of all the reasons stated in this thread. BY NO MEANS IS THIS A GOOD THING AT ALL. You can argue that it has some benefit but the cons MUCH outweigh the pros.


Edited by EpicPiety, 01 February 2016 - 23:21.


#91 Pythia

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:24

I have the answer too all the woes..

 

 

 

FRAG it.   DROP it.  

 

 

We know that anything dropped is lost for good.  Just think, then there would not be an over, over, over abundance of anything and prices would go up.. and up.... and up... lol

 

 

Really people..


Edited by Pythia, 01 February 2016 - 23:27.


#92 EpicPiety

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:28

I have the answer too all the woes..

 

 

 

FRAG it.   lol

Maybe if there was a 95% chance to auto frag everytime you get a drop otherwise fragging really doesn't help the cause. Players are free to choose whether to sell or frag... Doesn't help supply and demand. If the price is at 15 fsps and one person decides to sell they all hop in and try to profit. In return its back to 50k an item anyways. With no sales whatsoever because there is already such a high supply to begin with.



#93 Mister Doom

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:28

With regards to the arguments of us complaining while being in a top tier guild with everything provided for us.

 

If you think that applies to me, well...

 

I have always bought my own things, discovered creature stats for myself, created my own hunting setups etc etc etc.

 

I don't have all of the structures (which if you actually looked into, you' realise they are mostly garbage and aren't worth the gold you pay for them) I can't have relics the game doesn't allow it.

 

Yet I still think the game is in need of a serious challenge revamp.


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#94 EpicPiety

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:31

With regards to the arguments of us complaining while being in a top tier guild with everything provided for us.

 

If you think that applies to me, well...

 

I have always bought my own things, discovered creature stats for myself, created my own hunting setups etc etc etc.

 

I don't have all of the structures (which if you actually looked into, you' realise they are mostly garbage and aren't worth the gold you pay for them) I can't have relics the game doesn't allow it.

 

Yet I still think the game is in need of a serious challenge revamp.

Totally agree... OP buffs need to be reevaluated...As well as mobs. Anyone ever stopped to think about maybe discontinuing AM on LE??? Lower drop/spawn rate from LE that spawn in realms? Let's kick it old school again.

 

 

 

Maybe titan CD too. i guess a lone TH can only dream :(/


Edited by EpicPiety, 01 February 2016 - 23:32.


#95 Pythia

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:38

Good night please oh please don't alter the drop rate..

 

Even with a BIG fi  I cuss the low or seeming low drop rate.  If you all are getting lots of drops share your secret so I can get more, after all I could use lots more frag for my composing. Don't want to run out  now.

 

Ok?

 

Yes, I like my own stuff too. I have a three piece offline set in my bp.. Can't use it yet though, I'm not big enough but believe in preparing for the future.



#96 EpicPiety

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:41

Running a guild is hard work.  Harder still to make a go of it.

You couldn't be talking to a better person about that...Trust me i know. Been there...Done that...Still doing it.


Good night please oh please don't alter the drop rate..

 

Even with a BIG fi  I cuss the low or seeming low drop rate.  If you all are getting lots of drops share your secret so I can get more, after all I could use lots more frag for my composing. Don't want to run out  now.

 

Ok?

 

Yes, I like my own stuff too. I have a three piece offline set in my bp.. Can't use it yet though, I'm not big enough but believe in preparing for the future.

LL230 FI 1840  reck 230...


Edited by EpicPiety, 01 February 2016 - 23:41.


#97 EpicPiety

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:43

I have the answer too all the woes..

 

 

 

FRAG it.   DROP it.  

 

 

We know that anything dropped is lost for good.  Just think, then there would not be an over, over, over abundance of anything and prices would go up.. and up.... and up... lol

 

 

Really people..

Again one or even a dozen people can't make a difference even if they drop it...Again that would just be self sabotage anyways. I can farm enough LE sets to supply nearly the whole player base that can equip them in one go lol. That's the root of the LE problem.


Edited by EpicPiety, 01 February 2016 - 23:45.


#98 Pythia

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:47

LL175, reck 175,   FI1000,  boosted only by a lesser distil, brew master and extend both at 175 or whatever mine are at.

 

 

Anything else is OP. :P

 

 

As to the post above... Drop them, if you do they are not in the game and no longer matter.


Edited by Pythia, 01 February 2016 - 23:50.


#99 sweetlou

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:57

My only question to everybody out there: does anybody really believe that making things harder for levelers will solve anything?

The better question is will reducing the stat changing skill levels(ie KE, SH, CA, CD, and DC etc.) in Composing, Ladder and Global pots solve the ridiculousness of what the game has become? I believe it will! I think skills like Conserve, AL, AM, FI, 4L, LF etc. are all types of skills that can be set as high as anyone wants. At least they don't break the game. I also believe leaving the Godlike potions for donators is the exception that must remain. Let's not add to the stupidity and suggest hindering Cow revenue.


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#100 Pardoux

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 23:58

LL175, reck 175,   FI1000,  boosted only by a lesser distil, brew master and extend both at 175 or whatever mine are at.

 

 

Anything else is OP. :P

 

 

Umm, isn't that the whole point we're making about over-powered potions ? ;)


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Eddie Izzard : The National Rifle Association say that guns don't kill people, people do. But I think the gun helps, you know ? I think it helps. I think just standing there going "BANG" - that's not going to kill too many people, is it ?

 

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, but it seems that everything I eat lately turns to poo ...



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