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Something to help combat the simplicity of levelling these days.


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#101 Anonemesis

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 00:02

With regards to the arguments of us complaining while being in a top tier guild with everything provided for us.

 

If you think that applies to me, well...

 

I have always bought my own things, discovered creature stats for myself, created my own hunting setups etc etc etc.

 

I don't have all of the structures (which if you actually looked into, you' realise they are mostly garbage and aren't worth the gold you pay for them) I can't have relics the game doesn't allow it.

 

Yet I still think the game is in need of a serious challenge revamp.

 

Structures may not be worth the gold, but it still gives you a huge edge in the long run then a guild with low level structures. And I been in my guild since it's creation, you haven't, you got to the top with the help of others which is perfectly fine if you weren't sitting here trying to justify making the game harder for people who don't want to feed off others success. It would make more sense removing what was added to make the game easier then it would be to add diffuculty to it. It's a balancing act and I don't think adding difficulty is going to bold well for those who don't buy fsps. No game you should be forced to buy premium currency or join a guild to be able to play the game.


Edited by Anonemesis, 02 February 2016 - 00:07.

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#102 Pardoux

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 00:11

Structures may not be worth the gold, but it still gives you a huge edge in the long run then a guild with low level structures. And I been in my guild since it's creation, you haven't, you got to the top with the help of others which is perfectly fine if you weren't sitting here trying to justify making the game harder for people who don't want to feed off others success. It would make more sense removing what was added to make the game easier then it would be to add diffuculty to it. It's a balancing act and I don't think adding difficulty is going to bold well for those who don't buy fsps. No game you should be forced to buy premium currency or join a guild to be able to play the game.

 

1. No-one is saying you should be forced to buy fsps. There are countless players in the game who take great pride (misplaced, I think, but that's a different story) in never having spent a penny on the game.

 

2. Most structures ARE worthless. A lot of guilds have all the structures because noobs think that "structures = success" - they couldn't be further from the truth. There are a few essentials, but most are luxuries at best and useless at worst.

 

3. Removing stuff that made the game easier is the scenario that most people seem to be objecting to so far


Homer : Marge, don't discourage the boy. Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals .. except the weasel.

 

Eddie Izzard : The National Rifle Association say that guns don't kill people, people do. But I think the gun helps, you know ? I think it helps. I think just standing there going "BANG" - that's not going to kill too many people, is it ?

 

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, but it seems that everything I eat lately turns to poo ...


#103 Pythia

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 00:12

I'm not one using OP stuff all that much.

 

That is saved for special things, (unsolicited spanking, not into that you know) and is used or that and events. :)

 

I think that if people that are using those OP things stopped using those OP things the game might become more of a challenge for them, then they would not need to try and make it  more challenging for me.

 

I'm fine with things just the way they are. :)



#104 Pardoux

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 00:33

I'm not one using OP stuff all that much.

 

That is saved for special things, (unsolicited spanking, not into that you know) and is used or that and events. :)

 

I think that if people that are using those OP things stopped using those OP things the game might become more of a challenge for them, then they would not need to try and make it  more challenging for me.

 

I'm fine with things just the way they are. :)

 

If they are still in the game, then people with access to them are, of course, going to continue using them to maintain their position in game.

 

Saying for players to stop using them, whilst others continue to use them is kind of like asking Lewis Hamilton to drive a skoda whilst everyone else in the race drives an F1 car ... and still expecting him to place on the podium ...


Edited by Pardoux, 02 February 2016 - 00:59.

Homer : Marge, don't discourage the boy. Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals .. except the weasel.

 

Eddie Izzard : The National Rifle Association say that guns don't kill people, people do. But I think the gun helps, you know ? I think it helps. I think just standing there going "BANG" - that's not going to kill too many people, is it ?

 

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, but it seems that everything I eat lately turns to poo ...


#105 EpicPiety

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 00:35

LL175, reck 175,   FI1000,  boosted only by a lesser distil, brew master and extend both at 175 or whatever mine are at.

 

 

Anything else is OP. :P

 

 

As to the post above... Drop them, if you do they are not in the game and no longer matter.

Agree but disagree with the dropping part... That doesn't solve anything. They need to not be as easily available by nerfing drop rate through nerfing buffs and maybe touching the spawn rate. Definitely remove AM from LE.


Edited by EpicPiety, 02 February 2016 - 00:35.


#106 sweetlou

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 00:41

I'm not one using OP stuff all that much.

 

That is saved for special things, (unsolicited spanking, not into that you know) and is used or that and events. :)

 

I think that if people that are using those OP things stopped using those OP things the game might become more of a challenge for them, then they would not need to try and make it  more challenging for me.

 

I'm fine with things just the way they are. :)

If you don't use these over powered pots "that much" whatever that means you won't miss anything, so why would you oppose the reduction of stat changing skill levels? Can you seriously not 1 hit without mega pots? The whole game went through your current level years ago before these ridiculous pots were introduced. There's plenty of help out there if you suffer from anxiety about the possibility of not having super pots. I promise, I'll hold your hand!


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“When you tear out a man's tongue, you are not proving him a liar, you're only telling the world that you fear what he might say.” -GRRM


#107 EpicPiety

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 00:45

If you don't use these over powered pots "that much" whatever that means you won't miss anything, so why would you oppose the reduction of stat changing skill levels? Can you seriously not 1 hit without mega pots? The whole game went through your current level years ago before these ridiculous pots were introduced. There's plenty of help out there if you suffer from anxiety about the possibility of not having super pots. I promise, I'll hold your hand!

It's all relative anyways... You'll still succeed if you are succeeding and fail if your failing. But you won't be failing as hard because there won't be a "god mode" people can enable. You will also succeed but maybe not as easy and fast...



#108 Pythia

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:01

I am building a house of chests. If I don't get any then I can't build my house. It's my retirement home you know. I like to look at the pretty colored walls. :)

 

In truth Lou, I use my chests mostly for the events, (and I used one in a pesky GvG Saturday night, I will not tell anyone why though. My business.) big LF, AM, Con and whatever else is added to that particular combo.  There is not much to be had in GE's except more and of course the bling.  Most all of my bling is guild related and that which boosts me polishes the guild along the way.

 

That bling is pretty to me. I use it for interior decorating in my guild, they look good hanging on the wall.

 

I really don't use them the way others probably use them, so yes I would miss them.

 

Therefore, I still do not want anyone to change the way the game works for me. 



#109 sweetlou

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:02

These super pots have a two fold detriment. In PvE, like the topic of this thread, players are unhappy because of the lack of any challenge. Players are using the same gear for 1000+ levels. They never have to look at the creature stats. The overall lack of a challenge that used to be and what attracted us to play is gone. On the PvP and GvG side of the game, these pots have created a schism so far that players without these pots, whatever the reason, have absolutely zero chance to compete. In short the game needs some attention. Attention that we used to see has disappeared. I'd like to hear from HOOF what's going on?


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“When you tear out a man's tongue, you are not proving him a liar, you're only telling the world that you fear what he might say.” -GRRM


#110 Pythia

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:14

Perhaps we should also hear from players that are not 1500 to EOC. 

 

 I surfed players like I always do when I'm in learning mode.

 

I am one of the 6 I looked at.  One joined 2007, one joined in 2010 the rest joined in 2008 like me. 

 

Every last one of them but me is sitting at  or near OEC and commenting in this thread about how those pots damaged the game.

 

This bothers me.  Everyone used those pots to get where they are now with the possible exception of the 2007.

 

Now it's time to nerf them?  At EOC. it's time to nerf them?  Spare me.

 

I'm not sure how I feel or what to think about that. Maybe I should go look at some of the others.


Edited by Pythia, 02 February 2016 - 01:14.


#111 Pardoux

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:21

Perhaps we should also hear from players that are not 1500 to EOC. 

 

 I surfed players like I always do when I'm in learning mode.

 

I am one of the 6 I looked at.  One joined 2007, one joined in 2010 the rest joined in 2008 like me. 

 

Every last one of them but me is sitting at  or near OEC and commenting in this thread about how those pots damaged the game.

 

This bothers me.  Everyone used those pots to get where they are now with the possible exception of the 2007.

 

Now it's time to nerf them?  At EOC. it's time to nerf them?  Spare me.

 

I'm not sure how I feel or what to think about that. Maybe I should go look at some of the others.

 

The UBER-Pots haven't been around "that" long - so I think most of us had already gotten to EOC (or pretty darned close) before they appeared - but that doesn't appear to suit your argument ;)

 

Sorry, let me amend that - there WERE uber-pots, but they were only available via donations. Now, they're given away for very little effort in GE's and are accessible, via composing, at insane levels...


Edited by Pardoux, 02 February 2016 - 01:28.

Homer : Marge, don't discourage the boy. Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals .. except the weasel.

 

Eddie Izzard : The National Rifle Association say that guns don't kill people, people do. But I think the gun helps, you know ? I think it helps. I think just standing there going "BANG" - that's not going to kill too many people, is it ?

 

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, but it seems that everything I eat lately turns to poo ...


#112 Pythia

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:43

Pardoux, I know how hard it was in the beginning.

 

You joined FS  June 1st of 2008..  I joined November 27 of 2008.

 

Did you really experience so many more hardships than I did in those few months.

 

I know about composing, you got the first one in the game... Congratulations. it's a worthy feat.  Now you want things changed so I will not be able to make and experience anything near what you have done.

 

I've made my own way, bought my own gear, my own composed potions, my own gold to buy the other potions as I got to where I needed them.

 

You are right about new players coming into the game IF they get into a guild that can and will help them.  That is not a for sure that they will stay though.  Some guilds do not even want to be bothered with new players.

 

I don't want anyone telling me I'm not going to be allowed to grow into the same things you and others have grown into just because there is no challenge there anymore.

 

You don't have to like them, but I will not be told I won't be allowed to grow to where I can make them.



#113 EpicPiety

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:46

Pardoux, I know how hard it was in the beginning.

 

You joined FS  June 1st of 2008..  I joined November 27 of 2008.

 

Did you really experience so many more hardships than I did in those few months.

 

I know about composing, you got the first one in the game... Congratulations. it's a worthy feat.  Now you want things changed so I will not be able to make and experience anything near what you have done.

 

I've made my own way, bought my own gear, my own composed potions, my own gold to buy the other potions as I got to where I needed them.

 

You are right about new players coming into the game IF they get into a guild that can and will help them.  That is not a for sure that they will stay though.  Some guilds do not even want to be bothered with new players.

 

I don't want anyone telling me I'm not going to be allowed to grow into the same things you and others have grown into just because there is no challenge there anymore.

 

You don't have to like them, but I will not be told I won't be allowed to grow to where I can make them.

Everyone has had equal opportunity and chance to use said buffs? Still not seeing eye to eye with you never will. No one had early access to composing or anything else? Some players are more serious than others and thus they accel. Just because you or others chose to be less serious shouldn't mean you get extra time to catch up while the game suffers and essentially shoves the knife deeper into its own throat.

 

 

So answer this...Should someone be able to slap on say gear that's level 1200 and one hit a level 2500-3000 monsters inexpensively??? If no then there is no argument present... You already said yourself the buffs are OP confused on what we are still arguing here?


Edited by EpicPiety, 02 February 2016 - 01:50.


#114 Pythia

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:53

You don't understand.

 

If composing is nerfed, ( weeded out) everything I create will be less than what has been able to be created up to now, IF I get to compose anymore at all.

 

The push of this thread is to nerf the composing pots, alter or dumb down SSI, KE  and other buffs deemed OP.

 

Now, I think I'll watch some players when they hunt and take note of their buffs then find out if they are composed, epic, or pumped up by distil and the other buff.

 

I think it will be interesting to see who uses what and sings the blues over here.

 

What do you think?

 

 

 

By the way, I doubt the admin will make this happen I'm just interested.


Edited by Pythia, 02 February 2016 - 01:54.


#115 EpicPiety

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:55

You don't understand.

 

If composing is nerfed, ( weeded out) everything I create will be less than what has been able to be created up to now, IF I get to compose anymore at all.

 

The push of this thread is to nerf the composing pots, alter or dumb down SSI, KE  and other buffs deemed OP.

 

Now, I think I'll watch some players when they hunt and take note of their buffs then find out if they are composed, epic, or pumped up by distil and the other buff.

 

I think it will be interesting to see who uses what and sings the blues over here.

 

What do you think?

 

 

 

By the way, I doubt the admin will make this happen I'm just interested.

Ah so it's just a selfish argument then... you had equal opportunity to grind the levels in the beginning just like everyone else. The buffs are frankly very toxic and harmful for the game...You agreed they were op yourself now please answer said question... For the sake of proving this i'll literally throw on a level 1200 set and show you all my damage and show you the mob stats. I'll be 1 hitting them. Next time i'm leveling... Will also sit on the bounty board in composing and see how long i can last... You'd be surprised just how broken the game is because of OP buffs.


Edited by EpicPiety, 02 February 2016 - 01:57.


#116 Pardoux

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 01:58


 

Did you really experience so many more hardships than I did in those few months.

 

 

The "hardships", back in the day were what got me hooked onto the game. Figuring out setups, which changed from level to level. What buff combinations to use whilst still using all types of gear (common, rare, unique, SE and LE) - those were challenges, challenges I relished.

 

Now ? - there is NO challenge in levelling. Does anyone use COMMON or RARE at all anymore for it ? - I use the odd unique set here and there to make other LE sets work, but common/rare ? - they USED to have a function in the game , now all they're good for is composing ...

 

You're using the start date argument - well, given your progression in the game (and I'm not putting it down, each to their own), levelling is MUCH easier for you than it was in those same levels for me - so it's not about taking stuff away, per se, it's about restoring the challenge that the game USED to have when levelling, but hasn't had for a long time - and everytime new donation chests come out ('cos the trend seems to be bigger and better each time, to draw in the dollars), new GE chests, new Composing Pots (given those at L60 are clamouring for the cap to be raised again), the game gets dumbed down even further.


Homer : Marge, don't discourage the boy. Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals .. except the weasel.

 

Eddie Izzard : The National Rifle Association say that guns don't kill people, people do. But I think the gun helps, you know ? I think it helps. I think just standing there going "BANG" - that's not going to kill too many people, is it ?

 

I don't mean to sound pessimistic, but it seems that everything I eat lately turns to poo ...


#117 Pythia

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 02:05

Not like everyone else EP, I'm retired on a dollar menu monthly check, trying to play a high end game.  I'm doing the best I can with what I have.

 

Yes, to some extent this is selfish of me. But I do want to experience  the parts of the game that interest me.  This interests me.

 

 

Tell me about it Pardoux, when I hit Falgi zone I cussed. That's when I learned about DC, Fury, Con, and a few other potions.  Then I could kill those clawed freaks.

 

I'm taking it slower just for that reason.  I don't want to get there to fast. I want to have fun, but I also want to compose myself up the levels.

 

Therefor I don't want things changed to much before I get to experience what I want to.

 

There are a number of players that think I have to take part in parts that don't interest me before I can carry on with the ones that do interest me.


Edited by Pythia, 02 February 2016 - 02:07.


#118 EpicPiety

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 02:11

Not like everyone else EP, I'm retired on a dollar menu monthly check, trying to play a high end game.  I'm doing the best I can with what I have.

 

Yes, to some extent this is selfish of me. But I do want to experience  the parts of the game that interest me.  This interests me.

 

 

Well i guess you keep avoiding the question i asked...It's not like i don't play this game on a dollar menu. I only spend sometimes in 2x events and it's not for levels its for GXP and i sublevel which in a sense is totally worthless... You can still experience those parts of the game... Totally pointless conversing because you won't even answer my question  :(. We won't say parrelel because i'm looking out for the games health and your looking out for yourself. Which isn't a bad thing but i hope hoof would make the right choice.

 

 

 

 

So answer this...Should someone be able to slap on say gear that's level 1200 and one hit a level 2500-3000 monsters inexpensively??? If no then there is no argument present... You already said yourself the buffs are OP confused on what we are still arguing here?

 

Edited by EpicPiety, 02 February 2016 - 02:13.


#119 Pythia

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 02:37

Is the gear for those content releases complete?  If so then that is what you are meant to use.  If that bothers you then that is where you might find your challenge.  Have a gear fashion show and combine sets and whatnot and see if you can do better. It that not the math of the problem?

 

I can only speak to what I have experience with, and there is not that big of a level spread in the gear I use for hunting.

 

I know that in combining gear I try stuff on until I like what I see in my stats and enhancements. Maybe I'll try it in a hunt and see how it works with buffs too.  Level of gear is important but so are the stats of the gear and how it augments other gear.  I use gear below my level because of the boost given when all gear is equipped and buffs are applied.

 

In other words, I have a fashion show using the hunting guide as my gear guide and going on from there. 

 

Is that proper at the levels you speak of, I don't know, I'm not there. 

 

Ask me again when I get there.

 

Did that answer your question?



#120 EpicPiety

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 03:01

"\'challenge\' is supposed to be to make yourself as good as you possibly can within the game mechanics. It is THEIR job to make sure we can\'t make ourselves too powerful. "

 

Borrowing a quote from someone... Again Pythia...Challenge is not gimping oneself like you keep claiming. I don't find challenge in having a fashion show at EoC putting together sets that have even more useless damage. I can easily obtain 200k+ damage as it is now before DD/other on hit dmg buffs. That's not fun nor is it challenging... You can do near 400k dmg without breaking a nail... Needless to say the mobs have 50k hp after wither.

 

**edit

 

Yea and we're not really asking to make the early game any harder just mid/late game... When i say harder i mean take away these absurdly op buffs. AL/CON/Stalker/doubler/lib will stay the same..


Edited by EpicPiety, 02 February 2016 - 03:23.



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