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Stat Changing Skill Levels in Super Pots Are Harmful


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Poll: Super Pots (75 member(s) have cast votes)

Do you think Super pots are too powerful?

  1. Yes (44 votes [58.67%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 58.67%

  2. No (31 votes [41.33%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 41.33%

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#161 EpicPiety

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 00:55

Any set up or player can be beaten. Some of the best pvp players I know are considered low level. But it should take a level 500 player some strategy, knowledge, effort, something to take on a level 3000 and win. It shouldn't be easy.

Same can be said a 3000 vs 3000...Shouldn't be about who can use the best composing. 



#162 yotwehc

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 00:57

Same can be said a 3000 vs 3000...Shouldn't be about who can use the best composing.

It isn't... I use composing and I get schooled... by players not using composed pots... so point is?

oh.. and I always PM those guys... mad respect...

I am curious what those guys opinions are. IMHO, they are the best of the best. Although they had access to the easier way out, they didn't take it and still dominated. I certainly couldn't do what they did. Nit all of us want that hard a challenge so I understand ;-p

Edited by yotwehc, 09 July 2016 - 01:27.


#163 TxLxS

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 00:59

This is not about bounty board and making it so a level 500 can defend themselves against a 3000. That's just not right and makes no sense. It's about making it so you can't do that... Also making it so fighting someone your level isn't about who can use the biggest composing pots etc...

Even with composed pots you can still lose in gvg and pvp via enchanments it's not an instant win ex specially since it's a percentage increase with lower lvls if someone was to gvg against me and I had on the right gear even if they were using composed pots I could still make them miss I have done it before it may be with some chance buffs also but it's not an instant win


Edit and honestly about 95 percent of fs is in rare epics and goes offline with them lol pvp and gvg even if you use composed pots with epics you still won't win so idk most people who get hit in gvg are offline and 9/10 times are in epics same thing on board so I don't even know what the big deal is honestly you know that's one of the main reason you don't even need composed pots lol

Edited by TxLxS, 09 July 2016 - 01:11.


#164 EpicPiety

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 01:18

Proof is in the pudding. Nothing more nothing less. Everything's already been laid out pages back in this thread. Not going round about. If you want a response read my previous posts.


Edited by EpicPiety, 09 July 2016 - 01:19.


#165 EpicPiety

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 01:21

*edit* 


Edited by EpicPiety, 09 July 2016 - 01:22.


#166 Egami

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 01:40

I just erased one of the longest Egami diatribes in history.

What's the point?

Note this is just a question based on what I've been reading. Is the main issue here that you feel the high level composed potions have an adverse affect on PvP? And a solution to this would be to restrict (or cap) some of the potions levels when using in PvP?


To answer that question Hoof... no, not at all.

If you reevaluate what everyone is saying, you'll realize that they are actually increasing PvP activity.

Now I'm not arguing that, but since many are complaining about lower levels hitting them, seems pretty obvious.

The "no think" factor is a good point, but I'm pretty dang sure that's not taking into account what the attacker is doing.

But hey, I hit with no worries about losing before and even knowing I would lose.

There are a lot of "assumptions" about so-called "thinking" and what it's worth.

I fail to see how making low level players unable to hit higher ones would be positive for the PvP aspect of the game.

It leads to the idea that high level players should not be able to hit lower levels either.

I see zero logic to the argument, especially considering that people can work to get any of the so-called super pots.

Just like levels can be got and thus access to better equipment so can all these pots.

I am fervent defender of PvP and I think this is a truly weak sauce argument that will only serve to destroy it.

#167 KitiaraLi

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 07:57

<snip>

And to end: Again, sincere apologies Kit.

Fully accepted *hugs n snuggles* B)


No one can deny that we changed this game and influenced it in such a way that NO ONE could compete with us.. so much so that they changed the rules. ~Abhorrence, chosen founder of Cerulean Sins


#168 KitiaraLi

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 08:07

Any set up or player can be beaten. Some of the best pvp players I know are considered low level. But it should take a level 500 player some strategy, knowledge, effort, something to take on a level 3000 and win. It shouldn't be easy.

.. and those "low" level PvPers rightfully take huge pride in being able to serve it when it is hard to do.

 

I recall when alotta old friends said their goodbyes due to PvP being made easy to those, who just smack blindly ... Aaaah to be old, and ponder about the times where PvP was a game of skill, and not a game of buff level/luck buffs kicking in... yeeeessss... gawd I am old :wacko:

 

 

I am actually unsure if the level of composing/global buffs is the biggest issue, as much as the amount of luck based buffs available :unsure:

Maybe it would be better if PvP (also includes GvG) only did involve buffs at a max level of 175 (if deflect was removed from the game) ... at least that way, it would show a more reasonable difference in abilities, buff availability and gear score in a fight between a lvl 500 vs lvl 3K (if both are online) ... it still leaves the issue with the high amount of luck based buffs available to the higher leveled player though.


No one can deny that we changed this game and influenced it in such a way that NO ONE could compete with us.. so much so that they changed the rules. ~Abhorrence, chosen founder of Cerulean Sins


#169 Davros81

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 08:11

I just erased one of the longest Egami diatribes in history.

What's the point?


To answer that question Hoof... no, not at all.

If you reevaluate what everyone is saying, you'll realize that they are actually increasing PvP activity.

Now I'm not arguing that, but since many are complaining about lower levels hitting them, seems pretty obvious.

The "no think" factor is a good point, but I'm pretty dang sure that's not taking into account what the attacker is doing.

But hey, I hit with no worries about losing before and even knowing I would lose.

There are a lot of "assumptions" about so-called "thinking" and what it's worth.

I fail to see how making low level players unable to hit higher ones would be positive for the PvP aspect of the game.

It leads to the idea that high level players should not be able to hit lower levels either.

I see zero logic to the argument, especially considering that people can work to get any of the so-called super pots.

Just like levels can be got and thus access to better equipment so can all these pots.

I am fervent defender of PvP and I think this is a truly weak sauce argument that will only serve to destroy it.

So if what you're are saying is right Egami, then the "super pots" have in fact had a positive effect on the game by increasing pvp as more are willing to try it. I find that brilliant!

 

I am also disappointed that people seem to continue to bash composing even after members of HCS staff have stated it is staying and to refrain from being disrespectful regarding the subject.

 

I have always found that, when i am/was at EOC, people far below EOC have been able to take me out in pvp and this was long before composing was a mere glint in Leos3000 eye so in essence very little has changed.



#170 EpicPiety

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 14:56

Bad analogy Leo is a genius to do with this stuff lol. This thread isn't about "super pots"...It's about stat padders/thinners...IE Flinch,terrorize etc... that have an absurdly high level and are very very inexpensive. These buffs can exist but they can't be inexpensive otherwise it breaks the balance.

 

PvP more active after composing potions? Oh come on we know that's not true.


Edited by EpicPiety, 09 July 2016 - 14:59.


#171 Davros81

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Posted 09 July 2016 - 20:54

Leos3000 invented Composing so the analogy is valid as he did so around 3-4 years ago, why don't you ask him, but never mind I o not wish to derail this thread further.


Edited by Davros81, 09 July 2016 - 21:04.


#172 wil72

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 00:24

Leos3000 invented Composing so the analogy is valid as he did so around 3-4 years ago, why don't you ask him, but never mind I o not wish to derail this thread further.

 

Unfortunately "composing" is nothing like Leos original concept. I went for the derail, bugger it.

 

Cheers.

 

wil72



#173 EpicPiety

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Posted 11 July 2016 - 18:39

Leos3000 invented Composing so the analogy is valid as he did so around 3-4 years ago, why don't you ask him, but never mind I o not wish to derail this thread further.

The concept sure...But the implementation was butchered. For instance why FS is split on composing skill levels/unbalance. If leos truly word for word implemented it himself it would be of a different nature. So following that you must agree with the problem with composing. I agree that what you said was possible before...But now it makes it doable without any thinking.


Edited by EpicPiety, 11 July 2016 - 18:40.


#174 Hoofmaster

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Posted 11 July 2016 - 20:23

I'm just going to throw out another comment and see where it goes :D

 

Is the issue maybe with certain high level potions working when attacking in PvP? What if they were maybe capped for attacking but worked in defense?



#175 Pardoux

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Posted 11 July 2016 - 20:27

I'm just going to throw out another comment and see where it goes :D

 

Is the issue maybe with certain high level potions working when attacking in PvP? What if they were maybe capped for attacking but worked in defense?

 

Isn't that more complicated to implement than just a :-

 

Attack is PvE, allow pots to work,

 

Attack is PvP/GvG/Ladder, don't

 

(just for the stat padding buffs).

 

I think you're over complicating it ?


Edited by Pardoux, 11 July 2016 - 20:27.

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#176 Hoofmaster

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Posted 11 July 2016 - 20:32

Isn't that more complicated to implement than just a :-

 

Attack is PvE, allow pots to work,

 

Attack is PvP/GvG/Ladder, don't

 

(just for the stat padding buffs).

 

I think you're over complicating it ?

 

That's what I was thinking before when I put up the post asking if the main issue was the potions working in PvP. I agree that if that is the main issue then making them work in PvE and not work in PvP would be a better solution.



#177 Belaric

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Posted 11 July 2016 - 21:21

That's what I was thinking before when I put up the post asking if the main issue was the potions working in PvP. I agree that if that is the main issue then making them work in PvE and not work in PvP would be a better solution.

61 Votes.

 

32 or 33 Different posters.

 

You might change how composing works on that basis?

 

Your call. 


Good-bye and hello, as always.


#178 yotwehc

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Posted 11 July 2016 - 23:49

That's what I was thinking before when I put up the post asking if the main issue was the potions working in PvP. I agree that if that is the main issue then making them work in PvE and not work in PvP would be a better solution.

You know what would be an easier solution? Just leave it. just a small group of the loudest posters. I guess I'm not loud enough :(

#179 TxLxS

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Posted 11 July 2016 - 23:57

I vote in game poll at the very least :)

#180 Calista

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Posted 12 July 2016 - 02:47

Is the issue maybe with certain high level potions working when attacking in PvP? What if they were maybe capped for attacking but worked in defense?

 

 

The only way to get around the high level pots is to have the same high level pots active. And then, that's just to get the chance to have your buffs activate better then the targets. It's become a game of luck, not skill. If you made the pots work only in defense, you'd take away most any chance an attacker has of winning. I think this would make the issue far worse then it is now.


 



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