19 replies to this topic

[Legolis3]

Here be some builds, these are just templates because most of them are terrible lol:

 

Melee Classes:

 

 

PvE:
 

Tank - http://talenttheory....1V1Wc3h3l2m1p4/

 

HealTank - http://talenttheory....i2m1t3y3B1C1D3/

 

This abomination - http://talenttheory....h1i2l2m1p3r1w1/

 

SinTank - http://talenttheory....m1o2t3u2w1x1E4/

 

Warsin PvE - http://talenttheory....o3p3u2v1w1x1I2/

 

Easy levelling build (Warsin) - http://talenttheory....3Ae3g2i1m1o3t3/

 

Sinwar (Med armor) - http://talenttheory....I2K2L1N1O1Q2V1/

 

 

PvP: 

 

Warsin PvP - http://talenttheory....1Ae3g2i2m1o3t3/

 

Prophsin - http://talenttheory....e1g2j1m1o2t3y3/

 

Sinwar i guess? - http://talenttheory....o3p1q1t3v1w1x1/

 

Sinwar PvP - http://talenttheory....1C1I2K2L1N1O1V1

/

 

 

 

Ranged Classes:

 

 

PvE:

 

Ranger PvE - http://talenttheory....B1F2G2K1L2N2V1/

 

FoD SC farming build (Ranger version that i used) - http://talenttheory....e1g2j1m1o2t3y3/

 

Mage PvE - http://talenttheory....1L3Q1V1Pa1d3g2/

 

Healer - http://talenttheory....B1C1G3H1I1J2K1/

 

MageTank - http://talenttheory....w1x1B1C2D1F1I1/

 

 

PvP:

 

Ranger PvP - http://talenttheory....E2F2G2I1J1N2O1/

 

Prophranger - http://talenttheory....a1e2g2j2o2t3y3/

 

Mageproph - http://talenttheory....e2f2j1m1o2t3y3/

 

Mageproph 2 - http://talenttheory....l2o2t3u1y3B1C1/

 

Prophmage - http://talenttheory....y3B1C1F2J2L2N1/

 

Prophmage 2 (this be the fucked up pmage build, but actually works lol) - http://talenttheory....z1B1C1F2J2K1L2N

1/

 

 

 

Other stuff:

 

Annoy the fuck out of pkers build - http://talenttheory....t2v3x1y1D1E1I1/

 

Annoy the fuck out of pkers build V2 - http://talenttheory....i2k1m1o2t1w1B1/

Edited by Legolis3, 06 September 2017 - 22:17.

[Irradiated]

Good post, get all the basic builds in one place.  Now that I'm keeping a close eye on the forums (in case of talent theory issues) I may as well post some suggestions regarding the ranger PvE and farming builds.  This is assuming nothing has changed since I stopped playing.

 

PVE

* Skip Wild Instincts.  It only works on base focus, not focus from gear.  If you're putting all points in ranged, base focus is 49.  That translates into 295 attack power, or a whopping 15 dps ( IMO this talent is a relic from the days before caps and before gems, when there was a viable ranger 'crit build' with all points in focus rather then ranged.

* Two points in volley is enough, especially if you can catch the healer's snowfall.  Correctly time your mana pot and you'll have enough mana.

* Sleight of hand is debatable.  If you put those two points in quick draw you'll almost never need basic ranged attack.  This adds significant dps, but can sometimes cause mana problems if the fight goes on too long (eg undergeared group).  Hopefully get 2 snowfalls, or just work through it.

* Since black fang is your bread and butter spell, cruel barbs looks really good.  Especially now that we're talking about quick draw.

* And a point for blood trail.  Blood fang is your highest DPS single target attack.  You want to use it more often.

* Call of the wild vs. creeping vines.  Both are useful for CC.  The wolf is easier to use, but vines makes farming easier of you don't want to respec, and works against multiple targets.  Vines is useful in a group in very rare situations, the wolf adds a small bit of DPS.  Play style choice.  Both can be dropped if you ~only~ play in groups.

 

Only one comment regarding the farming build.  You really want explosives when kiting a group.  Depending on your style, drop either deliverance, or go with sword and board for more survivability and drop dual-wield mastery.

[Elrog]

I did not look at all of them but the ones I did look at have issues.

 

The prophtank is missing revenge and has a cc that only connects to three people

The sintank build does not have fully specced lc and bloodsiphon

The healer does not have snowfall

The warsin does not have bloodlust

 

I am all for helping people with advice but bad advice isn't helpful

[Kendiosa]

I did not look at all of them but the ones I did look at have issues.

The prophtank is missing revenge and has a cc that only connects to three people
The sintank build does not have fully specced lc and bloodsiphon
The healer does not have snowfall
The warsin does not have bloodlust

I am all for helping people with advice but bad advice isn't helpful

Warsin doesn't use bloodlust so that part is right.
Snow is not essential for a healer ( I've always used it but ran with some healers who don't)

[Elrog]

A warsin focused on dungeoning should have bloodlust.

 

Talking like that, an essence isn't essential for a healer either. If a healer does not have snowfall, you can't heal the tank much at all before the tank gets threat. Without it, you would be limited to healing smaller pulls. Even a sintank needs snowfall to do big pulls safely.

[Kendiosa]

A warsin focused on dungeoning should have bloodlust.

Talking like that, an essence isn't essential for a healer either. If a healer does not have snowfall, you can't heal the tank much at all before the tank gets threat. Without it, you would be limited to healing smaller pulls. Even a sintank needs snowfall to do big pulls safely.

You called it bad advice when it is more about options and styles of play. Yes, if you want to heal the big pulls into bosses that we all do now then snowfall is essential. But snowfall is not required to be a healer. It is required to be the best healer for large grouping in dungeons. An icc healer build however could easily get away without using snowfall at all.

I'm all for offering advice and help to people to make builds but please put that advice in the right context.

[Elrog]

Okay, I guess I will have to go into more detail.

 

For the healer build: Take the three points off of relentless magics (3 points for 6% crit) and move them to focused mind (2 points for 6% crit) and focus for the class buff (one point for 5% crit). Take two points off of master of the arcane and put them on purification (higher dps for the two points). This is straight up more crit and more dps. Regardless of what play style you use, this would be a better way to spend points.

 

The warsin has three points on vicious poison. Vicious poison only stacks up to 10 times regardless of if you apply three stacks per hit or one stack per hit. Vicious poison only takes effect if you are the first person with it to hit the target. If another person has it, then yours is not applied. Applying three points of vicious poison will help you get to 10 stacks quicker, adding maybe 25 damage to the amount you do to an enemy. When enemies have over 10 thousand or even over 1 million hp, this is negligible. With dps over 1k, you can easily get more than 25 damage worth out of two talent points by spending them elsewhere.

 

For the Sintank build:

This is the build I came up with independently, popularized (with some people taking one or two points different), and currently hold the record with for asv and arg http://tinyurl.com/mug8kuh. If you do the math, this build has literally over twice as much healing form lc as the build given in the initial post. It has both a higher damage output and is much much more survivable. The build given would not be safe (or possibly even able) to do rg dung pulls for powereleveling, do the pulls I do in asv, do the pulls I do when farming cores at darrowvale or crannoch and it could not kill a cc boss as quickly. There is literally nothing that the build given in the post could do as good as this build. This is not a playstyle choice. It is shameful to see the build I came up with misrepresented like this.

 

Again, this is bad advice and is not helpful.

Edited by Elrog, 10 October 2017 - 17:27.

[Kendiosa]

Okay, I guess I will have to go into more detail.

 

For the healer build: Take the three points off of relentless magics (3 points for 6% crit) and move them to focused mind (2 points for 6% crit) and focus for the class buff (one point for 5% crit). Take two points off of master of the arcane and put them on purification (higher dps for the two points). This is straight up more crit and more dps. Regardless of what play style you use, this would be a better way to spend points.

 

 

Agreed, although my healer build has master of the arcane, purification and relentless magics too

Edited by Kendiosa, 10 October 2017 - 21:48.

[Kendiosa]

Okay, I guess I will have to go into more detail.

 

The warsin has three points on vicious poison. Vicious poison only stacks up to 10 times regardless of if you apply three stacks per hit or one stack per hit. Vicious poison only takes effect if you are the first person with it to hit the target. If another person has it, then yours is not applied. Applying three points of vicious poison will help you get to 10 stacks quicker, adding maybe 25 damage to the amount you do to an enemy. When enemies have over 10 thousand or even over 1 million hp, this is negligible. With dps over 1k, you can easily get more than 25 damage worth out of two talent points by spending them elsewhere.

 

 

 

This is very good advice. No sin/warsin/sinwar build should ever have more than 1 point in Vicious poison. 

I'm not convinced you need a haste buff (blood lust) instead though. My warsin and sinwar always run out of mana while dpsing, and I am never short of a skill to use. I max out the mana regen talents instead. And before you ask.... No... I don't use an aqua  

[Kendiosa]

Okay, I guess I will have to go into more detail.

 

 

 

For the Sintank build:

This is the build I came up with independently, popularized (with some people taking one or two points different), and currently hold the record with for asv and arg http://tinyurl.com/mug8kuh. If you do the math, this build has literally over twice as much healing form lc as the build given in the initial post. It has both a higher damage output and is much much more survivable. The build given would not be safe (or possibly even able) to do rg dung pulls for powereleveling, do the pulls I do in asv, do the pulls I do when farming cores at darrowvale or crannoch and it could not kill a cc boss as quickly. There is literally nothing that the build given in the post could do as good as this build. This is not a playstyle choice. It is shameful to see the build I came up with misrepresented like this.

 

Again, this is bad advice and is not helpful.

 

Your sintank build is awesome and is a great addition to the game. It is so good, you had everyone asking: "how come no one has done that before?" which is a sign you created something that should have been obvious but wasn't. I play a slight variant of it now and I love it (thanks for the tips ). It's great fun to play and I even don't kill some of my group when I tank (some of my previous tanking attempts where bad ) - so for this reason I can understand why you are pissed off when someone ruins it so badly   You may or may not have noticed in the past but Legolis does like to play around with and suggest many, many builds, but he doesn't always get them very right. 

Edited by Kendiosa, 10 October 2017 - 21:59.

[Elrog]

This is very good advice. No sin/warsin/sinwar build should ever have more than 1 point in Vicious poison. 

I'm not convinced you need a haste buff (blood lust) instead though. My warsin and sinwar always run out of mana while dpsing, and I am never short of a skill to use. I max out the mana regen talents instead. And before you ask.... No... I don't use an aqua

Not, instead of mana talents... marauder and endurance should be full. I meant spec bloodlust instead of upgrading meteor for warsins focused on dungeoning. Bloodlust would be a better place to get the haste than weapon rolls and gems.

 

You are right, there are lots of abilities to choose from and you won't be short of a skill to use. However, It is perferable to be able to cast the stronger ones, such as bane, more often instead of using that mana on things like hail storm or ruin.

 

Also, 28% haste is an important benchmark because 28% haste is the requirement for 3 melee dps with shock trauma talents to keep shock trauma constantly active.

 

I will say though that the longer stun on meteor is nice for soloing, but I'd just use sintank for solo anyways.

[JoDu]

just a question about that sintank build: does "Dual-Wield Mastery" talent work on tank using 1h weapon and shield?

I thought dual-wield works only using two 1h weapon, as shield is off handed.

[Elrog]

No, it only works when you dual wield. Occasionally I dual wield for things for extra DPS (most often just for doing bene). I have two swords anyway, one with a haste roll and amber and one with a heal on hit roll and almandine. I swap between them for different circumstances.

 

You have to spend points in tier one to get to the tiers below though. The crit from wearing med armor doesn't help using heavy amor, the crit from dual wield isn't as strong as atk power increase, and accuracy statistically does not help at all against enemies your level or below your level once you get over 100% (you have to hover the mouse over your accuracy % to see the actual value, you have a base 75% accuracy that is not shown until you hover the mouse).

 

Accuracy affects the chance to hit a glancing blow which only does 30% of the damage that a regular hit would do. Accuracy does not affect dodging (dodge is simply based off of the dodge %). At level 49 with even mediocre gear, your focus (with no extra points allocated into it) is high enough to get you over 100% accuracy. To never hit glancing blows on enemies above your level requires higher accuracy (higher than 100%).

 

With all that said, the med armor talent is useless, the dual wield atk power helps more than the dual wield crit, and the accuracy is statistically useless except for fighting the level 52 frost dragon which is only there for a few weeks out of the year.

[JoDu]

No, it only works when you dual wield. Occasionally I dual wield for things for extra DPS (most often just for doing bene). I have two swords anyway, one with a haste roll and amber and one with a heal on hit roll and almandine. I swap between them for different circumstances.

 

You have to spend points in tier one to get to the tiers below though. The crit from wearing med armor doesn't help using heavy amor, the crit from dual wield isn't as strong as atk power increase, and accuracy statistically does not help at all against enemies your level or below your level once you get over 100% (you have to hover the mouse over your accuracy % to see the actual value, you have a base 75% accuracy that is not shown until you hover the mouse).

 

Accuracy affects the chance to hit a glancing blow which only does 30% of the damage that a regular hit would do. Accuracy does not affect dodging (dodge is simply based off of the dodge %). At level 49 with even mediocre gear, your focus (with no extra points allocated into it) is high enough to get you over 100% accuracy. To never hit glancing blows on enemies above your level requires higher accuracy (higher than 100%).

 

With all that said, the med armor talent is useless, the dual wield atk power helps more than the dual wield crit, and the accuracy is statistically useless except for fighting the level 52 frost dragon which is only there for a few weeks out of the year.

 

Thank you for the answer and other info about accuracy. Sometimes i'm feeling so noob to not paying attention on how things work in the game or being lazy to try it out

[Tankh]

One very small thing. Maxing viscious poison is good for grinding as a warsin as you kill things much faster. Look at it this way: meteorite applies 3, then 1 mael hit applies 3 and then another hit applies 3. So, you have 9 stacks of viscious poison on mobs with 4 more maelstorm hits already doing +9% damage on mobs. Also, if you are the only warsin in an icc group and you have a crit healer without pacifist, you will have a better chance to hold the gargs this way. Also, if you are the only warsin in an ASV/ARG group, you deal more damage faster.

As for blood lust; more haste means faster meteorite and malestorm, hence, more damage. It also means a faster bane and sever. Those two are strong attacks, especial Bane buffed with destruction. In my opinion, there is no reason not to get it. The only issue that arises from it is a mana and the bug where LC can get cancelled if you throw one while your other one is already active (it does not renew it which is ridiculous but Cow logic says it makes sense).

Crit... I won't go there as I am a crit addict

I don't know healtanks but logically CC should be fully maxed out.

[Elrog]

One very small thing. Maxing viscious poison is good for grinding as a warsin as you kill things much faster. Look at it this way: meteorite applies 3, then 1 mael hit applies 3 and then another hit applies 3. So, you have 9 stacks of viscious poison on mobs with 4 more maelstorm hits already doing +9% damage on mobs. Also, if you are the only warsin in an icc group and you have a crit healer without pacifist, you will have a better chance to hold the gargs this way. Also, if you are the only warsin in an ASV/ARG group, you deal more damage faster.

This assumes the small difference in damage would make the difference between killing a mob in 3 hits or 4 hits. I think putting those points on blood siphon, adrenaline rush, or fountain of mana would be more helpful for grinding.

 

Bane is strong yes.. sever.. not really lol

[Kendiosa]

This assumes the small difference in damage would make the difference between killing a mob in 3 hits or 4 hits. I think putting those points on blood siphon, adrenaline rush, or fountain of mana would be more helpful for grinding.

Bane is strong yes.. sever.. not really lol

I'm with Elrog on this one. There is no value to 3 points in vicious poison. It certainly is not needed in icc even for healers with garg treats in their pockets. As for solo then the points are much better spent elsewhere. The small extra dmg boost is really not worth it.

Edited by Kendiosa, 13 October 2017 - 08:28.

[Legolis3]

Just templates people....just templates

[Thomas02]

Just templates people....just templates

and look at what you started Lego, shame on you 

[Elrog]

I'm with Elrog on this one. There is no value to 3 points in vicious poison. It certainly is not needed in icc even for healers with garg treats in their pockets. As for solo then the points are much better spent elsewhere. The small extra dmg boost is really not worth it.

Ah yes.. I forgot to reply to the ICC part. I take gargs on my healer anyways when phase four hits. Vicious poison will not make the warsins able to get gargs from me and really, they shouldn't take them. The job of the warsin isn't to get aggro,  it is to kill the adds before there are too many. Crimson Chain heals the caster more than everyone else. With one point on Aura bene gives substantial self heals. It is more efficient for the healer to get aggro because the healer will heal up easier. When I heal, I tell warsins (the ones that will listen) not to do meal unless there are 4+ gargs.

 

And legolis, calling it a template doesn't change much. The fact of the matter is there are points which are not well spent and it would not be helpful for a new player to come along and use these builds. A new player (or just inexperienced in builds talents, etc) is not going to be able to tell which points should be moved and which shouldn't. If they knew all that they wouldn't need this post. 

Edited by Elrog, 13 October 2017 - 15:07.