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BraveKath

Member Since 16 Oct 2012
Offline Last Active Jul 09 2016 06:56

#860076 My Suggestions for reviving the Bounty Board (And this is quite radical)

Posted by Crzy on 04 April 2014 - 08:58

I think when he says ladder he really means top rated list? Is there an enhancement or buff to allow master thief over 100%? I know the thieves shrine guild structure allows thievery to go over 100% but I don't recall master thief getting one. Could be a new structure or 2000 buff. Sleight of hand or sticky fingers could be the name lol


#822285 Come, lets sing in the rain!

Posted by wil72 on 24 November 2013 - 22:30

" I'm singing in the rain,

just singing in the rain "




#860064 My Suggestions for reviving the Bounty Board (And this is quite radical)

Posted by Belaric on 04 April 2014 - 06:57

This is a hugely long post. As an OP I believe that is justified. There is repetition involved because it is so long and I want to remind people of key points that may be lost earlier in the wash. DeadParrot – I’m really sorry.

 

We are all FS players. I do actually believe in the whole community. I use PvP players here as an unfortunate short hand. I do not seek to divide – if my ideas are horrifying to you, rest easy knowing they are in no danger of being implemented, but since they occurred to me I have been unable to do much else but think on them and so must post this for the sake of my own sanity and productivity.

 

The core of these ideas is consistency and removal of ambiguity – make the rules clear for everyone. No more unwritten codes. We want consistency from HCS – we should expect it from each other. I also believe it will promote PvP activity – not your grandfather’s PvP – but meaningful PvP that will be a valuable part of the game’s ecosystem, that everyone will understand and not be in fear of. No more bogey-men.

 

I have a 4 point plan for the Bounty Board (BB).

 

Before we get started I’d like to say I think – after discussions today with guys on the forum - that the Thievery and Master Thief enhancements should be enhanced. I can’t lie – this system will increase punishment on PvP players – I know you guys can take it, because it will mean more PvP activity across the board – but I believe that if you do get punished more then your chances of earning gold before you get punished should be increased. If no-one PvP’s the system remains as dead as it is now. I agree that you need more incentive.

 

Back to my 4 point plan.  

 

1) The victim of an attack sets the punishment required.

 

2) The bounty hunter (BH) cannot in any circumstance be bountied. Don’t freak out before reading on – I think this can turn into a good thing.

 

3) Guildmates can clear each other’s bounties.

 

4) Two new Top 250's for PvP are created: An Outlaw Top 250 is created to track those players who have lost the most levels on the bounty board, and a Lawless Top 250 to track those who evaded the posse of Bounty Hunters and survived on the board for a set period of time, initial suggestion being one week. Additionally Outlaw and Lawless medals could be created in addition to the top 250s.

 

Please bear with me and hear out why I think these may actually be good ideas for PvP and the community at large.

 

Bear in mind I do not PvP and if you want you can completely ignore my ideas on that basis. I’ll not be offended in the slightest.

 

I will go through each point in turn and expand on it to explain how it might work and my thinking behind it and why it might be beneficial.

 

 

1) The victim of an attack sets the punishment required.

This is the core of my imaginary system. Currently among players who do not PvP, or who have been exposed to it as victims of attack there is a prevailing feeling that the BB does not provide adequate redress. They have no faith in the current system. Across numerous threads this scenario is painted: The victim is hit and loses gold, and then is made victim again by paying for a bounty only to see the bountied player soft cleared by her friends. The victim loses twice.

 

I am not here to hash that argument out again. I am not here to point fingers. This is my perception based on what I have seen in game and in this forum over the years I have been playing. The scenario above is reality in the minds of many players. People feel powerless in the face of attack. They do not want to hit back and risk being placed on the bounty board themselves. They are not able or do not want to put a delevel party together and risk everyone in the delevel party being put on the BB for their pains. They do not trust the board to provide realistic punishment. The end result is they do not post the bounty at all. The PvP ecosystem shrinks. The BB remains dead. If the victim sets the punishment, they feel empowered, they have a sense of control, they have an increased chance of seeing the punishment they want actually carried out. They are more likely to post bounties. The PvP ecosystem expands.

 

How do I propose this works?

 

 The injured party will pay for the damage they desire to be wrought upon their attacker, the more damage desired, the higher the fee. The exact scale can be determined if this idea got enough support to warrant it. Currently a fee is levied - this would be similar but slide up as more retribution is required. This fee is paid to the BH who completes the highest % of the required damage to the outlaw placed on the board, which will encourage competition among BH’s. Retribution would be capped at 3 levels initially. This is a radical departure from how it currently works. In one step this removes the ambiguity of BB etiquette, 10 stam vs. 100 stam hits, late bounty hits etc., as the punishment is set as required by the original victim, and must be fulfilled for the bounty to be completed. The bounty does not expire until the target damage is met, or a week passes – if an outlaw can defend him or herself that long – kudos. If 3 levels are required as punishment, then it is 3 levels that are lost. The victim gets the redress they can pay for. Why 3 levels max? Because currently 5 levels are risked, but that risk I believe is not consistently delivered. If this system does succeed in promoting more bounties and more regular punishments, those punishments need not be as harsh. 3 levels/bounty still means that if a player was harassing another in game with constant hits he or she could still be more effectively dropped out of range than currently.

 

 

2) The bounty hunter (BH) cannot in any circumstance be bountied.

This is almost as important as #1. This will encourage people who have not or will not PvP to try it as BH’s. The protection is key to making that happen. On the recent thread which suggested no more bountys on the BH there were a few comments indicating that if this were the case people would take up BHing. This is more people trying PvP. This is an expansion of the PvP ecosystem, not a contraction. I believe another reason the BB is dead is because BH’s have been punished heavily for doing their jobs in the past. So in game now we have on one hand a disaffected game population not bothering to post bounties because they don’t see the point, and on the other hand there are few people prepared to take on bounties as they risk being delevelled themselves as a result. It is a recipe for inactivity. The proof appears to be on the BB daily.

 

In this imaginary system BH’s cannot be driven off the board by counter bounties and delevelling. I believe this practice is why we do not see much in the way of independent BH’s nowadays. They are the agents of justice and as such should be protected. And again this helps to remove any unwritten rules about when and why a certain BH can be bountied and another not. An active BH population will also increase the incentive to bounty hits which currently go unanswered.

 

What will happen? Where is the risk going in PvP here? It is going away for BH’s sure – but in return our hardcore PvP population actually get to dance on the BB again. Do you guys really think the first inexperienced noob BH’s will be able to take you out? And if they suck and give up, why do you need to punish them further by bountying them for quitting? You have already beaten them and demonstrated your skill – which seems to me to be the point in PvP – the defeat of an active human opponent. This system increases the chance you’ll go up against them when they are hunting you. At first new BH’s will suck – but will learn the hard way at your hands, and may be tempted to switch codes! We may have two types of PvP player – the BH and the outlaw, who can switch roles when they want. Currently risk for every hit has led to a situation where experienced PvP players tell me the practice is not profitable for them, and the BB is dead in the water. Risk for all has led to inactivity and boredom for most – people are drifting away from the game. It may be time to pick your poison. A more active BB will give more opportunity for profit (depending on the imaginary pay structure – and why get into the minutiae of that if the system as a whole meets no approval here?), and more importantly increased PvP activity with new participants.

 

3) Guildmates can clear each other’s bounties.

The restriction can be dropped as the possibility of ‘soft clears’ is removed – the victim is in charge of the punishment, the hunter cannot be bountied, so guildmates can now clear each others’ bounties as they must perform the bounty punishment as set forth by the injured party.

 

Also in a game which has sadly got smaller this removes the need to have a network of allies – many of which may have retired. Your guildies can handle your business, if they can beat other BH’s to it!

  

4) Two new Top 250s for PvP are created: An Outlaw Top 250 is created to track those players who have lost the most levels on the bounty board, and a Lawless Top 250 to track those who evaded the posse of Bounty hunters and survived on the board for a set period of time, initial suggestion being one week.

 

PvP players get two top 250's (and possibly medals too) – one to show their battle scars and see who has taken the most risks and received the most punishment in their cause, the other to show PvP skill in evading punishment and being untouchable. Hence Outlaw vs Lawless. Guildmates and allies cannot post each other to the BB. This will reduce but not eliminate abuse. The fact that you have to lose levels on the Outlaw ladder should also limit abuse – even PvP players have limits to the ranges they want to drop from.

 

 

 

I think these ideas make the BB system clear and consistent. If you take the risk of stealing from another player then you can and will be bountied and made to pay for it. There are no unwritten rules or customs to follow – the person hit says how much retribution they want, and the bounty hunter who administers the punishment is free from counter bounty to encourage more participation on the board.

 

This system gives you more bounties, more players playing PvP, initially perhaps as BH’s but later they may become poachers rather than gamekeepers, and more rewards in the system via bounties. Hopefully Thievery and Master Thief enhancements can be upped to make the increased risk of retribution worth it for the PvP player. If more people play on the BB then more may become interested in the ladder. And by making the victims part of the process by having them set the punishment you remove the lingering sense of disenfranchisement that exists in those players who do not want to PvP and who feel helpless when attacked. This way they control what happens to their attacker. If the attacker can stay free for a week you have to hold your hand up and say well done. Removing ambiguity and unwritten codes of behaviour from the BB also demystifies the board – what we understand we need not fear. The whole community could become more comfortable with PvP. I’m a dreamer.

 

The BH medal – you would get a tick towards that not for completing the bounty as is done currently – but for doing the largest % of the desired damage to the outlaw on the board. This means competition will be had to clear the bounty and get the most damage done. Again – more people getting involved, as if you don’t make the BH tick, you’ll still get some Smasher ticks in. Will this devalue the Smasher medal? I don’t think so, but if you do – see my points on the Guild medals thread. If a titan scenario occurs where a player does 51% (if possible) and stops, then no payout is made if the full punishment is not completed – so if one BH does 51% of the damage and stops, but the outlaw survives for the rest of the week his bounty is active, then the 51% BH gets nothing. It pays to finish the job.

 

PvP ranges could be expanded if it is shown that outlaws are dropping levels rapidly and are not as capable of staying in a certain level range. The proof of that would be in the pudding – how it plays out.

 

The core of this is: have the victim set the punishment, and the BH be free of counter bounty. PvP players get more people to play with and places to be recognised, non-PvP players have some faith in the BB restored and so use it more often. More gold and FSP exchange hands via the BB. A virtuous cycle.

 

I know I have been talking about the need to present simple ideas to the Cows and then I vomit out this huge game altering plan. The idea would not let go. I’m sharing it.

 

Feel free to point out abuses/exploits. Feel free to point out why it might be unworkable. Feel free to cherry pick good sections from bad if you find some ideas more appealing. If you hate it all I’m cool with that too. Remember I don’t work for HCS and this is not on the roadmap so there is no danger of this becoming real unless everyone thought this was the best thing since sliced bread and agitated for this change to HCS (a sequence of events HIGHLY unlikely), and even then they might not do it anyway, so keep that blood pressure down! LOL!

 

Thanks for reading.




#859813 New PvP Ladder Rewards + Incentive to Play the ladder

Posted by Belaric on 03 April 2014 - 16:13

On another thread we talked about the ladder. There I was in favour of old tokens being used for new items, new potions, to buy extra duration to prestige, or perhaps to buy the ability to use prestige in chunks. Also the idea of highly useful low durability crystal items that would sell, be broken and need to be remade/bought with ladder tokens. Ladder tokens to extend prestige duration is a huge incentive to players I think.

 

I felt that introducing a new token system for a revamped ladder might be simply too much work for HCS to want to do. (a new 2 tier token system? Do the old tokens get earned alongside the new ones, and only count towards the old rewards? How is it worked and given roadmap slowness do we think adding a complex project is going to speed up the fix any?)

 

Keeping the old tokens is the simplest way forward. I still think this.

 

Yes this means that folk sitting on piles of tokens might make a killing. That is not their fault.

 

The fault is HCS's for not fixing the broken ladder fast enough - its failings have been discussed for a very long time.

 

So is it bad apples, or is it the devs? A bit of both perhaps. Sorry devs.
 

I think revamp the ladder, introduce new rewards, suck up the fact that old tokens easily earned will be used for profit - even if those tokens were gained rather than earned - those players stayed on the ladder when others did not bother.

 

Bound vs. unbound. I think old tokens will be burned faster if unbound, I think the community is not so large that bound items will be a huge draw. I think selling into the wider community would work.




#859395 Zombie Yeoman Global Event

Posted by BigGrim on 02 April 2014 - 14:36

This thread has run it's course. No more flaming.

 

*Locked*




#859520 New PvP Ladder Rewards + Incentive to Play the ladder

Posted by Chazz224 on 02 April 2014 - 21:47

A simple idea here to add some new "useful" Rewards to the pvp ladder and maybe bring some more players into the pvp ladder. Instead of just adding more items to make why not add some bound potions for each play style? (PvP, leveling, titan hunting, farming) These potions would have to be bound as to not instantly flood the market with them and thus making them worthless and not encouraging players to play and earn them.  

 

These potions could have a building system similar to the composing, in that the more tokens you use in them the stronger they become (capped at a reasonable level of coarse) and also used to increase duration( also capped).  The potions would need to be strong enough to make a leveling player want to use there stamina to earn them. I feel that AL level 300 would be a fair buff level for example. 

 

 

This is just a suggestion and would love feedback and other ideas from everyone here.

+1

 

I've commented a couple of times already supporting this idea of Bound Potions - I have explained reasons as to why and how they would encourage PvP and bring the community closer together as a whole. I have also suggested what I feel is a wonderful idea for the future of the PvP Ladder gear at the bottom of Page 1 as well. Both of these suggestions are in favor of the Original Poster's forum here.

 

Now I'd like to share some ideas with you all on what potions I would like to see from the PvP Ladder Rewards:

 

I will break these down into certain categories to ease reading them so people can share what I hope to be positive feed back. The break down will consist of PvP, leveling, titan hunting, farming.

 

Leveling Potions:

 

Potion of the " Supreme Leveler" contains:

 

Master Learner : +0.5% per point increase in xp from creature kills. <---- Capped at level 100 which would increase XP gained by 50% - Global pots that include AL 600 provide a 120% - normal Adept Learner at 175 is = to 35% I think this is nice and balanced.  [Please note this should only be available through the PvP Ladder no where else and especially not in Skill trees]

Animal Magnetism: Level 300

Stalker: Level 300

 

Potion of the " Wise and Wealthy ": contains:

 

Librarian: Level 300

Treasure Hunter: Level 225

Merchant: Level 225

Quest Finder: Level 225

 

Farming Potions:

 

Potion of the " Resourceful " contains:

 

Find Item: Level 1200

Four Leaf: Level 300

Resource Finder: Level 275

 

Potion of the "Mad Scientist"contains:

 

Inventor: Level 350

Inventor II: Level 350

Extractor: Level 350

 

Titan Hunting Potion:

 

Potion of the " Remarkable" contains:

 

Conserve: Level 300

Light Foot: Level 1200

Distraction: Level 300

 

PvP Potions:

 

Potion of the "Annihilator" contains:

 

Rage: Level 250

Savagery: Level 300

Retaliate: Level 300

Undermine: Level 300

Shame: Level 200

 

Potion of the "Spartan" contains:

 

Armor Boost: Level 200

Ageless: Level 200

Anchored: Level 200

Sanctuary: Level 225

 

- Chazz




#859542 New PvP Ladder Rewards + Incentive to Play the ladder

Posted by Chazz224 on 02 April 2014 - 23:57

That was suggested (by myself and others) eons ago - and, obviously IMO, is what SHOULD happen ... All those ladder tokens gained (note, I said gained, not earned) by 1-hit resets should NOT be usable against new gear / potions ...

The topic of tokens via those who already accumulated them and as to how they did so  is very controversial.  The Players who have them would argue for them - Players that don't have them would also argue against them. In the end what we would have is a tug of war ladies and gentleman. I am personally not looking for one. I personally feel it's best to let HCS decide what to do with current token holders as I personally don't feel I have the right to challenge how they acquired them.

 

Very much how Loyalty tokens were awarded to all players who donated - that idea may have seemed very unfair or not totally balanced to those who didn't donate prior to that point. I my self had almost 200 thousand Loyalty tokens at one time very much like the PvP Ladder holders today. I can also tell you that they went as fast as water from a pipe and I have almost nothing left and many people I know used and abused their stock of tokens over time as well. I do believe the same would be done to those who have current Ladder tokens now and if so who cares?

 

Let's not waste time arguing over the pennies - when what's really needed is support for the game - the games community - PvP especially since the majority can agree it's lacking and needs help right now. I don't want to fight or argue let's do our best here to stay on topic and not de-rail this thread that could be really good for the game - the players and even our devs.

 

- Chazz




#859248 New PvP Ladder Rewards + Incentive to Play the ladder

Posted by Ryebred on 01 April 2014 - 20:28

I always advocated bound consumables as rewards for ladder play - love this idea Mark.  One of the main reason is there are so many people in ladders collecting tokens waiting on quick profit means -which due to the sheer amount of them - will equate to no boost of activity if new gear is released.  It will be far more economical to buy -and most in ladders will tell you what a joke it has been collecting them with little to no effort.  Consumables that are bound offer opportunity to breath life into the ladders - you want the prize - play the game. 

 

Don't shy on the rewards though - if you can't offer something better then that of what global events offer - why are people going to feel inclined to play - make them attractive.  Bound is the key




#859353 Zombie Yeoman Global Event

Posted by Little Mac on 02 April 2014 - 07:36

Some people here who are whining (because they only received gold-tier rewards for doing the minimum 3k kills) are the same ones who log off for hours with full stam and let their stam gains oveflow. If you spent some of those wasted stam ticks on the event to at least reach your 5k kills regardless of how the community performs then you'd be enjoying the top rewards by now. What's a small amount of stam for another 2k kills to help increase the community totals?

Lesson: Do at least 5k kills regardless of how the community will perform.

 

i have to say i disagree. I dumped 30k stam into the global as always, so why should someone who has the same stam bank as me or larger enjoy rewards for doing the minimum?

 

So you spent 30k stam on the event, so pat yourself on the back for being on the top 100 and getting the extra ruby chest. I myself did almost 6k kills and would've done more if I had the stam (and time to login) for it.

 

But my post is directed towards those who did 3k or 4k kills despite having enough stam to do more, then whine when the cows made the 'error' of awarding ruby chests to those who reached ruby tier requirement. They then logoff for a couple of hours with full stam and waste their stam ticks in the process. Also take note that I said 'at least 5k kills' - if they did more, then good.

 

Now about the 5k kills that earn 3 ruby chests - which you disagree with (I suppose) - this is an entirely different issue and there have been suggestions to make the system fair to the high-stam contributors. I wouldn't mind it if there was some sort of a 'tiered reward system' based on kill count done past the minimum 5k (rough example: +1 legendary chest if you hit 10k kills, +2 legendary chests if you hit 20k, and +1 epic chest if you hit 30k kills - each tier prize replacing the ones below it). After all, the high-stam peeps and the ones on the top 100 make up at least 25% of the total community kills, so they deserve it.




#859235 Zombie Yeoman Global Event

Posted by sweetlou on 01 April 2014 - 18:57

I would have preferred a stam refill before a couple more silly uber pots...


#859318 Zombie Yeoman Global Event

Posted by cyrus7 on 02 April 2014 - 03:01

I was thinking that perhaps making the bigger Global Booster, bound of course, as a prize for the top 100 might be a fair compromise.

If the Top 100 was to receive higher level Global Boosters as a prize, I would think that would only ensure that [mostly] the same players achieve Top 100 the next time, as they can spend less time to use their stamina, and therefore are more inclined to do so, rather than spend hours using their stamina as those with only access to the tiny boosters do.




#859142 Zombie Yeoman Global Event

Posted by vikingv on 01 April 2014 - 10:15

I laugh at you whiners.




#859138 Zombie Yeoman Global Event

Posted by ignotus on 01 April 2014 - 09:47

 

Having said all that, I can't help being reminded of a famous bit of English literature that tells a story of someone hiring workers at three different times during the day and then paying them all the same.

 

 

I cant help myself to correct, that this story is a bit older than english literature.

 

Besides enjoyed the event, thanks for the reward




#859106 Zombie Yeoman Global Event

Posted by bloody18 on 01 April 2014 - 07:23

NO need to change anything HCS!

 

However A simple variance.  On the Darksun Dragons global event the reward chests are all equal.  You can simply achieve more of the same chest. Would you consider doing that for an event like the Zombie global we just completed. Here is a link for those who need a refresher on the Darksun Stash

 

http://wiki.fallensw..._Quest_15-08-13

 

First ALWAYS reward TOP 100!

SO the reward 3 RUBY chests. Simply have 3 equal  levels of say 5.5 million kills to reach each level -  Earn  1 Ruby chest for each 5.5 Million zombies killed , with a max of 3 :) 

 

Just taking ideas from both events:) thanks for listening




#859104 Zombie Yeoman Global Event

Posted by Pardoux on 01 April 2014 - 07:10

This is a game, and it is just stam in the game. It will regenerate and you can play again on another day. If you didn't hunt as much you can, then you have nothing to complain about. It was your own fault.

 

Oh, I agree with you there - and have no sympathy for those who stopped at 3k or 4k kills in this event ... 5k is not a lot to ask and is achievable for ANYONE if they put in the effort.

 

My idea is just an idea to make it fairer for ALL players - the cows will probably ignore it because of the "background" amount of work needed to implement it :)






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